Boris Tadić says he has held informal talks with the Socialists and proposed the formation of a socially responsible government guaranteeing a better life for its citizens.
After seeing how the DS (mal)treated its coalition partner Kostunica I don't think that many parties will be eager to have a coalition with them. If Tadic wants to have any chance he might better try the humble approach.
@Jan Dacic (SPS) declared in an interview: "We will never again support anybody's minority government. That is definite. Those who are offering us minority support are doing so to undermine us. Who wants to cooperate with us has to do so publicly" which seems to support my point of view. Have a look at the interview yourself: http://www.slobodan-milosevic.org/news/vn050908.htm
@John - excellent response. So the is not the attempts to influence the election, but the covert and illegal transfer and spending of money.
I guess I could ask if Fiat got some special exemptions from these money transfereing rules when they decided to buy this Zavasta(?) plant, but I am sure that is covered by some other law.
@Joachim - my point was, that it is not, by definition, against democracy, to have minority governments. A lot of postings here seem to believe that politics is only about counting to 126. Minority governments are not the most stable form of governments, but it can work. E.g. are you sure the SPS will join in a vote-of-no-confidence? At the first possible moment, or will they perhaps sit back, evaluate the situation, and see how bad a DS-lead coalition would be?
this kostunica is holding serbia back ! he is "a spanner in the works" as we say . some one do something ! get rid of him ! let serbia move forward for gods sake !
Jan, I agree with you when you write: "According to our
constitution, the requirement is that the sitting government
don't have a majority vote AGAINST it.
On many occasions, for many years, we have had minority (coalition) governments. If the opposition wanted to oust the sitting government and force a election, they had to call a Vote-of-no-confidence in the parliament and show that a majority of the parliament was against the sitting government."
The fact is that the Canak, Dinkic, Tadic coalition doesn't have a majority (126 MP's) and if Tadic would try a minority government it simply would immediately be ousted by a vote of non-confidence of the parliament.
So I don't see very well where's the point of your post.
Thanks for asking about the "illegality" of the US and EU spending to influence the elections in Serbia.
The illegality takes several forms which I will list in rising order of severity...
1. Perhaps you will remember the last time you crossed a border and came to customs control. There was probably a sign saying that you had to make a declaration if you were bringing cash or convertible monetary instruments worth more than $10,000 (a common limit) into the country. As the covert spending by foreign governments in Serbia's elections is never declared, and vastly exceeds $10,000... it violates national law. For example, smuggling of funds into the US is a crime punishable by law and is subject to even more serious penalties if related to matters of state. The US government banned the Nation of Islam from accepting a publicly declared and offered gift of $2 billion that Libya wanted to send into this country to better the lives of US Muslims. Had the Nation of Islam proceeded to accept those funds they would have found themselves behind bars. What might have happened to Libya would depend on the whim of the US Secretary of State. President Milosevic trailed in the first round of the election of 2000 mainly because of the tens of millions of dollars in cash that the opposition has since admitted smuggling into Serbia in false-bottomed suitcases to influence the vote.
2. Serbia, like most countries that call themselves democratic, has electoral spending and campaigning rules. Those rules are designed to provide a level playing for the exercise of democracy. A domestic political party would face criminal charges for exceeding the legal spending limits. A foreign government's violation of those limits constitutes a crime against the Serbian state and people, as well as an infringement of their right to govern themselves independently. It constitutes a form of aggression that the US increasingly tries to use first in place of armed intervention because it is cheaper and more sellable to the American public. This approach has been formally discussed and approved here in Washington. That does not make it any less of a crime for a foreign party to introduce such funds into either the US or Serbia.
3. When two countries recognize each other and exchange diplomatic papers, they enter into an contract governed by the generally accepted precepts of international law. When the diplomatic "contracts" between Serbia and each state that maintains relations with Serbia are violated, it constitutes an infringement of the customs referred to as international law and Serbia may seek damages, just as Nicaragua (successfully) sued the US in the international court of justice for mining its harbors. (The US ignored the ruling and said the court had no jurisdiction over it.)
The fact is that the US commits countless crimes as part of its standard foreign policy procedures and covert intelligence activities such as staging coups (Venezuela), preparing the groundwork for assassinations (Chile), fabricating "color" revolutions (Ukraine, Georgia, Tibet, Lebanon, etc.). What is more serious than the criminal nature of these actions is the fact that the entire world (except the American people themselves, who are shielded from reality by US corporate media) now know that the US is not altruistically spreading democracy but instead using democracy as a vehicle for conquest... making such US "diplomacy" merely an extension of war by other means. This contravenes the principles of the US Constitution, undermines the essence of democracy itself and sets the stage for growing demands for "revenge" against America. Nothing comes from nowhere. The 9/11 attacks might well have been a taste of what such revenge is going to look like.
