Russia, India, China call for new Kosovo talks

Russia, China, India.

In 10-20 years these will be the three largest economies in the world. None of them are happy with the so-called independence of Kosovo.

Those jingoistic pro-US posters on this site take a very short-term view of history unfolding. Remember all that stuff about "the end of history" in the early nineties?

There is a lot of water to flow under the bridge yet before the Kosovo story reaches its conclusion.

Russia, India, and China eh? The tree fastest growing economies in the world. Gee, I thought Serbia was 'self isolated' according to Tadic and Solana's boys??
Face it, Kosovo will never be independent. We Serbs have to wait it out, until the geo-political situation in the world tips in our favour. Then the Americans and their lapdogs will go back to where they belong.
Cheers!

Dear Ben,

Krajinians are NOT Croatians, so why not let them form their own state? (as you put it "their RIGHT on SELF-DETERMINATION")

Not only do "Kosovars" mercilessly oppress non-Albanians within Kosovo, they even traveled to Krajina to help the Croatian fascists wipe the Krajinians out (and then voted a leading figure of that operation, Ceku, in as a PM!?!... such is the multi ethnicity of Albanians)

Bottom line: Albanians seem to be fanatically anti-Serbian, "self determination" is just a mask for you.

Compared to the hypocracy of the "Kosovars", USA etc, Russia is like an innocent child!

PS: Free Krajina!

International law had to be RESPECTED!! Big Shame to these 40 states that recognized the illegal state of kosovo. Shame to those serbs who voted for the DS

I believe Russia is a good advocate for Serbia. Russia is forming a pro-Serbian front with big powers included. In the post-Soviet ethnic conflicts Russia is increasing the price the West will have to pay for the Kosovo violence. Russia use every possible contact with the EU a another platform for the dialogue over Kosovo. Russia undertakes other unexpected steps to make the US chorus retreat. After the Serbs are ready Russia will invest here really big sums the EU cannot even dream of.

And after all B-92 didn't find it possible even to mention of the great victory FC Zenit gained last night in Manchester City ... I hope it's not the general trend of pro-American Serbs ! At least don't forget that our brotherhood started long before the US to appear on the map ...

To Readers:

In China when a politican accepts bribes he is sentenced to death because his actions hurt a great number of people. In China, politicans are afraid to take bribes or to work against the people. Conversly, in the United States, people lose everyday when politicans take bribes. More importantly, Serbs lose when the US politicans take bribes from the Albanians in Kosovo. Thus, in retrospect, based on the infromation that I have provided, China has greater moral values than the United States.

ben - If you think what you say is correct then explain why Kosovo Albanians, Turkish Cypriots and other "independent states" haven't been recognised as states by UN law????

The simple fact is that a states borders take precedence over minorites right to self determination otherwise Kosovo would have been granted statehood by now, along with northern Cyprus, Abkhazia,etc,etc.....

As you seem to think every minority has the right to self determination, then you won't have a problem with the Serbs in Kosovo staying within Serbia and "breaking" away from Kosovo then will you?

Or maybe you think Serbs deserve a different treatment as many Albanian posters claim the right to self determination, but try to deny it to the Serbs in Kosovo as it would "cause instability in the region" - and Kosovo trying to break away from Serbia isn't going to cause more instability than a small minority of Serbs in Kosovo?????

YEAH, right!!

Russia, China and India currently represent close to half the world's population and will shortly become the dominant powers. What is important in their position is the respect for international law and the resolution of problems through negotiations.

However, on the other hand, you have the US - who promote themselves as the world's greatest democracy and are spreading it by bombing countries back to the stone age and ignoring international law when it gets in the way.

I am pleased that we have Russia, China and India backing Serbia and international law. We can stand shoulder to shoulder with them instead of bowing to the US/EU.

Samo napred Srbija!

Benny,

"Asia against Europe. What do they want in Europe. Enough their interferance in european yard. I am asking if serbia is part of europe or Asia? Do they want to cooperate with Europe or to fight against Europe in favor of China, India and Russia?"

Asia against Europe? No Benny, it is not. It is Asia and Europe against illegal action of some European governments. It is Asia and Europe for preservation of Final Act of European Security and Cooperation from Helsinki.

Do not forget, Russia is the biggest European country (taking into consideration just European part of Russia). China and India are as far from Serbia us USA.

What Camp Bondsteel is doing in Kosovo? What is purpose of US nuclear shield in Poland and Czech Republic?

Remember that India is the digest democracy in the World and as China the fastest growing economies. Also keep in mind that history of those countries are older then history of Europe.

@ben: there are no "kosovars"... there are Albanians living on serbian territory, yes. but there is no such thing like a "kosovar"

as I have always said, let´s just see what future brings! and I am quite confident.

'Ok Dragan, you do that.
Until then, Kosovo is independent.'

Blero,

'Supervised independence' is not independence. It is just more double speak from your hero, cowboy George. You are anything but independent. If NATO decides they want to use you for nuclear testing, or a dumping area for its contaminated waste, I am sure you will welcome their programs with open arms, right? You would have no choice anyways. Enjoy your 'supervised independence' while it lasts. I can assure you it is only temproary.
Cheers!

Ben,

You wrote: "It is - it is based on the RIGHT of self-determination of the nations clearly marked in the International Law".

Can you please direct me to the exact legislative framework you refer to where this is clearly marked?

Here's a principle of international law you may want to look into:

"territorial integrity and the inviolability of internationally recognized borders"

Just google it - you will see that this principle, which happens to be a legal one, is the current standard. This, as opposed to the THEORETICAL principle you refer to - which happens NOT to be a legal standard.

Benny:
What business does the US have in Europe?
ben:
You can twist it any way you like, nonetheless, the US has no legal right to strip a piece of a sovereign country's territory.
Tom O'Donoghue:
What do you mean in 10-20 years? Look around my friend.

I am amused at the attitudes of the Albanian lobby in their comments. There seems to be two strands:
1. Russia, China, India don't give a damn about Serbia or Kosovo. They're only acting from self interest.
2. How dare they speak; look at Tibet, Chechnya, Kashmir.

Well, well, there are none so blind as those who will not see.

As regards 1: Do the Albanians really believe that the Americans actually care for their welfare? If they do, they are living in Cloud Cuckoo Land. America cares only about America and its strategic interests, and if the Albanians stand in their way or act against American interests, they will happily obliterate them. Meanwhile a few Albanians might make money from the existence of Camp Bondsteel but that's the limit of American committment to the province.

As regards 2:

I don't recall the Russians, Chinese or Indians travelling half way across the globe to attack a succession of sovereign states. Iraq, Afghanistan and Vietnam are only a fraction of the countries that America or its proxies have assaulted in recent decades.

To Willy Nilly: I don't buy property except for my own home.
To Jan Andersen: I will address your question at a later time.

Don't forget Brazil - another supporter of Intl. laws, i.e. Serbia's integrity and territorial integrity.

The BRICS in short form half of world's population, 1/3rd of land area and 40% or more of GDP...

India, China and Russia are more qualified to comment on Kosovo's illegal UDI than any US or EU country...
Why...?

Because they represent the bulk of Eurasia, the same continent on which resides Serbia...

And US is about 8000 kms away.

I'll make this short and sweet because I'm heading out to a kafana, which is far more exciting than wasting time responding to every knee-jerk statement made by the predictable Albanian groupthinkers:

Kosovo Albanian leaders and their Western financiers have two choices.

Option 1: Keep thinking Kosovo is a European issue, where the rest of the world doesn't matter.

Option 2: Kosovo is, at some point or another, an international issue that needs to be solved so as to not remain a economic, political, and social blackhole until the Apocalypse.

If Option 1 is continued, Kosovo will remaim a European colony indefinately, with "independence" being little more than a sick joke.

If Option 2 is realized, and Kosovo truly wants to be taken seriously as a real country, it needs to head back to the negotiation table with Serbia, which is now apparently backed by three of the most powerful countries in the world.

Colony? Or globally recognized state?

Benny,Ben, Bembi, - is Joe any of these,

You are pushing logic and international law to the edge. You should benefit from the US bulling and small games on the short run. But you’re all provoking big thing(s) when all that stupidity should end and won’t be tolerated anymore in the long run of 20-40 years. You will be again on wrong – losing side and we will suffer a lot and get as prize some losers in our yard to manage them and start from zero. And we’ll accept that and give you a hand till the next time-occasion and Mary-history goes again in cycles. Boring… or not.

Cheers, enjoy your UDI - you deserve it and whatever happens later.

Dear all,

...call for new talks???

who??!!!!!Russia, India, China...

PLEEEEASE...

First, they ARE too dependent (economically at least) and moreover, they better solve Chechnya, Tibet, and Kashmir before they are even allowed to say a thing....on Kosovo, closed chapter with ongoing world-wide recognitions

Peace to all


Cheers

don´t worry for individuals like ben, or blero...

for them, everyone who tells them they are independent ( even if it´s simply not the factual truth ) is their hero. it´s that simple!

everyone who is against "their" (!) "state" is of course un-democratic and should care "of their own problems"... wow, what an argumentation!

of course Spain and Greece, Slovakia are also undemocratic countries, according to our albanian friends... =)

there´s one simple answer to those illusions: it was never yours, and it will never be yours. you will see how your dream will be crushed.

just a question of time. let´s just see what future brings...


perhaps you will rather go to the US than to stay in a serbian province, who knows... maybe you will change your mind, ...but in the end, who cares?

a lot of the k-albanians has alread serbian documents and those who don´t believe that or deny it, are simple fools.

it seems like some Albanians know that this whole "newborn"-nonsense will not last very long...

some others will have to realize it later, I guess.

ps: please, my albanian friends, don´t write bad things about Russia, India and China, since you could one day regret it! especially you, who are always bowing your head before those who are strong at the moment...you should look into the future, my friends...

:)

"He said that the three countries believed that the “Kosovo question” had to be settled exclusively on the basis of international law."

It is- it is based on the RIGHT of self-determination of the nations clearly marked in the International Law.

Why Sumadija doesn’t want to break form Serbia? because Sumadijans are part of the Serbian nation.

Kosovars are NOT.

Hence, they exercised their RIGHT on SELF-DETERMINATION- as from the international law.

If Russia wants to interpretate the international law only as tool to satisfy here hegemonic appetites towards her neighboring nations that's another issue- it has nothing to do with international law.

Free Tibet.

Asia against Europe. What do they want in Europe. Enough their interferance in european yard. I am asking if serbia is part of europe or Asia? Do they want to cooperate with Europe or to fight against Europe in favor of China, India and Russia?

Anyhow, get ready for 3 fat vetoes in the UNSC for any kind of "new talks". Funcakes
--
So what's new? You have two fat vetoes preventing Kosovo independence so we are still stuck in the status quo.

As always, Serbian's rule themselves and so do Albanians. Has anything changed since the IUDI?

My advice would be to keep an eye on that "70%" wealth figure because those nations at full capacity could be matched by 30% capacity of Russia, China and India alone.

