We'll defend what's ours in Georgia, says Lavrov

Ahmet Isufi:
> I thought Russia is the defender of International LAW.

Hopefully, reason for your befuddlement is that your concepts of 'International LAW' are just twisted. But is more probably just a case of double-standards & hypocrisy.

Funny thing is, Russia can lay claim to 'respecting international law' much easier lately than can the US.

I thought Russia is the defender of International LAW. So much for that Mr. Lavrov or i should say Mr. Stalin.

.........As have said before to you or others, do keep trying to spread your propaganda - is a free world & I welcome the opportunity to take your arguments apart at the seams.
(peter, sydney, 4 May 2008 13:01)

Well said Peter! I tried replying last night to these silly comments but unfortunately I went a wee bit over the top.....Sorry Mr Moderator.

However, the KS quote....America is the only country that bombs a country than spends billions of dollars rebuilding it (Iraq, Kosova, Afghanistan, etc).

This had me crying with laughter. Keep up the good work Peter I really enjoy reading your point of view.

KS:
> Hey Peter,

> do you know the fundamentals of international law? Respecting embassies, territorial integrity of member States, torture, etc. If Russia is the defender of international law then we are all doomed.

> America is in a better position towards protecting international law any day, month, or year than Russia.

Am not saying russians have an unblemished record. Am saying that russian track record lately is a heck of a lot better than that of the US. So lets compare them.

International law?

Have certainly been doing a lot of reading on this subject lately, so believe have a rough idea of the basic concepts.

Certainly enough to know that 'brussels' & the US have pretty much thrown the rule book out of the window lately with regard to Kosovo. Disregarding the UN charter, the Helsinki final Act & UN resolution 1244 in order to further their own geo-political aims.

Wheras the russians have been holding the west to account & actually rubbing the collective noses of the west into their illegalities, misrepresentations & outright lies that they have been engaged in lately.

Interesting turn-around.

Respecting embassies?

Are you lot still going on about this? Try for a sense of perspective for once. Will do you good. Remember the US/NATO bombing of the chinese embassy in Belgrade not so long ago. Embassy staff died in that attack. Big difference between a 500lb bomb & a mob of drunken hooligans.

And have answered this before - see B92 article on 24/2/2008: "US ambassador: This better not happen again" - post #19:

http://xs4.b92.net/eng/news/comments.php?nav_id=47946

Torture?

Is telling when all you have to do is mention a name. Try Abu Graib & Guantanamo. And lets not forget rendition to Egypt.

Territorial Integrity of member states?

This & sovereignity are covered by the UN charter. Inviolability of borders - Helsinki final Act of 1975. All of this has been ignored in the creation of puppet state in Kosovo by US & brussels.

Just calling so-called 'republic of Kosovo' a 'unique' case doesn't cut it. When you start ignoring the basic principles that were behind the creation of the UN, you are opening up a very big 'can of worms'.

Would be secessionists around the world will not care about any 'uniqueness in Kosovo', they will just point the finger at it & say 'if they can do this thing, then so can we'.

Yes, by all means let us talk about these things. Moving on...


> America is the only country that bombs a country than spends billions of dollars rebuilding it (Iraq, Kosova, Afghanistan, etc).

Do you actually realise just how ludicrous a statement this is?

War must ALWAYS be the avenue of last resort. Unfortunately, the 'Bush doctrine' has turned this idea around on its head - forget diplomacy - why negotiate when one can dictate - with bombs.

As for those billions in reconstruction, most of it goes to US companies at greatly inflated rates. Very little actually reaches the targeted population. As you brought it up, take a good look at the effort in Iraq - vast amounts of cash, flown in by the planeload every week, to pay the likes of Haliburton et al. Congress keeps trying to highlight this. White house keeps avoiding.

> America starts wars based on humanitarian causes not to grab more territory.

Yes, US starts a lot of wars doesn't it - and usually for its own benefit - and usually to maintain an uninterrupted supply of raw materials such as oil & gas. Anyone who believes otherwise most likely also believes in the 'tooth fairy'.

Kosovo for instance has much more to do with the protection of AMBO & projecting power towards the Caspian sea than it has to do with protecting K-albanians.

> I feel secured at night knowing that America is out to watch for my safety rather than "democratic" Russia or PRC.