Violating the fundamental rules of peaceful human interaction is always morally wrong. In this case, what the US and its "Euro-Atlantic" vassals have been doing is also demonstrably illegal.
"Either he comes up with a majority of 126 MP's either he's in opposition.
That's the way it is and that's democracy!"
It is one form of democracy. As I noted here http://www.b92.net/eng/news/comments.php?nav_id=50302 , it is not unusual to have minority governments in Denmark.
John Bosnitch wrote:
"The US apparatus failed to win the election (despite spending millions to illegally influence the result)"
In what way was it illegal? Would it be illegal for me (if I had access to Bill Gates bank account) to take out full-page ads in the major Serbian newspapers for 2 weeks straight and recommend the Serbian voters to vote for mr. X ?
Why it is illegal to try to influence voters? It is not always wise, since it often back-fires, but illegal?
--
Looking at many comments on different sites most people in Serbia seem to be against the Pro European parties, so who the hell voted for Tadic and co????
Poor Tadics,
Kostunica will do everything he can to stay in power, even to take down a great county like Serbia!!! In mine opinion, you should move to Vojvodina (where you have great support) and declare independent and then you will be able to join the EU!!! Right known you already lost Belgrade—to Aleksandar Vučić and the Serb Radical Party (SRS), and soon you will lose the rest of Serbia!
Tadic is a good pupil of Pres. Bush! He is applying the "new" democracy sistem employed with Hamas in Palestine! A mayority is NOT a Mayority if it does´nt fit "your personal" WILL!!Go ahead Mr. Kostunica with 130 seats.. THIS TIME,, in the middle of EUROPE.. you have the UPPER HAND!! Good luck in the benefit of SERBIA!
Ernst - Germany
Joachim it's a real shame that despite both camps saying basicly the same things, Serbia in the E.U. but with Kosovo, they can't agree on how to move forward. The reason there was an election in the first place was that the DS and DSS cant'work together.
The thing I hoped would happen now the results has been clear was that Kostunica acknowledged he had lost, and since there was a clear suport for the E.U. he would either lend his suport to the DS or go into the oposition. But since he was lying about giving the mandate back to the people, and hasn't changed his mind a DS-DSS goverment isn't going to happen.
I can see that Tadic is desperate to form a goverment, and he doesn't word himself very well. However the rhetoric and political violence used by Kostunica but especially Mr. Ilic scares my more. It reminds me to much of what happened in the 90's. When you call about half of your citicens who suports the SAA signing traitors I am afraid where it all will end up.
Tadic can form an goverment with the SPS and one of the minority parties, which I still hope will happen, tho I am not at all sure. But it still can go either way.
“During its elections campaign, the Democratic Party of Serbia (DSS) didn’t tell its voters that it would be implementing Šešelj’s policies, and now they are fending off an electoral fiasco by manipulating and changing the will of the citizens,” said the president.”
Everyone knew that DSS would form a coalition with SRS after the election, that is no surprise, and exactly why Kostunica lost some of his support.
I like Tadic, but he should respect the will of the Serbian people who clearly said “NE” to the EU without guarantees of keeping Kosovo in Serbia. All the polls show this.
Might I remind him that Nikolic got MORE votes for President in the first round of votes.
Reading this article back-to-back with the Kostunica statement makes me wonder if Boris Tadic is losing his grip on reality. Everything that Kostunica says about the "will" of the Serbian electorate is absolutely true. I used to quite like Boris Tadic but his statements in recent days really make me wonder what planet he's living on. If he wants to be in government he's going to have to gather 126 MPs. If he can't manage that and others can, then he's in opposition and that is that.
I think the issue here that Tadic missed is does Serbia want a Prime Minister which doesn't have the support of 87 percent of the population? That isn't including votes for Ilic within the DSS/NS coalition. I think the Serbian people answered that question at the ballot box.
To be completely clear, its time that Serbia's Prime Minister has a proper mandate from the people.
Tadic is repeating a lie a thousand times to make it the truth. From the night of the election when he claimed victory when even the US-funded CeSID "monitors" confirmed that his Democratic Party had fallen far short of a majority, Tadic has been repeating his lie to the Serbian people.