Anyway, that's a few years away and the time will come but in the mean time, enjoy your "Independence". I think the US have a few boots that need polishing!

I read these comments from the "Albanian" side, and I just cannot believe what arguments they use for everything. Rational people cannot dismiss that Russia, China, and India are voices to be heard and listened to! And their point is that the UDI of Kosovo was illegal, period! Don't you Albanians understand that your UDI was NOT about freedom, democracy, or your right of self-determination? It was simply a game of geo-politics and you are simply pawns of the West. You have been used and duped by the West to think that Albanians in Kosovo are "special" and will become as prosperous as the rest of Europe- or even Serbia. You had such wide autonomy under Serbia, and a much better standard of living than you do now, or will have in the future. You don't have the trained work force necessary to become prosperous- prosperity is something you WORK for- it's not just having "great benefactors". You don't even have enough electricity to supply yourselves. You can daydream forever that now, because you're "free" from Serbia, Kosovo will attain a better life for your people. Wake up- snap out of your stupor!!! The BEST thing that could happen would be for the UN to reconsider your UDI in September and come to terms with the reality "on the ground". And yes, these "insignificant" countries like Russia, China, and India will bring reality "to the table" and keep international law intact. And YES- Kosovo is Serbia, and will always be Serbian!!!

Russia, China, India.

In 10-20 years these will be the three largest economies in the world. None of them are happy with the so-called independence of Kosovo.
.
(Tom O'Donoghue, 15 May 2008 12:58)

Dear Tom,
Russia, China and India doesn’t care for Kosovo and Serbia, nor they care for Europe and Balkan. They care for their influence in Global Market. So they will not be happy no matter what happen with Kosovo. Kosovo is just a justification for voicing their influential cry. Kosovo is just a random victim. Kosovars are just the one to pay the price of their rising power against Europe and Western power. K-Serbs are the victim, and not only victim of not only Russia, China and India manipulation but victim of their own co-patriot manipulation in Beograd, who doesn’t really care for K-Serbs nor do they care for International Law but for International Game of Power. More and more K-Serbs understood this and their voices are heard now to let them alone and care for their welfare and not for warfare. They, although are in enormous pressure from masters of Beograd power mafia, every day are crying for help, they don’t want to be anymore a sward in Beograd power mafia’s hand to reach the power.
Listen to them and analyze their word chosen carefully, although they are afraid being labeled “enemy of the nation”. They realized that nothing can beat the freedom of the nation to live free in their 4000 years land. Nothing can justify the crimes against their fellow K-Albanians because they want to be free. Closer to Kosovo you are better you understand Kosovar rights for self-determination. Far way you are from Kosovo less and less you understand their need. That why many and many UK – Serbs like yourself are less realistic and more aggressive about future of Kosovo and Balkan. From a warm nest in far west, they see their back-home region as “Action Movie” or a “Fighting Game” to see who wins. There are their people and their neighbors who will be hurt. They don’t care. Unfortunately. Dear Tom, it is time of reflection. It is easy to make people suffer especially your neighbor. Europe is the future of Serbia and whole Balkan.

To answer to some of you regarding the RIGHT of self-determination.

"UN Charter in post�World War II 1945, the signatories introduced the right of all people to self-determination into the framework of international law and diplomacy. In addition, the right to self-determination holds the prestigious position of Article 1 in both the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights (ICCPR) and the International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights (ICESCR). Its presence in the two covenants points to the right's complex nature and importance."

The RIGHT on self-determination is lively that it make possible teh creation of Algeria, Morocco, and the entire post-colonial Africa.

I hope you don't wonder the "mystery" of how it happened that the UN in the 1945 had about 40 members and now has almost 200- it's teh self-determination that made this possible, OK? got it?

Slovenia created here state based on this right, Macedonia, BiH and guess what Serbia too, and Russia as well- EURECA

You see, the world slowly but surely is getting more democratic (by recognizing teh right of self-determination to almost 160 nations after the WW2) and now it will be even more democratic by recognizing Kosova.

The process has started, today we have 40 countries that have recognized Kosova, and teh process is continuing�

Jovan: Kosovars are the Albanians living in the Albania�s Northern Province Kosova. The state of Kosova is fake (I agree with Kostunica) it should�ve been part of Albania since 1912 by declaring UDI form Turkey not Serbia.

It was your protectors and sponsors Russia that forced Kosova being part of Serbia- and as result we hav this conflict.

The conflicts arise when you don�t respect the diversity and the right of other cultures and try to incorporate them into another culture by force.

Cool we can talk about the Yugoslavian embassies, pensions, and the mining that was done in Trepca for almost 50 years by the Serbs who used the money to build serbia and deprive the Kosovars. That we can talk about...
(Nehat, 15 May 2008 16:52)

Absolute rubbish. Ask yourself this, why did Slovenia leave YU?

Answer, they got fed up shovelling their hard earned cash into a black hole called Kosovo.

On 15 May 2008 15:27, Zbyszek wrote:

"Remember that India is the digest democracy in the World"

Democracy? Don't make me laugh. It is a country where people are divided into a multitude of castes, with people from one caste refusing to touch or speak with someone from a lower caste. It is a country where the (high-caste) police regularly beat the low-caste people, and corruption is just another way to generate income. Where women have acid thrown in their faces if they happen to look at the wrong man.

Don't give me no democracy shit about India.

"and as China the fastest growing economies."

And the biggest dictatorship in the world, with sweatshops where children regularly are being exploited, where mineworkers are killed almost every month, and people are being relocated by force whenever a new dam is being built.

It is no big feat to be a fast growing economy when you have no regard for the average people.

"Also keep in mind that history of those countries are older then history of Europe."

And your point is? Should we now regard Egypt, where the same presidential dictator, Mubarak, has been clinging to power in 25 years, and is preparing to pass the power to his - should we now regard Egypt as something to admire, because they built pyramids 5000 years ago?

Unbelievable!
Who in the earth needs Russian, Chinese or Indian democracy? Certanly not Europenas, not Albananians for sure!
People who consider cow as their god and throw babies from fifth floor, also worship rats in the temple the Indians.
People who kill their own, Russians and Chinese.
Thanks you but NO! We do NOT need this kind of "democracy", maybe some people in Serbia want this but I am sure Albanians in Kosovo do NOT need this.
Let them take care of their own problems and then maybe we will try to take a look at their advice.
Free Tibet, Free Chechnya.
Long live Western European and American democracy.

All these three must have wire taped Ban KI Moon's office, because the other day UN Secretary general has made a decission to give the green light to EU Mission. This will be made public right after 15 of June 2008. Watch and see, also you can mark my words.

Kosovo is not in Asia but Europe. My advise to India, China and Russia: stay away from Kosovo. You have your own problems to deal with: Tibet, Myanmar, Kashmir. When you have totally peace in your own continent, then you can begin to give your opinions about other parts of the world.

PS: Most if Russia is in Asia

Russia, China, India all of them irrilevant to Kosovar ppl and its ecnonomy. Nice try though!

We Serbs have to wait it out, until the geo-political situation in the world tips in our favour.

(Dragan, 15 May 2008 13:53)

Ok Dragan, you do that.
Until then, Kosovo is independent.

Tom,

in 10 years the main super powers will be EU, USA, China, and possibly Russia. While China opposes independence it is really not against it, Russia is just putting up a show. Is this what Velika Serbia has been reduced to? Depending on others to fight your battles eh?

Are there any REAL Danes here?

Jan "Rexhep" Andersen perhaps?

"Emerging economies"...lol, it'll take a few milleniums before they are able top compete with 70% of the world wealth. It's not like they'll grow while the West will get poor.

I got news for you. The West is already poor. The West have been financing their standard of living with other nation's money for decades. Guess who became the largest holder of American debt a few years ago? You guessed it...China!

Just a quick question to the Albanian arguments:

Why do you guys use Kashmir as an area which India supposedly mistreats on the same level as China Tibet?

The history of that region is quite complex, and one point I'd like to make is that there have been four wars in Kashmir between Pakistan and India, and all four were started by Pakistan. Hindus and Sikhs were annihilated in Kashmir by the Pakistanis, so in fact, it is Pakistan who should be criticized for Kashmir and not India.

One more thing: it's easy to accuse Russia of mistreating Chechnya, but do any of you Albanians know how the war started? It started because the government in power at the time was stormed by Chechen rebels, in which the party chief was killed, most of the party members tortured and many ethnic Russians attacked before declaring illegal independence. Russia did the right thing in taking it back and bringing it under its control again, though indeed the way they did it was unnacceptable with the heavy bombings, seiges and massacres, but to paint the Chechen rebels as freedom fighters is ridiculous, those "people" are some of the most extreme terrorists in the world and it was only right to put them down.

To conclude to the Albanians: conflicts are very complex things, it's not often that one exists as the result of one side only, though indeed when it comes to Tibet, then I agree wholeheartedly with you, they deserve freedom from the Reds more than anyone.

There is a lot of water to flow under the bridge yet before the Kosovo story reaches its conclusion. (Tom O'Donoghue, 15 May 2008 12:58)

before Russia, China and India are playing big daddies, they better should show the world first how to solve conflicts with their own provinces which require self-determination - and before Mr. Lavrov asks someone else for to respect international law, he should show the world how to do that in the cases he is responsible for.

russia is very dessperated and they talk desperatly they can talk nonstop nobody hear them bye bye russia

On 15 May 2008 12:58, Tom O'Donoghue wrote:

"In 10-20 years these will be the three largest economies in the world. None of them are happy with the so-called independence of Kosovo."

Let us assume you are right Tom. Let us assume that the US and EU in 20 years time are tangled up in internal disputes and economic disaster.

What do you propose Serbia (and Russia, China and India) do in regard to Kosovo at that time? Will the Kosovo-Albanians welcome their Serbian overlords, when they cross the border and set up new local governments? Create a new police force? Start collecting taxes for Belgrade?

Or will we have another war on our hands?
--

Cool we can talk about the Yugoslavian embassies, pensions, and the mining that was done in Trepca for almost 50 years by the Serbs who used the money to build serbia and deprive the Kosovars. That we can talk about...

Do we need all to admire Indian killers, destructionest of everything worth in the normal world - cowboy-fast food drive-through democracy.
They are just stealing the oil and killing people all over the world(bombardment of Serbia, Iraq - what a mess - they kill million of people and destroy the one of greatest-oldest cultures in the world). In name of what - american and your way of li(f)e.
Not mine and any normal human being.
Support stealing and nonsense,
it will all come back to you when more people get sober, untill then we have to be patient and read some of your nonsense puppeteering.

No point getting all exited about China, Russia, India calling for 'respect of international law'. The west makes it, the west can also break it.

These guys see the West getting older and think it has no will to rule yet. Trust me the will is there, and any meddling on how the west rules the world will be payed for IN KIND and IN TIME.

The west is down but definitely NOT OUT.

