“The biggest problem for FYROM or Macedonia is the Alanian population who will increasingly become hostile”
Who are Alanian???? Sorry but if you mean Albanian they can not be hostile at their home. The last events during the elections should be object to the police investigation as normally.
“At 25% of the population this will increase very consistently and if you think NATO is going to be able to stop that-its not”
What the hell has to do NATO with the internal problems of Macedonia? Macedonians and Albanians over there are able to solve their problems alone. The time of war is over.
What difference does it make about whether its FYROM or RoM? It is certainly not going to make much of a difference in the not so distant future. The biggest problem for FYROM or Macedonia is the Alanian population who will increasingly become hostile. At 25% of the population this will increase very consistently and if you think NATO is going to be able to stop that-its not. It amazes me of all the Maco's I come across they think that NATO and the EU will be there salvation. Good luck.
written by a Serb this strikes me as ironic. Didn't you guys threaten to kill Tadic as well? The MK police should crack down, just as the police in Albania and Kosovo do. The murder rate in Kosova is...3 per 100,000. Very low.
Once again a news about Macedonia is invaded by Greek nationalistic and ignorant comments.
Why don't you leave Macedonia alone? I have some Greek friends and it's impressive all the ignorant barbarities they say about the history of Macedonia (and Turkey), and the problem seems to be that you are taught propaganda while in school and when you grow older you don't even care about going and check some non altered facts about all the conflicts.
At least read some of the articles refereed in wikipedia instead of trusting just what your parents tell you about the evil Macedonians (sorry, FYRONIANS) and Turks (btw they were not Turks that invaded you, they were Otomans).
@16; Don't try to tell us we're this or that 'slav', when all southern balkan countries have a similar amount of slav dna, including "greece" and albania!!
We're sick of all your labels, that belong only in greece, a country where "ethnicity" is such an issue that "greeks" need to tie themselves up in semantics just so they can sleep at night!
You're not the keepers of Macedonia or Macedonians; you're a frightened people... frightened that what you've been taught is in fact a lie! Ethnic Macedonians expose the lie of your national construct!
The lady didn't talk in Macedonian. She either talked in slav-macedonian (which the bulgarian state argues officially that is a bulgarian dialect) or in greek-macedonian. You are right that she was embarassed or feeling uncomfortable to talk macedonian in public, because currently the relations between our two countries is not at its best point. When in your country, i was feeling uncomfortable to say i am greek because i did not feel safe. There are people in the greek part of macedonia that speak slavic dialects. Often they identify their language as "serbian" or "slavic". Let us all keep in mind that there are bilingual people in greek macedonia that have a greek national identity. They concider Greece as their motherland. Maybe there are others who concider FYR-Macedonia as their homeland. The same way that Vlachs of Greece speak Vlach but are also proud to be Greek. Do not consider that everyone speaking a languge is of that nationality
Today i am proud to be MACEDONIAN.. For once the Macedonian people have spoken and have been rewarded accordingly. The red line has been drawn.. Nikola will never give up on Macedonia.. His grandfather fought and died for Greece against the Italians during WWII. He is currently buried near lerin(Florina) under the name Nikolais Gruios, the Geeks don't know respect hence why his grandfather has a Greek name on his tombstone, denied the most basics of human rights. What have we ever done to the Greeks to make them hate us so much.. Unfortanately Macedonians still live in fear in Agean Macedonia. Next is to recognise the Macedonian minority in Greece. It amazes me that in the year 2008 Macedonians are still afraid to speak Macedonian in Agean Macedonia. Example I was in voden(Edessa) in 2006, i walked into bakery and pointed out to the Burek with my finger assuming the lady was Greek, yet she started talking to me in Macedonian, i was shocked.. yet then a man walked in and she stopped talking to me in Macedonian, she just smiled when i spoke to her in Macedonian and would not speak to me anymore in Macedonian.
The wrongs of the past will be corrected.. this I can garuntee!
@10; Whoever you are.. KNOW that I do not read anything where you blather FYROM all over the place... this only confirms the 2000 Eurobarometer survey confirming greece to have the highest degree of xenophobia in the EU!
@11; greeks are by far closer to today's 'bulgars' than Macedonians will ever be....look at your own thoughts and understand that slander and defamation will get you knowhere!
Please save for yourselves you freedom loving Serbs before you start ethnic cleansing other peoples in the Balkans and go on a rampage, assassinating your own political leaders.
