Albanians form "movement for unification"

The unification of one of the most corrupt countries on the planet (Albania) and one of the most destitute and impoverished regions (Kosovo) -- what a noble cause!! and a great match.
It speaks volumes to those who said this wasn't an Albanian land grab and that there was no intention of creating a greater Albania!

Unification of Albanian territories is one way to put it. Greater Albania is another. I am glad they finally admit their real goals. Now it will be much easier to win debates against people who still defend an independent Kosovo and recognition of it.

"Albanians form "movement for unification"'

I am Albanian and have not adhered to this movement- so according to B92 I am not part of the Albanian nation anymore?

When you Serbs will get rid of this Bolshevik culture- to label, generalize, and discredit entire nation/s?

You cannot be a persecutor and a judge, ok?

Anyhow, this "movement" looks like a poor copy of the Milosevic's politics of the Serbian unification-we all now how it ended... lessons from the contep. history folks in prishtina? ;)

Hahaha what clowns! We'll see how far their "unification" gets.

What on apetite albanians have.Too bad this is no news to either Montenegrians or Macedonians and that`s why they have some sitting in jails -where terrorist belong.

WAKE UP! GET A PASSPORT - Then tell me who you are!! HA

This declaration was entirely predictable. It has been reported and commented on since 1970's. The movement had received tacit support from Albania for the better part of 4 decades. Emboldened by the recent USA-EU support for Kosovo's independence Albanians feel their integration is now one giant step closer than ever before.

It could also be a sinister eu ploy to influence in Serbia the formation of a pro-EU government coallition, on the basis that there is salvation in a borderless EU.

Let’s see how long it takes USA and EU to denounce this act of agression against Montenegro, Macedonia, Greece and Serbia.

No well-meaning leftie can argue that Project Greater Albania is fiction.

This kind of "movement" have the support of only few people and their families and might be used only to draw attention that "we are here".
The future of all Albanians is in EU like every other Balkan countries. Anything else is just propaganda. No change of borders anymore! With Kosova's independence the Balkans border are sealed for ever!

What a boring story!

It's the usual albanian trick, with Thaci and co behind it.

It goes like this, create a small, phantom organization that is 'much more' militant than those in power.

1: You immediately look more 'moderate'

2: You promise the 'International Community'
that you will do all you can to keep a lid on it, but it 'may be difficult' as it is a reflection of 'real anger' against the continued presence of EU overlords and the Serbs (of course). So, the EU will rely on war criminals to stop terrorists.

3: You can create as many groups as you like and when you like. They will come an go depending on political expedience.

4: Thaci and co. will never allow any 'real' threat to their economic or political power base, so such groups if not created are tolerated. If they get to big for their boots, then someone falls down the stairs.

5: Such groups serve as a tool for Thaci and co to channel potential popular anger and frustration away from their own corrupt practices and failure to introduce real law reforms and equality before the law for all albanians, considering such great things were promised by 'independence', yet law and reform will fundamentally undermine Thaci and co's 'little' empire.

6: Always create new enemies, regardless of your own responsiblity. You can then claim leadership and avoid taking responsiblities for your own lack of action.

7: Continue the vicious circle ad nausiam.

An example of one of Thaci's groups is Kurti's 'Independence' group...

Well, as long as the boys get to keep their riches.

how do you wanna "liberate" something that was never yours???
-------------------------

Want to take us to court over it? Considering how the legal owner of Kosovo, the Ottoman Empire, recognized it as a consitutent part of an autonomous Albania (within the Empire), and considering that it has had an Albanian majority population since the the 17th century, and considering that there was a substantial Albainan byzantine presence since ...forever...
i think we have a pretty good case it is ours

Im so confused.......how can albania unify with itself?
how can one country be unified with itself?
if theyre talking about kosovo, theyre dead out of luck....... for "unification of all albanian territories" and theres only one albanian territory, albania. wow they don't get much more pathetic than the albanian officials.

Modern day "ethnic Albania" should be realized. Of course this would cause much complications and perhaps open Pandora's box.
(KV, 17 May 2008 21:21)

Modern day democratic, multi-ethnic "Albanoslavia" from Vardar to Triglav (don't forget Varna, too!) should be realized. Of course this would remove much complications and perhaps close Pandora's box. Enough border-surgeries and ethnic experiments.

There is a multi-ethnic and DEMOCRATIC and STRONG India which kind of works (just a sample). The language spoken in Punjab and language spoken in Tamil-Nadu are further apart (one is Indo-European, the other an exotic agglutinative), than Albanian and Russian (both Indo-European). Economic differences between Tamil-Nadu and Punjab are greater than between Albania, Slovenia, Russia, USA. This is just a mild hint, what can be done.

Ben so according to you this movement dont'exist of Albanians? Not sure I understand your point.

I trust the majority of the Albanians disaprove of this movement, and the goverment in Pristina does everything to disolve the movement and to show that Kosovo is the last piece of terority they have stolen, not the first. Otherwise no-one can deny anymore that granting Kosovo independence was a big mistake. Creating more instability, and more problems in the region instead of solving everything.

ben,

Let me humour you. You just condemned Serbs for generalisation, by generalising all Serbs. You're hilarious.

As for this movement - what an eloquent example to illustrate that Hitler is dead, but his ideas are not.
Greater Albania in the making, centralisation of Europe, ethnic cleansing of those who oppose this new regime - Hitler would be proud.

Ben,

if the oldest material record of Serbian existence on KiM back date to 5th,6th,7th... century and Albanian material records date from 18th century but predominantly from 19th and 20th century, how could it be that Serbs stole KiM from Albanians as you are claiming?
Please spare me of the Ilirs and Dardans story, they are to Albanians as much as Normans, Celts or Romans are to Serbs.
And stop spreading lies on this site.