We can negotiate all you want.
The problem is that there is no other solution.
Serbia too would not want Kosovo within its borders. It cannot handle it.
Easy to claim it from political meetings and internet posts.
The three countries have yet to come with a solution for Kosovo. They don't have one. Nor have they contributed until now for the progress of peace in Kosovo. Their declaration in fact has not much to do with Kosovo itself. It is a unholy alliance against other independence-seeking nations like Kosovo.
Well the progress of freedom will not stop.

"but, Albanians their history is oldest in the world."

LOL

this broken-english sentence says it all, in so many ways.

Funcakes

I won't comment, just provide you with the latest IMF statistics from 2007:

GDP per capita (PPP)

Kosovo - $1 800
India - $2 700
China - $5 300
Albania - $6 649
Russia - $14 692

So who are you calling the 3rd world around here?

On 15 May 2008 18:05, "Corfitz Ulfeldt" wrote:

"Are there any REAL Danes here?"

I don't know - what is a REAL Dane? Maybe a Dane Burger from one of the DSB grills?

Or someone like me that is brought up on rugbrød (ryebread), havregrød (oatmeal) and potatoes?

I tried earlier to post a reply to you, written in Danish accompanied with a translation in English, but the moderators here stripped the Danish part of my post and only allowed the English translation to go through.

Rexhep ???

Sad thing is, there is nothing more to be said on that. And that's everybody's fault.
But as long there is Serbia, there will be Kosovo.

“according to the talks in Ramboillet. In these talks it is stated that the final status will be solved according to the wishes of Kosova's people. (johny, 15 May 2008 20:57)”

Johnny,

Here is the full quote from the Rambouillet agreement, either you didn’t read it (most likely) or you didn’t understand it.

“an international meeting shall be convened to determine a mechanism for a final settlement for Kosovo, on the basis of the will of the people, opinions of relevant authorities, each Party's efforts regarding the implementation of this Agreement, AND the HELSINKI FINAL ACT”

http://www.state.gov/www/regions/eur/ksvo_rambouillet_text.html

In other words, it must be democractic AND (the key word being AND) respect the territory of Serbia.

Next you’ll claim UNSC 1244 doesn’t apply to Serbia, only Yugoslavia, ha ha…

Considering that the UN 1244 is law in Kosovo (i Metohija) it is well within the rights of the permanent veto holding members of the Security Council to make their opinions known.

Any one who says otherwise (Europeans and ethnic- Albanians) are disingenuous.

I swear to God, these readers' comments are more exciting than watching M.Gibson's "Apocalypto".So much verbal hostility, or should I dare to say hatred...
Ok, I am a Serb from the West, observing the situation from afar.I didn't care so much about the politics in Serbia but when Kosovo declared UDI I
was utterly shocked- like, NO, They Cannot Do This- and ever since I am following everything there is to follow about it. I oppose snatching of my country's territory wholeheartedly.
This is going to be a long game, that's what I feel. Somebody said the Serbs have not demonstrated sufficient level of patience in history. I kind of believe this is true
and I thank to the Albanian reader pointing at this.
I think though, that with Russian, Chinese help, Serbia can make a longlasting case about Kosovo. Without these countries, Russia in particular we would of course stand no chance (as small Serbia has on this the entire West alliance against us, UGHH)
However I think that many people in the world, regardless of their nationality feel that this isn't right, and that Bush administration had commited a huge mistake by recognizing Kosovo Independence.
Nobody will wink if the Serbs and the Russians go on with this forever. And I think that's exactly what we are going to do.
There are things that you just can't accept no matter how long time passes in between.

"Russia, India, China call for new Kosovo talks"

Well the answer to your request dear Asian’s is NO.
Now the issue is what are you guys going to do about this???
Kosovo is not Kashmir, Tibet or Chechnya so please spare your sympathy about the international law.
Just another finger-puppet show from the Far East it appears.

Is doesn't matter what Russia, China and India call for. And it's totally irrelevant what these countries will become 20-30 years from now. At this moment in time they are not yet the absolute rulers of the world and that is what matters.

If the issue will be decided in the UNSC, than let's not forget that it has been deadlocked on the issue for quite a while now, and any initiative to open up new talks, that doesn't take into account the situation on the ground - the declaration of independence and the international recognition it has received so far - any such initiative is not realistic and will certainly be blocked by US, GB and France. So, such calls are pretty much pointless.

It's also interesting to see that Brazil didn't join these other three in calling for new talks. Perhaps Brazil sees the situation a bit more realistically.

kv dont lecture me on someone fighting serbias battels who was the one fighting the battle for the kla from 30,000ft like cowards. if the serbs were given the green light in kosovo they would have shown you what fighting is all about so please

hey Tom,
you should get a head start and buy some property in India.

Ok, these three countries have an opinion and voiced it. Serbia has every reason to want more talks. China with the killings it is involved in Tibet has every reason to not let Kosova be a model, because that would mean that if you kill your own citizens then they have earned the right to separate from you. The same goes for India and Russia. These countries are afraid not of what they have done in the past, but of what they will continue doing in the future. Knowing fully well that they will continue to kill and persecute their citizens in Chechnya, Tibet and probably Kashmir, they fear Kosova because for the first time in history people where able to set themselves free from the killing and persecution of their own state without this state's approval (Serbia's approval). These three countries are not afraid of separatism, but afraid that if Kosova one day becomes a full UN member they will have to pay their dues for killing and persecuting their citizens. They are afraid that one day what happened in Kosova will become a principle international law and solving disputes. That is :" If you persecute and kill your own citizens, you lose the right of sovereignty over them, even if you are bigger, meaner and more powerful."
Personally I think that principle should be set, not only for Kosova but for all the peoples out there who have suffered by the hand of bigger countries that have forcefully incorporated them against their will, anywhere in the world.

Having said that: It would be wise for these politicians to talk about international law only once Serbia stops breaking it on a daily basis by hiding and aiding war criminals such as Mladic and Karadzic. You cannot ask for the world to respect international law in the name of Serbia when Serbia is the first one that breaks it on a daily basis. It is simply a nonsense.

On another note, it is not illegal to declare something. It is not illegal to recognize something.
Also based on 1244, it guaranteed Jugoslavia's sovereignty ONLY DURING THE TRANSITORY PERIOD. I capitalized that because our Serb readers seem to skip that part. 1244 also states that the final status will be settled according to the talks in Ramboillet. In these talks it is stated that the final status will be solved according to the wishes of Kosova's people. As a result we declared our independence in accord with 1244.

Also Dragan said:
We Serbs have to wait it out, until the geo-political situation in the world tips in our favour. Then the Americans and their lapdogs will go back to where they belong.
Cheers!
(Dragan, 15 May 2008 13:53)

Dragan I see you Serbs are learning a lot from us. That is what we Albanians did exactly. We waited until the geo-political situation in the world tipped in our favor, then the Russians and their lapdogs went where they belonged. Patience is a virtue. So far I have learned that Serbs lack it. Time will prove the accuracy of my opinion.
By the way, it feels great cutting ties with Serbia and being under NATO protection.

Zbyszek,

I am sorry my friend they have older history then you have but, Albanians their history is oldest in the world. Dou you think that history of europe started with invasion of slavs in europe?

"Absolute rubbish. Ask yourself this, why did Slovenia leave YU?

Answer, they got fed up shovelling their hard earned cash into a black hole called Kosovo.
(Niall O'Doherty, 15 May 2008 22:57) "

On the contrary. If you knew anything about the situation you would know that when Milosevic decided to anul Kosova's autonomy Slovenia was the first Republic to be against it. In fact the Slovenian representative left the meeting. At the same night an extraordinary meeting of the parliament of Slovenia occurred, where the Slovenian representatives denounced Milosevic's and Serbia's annulment of autonomy for Kosova. As a mattar of fact this session was televised in Serbia, as way to put a spin on the Slovenian attitude and show them as traitors as Jugoslavia since they were against the abolishment of Kosova's autonomy. Slovenia simply got fed up of the Serbian attitude that they're better and smarter than the other parts of the union so the Serbs have the right to decide for them. Slovenia was in fact one of the staunchest supporters of Kosova's autonomy during those times.

You on the other hand are continuing the work of the greatest Serbian propagandist, by twisting facts.

Resume talks, hmmm let's see. What are the odds of 70% of the world wealth bowing down to the requests of these 3rd world countries?

"Emerging economies"...lol, it'll take a few milleniums before they are able top compete with 70% of the world wealth. It's not like they'll grow while the West will get poor.

Anyhow, get ready for 3 fat vetoes in the UNSC for any kind of "new talks". The situation can only be solved under the new reality, and the only solution is to recognize independence. Anything else will simply get vetoed no matter what.

Luckily Russia has made the claim that Kosovo's independence will destabilize the region. Unluckily for Russia, if time proves the opposite, that argument will be toast. They have locked themselves into an irrational stance, so no matter how much they huff and puff, time can only prove them wrong. And no one wins against time, not even Russia.

In the original transcript, only Russia speaks supposedly on behalf of these countries. None of these countries have issued any statements, neither their leaders. Is Russia just bluffing?.
Credibility is in question. I am sorry Tanjug, but B92, could you obtain the original transcript instead? Shall your public read it without editing its title.

during the Balkan war interpol found proof of Bosnian Muslims and the KLA having links to Bin Laden and his groups. The US and EU have seized the opportunity to get certain Muslim states onside (Albanians, Turkey etc) by giving Kosovo independence.This issue will change once Iran is attacked, the little states of Kosovo and Albania will not matter. Serbia just needs to sit tight. There is no real media in the UK of Kosovo independence lets face it Albanians you are puppets to us in the west.

Benny,Ben, Bembi, - is Joe any of these,

You are pushing logic and international law to the edge. You should benefit from the US bulling and small games on the short run. But you’re all provoking big thing(s) when all that stupidity should end and won’t be tolerated anymore in the long run of 20-40 years. You will be again on wrong – losing side and we will suffer a lot and get as prize some losers in our yard to manage them and start from zero. And we’ll accept that and give you a hand till the next time-occasion and Mary-history goes again in cycles. Boring… or not.

Cheers, enjoy your UDI - you deserve it and whatever happens later.
(dd, 15 May 2008 14:35)

So we are supose to be on the wining side no mater if they are right or wrong , russia and china are growing economc powers, soon Albanians will start beging them again , Serbs choose there alleyes carefully no mater if they are winers or loosers we are always on the rightchous side, if you want to know who in the world is still rightchous and honorable just take a look at Serbia and her alleyes. Hey who knows maybe in 50-60 years Serbia is going to be a superpower then you Albanians will start beging us for forgivness.

Hi ORTHODOX,

Congratulations, for the Zenit’s, victory, nice game.

“… Russia is a good advocate for Serbia. … forming a pro-Serbian front … After the Serbs are ready Russia will invest here really big sums the EU cannot even dream of.

Yes, that’s the way to do it! This meeting in Yekaterinburg is really good sine. It is of outmost importance that Russia continue to do everything possible to further develop friendly relations with China and India. Russian – Chinese alliance is American biggest nightmare. They will do all they can to prevent it and create conflict between you.

