Dienstbier: Kosovo never legal, independent

Those in Kosovo know that they are now the pariahs of the International community...neither here nor there!

Kosovo is JUST A NATO/US ARMY
TERRITORY nothing more nothing less...

Kosovo is Serbia's, was Serbia's and will remain for ever an unassailable part of Serbia.

Albanians still under the impression of what some western masters are telling them...

and some european top-diplomats who exactly know what´s the point here...

the part I liked the best was "..will never, but really never be a legal..."

read it again, and enjoy! :)

What makes you think he hasn't been following closely the events in KosovO?

He wouldn't make a public statement if he didn't know what he was talking about. You just don't like what he said.
Not liking what you hear doesn't make it untrue you know.

Roberto,
What on earth are you blathering about? Serbia has never been anti-semitic, and in fact is the most tolerant country in the Balkans.
If you are looking for anti-semitism, please look at your albanian (SS Skanderbeg division), Croatian, and Bosnian muslim (SS Handjar division) friends' histories. When you finish a proper history lesson, then compare Serbian history with theirs, and you will then finally see who really are the 'good guys' and the 'bad guys' here.
Oh, and there are no Jews left in Kosovo since your beloved albanians took over in 1999.
Come to Serbia some time and see how a multi-cultural society functions, then you won't be so full of misinformation and hate.

Cheers!

Roberto, if you are going to make statements that are completely at odds with established history, you really need to offer some documentation. No people involved in the World War had a better record in regard to the Jews than the Serbs. Indeed, the bases of cooperation with the Nazis by most eastern Europeans (Poles, Ukrainians …) was their anti-Semitism. Such collaboration among Serbs was almost non-existent and has not been documented. To suggest the Orthodox Church prosecuted Jews more than the Catholic is completely against all the established evidence.

This statement doesn't bode well for the idea that the Czech Republic will recognise the UDI in Kosovo.

A breath of fresh air for serbs.

I wwas shocked and disappointed when the U.S. recognized Kosovo independence. I have said this to many people in the last few years: when the Mexicans in the American southwest try to secede from the U.S., we won't have much to say about it. We opened this Pandora's box, and may have to pay someday for the terrible precedent that has been set.

A very true statement by this man.

Now just sit and wait and see what happens to Kosovo when the US and World Recession kicks into full swing, and all that promised money that was supposed to go to Kosovo never apears, ... how the hell are the Kosovo going to re-build their country and they can't legally trade.

This Kosovo independence was very badly planned and thought out and very badly timed.

"Kosovo is Serbia's, was Serbia's and will remain for ever an unassailable part of Serbia..."

Wake up, wake up my dear...!???

roberto:
What on earth are you raving about this time?

Your wish is complete different from the reality in Kosova,I would suggest you to read and follow up closely latest developments in free Kosova.

b92 -- this is another of yr so-called experts, and a human rights "expert" at that... this is what i think, and i don't care how often you censor me, because when we believe in the truth, it doesn't matter what the opposition "allows." i think that once upon a time b92 represented what was the best in serbia, and by now it has become the other way around.

i also accuse you of an underlying anti-semitism, which is endemic to your beloved serbian orthodox church. it is sickening considering what happened to my people in your beloved serbia, under your not-so-beloved collaborationist regime. that is another set of untruths that you have perpetuated, but the truth about ww2 in the balkans will all come out, despite your lies and distortions.

i also accuse you of lacking basic ethics and sucking up to the worst in nationalist knee-jerk politics.

j'accuse...

roberto from frisco

In Kosovo there is nothing like the Republic Party or the communist party in Czech Republic. The percentage of "European Democrats" in Kosovo is way greater than in Czech Republic.
It would be best for Jiri to save his energies and lecture his compatriots instead about the shortcomings of political moderation.
Of course, not everybody is ready to accept an independent Kosovo. However, K is doing much better than the Czech R in its early days.
Jiri is doing to Kosovo nothing more than the adversaries of his country's independence did to then-Czechoslovakia.

Ruben: "Republic party" is gon some 10 years, yes communists still exist here and collect some 10-16 % left wing and frustrated voters each elections but the comparison you made is still a bit out. According to all information, however largelly EU conform and therefore "Kosovo optimistic" I am afraid there is still just one party in Kosovo named UCK which has few political branches and is hard to distinguish it from mafia.
Regarding the point of the article I would underwrite Mr. Dientsbier's opinion. It is true he is "former" but what he surely has is immediate experiance from place itself. He was also one of hottiest candidates of Social democracy and orher parties for nomination for Czech presidential elections this year against (finally re-ellected)Vaclav Klaus (who is by the way also strictly against the recognition using the same words as "pandorra box").