Just read what you wrote:
"FYROM was not due to go to the polls until 2010, however due to a GReek veto of FYROM's entry to NATO in April this year, early elections were called by the governing pro-Western VMRO DPMNE party, which promised not to change FYROM's constitutional name".
So let me get this straight. You went to elections because Greece put a veto for your name thing, but in those elections the decision is to not change the name.
So why did you go to elections in the first place? Just because of a veto that will remain a veto if your decision is the same? I find it a very stupid reason to go to elections and I also find it very hypocritical (not to mention stupid) of your side (the fyromians) to blame Greece for your instability.
As for the Albanians. I heard few minutes ago, that the albanian President made a statement about the fightings in FYROM and such, and sources around him say that since albaina is going to enter nato before you they might veto your entry, he might also ask the goverment to withdraw the recognition and return to the FYROM name. Thats the second one after the Russian statements about this issue.
What I feel is that your multiethnic melting pot is going to hell in terms of internal stability, the albanians are ready to take the mountains again, the usa have stated that they are very unsatisfied with the situation there and they were dissapointed that your goverment couldnt carry legal and free elections (this in diplomatic language means that there isnt political stability and the country isnt trustworthy), etc etc etc.
So what you are saying is that all the fyromians can say and do about it is to blame the Greeks for a very much expected and for a long time declared veto. You are not blaming yourself that you couldnt face a diplomatic challenge and failed tragically in doing it, you arent blaming yourself that you trusted your country's future in the hands of a falling ex super-power, that by the way has failed to predict everything that is going on in this area (they were saying that there will not be early elections in FYROM, they were wrong, they were saying that there were going to be peaceful and free and normal elections, they were wrong, they were not expecting a veto, they swallowed it and many more examples), you are not blaming yourself that you cannot produce safe and legal conditions for your own citizens in the highest moment of democracy, the elections, you are not blaming yourself that your country is so much behind in almost every condition set by the EU, you prefer to close your eyes and blame the Greeks for a veto that you were expecting anyway.
Good job :)
You also said:
"but I'd like you to know that we are a proud and self respecting people and we are never going to allow the theft of our name!"
We too :)
You also said:
"ACTIONS SPEAK LOUDER THAN WORDS!"
Unfortunately for you, the Greek veto was at the small (if at all) news of the popular world wide news agencies. And the killings, shootings and the rest at your elections made the frontpages.
You are absolutely right. ACTIONS SPEAK LOUDER THAN WORDS!
Unlike you Dimitar,the Greek people bear no malice towards you or your nation.I really hope that your people elect a goverment which will
have its feet on the ground and returne to the planet reality.
Your problems with the albanians is an internal matter but you should also ask Gruevski as to why he favours the DPA and not the UDI.Why did he give the interior ministry to DPA just before the elections?
With regard to the name dispute ,the Greek position is a composite name with a geographic qualifier.Not more ,not less.
As to your demands for recognised ethnicity,identity
and language, i think the majority of posters on this forum know the answer.I will leave you with a quote from your hero Gotse Delchev.
Letter to Nicola Maleshevski.
Sofia May 1899
Nicola
I have received all the letters sent by you.Let us not allow the splits to frighten us.It is,indeed,a pitty,but what can we do,since we are Bulgarians and all suffer from one common disease.If this disease had not been present in our ancestors, from whom we inherited, they would have never fallen under the spectre of the Turkish sultan.
Dear All,
I would like to be more realistic, is not now the case to generalise the things, it does not mean that in Macedonia is shown the albanian culture, it does not mean that they are representing albanians, in fact they are representing the society of Macedonia itself... in anyway incidents happens everywere, I can take an example: Stambolic has been killed from Milosevic just because was afraid that he can come in power in Serbia and there are lot of examples as such around the world. Absolutelly I am against the incidents in Macedonia, the giuridical institutions must do their duty and bring to justice everyone.
I wish all the best to macedonians in general and a stable state integrated in Euro-Atlantic structures.
As Macedonia went to the polls for an early election today, violence dominated
ethnic Albanian electorates because of regional rivalries. One is dead.
Macedonia was not due to go to the polls until 2010, however due to a GReek veto of Macedonia's entry to NATO in April this year, early elections were called by the governing pro-Western VMRO DPMNE party, which promised not to change Macedonia's constitutional name but continue Macedonia's reforms for EU and NATO entry.