I like the comment lets wait 10 to 20 years and lets see what happens. Sure this is great idea, Let people of Kosovo try to rule they land for next 10 to 20 years. People speak about China, Russia, India bla bla bla. Let people try to solve it them self, Kosovo has 92% Kosovars today do the math in 20 years it will have 97% since the they do love to make children. In 20 years Kosovo and Serbia will be in EU for sure. No one at that time will care about the invincible border, people will be busy working and taking vacations no will want to send their children to fight.

So this is simple let’s all concentrate in working for better future for each country and meet in EU together in 5 years. EU knows Serbia will never except Kosovo but it will to get in EU together so lets try this and make our economies Stronger and not worry about India, china, Brazil etc.

I don't recall the Russians, Chinese or Indians travelling half way across the globe to attack a succession of sovereign states. Iraq, Afghanistan and Vietnam

(Tom O'Donoghue, 15 May 2008 20:53)

Tom dis you skip those pages of history where Russia invaded Afghanistan and then they formed Taliban etc. America has every right to be in Europe as long as it pleases to be. They protected Western Europe from Nazis and after from communism.

As for Vietnam they went there after French had to withdraw again helping with European mess and stop of communism. Many many Americans died protecting Europe form your beloved Russia.

How do people remember only bad things no one speaks about the billions of dollars they brought to Europe and Yugoslavia for that matter under Marshal plan, just ask greec.

@ CORFIZ:
Yes, yes Corfiz, there is one, a REAL one, I can hear him, even see him twice a day in a nearby park: a REAL GREAT DANE!

Really who give a damn ,they have they back ground problems .. russia (chechnya) India(Kashmir) and China (Tibet)so if really they think doing something right try and make those inocent's people live better... so please no more puppet shows

McCormack: Kosovo's status already settled

Washington /16/05/ 12:06

The status of Kosovo has bees resolved. It's an independent state, U.S. Sate Department spokesman Sean McCormack told reporters in Washington.

The statement came after the Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov said his Chinese and Indian counterparts agreed that Belgrade and Pristina should renew the talks on a mutually acceptable solution to the Kosovo issue.

McCormack conveyed the State Department's position that the status of Kosovo has been already settled.

I dont know how in the world some of you serbian nationalist feel about your self's maybe a " patriot" I don't think so ,people like you are just a disaster for own country so its so SHAME hearing and seeing they are still in large

Can anybody tell me who Slovenija, Bosna-Hercegovina,Croatia,Macedonia and Montenegro didn't like to live together with serbia?
Then why should kosovars live with serbs???

when this 3 countries speak all i hear is...bla bla bla bla bla bla whome cares their words have no weight what so ever, and the only reason they speak is because they are the oppresors of their own people..

I am impressed of the facility how soem ppl try to lecture teh albanian camp on what to do and how to do things.

I am also bittered by the attitude of some albanians here who try to diminuisc the importnace of Russia, China and India- it's simply immaturity (although the latter two coutries never expressed excplicitly their nagative stance on this matter).

Someone said "Don't you Albanians understand that your UDI was NOT about freedom, democracy, or your right of self-determination?"

do you mind if we judge for ourselvs if we feel free before or after 1999??

If the west recognized us for geo-political opportunism that's thier affair- untill that is in line with my interests- we have no pretensions on playing role in thw international politics. But you cannot teach us if we are free now or NOT. ok???

Were you sleeping in 1999? or that is ok with your moral.

Kosova belongs to kosovars and they want to live in an independent state. period.

Who douesn't recognise this as a mmatter of national freedom it's his problem.

The only issue here to discuss is the rights of teh serbian minority in Kosova. Ahtisari plan foresses that those rights are guarenteed by teh constitution of Kosov and teh International Community- K-Albanians said OK- Serbs [backed like allways by Russia] are refusing.

The destabilizing factor in teh balkans are those who whent to war in Slovenia, Croatia, Bosnia and Kosova.

To many wars to be in teh right side. period.

On America:

When my parents came to America, they were proud Yugoslavians. Now by the ignorant generalizations of America, we are just "white". No face, identity, or representation to speak of. Then we are brainwashed into thinking that because of the color of our skin we are the "oppressors" and are required to give hand-outs to blacks and hispanics in the form of affirmative action programs.

My own government has alienated me through their multicultural and diversity agenda. I feel no pride or affinity towards my government. Serbia has a lot to look forward to if they want to be more like the "west".

Ever since February 17 I have been waiting for comments from Serbs who live in India, China, Russia, Slovakia, Cyprus or any country that is against Kosova's independence.

It seems like you guys have voted with your feet as to which are the real democracies in today's world so any discussion to the contrary is simply hypocritical.

Russia,India,China....Bangladesh....they'd better talk about cecnia,kashmir, tibet,abkhazia etc.Let them feed their own people first(potatoes,rice , cabbages) and after that they may decide about Europe Union.They may grow-up next 20 years,but for sure they will NEVER reach the life standards of Europe and USA.Imagin peoles around the world to try to work and live "illegally" in these countrys!Common,are you kidding me???

Tom: Do the Albanians really believe that the Americans actually care for their welfare? If they do, they are living in Cloud Cuckoo Land. America cares only about America and its strategic interests, and if the Albanians stand in their way or act against American interests, they will happily obliterate them.

@Tom. We simply decided to go with the lesser evil as our choices were very limited.

America put it very clear regarding talks.
America " kosova is an independent country".
That is all that has to be said. No need for negotiations regarding status, Kosova is already with status. Independent.

Serbia has break the internatoinal law when they take our independence in 1989 no one says this.Why?
Meanwhile Rusia try to involve China and India will not work because China will recoginize Kosova soon because they are interested for new friends, while India never opposited our INDEPENDENCE.
Rusia is wellcome to recognize Kosova.

Talks should result in both sides establishing normal diplomatic relations, just like all other countries

To B92, and all the serbian posters here, I have told you before there is not anymore,"Kosovo Status" that should be deleted from the page, the Kosovas status is solved, Kosova is a state now, as you can read here: http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/News/PoliticsNation/US_dismisses_call_by_RIC_for_talks_between_Serbia_and_Kosovo_/rssarticleshow/3047205.cms
so please , what is that you are not getting it, you got enough carrots in the name of Kosova, there is no more, so if you wanna move forward, then do it , and if you wanna stay in the same place, dreaming that you will be again the fearrespected citizens of non existing YU, then go ahead, it is your choice, but world has changed a lot since then, nobody is afraid of you anymore, and I dont think anyone respects you anymore, however you can gain respect by respecting the others,by saying sorry for all the horrible things you did in the past 20 yrs, it will take time though, that time for which some of you are dreaming to come, when the world interests will change.
So move on serbian volk, get your right place in the new world order.

"an international meeting shall be convened to determine a mechanism for a final settlement for Kosovo, on the basis of the will of the people, opinions of relevant authorities, each Party's efforts regarding the implementation of this Agreement, AND the HELSINKI FINAL ACT” "

Mathew why do you capitalize the Helsinki Final Act and not THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE?
The people in Kosova have spoken and THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE is Independence. So you see 1244, by what you wrote 1244 does not impede our declaration. Also according to the HELSINKI FINAL ACT it states:
"By virtue of the principle of equal rights and self- determination of peoples, all peoples always have the right, in full freedom, to determine, when and as they wish, their internal and external political status, without external interference, and to pursue as they wish their political, economic, social and cultural development."

So you see Mathew, by what you wrote 1244 does not impede our declaration.

Jan Anderson. I agree with you that India and China have sweatshops. So do Phillipines and Indonesia and many other countries.

BUT, who has set up those sweatshops and who makes a profit? You got it...AMERICA.

So please don't start with how immoral those countries are when America is the boss. If you feel so insulted by the way these countreies do business then what are you doing with your Nikes or any other big brand item in your closet?

“… Can anybody tell me who Slovenija, Bosna-Hercegovina,Croatia,Macedonia and Montenegro didn't like to live together with serbia?
Then why should kosovars live with serbs???”

H. Izetbegovic(u),
Yes, I can tell you. Because they were lead by extreme nationalists, same as “Kosovars”. These fanatical leaders misused unstable situation in Yugoslavia to grab the power and then helped by western powers, destroyed our common country. In place of multicultural, quite big, reasonably developed, with a good quality of life for average citizen, social justice and guaranteed equal rights for all citizens regardless of nationality, country with own foreign policy and own economic system, they created small, backwards, poor, weak banana republics that are completely dependent of the west. These extremists amassed huge wealth and power. Majority of their citizens live much worse now then they used to in Yugoslavia.

“” … In 20 years Kosovo and Serbia will be in EU for sure. No one at that time will care about the invincible border, people will be busy working and taking vacations no will want to send their children to fight. …”

If peaceful EU, union of equal members was really the goal, yours and more importantly, your masters, then wouldn’t go trough all this trouble. It was much more logical, easier, cheaper, safer, you name it, to leave Kosovo and Metohija where it belongs, with Serbia, give you autonomy and in few years accept us both in EU where borders would possibly loose importance. No, you and your masters didn’t go through all this trouble by accident, you have different plans …

“… you skip those pages of history where Russia invaded Afghanistan and then they formed Taliban etc…”

It seems that you skipped quite a few pages. Russia formed Taliban? Where did you get this from? Russia was invited by the official Afghanistan Government to help fight the extremists who were trained and armed by USA.

“… America has every right to be in Europe as long as it pleases to be. They protected Western Europe from Nazis and after from communism. …“

That was all long time ago, ancient history by American standards. Why they don’t just forget about that and look towards future as they advise us to do? American Army is not needed in Europe any more.

You should know that defeat of Nazism was joint effort but Soviet Union played biggest role, by far. Around 80% of the total German losses were in the fighting with a Soviet Union. And among these was absolute top elite of German Army, best man and best equipment they had. So, it would be quite fair to say that Soviet Union defeated Nazism and Western allies helped in the struggle.

“… As for Vietnam they went there after French had to withdraw again helping with European mess and stop of communism…”

US army committed a genocide against Vietnamese, they killed millions of innocent civilians in indiscriminate carpet bombings. 30 years after the end of the war thousands of people in Vietnam and Laos are still dying each year from the unexploded US mines and cancerogenic chemicals that American sprayed all over the country. That sad, French were not much better. All this upper stiff ex-colonial Europeans that are lecturing everybody, have a lot of scelets in their closets.

“… Many many Americans died protecting Europe form your beloved Russia…”

? Please, tell us more.

“…no one speaks about the billions of dollars … Marshal plan,..”
Well, yes, they also did some good, no baddy denies that. Although, motivation behind that is not exactly so idealistic as often presented but good, never mind, we’ll not go into that now

“… just ask greec…”

Well, actually, I did ask them. (I have quite a few Greek friends). When Americans are mentioned my friends usually talk about American role during Greek military dictature, Turkish invasion of Cypres and similar moments in history…

"He said that the three countries believed that the “Kosovo question” had to be settled exclusively on the basis of international law."