I'm an Albanian and I can tell you right now that I want nothing to do with this. He doesn't speak for me or any of the people I know.

Whoever that guy is, he only speaks for his own party's benefit, not Albanians'.

And to B92: Lovely generalization. As usual.

open question to our kids here:

how do you wanna "liberate" something that was never yours???
:)

wake up, don´t fool yourself...

and to EA:
" With Kosova's independence the Balkans border are sealed for ever!
(EA, 17 May 2008 22:21)

the borders are sealed, by the UN-Charter... and you can talk all day, write your fingers off, and yell and scream, ...but Kosovo is serbian territory, and it´s only a question of time until it is re-integrated again.

until then, you are of course free to dream your greater-albanian illusions...

(Richard Z, 18 May 2008 09:34)

Richard, Albanians have not stolen anything- they have only liberated their land.

Kosova was stolen from Albania that's why we have this conflict.

What's there stolen in 90% of a land that is Albanian- to be ruled by Albanians? that's a normal, natural thing- it's democracy DEMOS- CARTIA you know teh etymology of the word democracy don’t you?

A land of 90% of Albanians to be ruled by Serbs is a theft.

The political project to be attributed to the entire nation is just wrong. It’s not Albanians it’s a group of ppl that have formed a movement.

Anyhow, Albanians have been proved to be a factor of stability in the Balkans. The destabilizing factor are those who started wars in Slovenia, Croatia, Bosnia, Kosova- to many wars to be on the right side and to be declared as stabilization factor don’t you think??? How it’s possible that you forget this things.

The same those forces now are destabilizing the young democracy of Kosova and will try to divide her in ethnical basis despite that the Ahtisari plan gives the greatest minority rights on earth furthermore guaranteed by the international community.

I don't know why they bother. They will never be able to separate from whatever countries they live in, except through force, if they do that, NATO will bomb them back to the stone age and that will be the end of their dream (and if they think NATO will stand for it, they are in for a rather rude shock, I think).

What a trash article with trash comments.

(Jason Klein, 17 May 2008 22:30)

Please learn more Albanian history and stop making up facts. I think Bangladesh is the most corrupt in the world --- not Albania. Furthermore, they want to reunite Shqiperine etnike (ethnic Albania) not "greater Albania); there is a big difference.

I am glad to see that the Chauvinist attitude of the Serbs is alive and well. Reading the comments on this article by Serbs makes it crystal clear on why the Serbs lost all their endeavors,and why the West always supported the other side. If you cannot understand what I am saying, that is even MORE proof of how limited your vision is.

Now, 10% of KosovO Albanians (200K) live in Switzerland. Considering their birthrate that will be about 9 Million by August. Wander if US will be quick to recognize the inDependent Albanian state of SwitzerlandA.

Modern day "ethnic Albania" should be realized. Of course this would cause much complications and perhaps open Pandora's box.

Well, all wounds heal after you stop cutting them...

Serbia's knife no longer cuts the Albania-Kosovo border, so the healing process is already beginning.

They're already merging their economy and educational markets. Why would they want to remain 2 separate countries, when they can consolidate everything into one.

More cost effective. I'd give this unification thingy just about 10 years. I think we'll still be in our youth years when we see it happen.

"Please learn more Albanian history and stop making up facts. I think Bangladesh is the most corrupt in the world --- not Albania. Furthermore, they want to reunite Shqiperine etnike (ethnic Albania) not "greater Albania); there is a big difference.
(KV, 18 May 2008 04:12) "

KV, I didn't single out Albania as 'the' most corrupt country but just 'one of' the most corrupt countries. Regardless of where Albania ranks on the various worldwide reports published regarding corruption - the fact is that they appear time and time again. The following list was from the BBC a few months ago:

Percentage of people who paid a bribe in the past 12 months (Source: Transparency International)

Cameroon - 79%
Cambodia - 72%
Albania - 71%
Kosovo - 67%
FYR Macedonia - 44%
Pakistan - 44%
Nigeria - 40%
Senegal - 38%
Romania - 33%
Philippines - 32%

As far as 'greater Albania' or 'ethnic Albania', is it not enough that Albanian's already have a country? I can sympathize with you that there are likely many areas in the Balkans that have cultural or historical importance to the Albanians but the same can be said for most of the other people in the region - does that mean that everyone should stake claim to whichever piece of land deemed important to them?

To respond to Qafir Arnaut's comment:

"Albanians will decide when they finally understand how they are seen (read Jason Klein's comments here) by others...and this 'unification ' that scares all the slavs here will happen naturally. "

I don't see all Albanians as bad people, in my original comments I was pointing that a union between Albania and Kosovo would hardly be a viable partnership considering the economic and political situations. My comments were also a rebuttal to all those who commented before the UDI that there was no intention of joining Kosovo to Albania.

If my comments came across as 'harsh' to the Albanian camp then maybe it's my frustration showing that whenever I read the international news there are articles that Albanians in Montenegro are not happy or the Albanians in Macedonia are making certain demands - if you are already living in a sovereign nation, why not respect the integrity of that country. When is it enough?

And Qafir - even though I'm not Slavic, you're comment which says the unification that scares all slavs will happen naturally scares me too. I can't help but think of the quote 'give you an inch and you'll take a mile'.

Albania and Kosova are one and the same. Same language, same culture, etc. Kosova's unification with Albania would make a lot more sense than Kosova under a foreign Serbia, as it was a few years ago. Well anyways, borders don't really matter much in the EU. Whether under one country or not, the two countries are and will be closer than ever.
Cheers.

don't worry serbian,you no longer can decide what albanians can do....
We will unite if we want it and you will just have to accept it,because none of us is asking you what you think of it! So don't bother for us!

