I have a pretty good idea about how much money albanians paid the clinton administration & company. But does anyone know how much money this guy got from albanians?
Being nominated for the nobel peace prize does not mean anything. Yasser Arafat who ordered many terrorist acts was even given the peace prize!!!
(Marco, Amsterdam, 9 March 2008 12:41)
RE: Noble Peace Prize
As the UN organization has been ignored and its reputation destroyed by the independant policies of a few nations, so has the Noble Peace Price with undue influence.
Al Gore was awarded the Nobel Peace Prize for his piece on the Global Warming Propoganda. Outrageous, this man along with Clinton dropped Uranium Depleted bombs in both Serbia and Kosovo along with lighting a fertilizer plant afire during the illegal NATO Bombings in 1999 releasing chemcials into the atmoshphere. The bridge over to NOVI SAD was blown to bits caushing an environmental disaster in th e Sava River Basin. The Pancevo refinery plants were blown to bits again releasing toxins to the sky. Finally, only through the direct intervention of world scientists, NATO was restrained from bombing the nuclear facility in Serbia.
The Nobel Peace prize is worth as much as a roll of used toilet paper. In fact, it is worth more flushed down the toilet into the sewer into the garbage dump and never to be recycled.
Also, this is his job, to the Serb and Albanian posters here, don't take what Ahtisaari says as personal. It is not that he likes or dislikes Serbs or Albanians, it is just that he saw the situation and came up with a plan to solve it.
Mike, it's in vain. For some here the only truth is Albanian truth. Any American who is not supporting Albanian truth is automatically Serb, didn't you know? :(
They know precisely, I am a Serb. I won't mind if that would be the case - but unfortunately neither I nor the Serbian government know it yet.
It opens a new chapter of violence in the world. If these guys are supposed to be right, why do they have to keep defending their policies? Americans follow the practice that if you tell the same lie again and again, it magically becomes the "truth". This practice became widespread when b. clinton could have been easily thrown out of office for lying under oath and was let go by the us senate. The us has been in decline ever seen.
Eddie, it's you who are making no sense. I read your comment a few times to look for a point, but there's little else besides you seemingly foaming at the keyboard. You claim I have no regard for the history of the region yet you provide no evidence to show where I'm wrong or what counterpoint you have besides a few vague normative statements that at obviously flushed with emotional frustration.
You speak about persecution. Yet you choose to speak about only what you want to believe, and what you want to defend rather than looking at persecution as a crime committed by multiple groups simultaneously.
First, where was Europe when Serbs were being persecuted by the very people who claimed persecution from them? Where was Europe, or America for that matter, when persecution as you say, was, and is, taking place in Africa or Asia? Finally, I'm from the United States, the very country that's acting as your cash cow. I speak not as a Serbian nationalist, but as a frustrated American, angry at the decline in stature and objectivity my country has taken in the last decade. If you're worried at me "eating the stuff [my] government keeps feeding [me]", don't worry. I stopped paying attention to the spin doctors in the State Department a long time ago.
Dear serbian readers, its not words that move but actions. You can complain about kosovo as much as you want but at the end of the day it still has a stronger parliament than its neighbour. It is still committed to piece and multi-ethnic government. How do the the other minority's feel in serbia seeing that "kosovo is serbia" is used by nationalist who are enrolling all the hungarians for the army?
Both nations will survive together but with no myths and religions in between.
As for the wishful thinking of north kosovo, for kosovo serbia changed a couple of governments, for the northern part they will keep on dreaming. or the consequences are would be worst for serbia than for kosovo.
Ahtisaari said:
"...it was clear to him from the outset, on the basis of documents given to him by U.S. Under Secretary of State Nicholas Burns, that Kosovo would not be able to return to Belgrade's sovereignty."
Documents from Burns??
What a joke!
If I met Burns I would make sure to keep an eye on my wallet.
This man like the other finnish(ed) guy Rhen, are Serbophobes because they reminds them of the Russians the hate so much for fighting against Finnish and German Nazis. Like the Estonians they are very proud of their fascistic past...
Sir,... but you didn't get your plan through the UN, so it isn't that good. Nowhere did you take account of the will of the Serbian people. You did what Burns your master said instead.
If you had been less lazy, and if the US had not made the decision to lie when 1244 was signed, the possibility of strong autonomy was on the table. It is specifically what is required by 1244. This Kosovo UDI 'solution' is a pitiful imposition - the strength of Europe has been its ability to negotiate - in the case here the EU have failed badly because it lacked the imagination.