It is- it is based on the RIGHT of self-determination of the nations clearly marked in the International Law.

Why Sumadija doesn’t want to break form Serbia? because Sumadijans are part of the Serbian nation.

Kosovars are NOT.

Hence, they exercised their RIGHT on SELF-DETERMINATION- as from the international law.

If Russia wants to interpretate the international law only as tool to satisfy here hegemonic appetites towards her neighboring nations that's another issue- it has nothing to do with international law.

Free Tibet.

Asia against Europe. What do they want in Europe. Enough their interferance in european yard. I am asking if serbia is part of europe or Asia? Do they want to cooperate with Europe or to fight against Europe in favor of China, India and Russia?

Tom,

in 10 years the main super powers will be EU, USA, China, and possibly Russia. While China opposes independence it is really not against it, Russia is just putting up a show. Is this what Velika Serbia has been reduced to? Depending on others to fight your battles eh?

All these three must have wire taped Ban KI Moon's office, because the other day UN Secretary general has made a decission to give the green light to EU Mission. This will be made public right after 15 of June 2008. Watch and see, also you can mark my words.

russia is very dessperated and they talk desperatly they can talk nonstop nobody hear them bye bye russia

Kosovo is not in Asia but Europe. My advise to India, China and Russia: stay away from Kosovo. You have your own problems to deal with: Tibet, Myanmar, Kashmir. When you have totally peace in your own continent, then you can begin to give your opinions about other parts of the world.

PS: Most if Russia is in Asia

Russia, China, India all of them irrilevant to Kosovar ppl and its ecnonomy. Nice try though!

There is a lot of water to flow under the bridge yet before the Kosovo story reaches its conclusion. (Tom O'Donoghue, 15 May 2008 12:58)

before Russia, China and India are playing big daddies, they better should show the world first how to solve conflicts with their own provinces which require self-determination - and before Mr. Lavrov asks someone else for to respect international law, he should show the world how to do that in the cases he is responsible for.

Dear all,

...call for new talks???

who??!!!!!Russia, India, China...

PLEEEEASE...

First, they ARE too dependent (economically at least) and moreover, they better solve Chechnya, Tibet, and Kashmir before they are even allowed to say a thing....on Kosovo, closed chapter with ongoing world-wide recognitions

Peace to all


Cheers

Unbelievable!
Who in the earth needs Russian, Chinese or Indian democracy? Certanly not Europenas, not Albananians for sure!
People who consider cow as their god and throw babies from fifth floor, also worship rats in the temple the Indians.
People who kill their own, Russians and Chinese.
Thanks you but NO! We do NOT need this kind of "democracy", maybe some people in Serbia want this but I am sure Albanians in Kosovo do NOT need this.
Let them take care of their own problems and then maybe we will try to take a look at their advice.
Free Tibet, Free Chechnya.
Long live Western European and American democracy.

Resume talks, hmmm let's see. What are the odds of 70% of the world wealth bowing down to the requests of these 3rd world countries?

"Emerging economies"...lol, it'll take a few milleniums before they are able top compete with 70% of the world wealth. It's not like they'll grow while the West will get poor.

Anyhow, get ready for 3 fat vetoes in the UNSC for any kind of "new talks". The situation can only be solved under the new reality, and the only solution is to recognize independence. Anything else will simply get vetoed no matter what.

Luckily Russia has made the claim that Kosovo's independence will destabilize the region. Unluckily for Russia, if time proves the opposite, that argument will be toast. They have locked themselves into an irrational stance, so no matter how much they huff and puff, time can only prove them wrong. And no one wins against time, not even Russia.

Russia, China, India.

In 10-20 years these will be the three largest economies in the world. None of them are happy with the so-called independence of Kosovo.
.
(Tom O'Donoghue, 15 May 2008 12:58)

Dear Tom,
Russia, China and India doesn’t care for Kosovo and Serbia, nor they care for Europe and Balkan. They care for their influence in Global Market. So they will not be happy no matter what happen with Kosovo. Kosovo is just a justification for voicing their influential cry. Kosovo is just a random victim. Kosovars are just the one to pay the price of their rising power against Europe and Western power. K-Serbs are the victim, and not only victim of not only Russia, China and India manipulation but victim of their own co-patriot manipulation in Beograd, who doesn’t really care for K-Serbs nor do they care for International Law but for International Game of Power. More and more K-Serbs understood this and their voices are heard now to let them alone and care for their welfare and not for warfare. They, although are in enormous pressure from masters of Beograd power mafia, every day are crying for help, they don’t want to be anymore a sward in Beograd power mafia’s hand to reach the power.
Listen to them and analyze their word chosen carefully, although they are afraid being labeled “enemy of the nation”. They realized that nothing can beat the freedom of the nation to live free in their 4000 years land. Nothing can justify the crimes against their fellow K-Albanians because they want to be free. Closer to Kosovo you are better you understand Kosovar rights for self-determination. Far way you are from Kosovo less and less you understand their need. That why many and many UK – Serbs like yourself are less realistic and more aggressive about future of Kosovo and Balkan. From a warm nest in far west, they see their back-home region as “Action Movie” or a “Fighting Game” to see who wins. There are their people and their neighbors who will be hurt. They don’t care. Unfortunately. Dear Tom, it is time of reflection. It is easy to make people suffer especially your neighbor. Europe is the future of Serbia and whole Balkan.

We Serbs have to wait it out, until the geo-political situation in the world tips in our favour.

(Dragan, 15 May 2008 13:53)

Ok Dragan, you do that.
Until then, Kosovo is independent.

"Russia, India, China call for new Kosovo talks"

Well the answer to your request dear Asian’s is NO.
Now the issue is what are you guys going to do about this???
Kosovo is not Kashmir, Tibet or Chechnya so please spare your sympathy about the international law.
Just another finger-puppet show from the Far East it appears.

No point getting all exited about China, Russia, India calling for 'respect of international law'. The west makes it, the west can also break it.

These guys see the West getting older and think it has no will to rule yet. Trust me the will is there, and any meddling on how the west rules the world will be payed for IN KIND and IN TIME.

The west is down but definitely NOT OUT.

Cool we can talk about the Yugoslavian embassies, pensions, and the mining that was done in Trepca for almost 50 years by the Serbs who used the money to build serbia and deprive the Kosovars. That we can talk about...

hey Tom,
you should get a head start and buy some property in India.

On 15 May 2008 15:27, Zbyszek wrote:

"Remember that India is the digest democracy in the World"

Democracy? Don't make me laugh. It is a country where people are divided into a multitude of castes, with people from one caste refusing to touch or speak with someone from a lower caste. It is a country where the (high-caste) police regularly beat the low-caste people, and corruption is just another way to generate income. Where women have acid thrown in their faces if they happen to look at the wrong man.

Don't give me no democracy shit about India.

"and as China the fastest growing economies."

And the biggest dictatorship in the world, with sweatshops where children regularly are being exploited, where mineworkers are killed almost every month, and people are being relocated by force whenever a new dam is being built.

It is no big feat to be a fast growing economy when you have no regard for the average people.

"Also keep in mind that history of those countries are older then history of Europe."

And your point is? Should we now regard Egypt, where the same presidential dictator, Mubarak, has been clinging to power in 25 years, and is preparing to pass the power to his - should we now regard Egypt as something to admire, because they built pyramids 5000 years ago?

To answer to some of you regarding the RIGHT of self-determination.

"UN Charter in post�World War II 1945, the signatories introduced the right of all people to self-determination into the framework of international law and diplomacy. In addition, the right to self-determination holds the prestigious position of Article 1 in both the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights (ICCPR) and the International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights (ICESCR). Its presence in the two covenants points to the right's complex nature and importance."

The RIGHT on self-determination is lively that it make possible teh creation of Algeria, Morocco, and the entire post-colonial Africa.

I hope you don't wonder the "mystery" of how it happened that the UN in the 1945 had about 40 members and now has almost 200- it's teh self-determination that made this possible, OK? got it?

Slovenia created here state based on this right, Macedonia, BiH and guess what Serbia too, and Russia as well- EURECA

You see, the world slowly but surely is getting more democratic (by recognizing teh right of self-determination to almost 160 nations after the WW2) and now it will be even more democratic by recognizing Kosova.

The process has started, today we have 40 countries that have recognized Kosova, and teh process is continuing�

Jovan: Kosovars are the Albanians living in the Albania�s Northern Province Kosova. The state of Kosova is fake (I agree with Kostunica) it should�ve been part of Albania since 1912 by declaring UDI form Turkey not Serbia.

It was your protectors and sponsors Russia that forced Kosova being part of Serbia- and as result we hav this conflict.

The conflicts arise when you don�t respect the diversity and the right of other cultures and try to incorporate them into another culture by force.

We can negotiate all you want.
The problem is that there is no other solution.
Serbia too would not want Kosovo within its borders. It cannot handle it.
Easy to claim it from political meetings and internet posts.
The three countries have yet to come with a solution for Kosovo. They don't have one. Nor have they contributed until now for the progress of peace in Kosovo. Their declaration in fact has not much to do with Kosovo itself. It is a unholy alliance against other independence-seeking nations like Kosovo.
Well the progress of freedom will not stop.

I like the comment lets wait 10 to 20 years and lets see what happens. Sure this is great idea, Let people of Kosovo try to rule they land for next 10 to 20 years. People speak about China, Russia, India bla bla bla. Let people try to solve it them self, Kosovo has 92% Kosovars today do the math in 20 years it will have 97% since the they do love to make children. In 20 years Kosovo and Serbia will be in EU for sure. No one at that time will care about the invincible border, people will be busy working and taking vacations no will want to send their children to fight.

So this is simple let’s all concentrate in working for better future for each country and meet in EU together in 5 years. EU knows Serbia will never except Kosovo but it will to get in EU together so lets try this and make our economies Stronger and not worry about India, china, Brazil etc.

I don't recall the Russians, Chinese or Indians travelling half way across the globe to attack a succession of sovereign states. Iraq, Afghanistan and Vietnam

(Tom O'Donoghue, 15 May 2008 20:53)

Tom dis you skip those pages of history where Russia invaded Afghanistan and then they formed Taliban etc. America has every right to be in Europe as long as it pleases to be. They protected Western Europe from Nazis and after from communism.

As for Vietnam they went there after French had to withdraw again helping with European mess and stop of communism. Many many Americans died protecting Europe form your beloved Russia.

How do people remember only bad things no one speaks about the billions of dollars they brought to Europe and Yugoslavia for that matter under Marshal plan, just ask greec.

On 15 May 2008 12:58, Tom O'Donoghue wrote:

"In 10-20 years these will be the three largest economies in the world. None of them are happy with the so-called independence of Kosovo."

Let us assume you are right Tom. Let us assume that the US and EU in 20 years time are tangled up in internal disputes and economic disaster.