Let us call it what it really is - European Caliphate to be merged with Eurabia, and the Ottomon Empire in a decade or two.

Time for Slavs to get on the act as we are inching towards WWIII thanks to the Saudis, and the EU/State Department.

What a mess they have created for next generations

This messianic Albania these fellers want to create wont come about until the very moment before the existence both entities (the ottoman vilayet of Kosovo, and the Ottoman vilayet of Scutari) is threatened.

Kosovo's consitution does not allow merger with any other state, the same way the Kingdom of Albania's (1930s)consitution did not provide for any mergers.

Albanians will decide when they finally understand how they are seen (read Jason Klein's comments here) by others...and this 'unification ' that scares all the slavs here will happen naturally.

there wont be a need for a political party. until then, biz as usual. This political party wont even make ONE headline unless it blows something up

When couple of years ago articles were reading about Kosovo's independence, all of you living in "democratic Serbia" were so sceptical this will never happen, well as you can see it happened. Now, with the unification, I will asure all of you sceptics, we just need time to do it and it will come the same way as Independence came.

Peter Sudyka,

You have been/are definitely the most prominent icon on this forum especially because as a polish, uncommonly you seemt to be the best advocate of Serbian movement for protection against the “west” which wants to destroy the pivot of the world called Serbia. Unfortunately you try sometimes with information and MANY times with disinformation.

“They obviously didn't help the Albanians in Macedonia and in Presevo when they fought to break away from Macedonia and Serbia respectively, why should anyone help you now”

First of all, for the time being NATO is on our side. The reasons are clear and there is no need to repeat them again. Are you a toy of Serbian propaganda or are you able to think and to make conclusions!!! Who told you that the Albanians in Macedonia and Presevo wanted to break away? I have never seen any statements (officially) from them with such purposes. The Albanians in Macedonia and Presevo fought for their ELEMENTARY RIGHTS which were set aside by the respective governments. With 40 % Albanian population Macedonia was a pure Slavic Macedonian controlled country while the others got no jobs no education in their mother languages no identity. After the war in 2001 they become very generous and that is the way how they behavior.
Please don’t spread such lies anymore and DON’T be a toy of Serbian radical propaganda. The polish people are respected among Albanians.

Peter,

I have absolutely nothing against criticism but you better bring some good arguments in order to make it reliable. Nationalist elements are everywhere in every part of the globe. In our case I can say that the ones who aims to unifications, despite of the wishes, has not had the support of the Albanians especially from Albania. Our history of the past, history of the division is very sad but nowadays is more important to look forward than backward. As for Kosova I think the explanation is not necessary. My point of view has always been that the Serbs themselves caused the Kosova independence through their behavior, treatments and finally the war in 1999.

The situation in Macedonia war much different than in Kosova and the Albanians there had fewer reasons for independence than Kosovars. Of course there were some nationalist’s elements but at the end they got not support neither from leaders of NLA or the populations and politics.

Regards,
Endri

"...Otherwise no-one can deny anymore that granting Kosovo independence was a big mistake. Creating more instability, and more problems in the region instead of solving everything.
(Richard Z, 18 May 2008 09:34) "

It was probably a smaller mistake, than to leave Balkan unbalanced where the serbs had the poewr, it did not need more then 10 yrs to show, what the serbs can do, so Europe and USA just have learned from their mistakes.
By the way , there can not be anymore "Berlin walls" in Europe, so for you serbs is to decide, you want to be in or just isolated, as this map shows : http://europa.eu/abc/maps/index_en.htm
The bad thing is that you are isolated from the russian bretheren also ;).
So if you want to stay as you are , you will not have the power to slow down the process, becouse we Kosova, and also Albania, is getting there.

...but Kosovo is serbian territory, and it´s only a question of time until it is re-integrated again.

until then, you are of course free to dream your greater-albanian illusions...
(Jovan, 18 May 2008 16:05)

Jovan

You are already an icon in this side.

Let me tell you this story:
USA and Western Countries want to create a "Israel" in Balkans; luckily this part of cake belongs to Albanians.

guess who's got the slice of cake labeled "Palestines" in Balkans?
Tell me that in your next comment.

P.S.

As far as the question about Kosovo: who was first there the Albanians or Serbs? I have a hint:
First you should solve the riddle who was first the egg or the hen.

By the way USA and Europe don't give a demn who was there first; they want the "Israel" there. Period.

I think is gonna take some time for you guys to get that.

Jason Klein,
Albania may be poor and Kosovo corrupt! But Albanians as people, as nation, as ethnic group are the most ancient Europeans.
Yes, we've been conquered by Roman Empire, Byzantinnes, Ottomans and Slavs as the last ones. Now it is our era. This is our century in Balkans.
Definitively not with romantic ideas like this one. But with competitive economies in Balkans and by the youngest dynamic population in Balkans and Europe.

The abovementioned political party has less than 1% of the Kosova's electorate!
Although they have right to use democratic means to achieve their aims and program!

moisi

Albanians have a homeland already, jews at that time didn't, that's the difference. What makes you think NATO wants to create an ethnic Albania? They obviously didn't help the Albanians in Macedonia and in Presevo when they fought to break away from Macedonia and Serbia respectively, why should anyone help you now?

If Albanians elsewhere get too confident because of Kosovo, they will be left with a very bitter taste after NATO stands against them and on the side of Macedonia and Serbia, which they will, as NATO is biased towards Albanians and against Serbs/Macedonians, it depends on who is in the wrong and who is not, and if Albanians try to separate, they will be in the wrong and at NATO's mercy.