The VMRO DPMNE was in a ruling coalition with one of two rival Albanian parties DPA, however after a timely boycott of parliament by the DPA prior to Macedonia's invitation to NATO, early elections had to be called to increase the ruling government's majority, making the coalition immune from boycotts from the DPA. VMRO DPMNE saw a surge in popularity since entering office, with the attraction of foreign investments and strengthened institutions, and so the early elections were an attempt to strengthen their position and carry on with democratic and market reforms.
The two major Albanian parties, the DPA and DUI, are deep rivals and they are no strangers to violent intimidation techniques come election time. The gun battle began between the rival ethnic Albanian groups until Macedonia's multiethnic special forces unit was called in to diffuse the violence.
With intertwined connections to regional Albanian criminal networks and a troubling form of fundamentalist Wahabi Islam emerging, it makes for an explosive mix and something that Macedonia's forces should be quick to diffuse."
So you see, Greece is directly to blame for it's tactic of trying to isolate Macedonia in the hope that the Albanians will bring upon our destruction!
I'd also like to let you know that we're aware of greece's aim to protract the imposed "name issue" indefinitely, but I'd like you to know that we are a proud and self respecting people and we are never going to allow the theft of our name! BTW, when did Nimitz's mandate expand to include the questioning and legitimacy of not only our name, but also our identity, our language, our heritage and so on?
So, don't fein innocence, the greeks are by far Macedonia's number ONE enemy!! All Macedonians worldwide know this so please spare me/us the platitudes that you are our "friends" etc.
ACTIONS SPEAK LOUDER THAN WORDS!
Yes I feel sorry for all those good willing Macdonians. But on the other hand what did they really do when Albanians started attacking Serbs in Kosovo and in the South of Serbia. Retreating after every attack to Macedonia. and nothing happened. And now, yes, now they will have the same problems. Soon you will see what the Albanians will do to your country!
Democracies come in all shapes & forms. From a rigid 2 party system such as exists in the US, all the way through to a fluid multi-party system such as exists in Serbia today. But the fundamental tenet behind all of these is the right to choose your leadership, free of any coercion.
As long as albanians deny this to themselves, not to mention to others, they will never be democratic, regardless of what they call their parties.
ps: whatever else one can say about serbian democracy, it certainly isn't boring :)
Or maybe one day EU and nato understand that your current political, social, economical etc etc situation is not the one that justifies your petitions for membership in any kind of international organisation?
Which neighboring ethnic group is it that Albanians can live with in harmony?
How is their intransigent chauvanism even remotely justifiable?
A truely disgusting nature consistently on display. Maybe one day the Western press will get their heads out from their behinds and present events as they are and not with corporate fascist political expdiency.
How can it be otherwise when EU/US overlords have yet to mention to the Albanians that such a thing as responsibility exists?
I'm sure much of the ordinary Albanian populace is tired of primitive antics such as this, but as an Albanian poster on a Macedonian forum said,
"We cannot do anything about it, we become targets ourselves!"
Yes I feel sorry for all those good willing Macdonians. But on the other hand what did they really do when Albanians started attacking Serbs in Kosovo and in the South of Serbia. Retreating after every attack to Macedonia. and nothing happened. And now, yes, now they will have the same problems. Soon you will see what the Albanians will do to your country!
Which neighboring ethnic group is it that Albanians can live with in harmony?
How is their intransigent chauvanism even remotely justifiable?
A truely disgusting nature consistently on display. Maybe one day the Western press will get their heads out from their behinds and present events as they are and not with corporate fascist political expdiency.
How can it be otherwise when EU/US overlords have yet to mention to the Albanians that such a thing as responsibility exists?
I'm sure much of the ordinary Albanian populace is tired of primitive antics such as this, but as an Albanian poster on a Macedonian forum said,
"We cannot do anything about it, we become targets ourselves!"
Just read what you wrote:
"FYROM was not due to go to the polls until 2010, however due to a GReek veto of FYROM's entry to NATO in April this year, early elections were called by the governing pro-Western VMRO DPMNE party, which promised not to change FYROM's constitutional name".
So let me get this straight. You went to elections because Greece put a veto for your name thing, but in those elections the decision is to not change the name.
So why did you go to elections in the first place? Just because of a veto that will remain a veto if your decision is the same? I find it a very stupid reason to go to elections and I also find it very hypocritical (not to mention stupid) of your side (the fyromians) to blame Greece for your instability.