Ignorance is his strength and a combination of telling the people that his DS won, then having CNN, FOX and the rest repeat that lie over satellite TV, and finally accusing Kostunica of subverting the election is setting the stage for a coup d'etat in which Tadic might unilaterally name a prime minister who does not have a parliamentary majority.
Tadic is operating by the same CIA playbook used to overthrow elected governments worldwide for decades.
The US apparatus failed to win the election (despite spending millions to illegally influence the result) and now faces a possible loss not only of their Serbian colony, but also the collapse of their Kosovo pseudo-state and the end of their Nabucco oil project which will be replaced by Russia's South Stream.
This translates to a monetary-value loss potentially far exceeding the entire cost of the Iraq fiasco -- and all for the lack of about three seats in the Serbian parliament.
Any CIA veteran will tell you the agency's instinctive response -- try to provoke a crisis that will allow Tadic, as president, to exercise extraordinary powers to stop the seating of an independent government. This approach includes offering bribes into the millions of dollars to all political parties, threatening personal travel bans, Hague indictment... the whole repertoire.
The object, as "commentator" noted above, is to provoke public violence that can be used to justify a presidential coup. The fact that the US removed Milosevic in a coup sets a precedent for their continuing conduct that can't be ignored.
Tadic and his team have nothing to lose because if they ever leave power, a forensic audit will most likely reveal massive misuses of state funds in their failed effort to steal these latest elections.
Serbia! Beware of foreign-backed agents in the highest levels of your current government! Do not be tricked by provocations. Stand behind the Radical, DSS and SPS deputies that you have elected or these could be the last even marginally fair elections for the foreseeable future.
commentator, you are quite right about political violence. You have to remember that the people behind Tadic will do anything and everything to get their man in. They have no shame and will get out their dirty book when needed.
If they are prepared to trample over international law to recognise their occupation in Kosovo, then why shouldn't they declare victory when they have lost? Or cheat or lie or deceive or any other method mentioned in their dirty book?
Fortunately, this will be their undoing and it all beings about now so watch this space.
"Tadić said the citizens' electoral will should be respected"
I can't recall that Tadic said the same thing in 2003 and 2007 when SRS was the largest partie with respectively 27,7 and 28.7%.
Tadic should stop this dirty game!
Either he comes up with a majority of 126 MP's either he's in opposition.
That's the way it is and that's democracy!
DS should invite DSS for coalition talks. That would be the best solution for Serbia! I think there would be no problem concerning the five priorities DS is insisting on once it's clear that the defense of territorial integrity is in the first place.
I've been a bit neutral about these elections till now, I was happy to accept whatever the voters decided.
However, it now looks like it is a necessity for the SRS-DSS-SPS government to be formed. If only to prove that Serbia's democracy cannot be subverted.
The DS has lost the plot... if you cannot form a majority (50% + 1 vote), then that means you cannot be the government - get this thru your heads.
The SRS seems to understand this simple formula (I remember Nikolic was gracious when he lost the presidential election by a whisker)
If you don't have the numbers, be a dilligent opposition and keep the SRS to their promises etc if they form government.
These "warnings" and "victory" declarations of Tadic are nothing more than political violence.
Stop it before their is real violence (or is that actually the plan?)
I've been a bit neutral about these elections till now, I was happy to accept whatever the voters decided.
However, it now looks like it is a necessity for the SRS-DSS-SPS government to be formed. If only to prove that Serbia's democracy cannot be subverted.
The DS has lost the plot... if you cannot form a majority (50% + 1 vote), then that means you cannot be the government - get this thru your heads.
The SRS seems to understand this simple formula (I remember Nikolic was gracious when he lost the presidential election by a whisker)
If you don't have the numbers, be a dilligent opposition and keep the SRS to their promises etc if they form government.
These "warnings" and "victory" declarations of Tadic are nothing more than political violence.
Stop it before their is real violence (or is that actually the plan?)
Tadic is repeating a lie a thousand times to make it the truth. From the night of the election when he claimed victory when even the US-funded CeSID "monitors" confirmed that his Democratic Party had fallen far short of a majority, Tadic has been repeating his lie to the Serbian people.
Ignorance is his strength and a combination of telling the people that his DS won, then having CNN, FOX and the rest repeat that lie over satellite TV, and finally accusing Kostunica of subverting the election is setting the stage for a coup d'etat in which Tadic might unilaterally name a prime minister who does not have a parliamentary majority.
Tadic is operating by the same CIA playbook used to overthrow elected governments worldwide for decades.
The US apparatus failed to win the election (despite spending millions to illegally influence the result) and now faces a possible loss not only of their Serbian colony, but also the collapse of their Kosovo pseudo-state and the end of their Nabucco oil project which will be replaced by Russia's South Stream.