What do you propose Serbia (and Russia, China and India) do in regard to Kosovo at that time? Will the Kosovo-Albanians welcome their Serbian overlords, when they cross the border and set up new local governments? Create a new police force? Start collecting taxes for Belgrade?

Or will we have another war on our hands?
--

when this 3 countries speak all i hear is...bla bla bla bla bla bla whome cares their words have no weight what so ever, and the only reason they speak is because they are the oppresors of their own people..

Dear Ben,

Krajinians are NOT Croatians, so why not let them form their own state? (as you put it "their RIGHT on SELF-DETERMINATION")

Not only do "Kosovars" mercilessly oppress non-Albanians within Kosovo, they even traveled to Krajina to help the Croatian fascists wipe the Krajinians out (and then voted a leading figure of that operation, Ceku, in as a PM!?!... such is the multi ethnicity of Albanians)

Bottom line: Albanians seem to be fanatically anti-Serbian, "self determination" is just a mask for you.

Compared to the hypocracy of the "Kosovars", USA etc, Russia is like an innocent child!

PS: Free Krajina!

Zbyszek,

I am sorry my friend they have older history then you have but, Albanians their history is oldest in the world. Dou you think that history of europe started with invasion of slavs in europe?

Can anybody tell me who Slovenija, Bosna-Hercegovina,Croatia,Macedonia and Montenegro didn't like to live together with serbia?
Then why should kosovars live with serbs???

"an international meeting shall be convened to determine a mechanism for a final settlement for Kosovo, on the basis of the will of the people, opinions of relevant authorities, each Party's efforts regarding the implementation of this Agreement, AND the HELSINKI FINAL ACT” "

Mathew why do you capitalize the Helsinki Final Act and not THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE?
The people in Kosova have spoken and THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE is Independence. So you see 1244, by what you wrote 1244 does not impede our declaration. Also according to the HELSINKI FINAL ACT it states:
"By virtue of the principle of equal rights and self- determination of peoples, all peoples always have the right, in full freedom, to determine, when and as they wish, their internal and external political status, without external interference, and to pursue as they wish their political, economic, social and cultural development."

So you see Mathew, by what you wrote 1244 does not impede our declaration.

Russia, China, India.

In 10-20 years these will be the three largest economies in the world. None of them are happy with the so-called independence of Kosovo.

Those jingoistic pro-US posters on this site take a very short-term view of history unfolding. Remember all that stuff about "the end of history" in the early nineties?

There is a lot of water to flow under the bridge yet before the Kosovo story reaches its conclusion.

Ok, these three countries have an opinion and voiced it. Serbia has every reason to want more talks. China with the killings it is involved in Tibet has every reason to not let Kosova be a model, because that would mean that if you kill your own citizens then they have earned the right to separate from you. The same goes for India and Russia. These countries are afraid not of what they have done in the past, but of what they will continue doing in the future. Knowing fully well that they will continue to kill and persecute their citizens in Chechnya, Tibet and probably Kashmir, they fear Kosova because for the first time in history people where able to set themselves free from the killing and persecution of their own state without this state's approval (Serbia's approval). These three countries are not afraid of separatism, but afraid that if Kosova one day becomes a full UN member they will have to pay their dues for killing and persecuting their citizens. They are afraid that one day what happened in Kosova will become a principle international law and solving disputes. That is :" If you persecute and kill your own citizens, you lose the right of sovereignty over them, even if you are bigger, meaner and more powerful."
Personally I think that principle should be set, not only for Kosova but for all the peoples out there who have suffered by the hand of bigger countries that have forcefully incorporated them against their will, anywhere in the world.

Having said that: It would be wise for these politicians to talk about international law only once Serbia stops breaking it on a daily basis by hiding and aiding war criminals such as Mladic and Karadzic. You cannot ask for the world to respect international law in the name of Serbia when Serbia is the first one that breaks it on a daily basis. It is simply a nonsense.

On another note, it is not illegal to declare something. It is not illegal to recognize something.
Also based on 1244, it guaranteed Jugoslavia's sovereignty ONLY DURING THE TRANSITORY PERIOD. I capitalized that because our Serb readers seem to skip that part. 1244 also states that the final status will be settled according to the talks in Ramboillet. In these talks it is stated that the final status will be solved according to the wishes of Kosova's people. As a result we declared our independence in accord with 1244.

Also Dragan said:
We Serbs have to wait it out, until the geo-political situation in the world tips in our favour. Then the Americans and their lapdogs will go back to where they belong.
Cheers!
(Dragan, 15 May 2008 13:53)

Dragan I see you Serbs are learning a lot from us. That is what we Albanians did exactly. We waited until the geo-political situation in the world tipped in our favor, then the Russians and their lapdogs went where they belonged. Patience is a virtue. So far I have learned that Serbs lack it. Time will prove the accuracy of my opinion.
By the way, it feels great cutting ties with Serbia and being under NATO protection.

Really who give a damn ,they have they back ground problems .. russia (chechnya) India(Kashmir) and China (Tibet)so if really they think doing something right try and make those inocent's people live better... so please no more puppet shows

Serbia has break the internatoinal law when they take our independence in 1989 no one says this.Why?
Meanwhile Rusia try to involve China and India will not work because China will recoginize Kosova soon because they are interested for new friends, while India never opposited our INDEPENDENCE.
Rusia is wellcome to recognize Kosova.

Ever since February 17 I have been waiting for comments from Serbs who live in India, China, Russia, Slovakia, Cyprus or any country that is against Kosova's independence.

It seems like you guys have voted with your feet as to which are the real democracies in today's world so any discussion to the contrary is simply hypocritical.

America put it very clear regarding talks.
America " kosova is an independent country".
That is all that has to be said. No need for negotiations regarding status, Kosova is already with status. Independent.

In the original transcript, only Russia speaks supposedly on behalf of these countries. None of these countries have issued any statements, neither their leaders. Is Russia just bluffing?.
Credibility is in question. I am sorry Tanjug, but B92, could you obtain the original transcript instead? Shall your public read it without editing its title.

Russia, India, and China eh? The tree fastest growing economies in the world. Gee, I thought Serbia was 'self isolated' according to Tadic and Solana's boys??
Face it, Kosovo will never be independent. We Serbs have to wait it out, until the geo-political situation in the world tips in our favour. Then the Americans and their lapdogs will go back to where they belong.
Cheers!

To Readers:

In China when a politican accepts bribes he is sentenced to death because his actions hurt a great number of people. In China, politicans are afraid to take bribes or to work against the people. Conversly, in the United States, people lose everyday when politicans take bribes. More importantly, Serbs lose when the US politicans take bribes from the Albanians in Kosovo. Thus, in retrospect, based on the infromation that I have provided, China has greater moral values than the United States.

International law had to be RESPECTED!! Big Shame to these 40 states that recognized the illegal state of kosovo. Shame to those serbs who voted for the DS

Do we need all to admire Indian killers, destructionest of everything worth in the normal world - cowboy-fast food drive-through democracy.
They are just stealing the oil and killing people all over the world(bombardment of Serbia, Iraq - what a mess - they kill million of people and destroy the one of greatest-oldest cultures in the world). In name of what - american and your way of li(f)e.
Not mine and any normal human being.
Support stealing and nonsense,
it will all come back to you when more people get sober, untill then we have to be patient and read some of your nonsense puppeteering.

Are there any REAL Danes here?

Jan "Rexhep" Andersen perhaps?

"Absolute rubbish. Ask yourself this, why did Slovenia leave YU?

Answer, they got fed up shovelling their hard earned cash into a black hole called Kosovo.
(Niall O'Doherty, 15 May 2008 22:57) "

On the contrary. If you knew anything about the situation you would know that when Milosevic decided to anul Kosova's autonomy Slovenia was the first Republic to be against it. In fact the Slovenian representative left the meeting. At the same night an extraordinary meeting of the parliament of Slovenia occurred, where the Slovenian representatives denounced Milosevic's and Serbia's annulment of autonomy for Kosova. As a mattar of fact this session was televised in Serbia, as way to put a spin on the Slovenian attitude and show them as traitors as Jugoslavia since they were against the abolishment of Kosova's autonomy. Slovenia simply got fed up of the Serbian attitude that they're better and smarter than the other parts of the union so the Serbs have the right to decide for them. Slovenia was in fact one of the staunchest supporters of Kosova's autonomy during those times.

You on the other hand are continuing the work of the greatest Serbian propagandist, by twisting facts.

I am impressed of the facility how soem ppl try to lecture teh albanian camp on what to do and how to do things.

I am also bittered by the attitude of some albanians here who try to diminuisc the importnace of Russia, China and India- it's simply immaturity (although the latter two coutries never expressed excplicitly their nagative stance on this matter).

Someone said "Don't you Albanians understand that your UDI was NOT about freedom, democracy, or your right of self-determination?"

do you mind if we judge for ourselvs if we feel free before or after 1999??

If the west recognized us for geo-political opportunism that's thier affair- untill that is in line with my interests- we have no pretensions on playing role in thw international politics. But you cannot teach us if we are free now or NOT. ok???

Were you sleeping in 1999? or that is ok with your moral.

Kosova belongs to kosovars and they want to live in an independent state. period.

Who douesn't recognise this as a mmatter of national freedom it's his problem.

The only issue here to discuss is the rights of teh serbian minority in Kosova. Ahtisari plan foresses that those rights are guarenteed by teh constitution of Kosov and teh International Community- K-Albanians said OK- Serbs [backed like allways by Russia] are refusing.

The destabilizing factor in teh balkans are those who whent to war in Slovenia, Croatia, Bosnia and Kosova.

To many wars to be in teh right side. period.

McCormack: Kosovo's status already settled

Washington /16/05/ 12:06

The status of Kosovo has bees resolved. It's an independent state, U.S. Sate Department spokesman Sean McCormack told reporters in Washington.

The statement came after the Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov said his Chinese and Indian counterparts agreed that Belgrade and Pristina should renew the talks on a mutually acceptable solution to the Kosovo issue.

McCormack conveyed the State Department's position that the status of Kosovo has been already settled.

Tom: Do the Albanians really believe that the Americans actually care for their welfare? If they do, they are living in Cloud Cuckoo Land. America cares only about America and its strategic interests, and if the Albanians stand in their way or act against American interests, they will happily obliterate them.

@Tom. We simply decided to go with the lesser evil as our choices were very limited.

I believe Russia is a good advocate for Serbia. Russia is forming a pro-Serbian front with big powers included. In the post-Soviet ethnic conflicts Russia is increasing the price the West will have to pay for the Kosovo violence. Russia use every possible contact with the EU a another platform for the dialogue over Kosovo. Russia undertakes other unexpected steps to make the US chorus retreat. After the Serbs are ready Russia will invest here really big sums the EU cannot even dream of.

And after all B-92 didn't find it possible even to mention of the great victory FC Zenit gained last night in Manchester City ... I hope it's not the general trend of pro-American Serbs ! At least don't forget that our brotherhood started long before the US to appear on the map ...