As for the Albanians. I heard few minutes ago, that the albanian President made a statement about the fightings in FYROM and such, and sources around him say that since albaina is going to enter nato before you they might veto your entry, he might also ask the goverment to withdraw the recognition and return to the FYROM name. Thats the second one after the Russian statements about this issue.
What I feel is that your multiethnic melting pot is going to hell in terms of internal stability, the albanians are ready to take the mountains again, the usa have stated that they are very unsatisfied with the situation there and they were dissapointed that your goverment couldnt carry legal and free elections (this in diplomatic language means that there isnt political stability and the country isnt trustworthy), etc etc etc.
So what you are saying is that all the fyromians can say and do about it is to blame the Greeks for a very much expected and for a long time declared veto. You are not blaming yourself that you couldnt face a diplomatic challenge and failed tragically in doing it, you arent blaming yourself that you trusted your country's future in the hands of a falling ex super-power, that by the way has failed to predict everything that is going on in this area (they were saying that there will not be early elections in FYROM, they were wrong, they were saying that there were going to be peaceful and free and normal elections, they were wrong, they were not expecting a veto, they swallowed it and many more examples), you are not blaming yourself that you cannot produce safe and legal conditions for your own citizens in the highest moment of democracy, the elections, you are not blaming yourself that your country is so much behind in almost every condition set by the EU, you prefer to close your eyes and blame the Greeks for a veto that you were expecting anyway.
Good job :)
You also said:
"but I'd like you to know that we are a proud and self respecting people and we are never going to allow the theft of our name!"
We too :)
You also said:
"ACTIONS SPEAK LOUDER THAN WORDS!"
Unfortunately for you, the Greek veto was at the small (if at all) news of the popular world wide news agencies. And the killings, shootings and the rest at your elections made the frontpages.
You are absolutely right. ACTIONS SPEAK LOUDER THAN WORDS!
Or maybe one day EU and nato understand that your current political, social, economical etc etc situation is not the one that justifies your petitions for membership in any kind of international organisation?
Unlike you Dimitar,the Greek people bear no malice towards you or your nation.I really hope that your people elect a goverment which will
have its feet on the ground and returne to the planet reality.
Your problems with the albanians is an internal matter but you should also ask Gruevski as to why he favours the DPA and not the UDI.Why did he give the interior ministry to DPA just before the elections?
With regard to the name dispute ,the Greek position is a composite name with a geographic qualifier.Not more ,not less.
As to your demands for recognised ethnicity,identity
and language, i think the majority of posters on this forum know the answer.I will leave you with a quote from your hero Gotse Delchev.
Letter to Nicola Maleshevski.
Sofia May 1899
Nicola
I have received all the letters sent by you.Let us not allow the splits to frighten us.It is,indeed,a pitty,but what can we do,since we are Bulgarians and all suffer from one common disease.If this disease had not been present in our ancestors, from whom we inherited, they would have never fallen under the spectre of the Turkish sultan.
Dear All,
I would like to be more realistic, is not now the case to generalise the things, it does not mean that in Macedonia is shown the albanian culture, it does not mean that they are representing albanians, in fact they are representing the society of Macedonia itself... in anyway incidents happens everywere, I can take an example: Stambolic has been killed from Milosevic just because was afraid that he can come in power in Serbia and there are lot of examples as such around the world. Absolutelly I am against the incidents in Macedonia, the giuridical institutions must do their duty and bring to justice everyone.
I wish all the best to macedonians in general and a stable state integrated in Euro-Atlantic structures.
Please save for yourselves you freedom loving Serbs before you start ethnic cleansing other peoples in the Balkans and go on a rampage, assassinating your own political leaders.
Democracies come in all shapes & forms. From a rigid 2 party system such as exists in the US, all the way through to a fluid multi-party system such as exists in Serbia today. But the fundamental tenet behind all of these is the right to choose your leadership, free of any coercion.
As long as albanians deny this to themselves, not to mention to others, they will never be democratic, regardless of what they call their parties.
ps: whatever else one can say about serbian democracy, it certainly isn't boring :)
As Macedonia went to the polls for an early election today, violence dominated
ethnic Albanian electorates because of regional rivalries. One is dead.
Macedonia was not due to go to the polls until 2010, however due to a GReek veto of Macedonia's entry to NATO in April this year, early elections were called by the governing pro-Western VMRO DPMNE party, which promised not to change Macedonia's constitutional name but continue Macedonia's reforms for EU and NATO entry.