This translates to a monetary-value loss potentially far exceeding the entire cost of the Iraq fiasco -- and all for the lack of about three seats in the Serbian parliament.
Any CIA veteran will tell you the agency's instinctive response -- try to provoke a crisis that will allow Tadic, as president, to exercise extraordinary powers to stop the seating of an independent government. This approach includes offering bribes into the millions of dollars to all political parties, threatening personal travel bans, Hague indictment... the whole repertoire.
The object, as "commentator" noted above, is to provoke public violence that can be used to justify a presidential coup. The fact that the US removed Milosevic in a coup sets a precedent for their continuing conduct that can't be ignored.
Tadic and his team have nothing to lose because if they ever leave power, a forensic audit will most likely reveal massive misuses of state funds in their failed effort to steal these latest elections.
Serbia! Beware of foreign-backed agents in the highest levels of your current government! Do not be tricked by provocations. Stand behind the Radical, DSS and SPS deputies that you have elected or these could be the last even marginally fair elections for the foreseeable future.
commentator, you are quite right about political violence. You have to remember that the people behind Tadic will do anything and everything to get their man in. They have no shame and will get out their dirty book when needed.
If they are prepared to trample over international law to recognise their occupation in Kosovo, then why shouldn't they declare victory when they have lost? Or cheat or lie or deceive or any other method mentioned in their dirty book?
Fortunately, this will be their undoing and it all beings about now so watch this space.
"Tadić said the citizens' electoral will should be respected"
I can't recall that Tadic said the same thing in 2003 and 2007 when SRS was the largest partie with respectively 27,7 and 28.7%.
Tadic should stop this dirty game!
Either he comes up with a majority of 126 MP's either he's in opposition.
That's the way it is and that's democracy!
Reading this article back-to-back with the Kostunica statement makes me wonder if Boris Tadic is losing his grip on reality. Everything that Kostunica says about the "will" of the Serbian electorate is absolutely true. I used to quite like Boris Tadic but his statements in recent days really make me wonder what planet he's living on. If he wants to be in government he's going to have to gather 126 MPs. If he can't manage that and others can, then he's in opposition and that is that.
Tadic is a good pupil of Pres. Bush! He is applying the "new" democracy sistem employed with Hamas in Palestine! A mayority is NOT a Mayority if it does´nt fit "your personal" WILL!!Go ahead Mr. Kostunica with 130 seats.. THIS TIME,, in the middle of EUROPE.. you have the UPPER HAND!! Good luck in the benefit of SERBIA!
Ernst - Germany
Thanks for asking about the "illegality" of the US and EU spending to influence the elections in Serbia.
The illegality takes several forms which I will list in rising order of severity...
1. Perhaps you will remember the last time you crossed a border and came to customs control. There was probably a sign saying that you had to make a declaration if you were bringing cash or convertible monetary instruments worth more than $10,000 (a common limit) into the country. As the covert spending by foreign governments in Serbia's elections is never declared, and vastly exceeds $10,000... it violates national law. For example, smuggling of funds into the US is a crime punishable by law and is subject to even more serious penalties if related to matters of state. The US government banned the Nation of Islam from accepting a publicly declared and offered gift of $2 billion that Libya wanted to send into this country to better the lives of US Muslims. Had the Nation of Islam proceeded to accept those funds they would have found themselves behind bars. What might have happened to Libya would depend on the whim of the US Secretary of State. President Milosevic trailed in the first round of the election of 2000 mainly because of the tens of millions of dollars in cash that the opposition has since admitted smuggling into Serbia in false-bottomed suitcases to influence the vote.
2. Serbia, like most countries that call themselves democratic, has electoral spending and campaigning rules. Those rules are designed to provide a level playing for the exercise of democracy. A domestic political party would face criminal charges for exceeding the legal spending limits. A foreign government's violation of those limits constitutes a crime against the Serbian state and people, as well as an infringement of their right to govern themselves independently. It constitutes a form of aggression that the US increasingly tries to use first in place of armed intervention because it is cheaper and more sellable to the American public. This approach has been formally discussed and approved here in Washington. That does not make it any less of a crime for a foreign party to introduce such funds into either the US or Serbia.
3. When two countries recognize each other and exchange diplomatic papers, they enter into an contract governed by the generally accepted precepts of international law. When the diplomatic "contracts" between Serbia and each state that maintains relations with Serbia are violated, it constitutes an infringement of the customs referred to as international law and Serbia may seek damages, just as Nicaragua (successfully) sued the US in the international court of justice for mining its harbors. (The US ignored the ruling and said the court had no jurisdiction over it.)