The reason why I criticise Albanians here, for example, is that they are doing everything they can to integrate into the Euro-Atlantic organizations, but at the same time some elements are striving for a nationalistically bound ethnic state, which is totally in contradiction with the morals, values and policies of Western mentality and politics, considering there are many minorities living in Europe in different countries, but one does not hear them wanting to break away and rejoining their ethnic homeland, so why should Albanians be different? Do you see my arguement here?

(Peter Sudyka, 20 May 2008 08:49)

Peter,
I see your point but your argument is flawed as it is inaccurate to suggest that Kosovo's quest for independence is in contradiction 'with the morals, values and policies of Western mentality and politics'. If that was the case, these countries would have not recognized Kosovo's independence. Most, if not all, western countries were built as nation-states and then integrated not only into the EU but also in the overall globalizing processes on their own terms.

Furthermore, we're not trying to build an ethnic state but a state of all citizens of Kosovo. Kosovo's constitution is one of the most inclusive ones around. If you look at the Serbian and Macedonian constitutions you'll see that they define these two countries as belonging to Serbs and Macedonians first and to other citizens second.

In addition, we're not looking to rejoin any other country but to develop as an independent state and join the EU. You cannot claim that this new movement represents the views of all Albanians anymore than you can about other radical movements all over Europe. Besides, the Serbian Radical Party have openly said that they regret that Milosevic never finished what he started, i.e. the Greater Serbia, and they are the largest political party in the Serbian Parliament and about to form a government. However, even they do not represent the views of all Serbs.

Finally, and most importantly, the minorities you refer to have not in their recent history faced the same discrimination, persecution and atrocities Albanians in Kosovo have by consecutive Yugoslav and Serbian regimes. According to many scholars (Hobsbawm being one), the states you refer to avoid claims for self-determination by their minorities by granting them autonomy and self-rule in the areas where they constitute a majority. In Kosovo's case, Serbia refused to talk about anything until the war started and they were faced with use of force, in other words - until it was too late. Although, I'm not so sure the analogy works in the case of Kosovo as Kosovo's independence should be seen as part of a larger process - that of disintegration of Yugoslavia, and just like the other nations of SFRY did, so did the Albanians have the moral and legal right to go their own way. States claim sovereignty on behalf of their citizens so when they violate their citizens' basic human rights they violate their own sovereignty. And that's what's different about the Albanians.

Regards,

Duro wrote: "Hahaha..."
Hahaha, Duro?! We are independent state and we can decide with majority of people about unification with Albania. OK.,I know what Ahtisari Plan says: "...no unification with any other state...", but believe me that very soon you will be convinced for this. Why not with Albania? Better than you with Russia.

Kosova is now an independent country and as such it should develop on its own way. Despite of our wish, the unification will come when we all balkan coutries one day will be part of EU. With proper leadership, support, laws and rights for all citizens, Kosova will make more steaps forward as separate country.

Jovan,
Time ago I gently asked you to show one only political map of before 1912 to include Kosova inside the Serbian State.
I've never seen such a map, can you help.

Another fact: until 1912 Serbia was represented in Pristina by a General Consulate. How can Serbia have a General Consulate in its "own territory".

To all,
I have, unsuccessfully, to draw attention to two critical facts regarding the Kosova question:
1-for the first time in the history Kosova figured inside the political map of the Serbian state in 1912 and never before;
2- Until 1912 Serbia had its General Consulate in Pristina.

If the above is true and nobody (as it's happened till now)can prove it's a wrong statement, isn't it the right time for Serbia to RE-OPEN the GENERAL CONSULATE or better its Embassy in Pristina???

when radicals win elections in serbia, why not in kosova be established a Unification Party. As we are asking about unification of sweeds with russians. Is about albanians and albanians. Ok? cheers

I love these "statisticians" that never include Serbia in their "analysis" ;))

I had to deal with Serbian Administration and my colleagues too(from EU)- and both of us got the same answer- corruption is business- as- usual in Serbia.

BKK: I was just describing the facts of not more than 10 years ago- if the voice of opposition in Serbia to those events is still almost inexistent the conclusions are just a rational event-following reckoning...

Endri

Thanks for your reply, but you definitely understand me wrong as far as being only on Serbia's side in all this. I agree and disagree with the arguments of both sides and don't stick to one.

The reason why I criticise Albanians here, for example, is that they are doing everything they can to integrate into the Euro-Atlantic organizations, but at the same time some elements are striving for a nationalistically bound ethnic state, which is totally in contradiction with the morals, values and policies of Western mentality and politics, considering there are many minorities living in Europe in different countries, but one does not hear them wanting to break away and rejoining their ethnic homeland, so why should Albanians be different? Do you see my arguement here?

However, the other day, for example, I criticized several Serbian arguments that tried to portray the US and EU as rotting, dying states, while Russia, China and India are the beacons of civilization, or how EU integration would destroy Serbia's culture or heritage.

While both Serbs and Albanians here criticize me of not being impartial when they see me criticize them, I do my best to be impartial.

BTW While I understand that many Albanians did not want to separate in the Presevo and Macedonia conflicts, they just wanted equal rights, those that did most of the fighting (NLA in Macedonia and UCPMB in Serbia) were for the reunification of Albanians lands with Albania and Kosovo respectively, and this is definitely not Serbian propaganda, this was in the Western media as well.

Both Albanians and Serbians are respected by myself for various reasons, though if I criticize some of the ideas of one side, does not mean I stand exclusively with the other or for the other. Hope I clarified myself here.