Don't get too comfortable. K-albanian sentiment towards the US/NATO may very well change once the dust has settled & the current status-quo starts to solidify. Judging by the size of Bondsteel, US has no intentions of leaving.

And when they do leave, will be because they no longer have any use for Kosovo, or for K-albanians.

> Disliking Bush and connecting the dots between a President and hatred towards all American's and the country is very immature.

Have never said that I hate americans youngster - have met many. Occasionally come across a 'loud yank', but is the exception rather than the rule. Have found that youngsters, especially those in the military are usually courteous & very polite.

Bush however is a different story. In my personal opinion, this man has been a disaster not just for US foreign policy, not just for the US itself, but for the whole world - developed or otherwise. Is what happens when a weak man attempts to portray himself as 'strong' - overcompensates & fails.


As have said before to you or others, do keep trying to spread your propaganda - is a free world & I welcome the opportunity to take your arguments apart at the seams.

If Kosovo can go why not Abkhazia?

Why is Kosovo allowed to split off and Abkahzia is not?

No double standards please! :)

KS,

You keep misspelling Kosovo!

Hey Peter,

do you know the fundamentals of international law? Respecting embassies, territorial integrity of member States, torture, etc. If Russia is the defender of international law then we are all doomed.

America is in a better position towards protecting international law any day, month, or year than Russia.

America is the only country that bombs a country than spends billions of dollars rebuilding it (Iraq, Kosova, Afghanistan, etc).

America spends billions of dollars helping other countries (i.e Serbia 180mn Euro / year).

America starts wars based on humanitarian causes not to grab more territory.

I feel secured at night knowing that America is out to watch for my safety rather than "democratic" Russia or PRC. Disliking Bush and connecting the dots between a President and hatred towards all American's and the country is very immature.

"We'll defend what's ours in Georgia, says Lavrov"
YOU are willing to take territory by force from another country for the sake of 50 thousand ruskies that live there, just like serbia for 100 thousand serbs living amongst 2.2 milion Albanians and they think the land is theirs. Shame on you Lenin, Stalin, Brezhnjev and so called judo master.ussr is dead and baried so will mother Russia the way is going.

I thought Russia is the defender of International LAW. So much for that Mr. Lavrov or i should say Mr. Stalin.

"We'll defend what's ours in Georgia, says Lavrov"
YOU are willing to take territory by force from another country for the sake of 50 thousand ruskies that live there, just like serbia for 100 thousand serbs living amongst 2.2 milion Albanians and they think the land is theirs. Shame on you Lenin, Stalin, Brezhnjev and so called judo master.ussr is dead and baried so will mother Russia the way is going.

Hey Peter,

do you know the fundamentals of international law? Respecting embassies, territorial integrity of member States, torture, etc. If Russia is the defender of international law then we are all doomed.

America is in a better position towards protecting international law any day, month, or year than Russia.

America is the only country that bombs a country than spends billions of dollars rebuilding it (Iraq, Kosova, Afghanistan, etc).

America spends billions of dollars helping other countries (i.e Serbia 180mn Euro / year).

America starts wars based on humanitarian causes not to grab more territory.

I feel secured at night knowing that America is out to watch for my safety rather than "democratic" Russia or PRC. Disliking Bush and connecting the dots between a President and hatred towards all American's and the country is very immature.

KS,

You keep misspelling Kosovo!

Ahmet Isufi:
> I thought Russia is the defender of International LAW.

Hopefully, reason for your befuddlement is that your concepts of 'International LAW' are just twisted. But is more probably just a case of double-standards & hypocrisy.

Funny thing is, Russia can lay claim to 'respecting international law' much easier lately than can the US.

If Kosovo can go why not Abkhazia?

Why is Kosovo allowed to split off and Abkahzia is not?

No double standards please! :)

KS:
> Hey Peter,

> do you know the fundamentals of international law? Respecting embassies, territorial integrity of member States, torture, etc. If Russia is the defender of international law then we are all doomed.

> America is in a better position towards protecting international law any day, month, or year than Russia.

Am not saying russians have an unblemished record. Am saying that russian track record lately is a heck of a lot better than that of the US. So lets compare them.

International law?

Have certainly been doing a lot of reading on this subject lately, so believe have a rough idea of the basic concepts.