The fact is that the US commits countless crimes as part of its standard foreign policy procedures and covert intelligence activities such as staging coups (Venezuela), preparing the groundwork for assassinations (Chile), fabricating "color" revolutions (Ukraine, Georgia, Tibet, Lebanon, etc.). What is more serious than the criminal nature of these actions is the fact that the entire world (except the American people themselves, who are shielded from reality by US corporate media) now know that the US is not altruistically spreading democracy but instead using democracy as a vehicle for conquest... making such US "diplomacy" merely an extension of war by other means. This contravenes the principles of the US Constitution, undermines the essence of democracy itself and sets the stage for growing demands for "revenge" against America. Nothing comes from nowhere. The 9/11 attacks might well have been a taste of what such revenge is going to look like.
Violating the fundamental rules of peaceful human interaction is always morally wrong. In this case, what the US and its "Euro-Atlantic" vassals have been doing is also demonstrably illegal.
“During its elections campaign, the Democratic Party of Serbia (DSS) didn’t tell its voters that it would be implementing Šešelj’s policies, and now they are fending off an electoral fiasco by manipulating and changing the will of the citizens,” said the president.”
Everyone knew that DSS would form a coalition with SRS after the election, that is no surprise, and exactly why Kostunica lost some of his support.
I like Tadic, but he should respect the will of the Serbian people who clearly said “NE” to the EU without guarantees of keeping Kosovo in Serbia. All the polls show this.
Might I remind him that Nikolic got MORE votes for President in the first round of votes.
I think the issue here that Tadic missed is does Serbia want a Prime Minister which doesn't have the support of 87 percent of the population? That isn't including votes for Ilic within the DSS/NS coalition. I think the Serbian people answered that question at the ballot box.
To be completely clear, its time that Serbia's Prime Minister has a proper mandate from the people.
Looking at many comments on different sites most people in Serbia seem to be against the Pro European parties, so who the hell voted for Tadic and co????
Joachim it's a real shame that despite both camps saying basicly the same things, Serbia in the E.U. but with Kosovo, they can't agree on how to move forward. The reason there was an election in the first place was that the DS and DSS cant'work together.
The thing I hoped would happen now the results has been clear was that Kostunica acknowledged he had lost, and since there was a clear suport for the E.U. he would either lend his suport to the DS or go into the oposition. But since he was lying about giving the mandate back to the people, and hasn't changed his mind a DS-DSS goverment isn't going to happen.
I can see that Tadic is desperate to form a goverment, and he doesn't word himself very well. However the rhetoric and political violence used by Kostunica but especially Mr. Ilic scares my more. It reminds me to much of what happened in the 90's. When you call about half of your citicens who suports the SAA signing traitors I am afraid where it all will end up.
Tadic can form an goverment with the SPS and one of the minority parties, which I still hope will happen, tho I am not at all sure. But it still can go either way.
DS should invite DSS for coalition talks. That would be the best solution for Serbia! I think there would be no problem concerning the five priorities DS is insisting on once it's clear that the defense of territorial integrity is in the first place.
"Either he comes up with a majority of 126 MP's either he's in opposition.
That's the way it is and that's democracy!"
It is one form of democracy. As I noted here http://www.b92.net/eng/news/comments.php?nav_id=50302 , it is not unusual to have minority governments in Denmark.
John Bosnitch wrote:
"The US apparatus failed to win the election (despite spending millions to illegally influence the result)"
In what way was it illegal? Would it be illegal for me (if I had access to Bill Gates bank account) to take out full-page ads in the major Serbian newspapers for 2 weeks straight and recommend the Serbian voters to vote for mr. X ?
Why it is illegal to try to influence voters? It is not always wise, since it often back-fires, but illegal?
--
Jan, I agree with you when you write: "According to our
constitution, the requirement is that the sitting government
don't have a majority vote AGAINST it.
On many occasions, for many years, we have had minority (coalition) governments. If the opposition wanted to oust the sitting government and force a election, they had to call a Vote-of-no-confidence in the parliament and show that a majority of the parliament was against the sitting government."
The fact is that the Canak, Dinkic, Tadic coalition doesn't have a majority (126 MP's) and if Tadic would try a minority government it simply would immediately be ousted by a vote of non-confidence of the parliament.
So I don't see very well where's the point of your post.