Regards

This kind of "movement" have the support of only few people and their families and might be used only to draw attention that "we are here".
The future of all Albanians is in EU like every other Balkan countries. Anything else is just propaganda. No change of borders anymore! With Kosova's independence the Balkans border are sealed for ever!

"Albanians form "movement for unification"'

I am Albanian and have not adhered to this movement- so according to B92 I am not part of the Albanian nation anymore?

When you Serbs will get rid of this Bolshevik culture- to label, generalize, and discredit entire nation/s?

You cannot be a persecutor and a judge, ok?

Anyhow, this "movement" looks like a poor copy of the Milosevic's politics of the Serbian unification-we all now how it ended... lessons from the contep. history folks in prishtina? ;)

(Jason Klein, 17 May 2008 22:30)

Please learn more Albanian history and stop making up facts. I think Bangladesh is the most corrupt in the world --- not Albania. Furthermore, they want to reunite Shqiperine etnike (ethnic Albania) not "greater Albania); there is a big difference.

(Richard Z, 18 May 2008 09:34)

Richard, Albanians have not stolen anything- they have only liberated their land.

Kosova was stolen from Albania that's why we have this conflict.

What's there stolen in 90% of a land that is Albanian- to be ruled by Albanians? that's a normal, natural thing- it's democracy DEMOS- CARTIA you know teh etymology of the word democracy don’t you?

A land of 90% of Albanians to be ruled by Serbs is a theft.

The political project to be attributed to the entire nation is just wrong. It’s not Albanians it’s a group of ppl that have formed a movement.

Anyhow, Albanians have been proved to be a factor of stability in the Balkans. The destabilizing factor are those who started wars in Slovenia, Croatia, Bosnia, Kosova- to many wars to be on the right side and to be declared as stabilization factor don’t you think??? How it’s possible that you forget this things.

The same those forces now are destabilizing the young democracy of Kosova and will try to divide her in ethnical basis despite that the Ahtisari plan gives the greatest minority rights on earth furthermore guaranteed by the international community.

What a trash article with trash comments.

how do you wanna "liberate" something that was never yours???
-------------------------

Want to take us to court over it? Considering how the legal owner of Kosovo, the Ottoman Empire, recognized it as a consitutent part of an autonomous Albania (within the Empire), and considering that it has had an Albanian majority population since the the 17th century, and considering that there was a substantial Albainan byzantine presence since ...forever...
i think we have a pretty good case it is ours

I am glad to see that the Chauvinist attitude of the Serbs is alive and well. Reading the comments on this article by Serbs makes it crystal clear on why the Serbs lost all their endeavors,and why the West always supported the other side. If you cannot understand what I am saying, that is even MORE proof of how limited your vision is.

Hahaha what clowns! We'll see how far their "unification" gets.

Modern day "ethnic Albania" should be realized. Of course this would cause much complications and perhaps open Pandora's box.

I'm an Albanian and I can tell you right now that I want nothing to do with this. He doesn't speak for me or any of the people I know.

Whoever that guy is, he only speaks for his own party's benefit, not Albanians'.

And to B92: Lovely generalization. As usual.

"...Otherwise no-one can deny anymore that granting Kosovo independence was a big mistake. Creating more instability, and more problems in the region instead of solving everything.
(Richard Z, 18 May 2008 09:34) "

It was probably a smaller mistake, than to leave Balkan unbalanced where the serbs had the poewr, it did not need more then 10 yrs to show, what the serbs can do, so Europe and USA just have learned from their mistakes.
By the way , there can not be anymore "Berlin walls" in Europe, so for you serbs is to decide, you want to be in or just isolated, as this map shows : http://europa.eu/abc/maps/index_en.htm
The bad thing is that you are isolated from the russian bretheren also ;).
So if you want to stay as you are , you will not have the power to slow down the process, becouse we Kosova, and also Albania, is getting there.

Well, all wounds heal after you stop cutting them...

Serbia's knife no longer cuts the Albania-Kosovo border, so the healing process is already beginning.

They're already merging their economy and educational markets. Why would they want to remain 2 separate countries, when they can consolidate everything into one.

More cost effective. I'd give this unification thingy just about 10 years. I think we'll still be in our youth years when we see it happen.

What on apetite albanians have.Too bad this is no news to either Montenegrians or Macedonians and that`s why they have some sitting in jails -where terrorist belong.

The unification of one of the most corrupt countries on the planet (Albania) and one of the most destitute and impoverished regions (Kosovo) -- what a noble cause!! and a great match.
It speaks volumes to those who said this wasn't an Albanian land grab and that there was no intention of creating a greater Albania!

Unification of Albanian territories is one way to put it. Greater Albania is another. I am glad they finally admit their real goals. Now it will be much easier to win debates against people who still defend an independent Kosovo and recognition of it.

What a boring story!

It's the usual albanian trick, with Thaci and co behind it.

It goes like this, create a small, phantom organization that is 'much more' militant than those in power.

1: You immediately look more 'moderate'

2: You promise the 'International Community'
that you will do all you can to keep a lid on it, but it 'may be difficult' as it is a reflection of 'real anger' against the continued presence of EU overlords and the Serbs (of course). So, the EU will rely on war criminals to stop terrorists.

3: You can create as many groups as you like and when you like. They will come an go depending on political expedience.

4: Thaci and co. will never allow any 'real' threat to their economic or political power base, so such groups if not created are tolerated. If they get to big for their boots, then someone falls down the stairs.

5: Such groups serve as a tool for Thaci and co to channel potential popular anger and frustration away from their own corrupt practices and failure to introduce real law reforms and equality before the law for all albanians, considering such great things were promised by 'independence', yet law and reform will fundamentally undermine Thaci and co's 'little' empire.