Certainly enough to know that 'brussels' & the US have pretty much thrown the rule book out of the window lately with regard to Kosovo. Disregarding the UN charter, the Helsinki final Act & UN resolution 1244 in order to further their own geo-political aims.

Wheras the russians have been holding the west to account & actually rubbing the collective noses of the west into their illegalities, misrepresentations & outright lies that they have been engaged in lately.

Interesting turn-around.

Respecting embassies?

Are you lot still going on about this? Try for a sense of perspective for once. Will do you good. Remember the US/NATO bombing of the chinese embassy in Belgrade not so long ago. Embassy staff died in that attack. Big difference between a 500lb bomb & a mob of drunken hooligans.

And have answered this before - see B92 article on 24/2/2008: "US ambassador: This better not happen again" - post #19:

http://xs4.b92.net/eng/news/comments.php?nav_id=47946

Torture?

Is telling when all you have to do is mention a name. Try Abu Graib & Guantanamo. And lets not forget rendition to Egypt.

Territorial Integrity of member states?

This & sovereignity are covered by the UN charter. Inviolability of borders - Helsinki final Act of 1975. All of this has been ignored in the creation of puppet state in Kosovo by US & brussels.

Just calling so-called 'republic of Kosovo' a 'unique' case doesn't cut it. When you start ignoring the basic principles that were behind the creation of the UN, you are opening up a very big 'can of worms'.

Would be secessionists around the world will not care about any 'uniqueness in Kosovo', they will just point the finger at it & say 'if they can do this thing, then so can we'.

Yes, by all means let us talk about these things. Moving on...


> America is the only country that bombs a country than spends billions of dollars rebuilding it (Iraq, Kosova, Afghanistan, etc).

Do you actually realise just how ludicrous a statement this is?

War must ALWAYS be the avenue of last resort. Unfortunately, the 'Bush doctrine' has turned this idea around on its head - forget diplomacy - why negotiate when one can dictate - with bombs.

As for those billions in reconstruction, most of it goes to US companies at greatly inflated rates. Very little actually reaches the targeted population. As you brought it up, take a good look at the effort in Iraq - vast amounts of cash, flown in by the planeload every week, to pay the likes of Haliburton et al. Congress keeps trying to highlight this. White house keeps avoiding.

> America starts wars based on humanitarian causes not to grab more territory.

Yes, US starts a lot of wars doesn't it - and usually for its own benefit - and usually to maintain an uninterrupted supply of raw materials such as oil & gas. Anyone who believes otherwise most likely also believes in the 'tooth fairy'.

Kosovo for instance has much more to do with the protection of AMBO & projecting power towards the Caspian sea than it has to do with protecting K-albanians.

> I feel secured at night knowing that America is out to watch for my safety rather than "democratic" Russia or PRC.

Don't get too comfortable. K-albanian sentiment towards the US/NATO may very well change once the dust has settled & the current status-quo starts to solidify. Judging by the size of Bondsteel, US has no intentions of leaving.

And when they do leave, will be because they no longer have any use for Kosovo, or for K-albanians.

> Disliking Bush and connecting the dots between a President and hatred towards all American's and the country is very immature.

Have never said that I hate americans youngster - have met many. Occasionally come across a 'loud yank', but is the exception rather than the rule. Have found that youngsters, especially those in the military are usually courteous & very polite.

Bush however is a different story. In my personal opinion, this man has been a disaster not just for US foreign policy, not just for the US itself, but for the whole world - developed or otherwise. Is what happens when a weak man attempts to portray himself as 'strong' - overcompensates & fails.


As have said before to you or others, do keep trying to spread your propaganda - is a free world & I welcome the opportunity to take your arguments apart at the seams.

.........As have said before to you or others, do keep trying to spread your propaganda - is a free world & I welcome the opportunity to take your arguments apart at the seams.
(peter, sydney, 4 May 2008 13:01)

Well said Peter! I tried replying last night to these silly comments but unfortunately I went a wee bit over the top.....Sorry Mr Moderator.

However, the KS quote....America is the only country that bombs a country than spends billions of dollars rebuilding it (Iraq, Kosova, Afghanistan, etc).

This had me crying with laughter. Keep up the good work Peter I really enjoy reading your point of view.