Yes it's true Mr. Dienstbier does not speak for anyone and he is one of those 'hasbeens' in Czech Republic, so his words carry no weight. The official view of the Czech government is very different and it will very likely recognize Kosova independence, sooner or later.
However, Ruben, get a sense of proportion...are you seriously trying to compare impoverished Kosova to Czechoslovakia of 1989? Even then Czechoslovakia was more developed and richer than any country in the Balkans (including Greece) and approximately on the same level as Spain or Portugal (GDP approx. $12000/per capita). I'm not happy about that, but I don't think Kosova will achieve the same level in the next 30 years, maybe never. Compare comparable please. Only then it makes some sense.

Too bad for Serbian diaspora that this Mr. Dienstbier is another "former".

It's like a "former" owner knocking at the door of the house you just moved in and begging to have another night sleep in his "former" room. Imagine home much respect that person would get from the neighborhood.

I Just dont understand how some of you Serbs who are writing here on forum just continue to dream, really day dreams. Whake up now please for ur own good.

"Kosovo extremists into European democrats"

Looks like he's been reading Tanjug a bit too much.

Dear all,

I think K-Albanians should make an agreement with Serbs in general allowing them to mention 'axiom' ..."Kosovo is Serbia", ...while we on the other hand...move ahead with more and more recognition...and consolidate comprehensively our new state...

During Serbia's negotiations on recognising Kosovo, Mr. Thaci may agree on a special clause allowing Serbs still to publicly say "Kosovo is Serbia",...:)...doesn't bother us...if it amuses them...

I really do think Serbians amuse themselves when they repeat their favorit 'axiom'...

On 21 April 2008 05:44, Stephen Pointer wrote:

"when the Mexicans in the American southwest try to secede from the U.S., we won't have much to say about it. We opened this Pandora's box, and may have to pay someday for the terrible precedent that has been set."

Well, sometimes Pandorax box needs to be opened up so the stale air can get out and some fresh air can get in.

Stephen Pointer - why would it be so bad if parts of the USA decided to secede? The only danger I see, is if a minority of the people in the seceding areas (in disregard of democratic principles) refuses to accept the decision of the majority and instead starts an armed rebellion. Are you saying that the people wishing to secede are to blame when the opposition takes to arms? If so, that is some warped logic!

"Kosovo is Serbia's, was Serbia's and will remain for ever an unassailable part of Serbia..."

Wake up, wake up my dear...!???

Your wish is complete different from the reality in Kosova,I would suggest you to read and follow up closely latest developments in free Kosova.

b92 -- this is another of yr so-called experts, and a human rights "expert" at that... this is what i think, and i don't care how often you censor me, because when we believe in the truth, it doesn't matter what the opposition "allows." i think that once upon a time b92 represented what was the best in serbia, and by now it has become the other way around.

i also accuse you of an underlying anti-semitism, which is endemic to your beloved serbian orthodox church. it is sickening considering what happened to my people in your beloved serbia, under your not-so-beloved collaborationist regime. that is another set of untruths that you have perpetuated, but the truth about ww2 in the balkans will all come out, despite your lies and distortions.

i also accuse you of lacking basic ethics and sucking up to the worst in nationalist knee-jerk politics.

j'accuse...

roberto from frisco

roberto:
What on earth are you raving about this time?

Those in Kosovo know that they are now the pariahs of the International community...neither here nor there!

Kosovo is JUST A NATO/US ARMY
TERRITORY nothing more nothing less...

Kosovo is Serbia's, was Serbia's and will remain for ever an unassailable part of Serbia.

What makes you think he hasn't been following closely the events in KosovO?

He wouldn't make a public statement if he didn't know what he was talking about. You just don't like what he said.
Not liking what you hear doesn't make it untrue you know.

In Kosovo there is nothing like the Republic Party or the communist party in Czech Republic. The percentage of "European Democrats" in Kosovo is way greater than in Czech Republic.
It would be best for Jiri to save his energies and lecture his compatriots instead about the shortcomings of political moderation.
Of course, not everybody is ready to accept an independent Kosovo. However, K is doing much better than the Czech R in its early days.
Jiri is doing to Kosovo nothing more than the adversaries of his country's independence did to then-Czechoslovakia.

Too bad for Serbian diaspora that this Mr. Dienstbier is another "former".

It's like a "former" owner knocking at the door of the house you just moved in and begging to have another night sleep in his "former" room. Imagine home much respect that person would get from the neighborhood.

I Just dont understand how some of you Serbs who are writing here on forum just continue to dream, really day dreams. Whake up now please for ur own good.