After seeing how the DS (mal)treated its coalition partner Kostunica I don't think that many parties will be eager to have a coalition with them. If Tadic wants to have any chance he might better try the humble approach.
Poor Tadics,
Kostunica will do everything he can to stay in power, even to take down a great county like Serbia!!! In mine opinion, you should move to Vojvodina (where you have great support) and declare independent and then you will be able to join the EU!!! Right known you already lost Belgrade—to Aleksandar Vučić and the Serb Radical Party (SRS), and soon you will lose the rest of Serbia!
this kostunica is holding serbia back ! he is "a spanner in the works" as we say . some one do something ! get rid of him ! let serbia move forward for gods sake !
@Jan Dacic (SPS) declared in an interview: "We will never again support anybody's minority government. That is definite. Those who are offering us minority support are doing so to undermine us. Who wants to cooperate with us has to do so publicly" which seems to support my point of view. Have a look at the interview yourself: http://www.slobodan-milosevic.org/news/vn050908.htm
@John - excellent response. So the is not the attempts to influence the election, but the covert and illegal transfer and spending of money.
I guess I could ask if Fiat got some special exemptions from these money transfereing rules when they decided to buy this Zavasta(?) plant, but I am sure that is covered by some other law.
@Joachim - my point was, that it is not, by definition, against democracy, to have minority governments. A lot of postings here seem to believe that politics is only about counting to 126. Minority governments are not the most stable form of governments, but it can work. E.g. are you sure the SPS will join in a vote-of-no-confidence? At the first possible moment, or will they perhaps sit back, evaluate the situation, and see how bad a DS-lead coalition would be?
Joachim it's a real shame that despite both camps saying basicly the same things, Serbia in the E.U. but with Kosovo, they can't agree on how to move forward. The reason there was an election in the first place was that the DS and DSS cant'work together.
The thing I hoped would happen now the results has been clear was that Kostunica acknowledged he had lost, and since there was a clear suport for the E.U. he would either lend his suport to the DS or go into the oposition. But since he was lying about giving the mandate back to the people, and hasn't changed his mind a DS-DSS goverment isn't going to happen.
I can see that Tadic is desperate to form a goverment, and he doesn't word himself very well. However the rhetoric and political violence used by Kostunica but especially Mr. Ilic scares my more. It reminds me to much of what happened in the 90's. When you call about half of your citicens who suports the SAA signing traitors I am afraid where it all will end up.
Tadic can form an goverment with the SPS and one of the minority parties, which I still hope will happen, tho I am not at all sure. But it still can go either way.
I think the issue here that Tadic missed is does Serbia want a Prime Minister which doesn't have the support of 87 percent of the population? That isn't including votes for Ilic within the DSS/NS coalition. I think the Serbian people answered that question at the ballot box.
To be completely clear, its time that Serbia's Prime Minister has a proper mandate from the people.
Poor Tadics,
Kostunica will do everything he can to stay in power, even to take down a great county like Serbia!!! In mine opinion, you should move to Vojvodina (where you have great support) and declare independent and then you will be able to join the EU!!! Right known you already lost Belgrade—to Aleksandar Vučić and the Serb Radical Party (SRS), and soon you will lose the rest of Serbia!
this kostunica is holding serbia back ! he is "a spanner in the works" as we say . some one do something ! get rid of him ! let serbia move forward for gods sake !
DS should invite DSS for coalition talks. That would be the best solution for Serbia! I think there would be no problem concerning the five priorities DS is insisting on once it's clear that the defense of territorial integrity is in the first place.
Tadic is repeating a lie a thousand times to make it the truth. From the night of the election when he claimed victory when even the US-funded CeSID "monitors" confirmed that his Democratic Party had fallen far short of a majority, Tadic has been repeating his lie to the Serbian people.
Ignorance is his strength and a combination of telling the people that his DS won, then having CNN, FOX and the rest repeat that lie over satellite TV, and finally accusing Kostunica of subverting the election is setting the stage for a coup d'etat in which Tadic might unilaterally name a prime minister who does not have a parliamentary majority.
Tadic is operating by the same CIA playbook used to overthrow elected governments worldwide for decades.
The US apparatus failed to win the election (despite spending millions to illegally influence the result) and now faces a possible loss not only of their Serbian colony, but also the collapse of their Kosovo pseudo-state and the end of their Nabucco oil project which will be replaced by Russia's South Stream.
This translates to a monetary-value loss potentially far exceeding the entire cost of the Iraq fiasco -- and all for the lack of about three seats in the Serbian parliament.