6: Always create new enemies, regardless of your own responsiblity. You can then claim leadership and avoid taking responsiblities for your own lack of action.

7: Continue the vicious circle ad nausiam.

An example of one of Thaci's groups is Kurti's 'Independence' group...

Well, as long as the boys get to keep their riches.

Ben,

if the oldest material record of Serbian existence on KiM back date to 5th,6th,7th... century and Albanian material records date from 18th century but predominantly from 19th and 20th century, how could it be that Serbs stole KiM from Albanians as you are claiming?
Please spare me of the Ilirs and Dardans story, they are to Albanians as much as Normans, Celts or Romans are to Serbs.
And stop spreading lies on this site.

Albania and Kosova are one and the same. Same language, same culture, etc. Kosova's unification with Albania would make a lot more sense than Kosova under a foreign Serbia, as it was a few years ago. Well anyways, borders don't really matter much in the EU. Whether under one country or not, the two countries are and will be closer than ever.
Cheers.

WAKE UP! GET A PASSPORT - Then tell me who you are!! HA

This messianic Albania these fellers want to create wont come about until the very moment before the existence both entities (the ottoman vilayet of Kosovo, and the Ottoman vilayet of Scutari) is threatened.

Kosovo's consitution does not allow merger with any other state, the same way the Kingdom of Albania's (1930s)consitution did not provide for any mergers.

Albanians will decide when they finally understand how they are seen (read Jason Klein's comments here) by others...and this 'unification ' that scares all the slavs here will happen naturally.

there wont be a need for a political party. until then, biz as usual. This political party wont even make ONE headline unless it blows something up

don't worry serbian,you no longer can decide what albanians can do....
We will unite if we want it and you will just have to accept it,because none of us is asking you what you think of it! So don't bother for us!

Endri

Thanks for your reply, but you definitely understand me wrong as far as being only on Serbia's side in all this. I agree and disagree with the arguments of both sides and don't stick to one.

The reason why I criticise Albanians here, for example, is that they are doing everything they can to integrate into the Euro-Atlantic organizations, but at the same time some elements are striving for a nationalistically bound ethnic state, which is totally in contradiction with the morals, values and policies of Western mentality and politics, considering there are many minorities living in Europe in different countries, but one does not hear them wanting to break away and rejoining their ethnic homeland, so why should Albanians be different? Do you see my arguement here?

However, the other day, for example, I criticized several Serbian arguments that tried to portray the US and EU as rotting, dying states, while Russia, China and India are the beacons of civilization, or how EU integration would destroy Serbia's culture or heritage.

While both Serbs and Albanians here criticize me of not being impartial when they see me criticize them, I do my best to be impartial.

BTW While I understand that many Albanians did not want to separate in the Presevo and Macedonia conflicts, they just wanted equal rights, those that did most of the fighting (NLA in Macedonia and UCPMB in Serbia) were for the reunification of Albanians lands with Albania and Kosovo respectively, and this is definitely not Serbian propaganda, this was in the Western media as well.

Both Albanians and Serbians are respected by myself for various reasons, though if I criticize some of the ideas of one side, does not mean I stand exclusively with the other or for the other. Hope I clarified myself here.

Regards

Modern day "ethnic Albania" should be realized. Of course this would cause much complications and perhaps open Pandora's box.
(KV, 17 May 2008 21:21)

Modern day democratic, multi-ethnic "Albanoslavia" from Vardar to Triglav (don't forget Varna, too!) should be realized. Of course this would remove much complications and perhaps close Pandora's box. Enough border-surgeries and ethnic experiments.

There is a multi-ethnic and DEMOCRATIC and STRONG India which kind of works (just a sample). The language spoken in Punjab and language spoken in Tamil-Nadu are further apart (one is Indo-European, the other an exotic agglutinative), than Albanian and Russian (both Indo-European). Economic differences between Tamil-Nadu and Punjab are greater than between Albania, Slovenia, Russia, USA. This is just a mild hint, what can be done.

Ben so according to you this movement dont'exist of Albanians? Not sure I understand your point.

I trust the majority of the Albanians disaprove of this movement, and the goverment in Pristina does everything to disolve the movement and to show that Kosovo is the last piece of terority they have stolen, not the first. Otherwise no-one can deny anymore that granting Kosovo independence was a big mistake. Creating more instability, and more problems in the region instead of solving everything.

I love these "statisticians" that never include Serbia in their "analysis" ;))

I had to deal with Serbian Administration and my colleagues too(from EU)- and both of us got the same answer- corruption is business- as- usual in Serbia.

BKK: I was just describing the facts of not more than 10 years ago- if the voice of opposition in Serbia to those events is still almost inexistent the conclusions are just a rational event-following reckoning...

Duro wrote: "Hahaha..."
Hahaha, Duro?! We are independent state and we can decide with majority of people about unification with Albania. OK.,I know what Ahtisari Plan says: "...no unification with any other state...", but believe me that very soon you will be convinced for this. Why not with Albania? Better than you with Russia.

I don't know why they bother. They will never be able to separate from whatever countries they live in, except through force, if they do that, NATO will bomb them back to the stone age and that will be the end of their dream (and if they think NATO will stand for it, they are in for a rather rude shock, I think).

Let us call it what it really is - European Caliphate to be merged with Eurabia, and the Ottomon Empire in a decade or two.

Time for Slavs to get on the act as we are inching towards WWIII thanks to the Saudis, and the EU/State Department.