The VMRO DPMNE was in a ruling coalition with one of two rival Albanian parties DPA, however after a timely boycott of parliament by the DPA prior to Macedonia's invitation to NATO, early elections had to be called to increase the ruling government's majority, making the coalition immune from boycotts from the DPA. VMRO DPMNE saw a surge in popularity since entering office, with the attraction of foreign investments and strengthened institutions, and so the early elections were an attempt to strengthen their position and carry on with democratic and market reforms.
The two major Albanian parties, the DPA and DUI, are deep rivals and they are no strangers to violent intimidation techniques come election time. The gun battle began between the rival ethnic Albanian groups until Macedonia's multiethnic special forces unit was called in to diffuse the violence.
With intertwined connections to regional Albanian criminal networks and a troubling form of fundamentalist Wahabi Islam emerging, it makes for an explosive mix and something that Macedonia's forces should be quick to diffuse."
So you see, Greece is directly to blame for it's tactic of trying to isolate Macedonia in the hope that the Albanians will bring upon our destruction!
I'd also like to let you know that we're aware of greece's aim to protract the imposed "name issue" indefinitely, but I'd like you to know that we are a proud and self respecting people and we are never going to allow the theft of our name! BTW, when did Nimitz's mandate expand to include the questioning and legitimacy of not only our name, but also our identity, our language, our heritage and so on?
So, don't fein innocence, the greeks are by far Macedonia's number ONE enemy!! All Macedonians worldwide know this so please spare me/us the platitudes that you are our "friends" etc.
ACTIONS SPEAK LOUDER THAN WORDS!
@10; Whoever you are.. KNOW that I do not read anything where you blather FYROM all over the place... this only confirms the 2000 Eurobarometer survey confirming greece to have the highest degree of xenophobia in the EU!
@11; greeks are by far closer to today's 'bulgars' than Macedonians will ever be....look at your own thoughts and understand that slander and defamation will get you knowhere!
@16; Don't try to tell us we're this or that 'slav', when all southern balkan countries have a similar amount of slav dna, including "greece" and albania!!
We're sick of all your labels, that belong only in greece, a country where "ethnicity" is such an issue that "greeks" need to tie themselves up in semantics just so they can sleep at night!
You're not the keepers of Macedonia or Macedonians; you're a frightened people... frightened that what you've been taught is in fact a lie! Ethnic Macedonians expose the lie of your national construct!
Today i am proud to be MACEDONIAN.. For once the Macedonian people have spoken and have been rewarded accordingly. The red line has been drawn.. Nikola will never give up on Macedonia.. His grandfather fought and died for Greece against the Italians during WWII. He is currently buried near lerin(Florina) under the name Nikolais Gruios, the Geeks don't know respect hence why his grandfather has a Greek name on his tombstone, denied the most basics of human rights. What have we ever done to the Greeks to make them hate us so much.. Unfortanately Macedonians still live in fear in Agean Macedonia. Next is to recognise the Macedonian minority in Greece. It amazes me that in the year 2008 Macedonians are still afraid to speak Macedonian in Agean Macedonia. Example I was in voden(Edessa) in 2006, i walked into bakery and pointed out to the Burek with my finger assuming the lady was Greek, yet she started talking to me in Macedonian, i was shocked.. yet then a man walked in and she stopped talking to me in Macedonian, she just smiled when i spoke to her in Macedonian and would not speak to me anymore in Macedonian.
The wrongs of the past will be corrected.. this I can garuntee!
written by a Serb this strikes me as ironic. Didn't you guys threaten to kill Tadic as well? The MK police should crack down, just as the police in Albania and Kosovo do. The murder rate in Kosova is...3 per 100,000. Very low.
The lady didn't talk in Macedonian. She either talked in slav-macedonian (which the bulgarian state argues officially that is a bulgarian dialect) or in greek-macedonian. You are right that she was embarassed or feeling uncomfortable to talk macedonian in public, because currently the relations between our two countries is not at its best point. When in your country, i was feeling uncomfortable to say i am greek because i did not feel safe. There are people in the greek part of macedonia that speak slavic dialects. Often they identify their language as "serbian" or "slavic". Let us all keep in mind that there are bilingual people in greek macedonia that have a greek national identity. They concider Greece as their motherland. Maybe there are others who concider FYR-Macedonia as their homeland. The same way that Vlachs of Greece speak Vlach but are also proud to be Greek. Do not consider that everyone speaking a languge is of that nationality
What difference does it make about whether its FYROM or RoM? It is certainly not going to make much of a difference in the not so distant future. The biggest problem for FYROM or Macedonia is the Alanian population who will increasingly become hostile. At 25% of the population this will increase very consistently and if you think NATO is going to be able to stop that-its not. It amazes me of all the Maco's I come across they think that NATO and the EU will be there salvation. Good luck.