@ben: there are no "kosovars"... there are Albanians living on serbian territory, yes. but there is no such thing like a "kosovar"

as I have always said, let´s just see what future brings! and I am quite confident.

"Emerging economies"...lol, it'll take a few milleniums before they are able top compete with 70% of the world wealth. It's not like they'll grow while the West will get poor.

I got news for you. The West is already poor. The West have been financing their standard of living with other nation's money for decades. Guess who became the largest holder of American debt a few years ago? You guessed it...China!

I dont know how in the world some of you serbian nationalist feel about your self's maybe a " patriot" I don't think so ,people like you are just a disaster for own country so its so SHAME hearing and seeing they are still in large

Russia,India,China....Bangladesh....they'd better talk about cecnia,kashmir, tibet,abkhazia etc.Let them feed their own people first(potatoes,rice , cabbages) and after that they may decide about Europe Union.They may grow-up next 20 years,but for sure they will NEVER reach the life standards of Europe and USA.Imagin peoles around the world to try to work and live "illegally" in these countrys!Common,are you kidding me???

To B92, and all the serbian posters here, I have told you before there is not anymore,"Kosovo Status" that should be deleted from the page, the Kosovas status is solved, Kosova is a state now, as you can read here: http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/News/PoliticsNation/US_dismisses_call_by_RIC_for_talks_between_Serbia_and_Kosovo_/rssarticleshow/3047205.cms
so please , what is that you are not getting it, you got enough carrots in the name of Kosova, there is no more, so if you wanna move forward, then do it , and if you wanna stay in the same place, dreaming that you will be again the fearrespected citizens of non existing YU, then go ahead, it is your choice, but world has changed a lot since then, nobody is afraid of you anymore, and I dont think anyone respects you anymore, however you can gain respect by respecting the others,by saying sorry for all the horrible things you did in the past 20 yrs, it will take time though, that time for which some of you are dreaming to come, when the world interests will change.
So move on serbian volk, get your right place in the new world order.

Benny,

"Asia against Europe. What do they want in Europe. Enough their interferance in european yard. I am asking if serbia is part of europe or Asia? Do they want to cooperate with Europe or to fight against Europe in favor of China, India and Russia?"

Asia against Europe? No Benny, it is not. It is Asia and Europe against illegal action of some European governments. It is Asia and Europe for preservation of Final Act of European Security and Cooperation from Helsinki.

Do not forget, Russia is the biggest European country (taking into consideration just European part of Russia). China and India are as far from Serbia us USA.

What Camp Bondsteel is doing in Kosovo? What is purpose of US nuclear shield in Poland and Czech Republic?

Remember that India is the digest democracy in the World and as China the fastest growing economies. Also keep in mind that history of those countries are older then history of Europe.

Russia, China and India currently represent close to half the world's population and will shortly become the dominant powers. What is important in their position is the respect for international law and the resolution of problems through negotiations.

However, on the other hand, you have the US - who promote themselves as the world's greatest democracy and are spreading it by bombing countries back to the stone age and ignoring international law when it gets in the way.

I am pleased that we have Russia, China and India backing Serbia and international law. We can stand shoulder to shoulder with them instead of bowing to the US/EU.

Samo napred Srbija!

'Ok Dragan, you do that.
Until then, Kosovo is independent.'

Blero,

'Supervised independence' is not independence. It is just more double speak from your hero, cowboy George. You are anything but independent. If NATO decides they want to use you for nuclear testing, or a dumping area for its contaminated waste, I am sure you will welcome their programs with open arms, right? You would have no choice anyways. Enjoy your 'supervised independence' while it lasts. I can assure you it is only temproary.
Cheers!

Is doesn't matter what Russia, China and India call for. And it's totally irrelevant what these countries will become 20-30 years from now. At this moment in time they are not yet the absolute rulers of the world and that is what matters.

If the issue will be decided in the UNSC, than let's not forget that it has been deadlocked on the issue for quite a while now, and any initiative to open up new talks, that doesn't take into account the situation on the ground - the declaration of independence and the international recognition it has received so far - any such initiative is not realistic and will certainly be blocked by US, GB and France. So, such calls are pretty much pointless.

It's also interesting to see that Brazil didn't join these other three in calling for new talks. Perhaps Brazil sees the situation a bit more realistically.

Benny:
What business does the US have in Europe?
ben:
You can twist it any way you like, nonetheless, the US has no legal right to strip a piece of a sovereign country's territory.
Tom O'Donoghue:
What do you mean in 10-20 years? Look around my friend.

Talks should result in both sides establishing normal diplomatic relations, just like all other countries

Benny,Ben, Bembi, - is Joe any of these,

You are pushing logic and international law to the edge. You should benefit from the US bulling and small games on the short run. But you’re all provoking big thing(s) when all that stupidity should end and won’t be tolerated anymore in the long run of 20-40 years. You will be again on wrong – losing side and we will suffer a lot and get as prize some losers in our yard to manage them and start from zero. And we’ll accept that and give you a hand till the next time-occasion and Mary-history goes again in cycles. Boring… or not.

Cheers, enjoy your UDI - you deserve it and whatever happens later.

Ben,

You wrote: "It is - it is based on the RIGHT of self-determination of the nations clearly marked in the International Law".

Can you please direct me to the exact legislative framework you refer to where this is clearly marked?

Here's a principle of international law you may want to look into:

"territorial integrity and the inviolability of internationally recognized borders"

Just google it - you will see that this principle, which happens to be a legal one, is the current standard. This, as opposed to the THEORETICAL principle you refer to - which happens NOT to be a legal standard.

ben - If you think what you say is correct then explain why Kosovo Albanians, Turkish Cypriots and other "independent states" haven't been recognised as states by UN law????

The simple fact is that a states borders take precedence over minorites right to self determination otherwise Kosovo would have been granted statehood by now, along with northern Cyprus, Abkhazia,etc,etc.....

As you seem to think every minority has the right to self determination, then you won't have a problem with the Serbs in Kosovo staying within Serbia and "breaking" away from Kosovo then will you?

Or maybe you think Serbs deserve a different treatment as many Albanian posters claim the right to self determination, but try to deny it to the Serbs in Kosovo as it would "cause instability in the region" - and Kosovo trying to break away from Serbia isn't going to cause more instability than a small minority of Serbs in Kosovo?????

YEAH, right!!

Don't forget Brazil - another supporter of Intl. laws, i.e. Serbia's integrity and territorial integrity.

The BRICS in short form half of world's population, 1/3rd of land area and 40% or more of GDP...

India, China and Russia are more qualified to comment on Kosovo's illegal UDI than any US or EU country...
Why...?

Because they represent the bulk of Eurasia, the same continent on which resides Serbia...

And US is about 8000 kms away.

On 15 May 2008 18:05, "Corfitz Ulfeldt" wrote:

"Are there any REAL Danes here?"

I don't know - what is a REAL Dane? Maybe a Dane Burger from one of the DSB grills?

Or someone like me that is brought up on rugbrød (ryebread), havregrød (oatmeal) and potatoes?

I tried earlier to post a reply to you, written in Danish accompanied with a translation in English, but the moderators here stripped the Danish part of my post and only allowed the English translation to go through.

Rexhep ???

I'll make this short and sweet because I'm heading out to a kafana, which is far more exciting than wasting time responding to every knee-jerk statement made by the predictable Albanian groupthinkers:

Kosovo Albanian leaders and their Western financiers have two choices.

Option 1: Keep thinking Kosovo is a European issue, where the rest of the world doesn't matter.

Option 2: Kosovo is, at some point or another, an international issue that needs to be solved so as to not remain a economic, political, and social blackhole until the Apocalypse.

If Option 1 is continued, Kosovo will remaim a European colony indefinately, with "independence" being little more than a sick joke.

If Option 2 is realized, and Kosovo truly wants to be taken seriously as a real country, it needs to head back to the negotiation table with Serbia, which is now apparently backed by three of the most powerful countries in the world.

Colony? Or globally recognized state?

@ CORFIZ:
Yes, yes Corfiz, there is one, a REAL one, I can hear him, even see him twice a day in a nearby park: a REAL GREAT DANE!

I am amused at the attitudes of the Albanian lobby in their comments. There seems to be two strands:
1. Russia, China, India don't give a damn about Serbia or Kosovo. They're only acting from self interest.
2. How dare they speak; look at Tibet, Chechnya, Kashmir.

Well, well, there are none so blind as those who will not see.

As regards 1: Do the Albanians really believe that the Americans actually care for their welfare? If they do, they are living in Cloud Cuckoo Land. America cares only about America and its strategic interests, and if the Albanians stand in their way or act against American interests, they will happily obliterate them. Meanwhile a few Albanians might make money from the existence of Camp Bondsteel but that's the limit of American committment to the province.

As regards 2:

I don't recall the Russians, Chinese or Indians travelling half way across the globe to attack a succession of sovereign states. Iraq, Afghanistan and Vietnam are only a fraction of the countries that America or its proxies have assaulted in recent decades.

To Willy Nilly: I don't buy property except for my own home.
To Jan Andersen: I will address your question at a later time.

don´t worry for individuals like ben, or blero...

for them, everyone who tells them they are independent ( even if it´s simply not the factual truth ) is their hero. it´s that simple!

everyone who is against "their" (!) "state" is of course un-democratic and should care "of their own problems"... wow, what an argumentation!

of course Spain and Greece, Slovakia are also undemocratic countries, according to our albanian friends... =)

there´s one simple answer to those illusions: it was never yours, and it will never be yours. you will see how your dream will be crushed.

just a question of time. let´s just see what future brings...


perhaps you will rather go to the US than to stay in a serbian province, who knows... maybe you will change your mind, ...but in the end, who cares?

a lot of the k-albanians has alread serbian documents and those who don´t believe that or deny it, are simple fools.

it seems like some Albanians know that this whole "newborn"-nonsense will not last very long...

some others will have to realize it later, I guess.

ps: please, my albanian friends, don´t write bad things about Russia, India and China, since you could one day regret it! especially you, who are always bowing your head before those who are strong at the moment...you should look into the future, my friends...

:)

Anyhow, get ready for 3 fat vetoes in the UNSC for any kind of "new talks". Funcakes
--
So what's new? You have two fat vetoes preventing Kosovo independence so we are still stuck in the status quo.

As always, Serbian's rule themselves and so do Albanians. Has anything changed since the IUDI?

My advice would be to keep an eye on that "70%" wealth figure because those nations at full capacity could be matched by 30% capacity of Russia, China and India alone.

Anyway, that's a few years away and the time will come but in the mean time, enjoy your "Independence". I think the US have a few boots that need polishing!

Cool we can talk about the Yugoslavian embassies, pensions, and the mining that was done in Trepca for almost 50 years by the Serbs who used the money to build serbia and deprive the Kosovars. That we can talk about...
(Nehat, 15 May 2008 16:52)

Absolute rubbish. Ask yourself this, why did Slovenia leave YU?