Any CIA veteran will tell you the agency's instinctive response -- try to provoke a crisis that will allow Tadic, as president, to exercise extraordinary powers to stop the seating of an independent government. This approach includes offering bribes into the millions of dollars to all political parties, threatening personal travel bans, Hague indictment... the whole repertoire.
The object, as "commentator" noted above, is to provoke public violence that can be used to justify a presidential coup. The fact that the US removed Milosevic in a coup sets a precedent for their continuing conduct that can't be ignored.
Tadic and his team have nothing to lose because if they ever leave power, a forensic audit will most likely reveal massive misuses of state funds in their failed effort to steal these latest elections.
Serbia! Beware of foreign-backed agents in the highest levels of your current government! Do not be tricked by provocations. Stand behind the Radical, DSS and SPS deputies that you have elected or these could be the last even marginally fair elections for the foreseeable future.
"Either he comes up with a majority of 126 MP's either he's in opposition.
That's the way it is and that's democracy!"
It is one form of democracy. As I noted here http://www.b92.net/eng/news/comments.php?nav_id=50302 , it is not unusual to have minority governments in Denmark.
John Bosnitch wrote:
"The US apparatus failed to win the election (despite spending millions to illegally influence the result)"
In what way was it illegal? Would it be illegal for me (if I had access to Bill Gates bank account) to take out full-page ads in the major Serbian newspapers for 2 weeks straight and recommend the Serbian voters to vote for mr. X ?
Why it is illegal to try to influence voters? It is not always wise, since it often back-fires, but illegal?
--
Tadic is a good pupil of Pres. Bush! He is applying the "new" democracy sistem employed with Hamas in Palestine! A mayority is NOT a Mayority if it does´nt fit "your personal" WILL!!Go ahead Mr. Kostunica with 130 seats.. THIS TIME,, in the middle of EUROPE.. you have the UPPER HAND!! Good luck in the benefit of SERBIA!
Ernst - Germany
I've been a bit neutral about these elections till now, I was happy to accept whatever the voters decided.
However, it now looks like it is a necessity for the SRS-DSS-SPS government to be formed. If only to prove that Serbia's democracy cannot be subverted.
The DS has lost the plot... if you cannot form a majority (50% + 1 vote), then that means you cannot be the government - get this thru your heads.
The SRS seems to understand this simple formula (I remember Nikolic was gracious when he lost the presidential election by a whisker)
If you don't have the numbers, be a dilligent opposition and keep the SRS to their promises etc if they form government.
These "warnings" and "victory" declarations of Tadic are nothing more than political violence.
Stop it before their is real violence (or is that actually the plan?)
"Tadić said the citizens' electoral will should be respected"
I can't recall that Tadic said the same thing in 2003 and 2007 when SRS was the largest partie with respectively 27,7 and 28.7%.
Tadic should stop this dirty game!
Either he comes up with a majority of 126 MP's either he's in opposition.
That's the way it is and that's democracy!
commentator, you are quite right about political violence. You have to remember that the people behind Tadic will do anything and everything to get their man in. They have no shame and will get out their dirty book when needed.
If they are prepared to trample over international law to recognise their occupation in Kosovo, then why shouldn't they declare victory when they have lost? Or cheat or lie or deceive or any other method mentioned in their dirty book?
Fortunately, this will be their undoing and it all beings about now so watch this space.
Reading this article back-to-back with the Kostunica statement makes me wonder if Boris Tadic is losing his grip on reality. Everything that Kostunica says about the "will" of the Serbian electorate is absolutely true. I used to quite like Boris Tadic but his statements in recent days really make me wonder what planet he's living on. If he wants to be in government he's going to have to gather 126 MPs. If he can't manage that and others can, then he's in opposition and that is that.
“During its elections campaign, the Democratic Party of Serbia (DSS) didn’t tell its voters that it would be implementing Šešelj’s policies, and now they are fending off an electoral fiasco by manipulating and changing the will of the citizens,” said the president.”
Everyone knew that DSS would form a coalition with SRS after the election, that is no surprise, and exactly why Kostunica lost some of his support.
I like Tadic, but he should respect the will of the Serbian people who clearly said “NE” to the EU without guarantees of keeping Kosovo in Serbia. All the polls show this.
Might I remind him that Nikolic got MORE votes for President in the first round of votes.
Looking at many comments on different sites most people in Serbia seem to be against the Pro European parties, so who the hell voted for Tadic and co????
Thanks for asking about the "illegality" of the US and EU spending to influence the elections in Serbia.
The illegality takes several forms which I will list in rising order of severity...