“The biggest problem for FYROM or Macedonia is the Alanian population who will increasingly become hostile”
Who are Alanian???? Sorry but if you mean Albanian they can not be hostile at their home. The last events during the elections should be object to the police investigation as normally.
“At 25% of the population this will increase very consistently and if you think NATO is going to be able to stop that-its not”
What the hell has to do NATO with the internal problems of Macedonia? Macedonians and Albanians over there are able to solve their problems alone. The time of war is over.
Once again a news about Macedonia is invaded by Greek nationalistic and ignorant comments.
Why don't you leave Macedonia alone? I have some Greek friends and it's impressive all the ignorant barbarities they say about the history of Macedonia (and Turkey), and the problem seems to be that you are taught propaganda while in school and when you grow older you don't even care about going and check some non altered facts about all the conflicts.
At least read some of the articles refereed in wikipedia instead of trusting just what your parents tell you about the evil Macedonians (sorry, FYRONIANS) and Turks (btw they were not Turks that invaded you, they were Otomans).
Please save for yourselves you freedom loving Serbs before you start ethnic cleansing other peoples in the Balkans and go on a rampage, assassinating your own political leaders.
@10; Whoever you are.. KNOW that I do not read anything where you blather FYROM all over the place... this only confirms the 2000 Eurobarometer survey confirming greece to have the highest degree of xenophobia in the EU!
@11; greeks are by far closer to today's 'bulgars' than Macedonians will ever be....look at your own thoughts and understand that slander and defamation will get you knowhere!
How can it be otherwise when EU/US overlords have yet to mention to the Albanians that such a thing as responsibility exists?
I'm sure much of the ordinary Albanian populace is tired of primitive antics such as this, but as an Albanian poster on a Macedonian forum said,
"We cannot do anything about it, we become targets ourselves!"
written by a Serb this strikes me as ironic. Didn't you guys threaten to kill Tadic as well? The MK police should crack down, just as the police in Albania and Kosovo do. The murder rate in Kosova is...3 per 100,000. Very low.
“The biggest problem for FYROM or Macedonia is the Alanian population who will increasingly become hostile”
Who are Alanian???? Sorry but if you mean Albanian they can not be hostile at their home. The last events during the elections should be object to the police investigation as normally.
“At 25% of the population this will increase very consistently and if you think NATO is going to be able to stop that-its not”
What the hell has to do NATO with the internal problems of Macedonia? Macedonians and Albanians over there are able to solve their problems alone. The time of war is over.
Which neighboring ethnic group is it that Albanians can live with in harmony?
How is their intransigent chauvanism even remotely justifiable?
A truely disgusting nature consistently on display. Maybe one day the Western press will get their heads out from their behinds and present events as they are and not with corporate fascist political expdiency.
Or maybe one day EU and nato understand that your current political, social, economical etc etc situation is not the one that justifies your petitions for membership in any kind of international organisation?
As Macedonia went to the polls for an early election today, violence dominated
ethnic Albanian electorates because of regional rivalries. One is dead.
Macedonia was not due to go to the polls until 2010, however due to a GReek veto of Macedonia's entry to NATO in April this year, early elections were called by the governing pro-Western VMRO DPMNE party, which promised not to change Macedonia's constitutional name but continue Macedonia's reforms for EU and NATO entry.
The VMRO DPMNE was in a ruling coalition with one of two rival Albanian parties DPA, however after a timely boycott of parliament by the DPA prior to Macedonia's invitation to NATO, early elections had to be called to increase the ruling government's majority, making the coalition immune from boycotts from the DPA. VMRO DPMNE saw a surge in popularity since entering office, with the attraction of foreign investments and strengthened institutions, and so the early elections were an attempt to strengthen their position and carry on with democratic and market reforms.
The two major Albanian parties, the DPA and DUI, are deep rivals and they are no strangers to violent intimidation techniques come election time. The gun battle began between the rival ethnic Albanian groups until Macedonia's multiethnic special forces unit was called in to diffuse the violence.