What a mess they have created for next generations

when radicals win elections in serbia, why not in kosova be established a Unification Party. As we are asking about unification of sweeds with russians. Is about albanians and albanians. Ok? cheers

Jason Klein,
Albania may be poor and Kosovo corrupt! But Albanians as people, as nation, as ethnic group are the most ancient Europeans.
Yes, we've been conquered by Roman Empire, Byzantinnes, Ottomans and Slavs as the last ones. Now it is our era. This is our century in Balkans.
Definitively not with romantic ideas like this one. But with competitive economies in Balkans and by the youngest dynamic population in Balkans and Europe.

The abovementioned political party has less than 1% of the Kosova's electorate!
Although they have right to use democratic means to achieve their aims and program!

moisi

Albanians have a homeland already, jews at that time didn't, that's the difference. What makes you think NATO wants to create an ethnic Albania? They obviously didn't help the Albanians in Macedonia and in Presevo when they fought to break away from Macedonia and Serbia respectively, why should anyone help you now?

If Albanians elsewhere get too confident because of Kosovo, they will be left with a very bitter taste after NATO stands against them and on the side of Macedonia and Serbia, which they will, as NATO is biased towards Albanians and against Serbs/Macedonians, it depends on who is in the wrong and who is not, and if Albanians try to separate, they will be in the wrong and at NATO's mercy.

Peter Sudyka,

You have been/are definitely the most prominent icon on this forum especially because as a polish, uncommonly you seemt to be the best advocate of Serbian movement for protection against the “west” which wants to destroy the pivot of the world called Serbia. Unfortunately you try sometimes with information and MANY times with disinformation.

“They obviously didn't help the Albanians in Macedonia and in Presevo when they fought to break away from Macedonia and Serbia respectively, why should anyone help you now”

First of all, for the time being NATO is on our side. The reasons are clear and there is no need to repeat them again. Are you a toy of Serbian propaganda or are you able to think and to make conclusions!!! Who told you that the Albanians in Macedonia and Presevo wanted to break away? I have never seen any statements (officially) from them with such purposes. The Albanians in Macedonia and Presevo fought for their ELEMENTARY RIGHTS which were set aside by the respective governments. With 40 % Albanian population Macedonia was a pure Slavic Macedonian controlled country while the others got no jobs no education in their mother languages no identity. After the war in 2001 they become very generous and that is the way how they behavior.
Please don’t spread such lies anymore and DON’T be a toy of Serbian radical propaganda. The polish people are respected among Albanians.

Im so confused.......how can albania unify with itself?
how can one country be unified with itself?
if theyre talking about kosovo, theyre dead out of luck....... for "unification of all albanian territories" and theres only one albanian territory, albania. wow they don't get much more pathetic than the albanian officials.

This declaration was entirely predictable. It has been reported and commented on since 1970's. The movement had received tacit support from Albania for the better part of 4 decades. Emboldened by the recent USA-EU support for Kosovo's independence Albanians feel their integration is now one giant step closer than ever before.

It could also be a sinister eu ploy to influence in Serbia the formation of a pro-EU government coallition, on the basis that there is salvation in a borderless EU.

Let’s see how long it takes USA and EU to denounce this act of agression against Montenegro, Macedonia, Greece and Serbia.

No well-meaning leftie can argue that Project Greater Albania is fiction.

open question to our kids here:

how do you wanna "liberate" something that was never yours???
:)

wake up, don´t fool yourself...

and to EA:
" With Kosova's independence the Balkans border are sealed for ever!
(EA, 17 May 2008 22:21)

the borders are sealed, by the UN-Charter... and you can talk all day, write your fingers off, and yell and scream, ...but Kosovo is serbian territory, and it´s only a question of time until it is re-integrated again.

until then, you are of course free to dream your greater-albanian illusions...

ben,

Let me humour you. You just condemned Serbs for generalisation, by generalising all Serbs. You're hilarious.

As for this movement - what an eloquent example to illustrate that Hitler is dead, but his ideas are not.
Greater Albania in the making, centralisation of Europe, ethnic cleansing of those who oppose this new regime - Hitler would be proud.

"Please learn more Albanian history and stop making up facts. I think Bangladesh is the most corrupt in the world --- not Albania. Furthermore, they want to reunite Shqiperine etnike (ethnic Albania) not "greater Albania); there is a big difference.
(KV, 18 May 2008 04:12) "

KV, I didn't single out Albania as 'the' most corrupt country but just 'one of' the most corrupt countries. Regardless of where Albania ranks on the various worldwide reports published regarding corruption - the fact is that they appear time and time again. The following list was from the BBC a few months ago:

Percentage of people who paid a bribe in the past 12 months (Source: Transparency International)

Cameroon - 79%
Cambodia - 72%
Albania - 71%
Kosovo - 67%
FYR Macedonia - 44%
Pakistan - 44%
Nigeria - 40%
Senegal - 38%
Romania - 33%
Philippines - 32%

As far as 'greater Albania' or 'ethnic Albania', is it not enough that Albanian's already have a country? I can sympathize with you that there are likely many areas in the Balkans that have cultural or historical importance to the Albanians but the same can be said for most of the other people in the region - does that mean that everyone should stake claim to whichever piece of land deemed important to them?

To respond to Qafir Arnaut's comment:

"Albanians will decide when they finally understand how they are seen (read Jason Klein's comments here) by others...and this 'unification ' that scares all the slavs here will happen naturally. "

I don't see all Albanians as bad people, in my original comments I was pointing that a union between Albania and Kosovo would hardly be a viable partnership considering the economic and political situations. My comments were also a rebuttal to all those who commented before the UDI that there was no intention of joining Kosovo to Albania.