1. Perhaps you will remember the last time you crossed a border and came to customs control. There was probably a sign saying that you had to make a declaration if you were bringing cash or convertible monetary instruments worth more than $10,000 (a common limit) into the country. As the covert spending by foreign governments in Serbia's elections is never declared, and vastly exceeds $10,000... it violates national law. For example, smuggling of funds into the US is a crime punishable by law and is subject to even more serious penalties if related to matters of state. The US government banned the Nation of Islam from accepting a publicly declared and offered gift of $2 billion that Libya wanted to send into this country to better the lives of US Muslims. Had the Nation of Islam proceeded to accept those funds they would have found themselves behind bars. What might have happened to Libya would depend on the whim of the US Secretary of State. President Milosevic trailed in the first round of the election of 2000 mainly because of the tens of millions of dollars in cash that the opposition has since admitted smuggling into Serbia in false-bottomed suitcases to influence the vote.
2. Serbia, like most countries that call themselves democratic, has electoral spending and campaigning rules. Those rules are designed to provide a level playing for the exercise of democracy. A domestic political party would face criminal charges for exceeding the legal spending limits. A foreign government's violation of those limits constitutes a crime against the Serbian state and people, as well as an infringement of their right to govern themselves independently. It constitutes a form of aggression that the US increasingly tries to use first in place of armed intervention because it is cheaper and more sellable to the American public. This approach has been formally discussed and approved here in Washington. That does not make it any less of a crime for a foreign party to introduce such funds into either the US or Serbia.
3. When two countries recognize each other and exchange diplomatic papers, they enter into an contract governed by the generally accepted precepts of international law. When the diplomatic "contracts" between Serbia and each state that maintains relations with Serbia are violated, it constitutes an infringement of the customs referred to as international law and Serbia may seek damages, just as Nicaragua (successfully) sued the US in the international court of justice for mining its harbors. (The US ignored the ruling and said the court had no jurisdiction over it.)
The fact is that the US commits countless crimes as part of its standard foreign policy procedures and covert intelligence activities such as staging coups (Venezuela), preparing the groundwork for assassinations (Chile), fabricating "color" revolutions (Ukraine, Georgia, Tibet, Lebanon, etc.). What is more serious than the criminal nature of these actions is the fact that the entire world (except the American people themselves, who are shielded from reality by US corporate media) now know that the US is not altruistically spreading democracy but instead using democracy as a vehicle for conquest... making such US "diplomacy" merely an extension of war by other means. This contravenes the principles of the US Constitution, undermines the essence of democracy itself and sets the stage for growing demands for "revenge" against America. Nothing comes from nowhere. The 9/11 attacks might well have been a taste of what such revenge is going to look like.
Violating the fundamental rules of peaceful human interaction is always morally wrong. In this case, what the US and its "Euro-Atlantic" vassals have been doing is also demonstrably illegal.
Jan, I agree with you when you write: "According to our
constitution, the requirement is that the sitting government
don't have a majority vote AGAINST it.
On many occasions, for many years, we have had minority (coalition) governments. If the opposition wanted to oust the sitting government and force a election, they had to call a Vote-of-no-confidence in the parliament and show that a majority of the parliament was against the sitting government."
The fact is that the Canak, Dinkic, Tadic coalition doesn't have a majority (126 MP's) and if Tadic would try a minority government it simply would immediately be ousted by a vote of non-confidence of the parliament.
So I don't see very well where's the point of your post.
@John - excellent response. So the is not the attempts to influence the election, but the covert and illegal transfer and spending of money.
I guess I could ask if Fiat got some special exemptions from these money transfereing rules when they decided to buy this Zavasta(?) plant, but I am sure that is covered by some other law.
@Joachim - my point was, that it is not, by definition, against democracy, to have minority governments. A lot of postings here seem to believe that politics is only about counting to 126. Minority governments are not the most stable form of governments, but it can work. E.g. are you sure the SPS will join in a vote-of-no-confidence? At the first possible moment, or will they perhaps sit back, evaluate the situation, and see how bad a DS-lead coalition would be?
@Jan Dacic (SPS) declared in an interview: "We will never again support anybody's minority government. That is definite. Those who are offering us minority support are doing so to undermine us. Who wants to cooperate with us has to do so publicly" which seems to support my point of view. Have a look at the interview yourself: http://www.slobodan-milosevic.org/news/vn050908.htm
After seeing how the DS (mal)treated its coalition partner Kostunica I don't think that many parties will be eager to have a coalition with them. If Tadic wants to have any chance he might better try the humble approach.
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