With intertwined connections to regional Albanian criminal networks and a troubling form of fundamentalist Wahabi Islam emerging, it makes for an explosive mix and something that Macedonia's forces should be quick to diffuse."
So you see, Greece is directly to blame for it's tactic of trying to isolate Macedonia in the hope that the Albanians will bring upon our destruction!
I'd also like to let you know that we're aware of greece's aim to protract the imposed "name issue" indefinitely, but I'd like you to know that we are a proud and self respecting people and we are never going to allow the theft of our name! BTW, when did Nimitz's mandate expand to include the questioning and legitimacy of not only our name, but also our identity, our language, our heritage and so on?
So, don't fein innocence, the greeks are by far Macedonia's number ONE enemy!! All Macedonians worldwide know this so please spare me/us the platitudes that you are our "friends" etc.
ACTIONS SPEAK LOUDER THAN WORDS!
Dear All,
I would like to be more realistic, is not now the case to generalise the things, it does not mean that in Macedonia is shown the albanian culture, it does not mean that they are representing albanians, in fact they are representing the society of Macedonia itself... in anyway incidents happens everywere, I can take an example: Stambolic has been killed from Milosevic just because was afraid that he can come in power in Serbia and there are lot of examples as such around the world. Absolutelly I am against the incidents in Macedonia, the giuridical institutions must do their duty and bring to justice everyone.
I wish all the best to macedonians in general and a stable state integrated in Euro-Atlantic structures.
@16; Don't try to tell us we're this or that 'slav', when all southern balkan countries have a similar amount of slav dna, including "greece" and albania!!
We're sick of all your labels, that belong only in greece, a country where "ethnicity" is such an issue that "greeks" need to tie themselves up in semantics just so they can sleep at night!
You're not the keepers of Macedonia or Macedonians; you're a frightened people... frightened that what you've been taught is in fact a lie! Ethnic Macedonians expose the lie of your national construct!
Yes I feel sorry for all those good willing Macdonians. But on the other hand what did they really do when Albanians started attacking Serbs in Kosovo and in the South of Serbia. Retreating after every attack to Macedonia. and nothing happened. And now, yes, now they will have the same problems. Soon you will see what the Albanians will do to your country!
Democracies come in all shapes & forms. From a rigid 2 party system such as exists in the US, all the way through to a fluid multi-party system such as exists in Serbia today. But the fundamental tenet behind all of these is the right to choose your leadership, free of any coercion.
As long as albanians deny this to themselves, not to mention to others, they will never be democratic, regardless of what they call their parties.
ps: whatever else one can say about serbian democracy, it certainly isn't boring :)
Just read what you wrote:
"FYROM was not due to go to the polls until 2010, however due to a GReek veto of FYROM's entry to NATO in April this year, early elections were called by the governing pro-Western VMRO DPMNE party, which promised not to change FYROM's constitutional name".
So let me get this straight. You went to elections because Greece put a veto for your name thing, but in those elections the decision is to not change the name.
So why did you go to elections in the first place? Just because of a veto that will remain a veto if your decision is the same? I find it a very stupid reason to go to elections and I also find it very hypocritical (not to mention stupid) of your side (the fyromians) to blame Greece for your instability.
As for the Albanians. I heard few minutes ago, that the albanian President made a statement about the fightings in FYROM and such, and sources around him say that since albaina is going to enter nato before you they might veto your entry, he might also ask the goverment to withdraw the recognition and return to the FYROM name. Thats the second one after the Russian statements about this issue.
What I feel is that your multiethnic melting pot is going to hell in terms of internal stability, the albanians are ready to take the mountains again, the usa have stated that they are very unsatisfied with the situation there and they were dissapointed that your goverment couldnt carry legal and free elections (this in diplomatic language means that there isnt political stability and the country isnt trustworthy), etc etc etc.
So what you are saying is that all the fyromians can say and do about it is to blame the Greeks for a very much expected and for a long time declared veto. You are not blaming yourself that you couldnt face a diplomatic challenge and failed tragically in doing it, you arent blaming yourself that you trusted your country's future in the hands of a falling ex super-power, that by the way has failed to predict everything that is going on in this area (they were saying that there will not be early elections in FYROM, they were wrong, they were saying that there were going to be peaceful and free and normal elections, they were wrong, they were not expecting a veto, they swallowed it and many more examples), you are not blaming yourself that you cannot produce safe and legal conditions for your own citizens in the highest moment of democracy, the elections, you are not blaming yourself that your country is so much behind in almost every condition set by the EU, you prefer to close your eyes and blame the Greeks for a veto that you were expecting anyway.