Dear all,

I think K-Albanians should make an agreement with Serbs in general allowing them to mention 'axiom' ..."Kosovo is Serbia", ...while we on the other hand...move ahead with more and more recognition...and consolidate comprehensively our new state...

During Serbia's negotiations on recognising Kosovo, Mr. Thaci may agree on a special clause allowing Serbs still to publicly say "Kosovo is Serbia",...:)...doesn't bother us...if it amuses them...

I really do think Serbians amuse themselves when they repeat their favorit 'axiom'...

Albanians still under the impression of what some western masters are telling them...

and some european top-diplomats who exactly know what´s the point here...

the part I liked the best was "..will never, but really never be a legal..."

read it again, and enjoy! :)

This statement doesn't bode well for the idea that the Czech Republic will recognise the UDI in Kosovo.

A breath of fresh air for serbs.

I wwas shocked and disappointed when the U.S. recognized Kosovo independence. I have said this to many people in the last few years: when the Mexicans in the American southwest try to secede from the U.S., we won't have much to say about it. We opened this Pandora's box, and may have to pay someday for the terrible precedent that has been set.

A very true statement by this man.

Now just sit and wait and see what happens to Kosovo when the US and World Recession kicks into full swing, and all that promised money that was supposed to go to Kosovo never apears, ... how the hell are the Kosovo going to re-build their country and they can't legally trade.

This Kosovo independence was very badly planned and thought out and very badly timed.

Yes it's true Mr. Dienstbier does not speak for anyone and he is one of those 'hasbeens' in Czech Republic, so his words carry no weight. The official view of the Czech government is very different and it will very likely recognize Kosova independence, sooner or later.
However, Ruben, get a sense of proportion...are you seriously trying to compare impoverished Kosova to Czechoslovakia of 1989? Even then Czechoslovakia was more developed and richer than any country in the Balkans (including Greece) and approximately on the same level as Spain or Portugal (GDP approx. $12000/per capita). I'm not happy about that, but I don't think Kosova will achieve the same level in the next 30 years, maybe never. Compare comparable please. Only then it makes some sense.

Roberto, if you are going to make statements that are completely at odds with established history, you really need to offer some documentation. No people involved in the World War had a better record in regard to the Jews than the Serbs. Indeed, the bases of cooperation with the Nazis by most eastern Europeans (Poles, Ukrainians …) was their anti-Semitism. Such collaboration among Serbs was almost non-existent and has not been documented. To suggest the Orthodox Church prosecuted Jews more than the Catholic is completely against all the established evidence.

Roberto,
What on earth are you blathering about? Serbia has never been anti-semitic, and in fact is the most tolerant country in the Balkans.
If you are looking for anti-semitism, please look at your albanian (SS Skanderbeg division), Croatian, and Bosnian muslim (SS Handjar division) friends' histories. When you finish a proper history lesson, then compare Serbian history with theirs, and you will then finally see who really are the 'good guys' and the 'bad guys' here.
Oh, and there are no Jews left in Kosovo since your beloved albanians took over in 1999.
Come to Serbia some time and see how a multi-cultural society functions, then you won't be so full of misinformation and hate.

Cheers!

On 21 April 2008 05:44, Stephen Pointer wrote:

"when the Mexicans in the American southwest try to secede from the U.S., we won't have much to say about it. We opened this Pandora's box, and may have to pay someday for the terrible precedent that has been set."

Well, sometimes Pandorax box needs to be opened up so the stale air can get out and some fresh air can get in.

Stephen Pointer - why would it be so bad if parts of the USA decided to secede? The only danger I see, is if a minority of the people in the seceding areas (in disregard of democratic principles) refuses to accept the decision of the majority and instead starts an armed rebellion. Are you saying that the people wishing to secede are to blame when the opposition takes to arms? If so, that is some warped logic!

"Kosovo extremists into European democrats"

Looks like he's been reading Tanjug a bit too much.

Ruben: "Republic party" is gon some 10 years, yes communists still exist here and collect some 10-16 % left wing and frustrated voters each elections but the comparison you made is still a bit out. According to all information, however largelly EU conform and therefore "Kosovo optimistic" I am afraid there is still just one party in Kosovo named UCK which has few political branches and is hard to distinguish it from mafia.
Regarding the point of the article I would underwrite Mr. Dientsbier's opinion. It is true he is "former" but what he surely has is immediate experiance from place itself. He was also one of hottiest candidates of Social democracy and orher parties for nomination for Czech presidential elections this year against (finally re-ellected)Vaclav Klaus (who is by the way also strictly against the recognition using the same words as "pandorra box").