If my comments came across as 'harsh' to the Albanian camp then maybe it's my frustration showing that whenever I read the international news there are articles that Albanians in Montenegro are not happy or the Albanians in Macedonia are making certain demands - if you are already living in a sovereign nation, why not respect the integrity of that country. When is it enough?

And Qafir - even though I'm not Slavic, you're comment which says the unification that scares all slavs will happen naturally scares me too. I can't help but think of the quote 'give you an inch and you'll take a mile'.

Now, 10% of KosovO Albanians (200K) live in Switzerland. Considering their birthrate that will be about 9 Million by August. Wander if US will be quick to recognize the inDependent Albanian state of SwitzerlandA.

...but Kosovo is serbian territory, and it´s only a question of time until it is re-integrated again.

until then, you are of course free to dream your greater-albanian illusions...
(Jovan, 18 May 2008 16:05)

Jovan

You are already an icon in this side.

Let me tell you this story:
USA and Western Countries want to create a "Israel" in Balkans; luckily this part of cake belongs to Albanians.

guess who's got the slice of cake labeled "Palestines" in Balkans?
Tell me that in your next comment.

P.S.

As far as the question about Kosovo: who was first there the Albanians or Serbs? I have a hint:
First you should solve the riddle who was first the egg or the hen.

By the way USA and Europe don't give a demn who was there first; they want the "Israel" there. Period.

I think is gonna take some time for you guys to get that.

When couple of years ago articles were reading about Kosovo's independence, all of you living in "democratic Serbia" were so sceptical this will never happen, well as you can see it happened. Now, with the unification, I will asure all of you sceptics, we just need time to do it and it will come the same way as Independence came.

Kosova is now an independent country and as such it should develop on its own way. Despite of our wish, the unification will come when we all balkan coutries one day will be part of EU. With proper leadership, support, laws and rights for all citizens, Kosova will make more steaps forward as separate country.

Jovan,
Time ago I gently asked you to show one only political map of before 1912 to include Kosova inside the Serbian State.
I've never seen such a map, can you help.

Another fact: until 1912 Serbia was represented in Pristina by a General Consulate. How can Serbia have a General Consulate in its "own territory".

Peter,

I have absolutely nothing against criticism but you better bring some good arguments in order to make it reliable. Nationalist elements are everywhere in every part of the globe. In our case I can say that the ones who aims to unifications, despite of the wishes, has not had the support of the Albanians especially from Albania. Our history of the past, history of the division is very sad but nowadays is more important to look forward than backward. As for Kosova I think the explanation is not necessary. My point of view has always been that the Serbs themselves caused the Kosova independence through their behavior, treatments and finally the war in 1999.

The situation in Macedonia war much different than in Kosova and the Albanians there had fewer reasons for independence than Kosovars. Of course there were some nationalist’s elements but at the end they got not support neither from leaders of NLA or the populations and politics.

Regards,
Endri

The reason why I criticise Albanians here, for example, is that they are doing everything they can to integrate into the Euro-Atlantic organizations, but at the same time some elements are striving for a nationalistically bound ethnic state, which is totally in contradiction with the morals, values and policies of Western mentality and politics, considering there are many minorities living in Europe in different countries, but one does not hear them wanting to break away and rejoining their ethnic homeland, so why should Albanians be different? Do you see my arguement here?

(Peter Sudyka, 20 May 2008 08:49)

Peter,
I see your point but your argument is flawed as it is inaccurate to suggest that Kosovo's quest for independence is in contradiction 'with the morals, values and policies of Western mentality and politics'. If that was the case, these countries would have not recognized Kosovo's independence. Most, if not all, western countries were built as nation-states and then integrated not only into the EU but also in the overall globalizing processes on their own terms.

Furthermore, we're not trying to build an ethnic state but a state of all citizens of Kosovo. Kosovo's constitution is one of the most inclusive ones around. If you look at the Serbian and Macedonian constitutions you'll see that they define these two countries as belonging to Serbs and Macedonians first and to other citizens second.

In addition, we're not looking to rejoin any other country but to develop as an independent state and join the EU. You cannot claim that this new movement represents the views of all Albanians anymore than you can about other radical movements all over Europe. Besides, the Serbian Radical Party have openly said that they regret that Milosevic never finished what he started, i.e. the Greater Serbia, and they are the largest political party in the Serbian Parliament and about to form a government. However, even they do not represent the views of all Serbs.

Finally, and most importantly, the minorities you refer to have not in their recent history faced the same discrimination, persecution and atrocities Albanians in Kosovo have by consecutive Yugoslav and Serbian regimes. According to many scholars (Hobsbawm being one), the states you refer to avoid claims for self-determination by their minorities by granting them autonomy and self-rule in the areas where they constitute a majority. In Kosovo's case, Serbia refused to talk about anything until the war started and they were faced with use of force, in other words - until it was too late. Although, I'm not so sure the analogy works in the case of Kosovo as Kosovo's independence should be seen as part of a larger process - that of disintegration of Yugoslavia, and just like the other nations of SFRY did, so did the Albanians have the moral and legal right to go their own way. States claim sovereignty on behalf of their citizens so when they violate their citizens' basic human rights they violate their own sovereignty. And that's what's different about the Albanians.

Regards,

To all,
I have, unsuccessfully, to draw attention to two critical facts regarding the Kosova question:
1-for the first time in the history Kosova figured inside the political map of the Serbian state in 1912 and never before;
2- Until 1912 Serbia had its General Consulate in Pristina.

If the above is true and nobody (as it's happened till now)can prove it's a wrong statement, isn't it the right time for Serbia to RE-OPEN the GENERAL CONSULATE or better its Embassy in Pristina???