Good job :)
You also said:
"but I'd like you to know that we are a proud and self respecting people and we are never going to allow the theft of our name!"
We too :)
You also said:
"ACTIONS SPEAK LOUDER THAN WORDS!"
Unfortunately for you, the Greek veto was at the small (if at all) news of the popular world wide news agencies. And the killings, shootings and the rest at your elections made the frontpages.
You are absolutely right. ACTIONS SPEAK LOUDER THAN WORDS!
Unlike you Dimitar,the Greek people bear no malice towards you or your nation.I really hope that your people elect a goverment which will
have its feet on the ground and returne to the planet reality.
Your problems with the albanians is an internal matter but you should also ask Gruevski as to why he favours the DPA and not the UDI.Why did he give the interior ministry to DPA just before the elections?
With regard to the name dispute ,the Greek position is a composite name with a geographic qualifier.Not more ,not less.
As to your demands for recognised ethnicity,identity
and language, i think the majority of posters on this forum know the answer.I will leave you with a quote from your hero Gotse Delchev.
Letter to Nicola Maleshevski.
Sofia May 1899
Nicola
I have received all the letters sent by you.Let us not allow the splits to frighten us.It is,indeed,a pitty,but what can we do,since we are Bulgarians and all suffer from one common disease.If this disease had not been present in our ancestors, from whom we inherited, they would have never fallen under the spectre of the Turkish sultan.
Today i am proud to be MACEDONIAN.. For once the Macedonian people have spoken and have been rewarded accordingly. The red line has been drawn.. Nikola will never give up on Macedonia.. His grandfather fought and died for Greece against the Italians during WWII. He is currently buried near lerin(Florina) under the name Nikolais Gruios, the Geeks don't know respect hence why his grandfather has a Greek name on his tombstone, denied the most basics of human rights. What have we ever done to the Greeks to make them hate us so much.. Unfortanately Macedonians still live in fear in Agean Macedonia. Next is to recognise the Macedonian minority in Greece. It amazes me that in the year 2008 Macedonians are still afraid to speak Macedonian in Agean Macedonia. Example I was in voden(Edessa) in 2006, i walked into bakery and pointed out to the Burek with my finger assuming the lady was Greek, yet she started talking to me in Macedonian, i was shocked.. yet then a man walked in and she stopped talking to me in Macedonian, she just smiled when i spoke to her in Macedonian and would not speak to me anymore in Macedonian.
The wrongs of the past will be corrected.. this I can garuntee!
The lady didn't talk in Macedonian. She either talked in slav-macedonian (which the bulgarian state argues officially that is a bulgarian dialect) or in greek-macedonian. You are right that she was embarassed or feeling uncomfortable to talk macedonian in public, because currently the relations between our two countries is not at its best point. When in your country, i was feeling uncomfortable to say i am greek because i did not feel safe. There are people in the greek part of macedonia that speak slavic dialects. Often they identify their language as "serbian" or "slavic". Let us all keep in mind that there are bilingual people in greek macedonia that have a greek national identity. They concider Greece as their motherland. Maybe there are others who concider FYR-Macedonia as their homeland. The same way that Vlachs of Greece speak Vlach but are also proud to be Greek. Do not consider that everyone speaking a languge is of that nationality
Once again a news about Macedonia is invaded by Greek nationalistic and ignorant comments.
Why don't you leave Macedonia alone? I have some Greek friends and it's impressive all the ignorant barbarities they say about the history of Macedonia (and Turkey), and the problem seems to be that you are taught propaganda while in school and when you grow older you don't even care about going and check some non altered facts about all the conflicts.
At least read some of the articles refereed in wikipedia instead of trusting just what your parents tell you about the evil Macedonians (sorry, FYRONIANS) and Turks (btw they were not Turks that invaded you, they were Otomans).
What difference does it make about whether its FYROM or RoM? It is certainly not going to make much of a difference in the not so distant future. The biggest problem for FYROM or Macedonia is the Alanian population who will increasingly become hostile. At 25% of the population this will increase very consistently and if you think NATO is going to be able to stop that-its not. It amazes me of all the Maco's I come across they think that NATO and the EU will be there salvation. Good luck.
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