Answer, they got fed up shovelling their hard earned cash into a black hole called Kosovo.

Sad thing is, there is nothing more to be said on that. And that's everybody's fault.
But as long there is Serbia, there will be Kosovo.

I read these comments from the "Albanian" side, and I just cannot believe what arguments they use for everything. Rational people cannot dismiss that Russia, China, and India are voices to be heard and listened to! And their point is that the UDI of Kosovo was illegal, period! Don't you Albanians understand that your UDI was NOT about freedom, democracy, or your right of self-determination? It was simply a game of geo-politics and you are simply pawns of the West. You have been used and duped by the West to think that Albanians in Kosovo are "special" and will become as prosperous as the rest of Europe- or even Serbia. You had such wide autonomy under Serbia, and a much better standard of living than you do now, or will have in the future. You don't have the trained work force necessary to become prosperous- prosperity is something you WORK for- it's not just having "great benefactors". You don't even have enough electricity to supply yourselves. You can daydream forever that now, because you're "free" from Serbia, Kosovo will attain a better life for your people. Wake up- snap out of your stupor!!! The BEST thing that could happen would be for the UN to reconsider your UDI in September and come to terms with the reality "on the ground". And yes, these "insignificant" countries like Russia, China, and India will bring reality "to the table" and keep international law intact. And YES- Kosovo is Serbia, and will always be Serbian!!!

Hi ORTHODOX,

Congratulations, for the Zenit’s, victory, nice game.

“… Russia is a good advocate for Serbia. … forming a pro-Serbian front … After the Serbs are ready Russia will invest here really big sums the EU cannot even dream of.

Yes, that’s the way to do it! This meeting in Yekaterinburg is really good sine. It is of outmost importance that Russia continue to do everything possible to further develop friendly relations with China and India. Russian – Chinese alliance is American biggest nightmare. They will do all they can to prevent it and create conflict between you.

"but, Albanians their history is oldest in the world."

LOL

this broken-english sentence says it all, in so many ways.

“according to the talks in Ramboillet. In these talks it is stated that the final status will be solved according to the wishes of Kosova's people. (johny, 15 May 2008 20:57)”

Johnny,

Here is the full quote from the Rambouillet agreement, either you didn’t read it (most likely) or you didn’t understand it.

“an international meeting shall be convened to determine a mechanism for a final settlement for Kosovo, on the basis of the will of the people, opinions of relevant authorities, each Party's efforts regarding the implementation of this Agreement, AND the HELSINKI FINAL ACT”

http://www.state.gov/www/regions/eur/ksvo_rambouillet_text.html

In other words, it must be democractic AND (the key word being AND) respect the territory of Serbia.

Next you’ll claim UNSC 1244 doesn’t apply to Serbia, only Yugoslavia, ha ha…

Considering that the UN 1244 is law in Kosovo (i Metohija) it is well within the rights of the permanent veto holding members of the Security Council to make their opinions known.

Any one who says otherwise (Europeans and ethnic- Albanians) are disingenuous.

kv dont lecture me on someone fighting serbias battels who was the one fighting the battle for the kla from 30,000ft like cowards. if the serbs were given the green light in kosovo they would have shown you what fighting is all about so please

Just a quick question to the Albanian arguments:

Why do you guys use Kashmir as an area which India supposedly mistreats on the same level as China Tibet?

The history of that region is quite complex, and one point I'd like to make is that there have been four wars in Kashmir between Pakistan and India, and all four were started by Pakistan. Hindus and Sikhs were annihilated in Kashmir by the Pakistanis, so in fact, it is Pakistan who should be criticized for Kashmir and not India.

One more thing: it's easy to accuse Russia of mistreating Chechnya, but do any of you Albanians know how the war started? It started because the government in power at the time was stormed by Chechen rebels, in which the party chief was killed, most of the party members tortured and many ethnic Russians attacked before declaring illegal independence. Russia did the right thing in taking it back and bringing it under its control again, though indeed the way they did it was unnacceptable with the heavy bombings, seiges and massacres, but to paint the Chechen rebels as freedom fighters is ridiculous, those "people" are some of the most extreme terrorists in the world and it was only right to put them down.

To conclude to the Albanians: conflicts are very complex things, it's not often that one exists as the result of one side only, though indeed when it comes to Tibet, then I agree wholeheartedly with you, they deserve freedom from the Reds more than anyone.

Funcakes

I won't comment, just provide you with the latest IMF statistics from 2007:

GDP per capita (PPP)

Kosovo - $1 800
India - $2 700
China - $5 300
Albania - $6 649
Russia - $14 692

So who are you calling the 3rd world around here?

On America:

When my parents came to America, they were proud Yugoslavians. Now by the ignorant generalizations of America, we are just "white". No face, identity, or representation to speak of. Then we are brainwashed into thinking that because of the color of our skin we are the "oppressors" and are required to give hand-outs to blacks and hispanics in the form of affirmative action programs.

My own government has alienated me through their multicultural and diversity agenda. I feel no pride or affinity towards my government. Serbia has a lot to look forward to if they want to be more like the "west".

I swear to God, these readers' comments are more exciting than watching M.Gibson's "Apocalypto".So much verbal hostility, or should I dare to say hatred...
Ok, I am a Serb from the West, observing the situation from afar.I didn't care so much about the politics in Serbia but when Kosovo declared UDI I
was utterly shocked- like, NO, They Cannot Do This- and ever since I am following everything there is to follow about it. I oppose snatching of my country's territory wholeheartedly.
This is going to be a long game, that's what I feel. Somebody said the Serbs have not demonstrated sufficient level of patience in history. I kind of believe this is true
and I thank to the Albanian reader pointing at this.
I think though, that with Russian, Chinese help, Serbia can make a longlasting case about Kosovo. Without these countries, Russia in particular we would of course stand no chance (as small Serbia has on this the entire West alliance against us, UGHH)
However I think that many people in the world, regardless of their nationality feel that this isn't right, and that Bush administration had commited a huge mistake by recognizing Kosovo Independence.
Nobody will wink if the Serbs and the Russians go on with this forever. And I think that's exactly what we are going to do.
There are things that you just can't accept no matter how long time passes in between.

during the Balkan war interpol found proof of Bosnian Muslims and the KLA having links to Bin Laden and his groups. The US and EU have seized the opportunity to get certain Muslim states onside (Albanians, Turkey etc) by giving Kosovo independence.This issue will change once Iran is attacked, the little states of Kosovo and Albania will not matter. Serbia just needs to sit tight. There is no real media in the UK of Kosovo independence lets face it Albanians you are puppets to us in the west.

Benny,Ben, Bembi, - is Joe any of these,

You are pushing logic and international law to the edge. You should benefit from the US bulling and small games on the short run. But you’re all provoking big thing(s) when all that stupidity should end and won’t be tolerated anymore in the long run of 20-40 years. You will be again on wrong – losing side and we will suffer a lot and get as prize some losers in our yard to manage them and start from zero. And we’ll accept that and give you a hand till the next time-occasion and Mary-history goes again in cycles. Boring… or not.

Cheers, enjoy your UDI - you deserve it and whatever happens later.
(dd, 15 May 2008 14:35)

So we are supose to be on the wining side no mater if they are right or wrong , russia and china are growing economc powers, soon Albanians will start beging them again , Serbs choose there alleyes carefully no mater if they are winers or loosers we are always on the rightchous side, if you want to know who in the world is still rightchous and honorable just take a look at Serbia and her alleyes. Hey who knows maybe in 50-60 years Serbia is going to be a superpower then you Albanians will start beging us for forgivness.

Jan Anderson. I agree with you that India and China have sweatshops. So do Phillipines and Indonesia and many other countries.

BUT, who has set up those sweatshops and who makes a profit? You got it...AMERICA.

So please don't start with how immoral those countries are when America is the boss. If you feel so insulted by the way these countreies do business then what are you doing with your Nikes or any other big brand item in your closet?

“… Can anybody tell me who Slovenija, Bosna-Hercegovina,Croatia,Macedonia and Montenegro didn't like to live together with serbia?
Then why should kosovars live with serbs???”

H. Izetbegovic(u),
Yes, I can tell you. Because they were lead by extreme nationalists, same as “Kosovars”. These fanatical leaders misused unstable situation in Yugoslavia to grab the power and then helped by western powers, destroyed our common country. In place of multicultural, quite big, reasonably developed, with a good quality of life for average citizen, social justice and guaranteed equal rights for all citizens regardless of nationality, country with own foreign policy and own economic system, they created small, backwards, poor, weak banana republics that are completely dependent of the west. These extremists amassed huge wealth and power. Majority of their citizens live much worse now then they used to in Yugoslavia.

“” … In 20 years Kosovo and Serbia will be in EU for sure. No one at that time will care about the invincible border, people will be busy working and taking vacations no will want to send their children to fight. …”

If peaceful EU, union of equal members was really the goal, yours and more importantly, your masters, then wouldn’t go trough all this trouble. It was much more logical, easier, cheaper, safer, you name it, to leave Kosovo and Metohija where it belongs, with Serbia, give you autonomy and in few years accept us both in EU where borders would possibly loose importance. No, you and your masters didn’t go through all this trouble by accident, you have different plans …

“… you skip those pages of history where Russia invaded Afghanistan and then they formed Taliban etc…”

It seems that you skipped quite a few pages. Russia formed Taliban? Where did you get this from? Russia was invited by the official Afghanistan Government to help fight the extremists who were trained and armed by USA.

“… America has every right to be in Europe as long as it pleases to be. They protected Western Europe from Nazis and after from communism. …“

That was all long time ago, ancient history by American standards. Why they don’t just forget about that and look towards future as they advise us to do? American Army is not needed in Europe any more.

You should know that defeat of Nazism was joint effort but Soviet Union played biggest role, by far. Around 80% of the total German losses were in the fighting with a Soviet Union. And among these was absolute top elite of German Army, best man and best equipment they had. So, it would be quite fair to say that Soviet Union defeated Nazism and Western allies helped in the struggle.

“… As for Vietnam they went there after French had to withdraw again helping with European mess and stop of communism…”

US army committed a genocide against Vietnamese, they killed millions of innocent civilians in indiscriminate carpet bombings. 30 years after the end of the war thousands of people in Vietnam and Laos are still dying each year from the unexploded US mines and cancerogenic chemicals that American sprayed all over the country. That sad, French were not much better. All this upper stiff ex-colonial Europeans that are lecturing everybody, have a lot of scelets in their closets.

“… Many many Americans died protecting Europe form your beloved Russia…”

? Please, tell us more.

“…no one speaks about the billions of dollars … Marshal plan,..”
Well, yes, they also did some good, no baddy denies that. Although, motivation behind that is not exactly so idealistic as often presented but good, never mind, we’ll not go into that now

“… just ask greec…”

Well, actually, I did ask them. (I have quite a few Greek friends). When Americans are mentioned my friends usually talk about American role during Greek military dictature, Turkish invasion of Cypres and similar moments in history…