What is the point of having a democratic Serbia if you still punish it because of the past? You are as hooked into history as any Balkan nationalist. Forget the mass punishment of Serbia that has been the bedrock of US policy. Collective punishment is in itself a crime.
We are all aware that the cause of the Kosovo conflict is because of the determined mono-ethnic ambition of Albanians - they have ethnically cleansed and you are wrongly rewarding that.
Serbia has not agreed to this UDI and people will not forget. The situation has no guarantee of stability. Don't get too comfortable - history hasn't stopped yet.
You have created a new contention for the future - it was unnecessary and not what was envisioned in 1244. Instead of bringing people together, it is driving them apart. In my view you have done wrong.
Yes Serbia should be in the EU - it should also retain the territorial integrity that happened to be mentioned in the UN documents under which everyone has been working until recently.
From the fear of being censured yet AGAIN, I am trying to keep this as short as i can.
Our Serb friend will excuse us if we do not share their gloomy outlook on Kosova’s future. In fact, the complete opposite is true for us. Trying not to sound too cocky, we are ecstatic with what we have achieved so far. This mood is beautifully reflected by a spontaneous the upsurge of folk literature among other things. Even Antihsari is mentioned a few times. I was cuffed to her that Bjork too had dedicated a song to our independence. ‘Raising the flag’ like any other crucial moments in history will have a huge impact in arts, literature, and popular culture. Our fight has been one for freedom, equality, and every freedom and peace-loving person should rejoice.
It is understandable that the other side will try to downplay the significance of the independence but in a day like this, even their cynicism is forgiven.
The simple fact that Martti is repeating the same story as NATO/US/EU means he is in bed with them. In that case he was not fit to propose a balanced solution for Kosovo.
You make no sense!! If history teaches us anything is that it repeats itself. The ethnic groups in the former Yugoslavia fought each other since the beggining. What amazes me is your utter disregard of the history of the region. This is even more astonishing given the fact that it wasn't that long ago that people were being systematically persecuted. It happened in EUROPE! EUROPE!! In the eyes of the the whole region, in violation of your so called" international law" and every human rights principle ever discussed by humanity.
The world--that includes EU and the US-- are tired at doing nothing. history is full of examples when forces of good are indiferent--WWII for example.
Free will is the ultimate gift God gave us. Kosovars are happy to be independent.
give me a break, and stop eating the stuff your government keeps feeding you. you are wrong!!
"They tell us that everything that is happening is the price that must be paid for the declaration and recognition of independence. Such were called the concessions made to Serbia in Vienna – the price for independence. As was the continuation of governance by an international mission, the division of Kosovo and usurping of our culture and heritage, the de-nationalization of Albanians in Kosovo, the double majority (a practical veto) for minority deputies, the prohibition of the right to self-defence – all these have become the price for independence. When the truth is precisely the opposite: exactly the refusal of this would have been independence."
The rest of the article is very interesting.
Now, at last we see Albanians and Serbs united - they agree, the "independence" is a joke.
The comments are interesting... some Albanian readers can only say, "Vetvendosje is Troyan Horse within Kosovo estabilished by Serbian state army and police Security Agencies"... Sure, and I am the Dalai Lama.
So if Albanian "New Kosova Report" say, they don't feel independent - what can be said?
Some of the worst crimes of the 21st century are being commited against Serbia. Ahtisaaris plan got REJECTED from the UN Security council and is long dead. Ahtisaari himself got fired after rumours of taking bribes from albanian "businessman" Behgjet Pacolli. He is also on the ICG payroll. Nobody should be taking a word from Ahtisaari seriously.
Kosovo's unilateral declaration of complete and absolute depednence on wealthy countries will certainly open a new chapter as Mr. Ahtisaari points out.
1. It will create the precedence for semi-sovereign political entities that until recently was only characterized by Northern Cyprus and possibly Taiwan. These are regions that are not really part of any other territory officially, but are basically alive due to the handouts and foreign aid of official states. By this definition alone, Kosovo Provice is not, and cannot be considered, independent in any meaningful sense. I'm relucant to include Taiwan here because of its own economy it can stand up on, but Kosovo, if we are to consider it a country of its own, is currently rated the 4th most corrupt economy in the world, behind Cameroon, Cambodia, and - yes you guessed it - Albania, as ranked by Transparency International.
2. It also cheapens the definition of sovereignty, when a handful of states recognize the so-called sovereignty of a particular territory, while the majority of states do not, and while international bodies who are given the responsibility for arbitration are either ignored or dismissed. Again, Northern Cyprus has enjoyed relative independence for over 30 years and has been recognized by only Turkey. Did that stop the Cypriot Turks from pushing ahead with parallel government institutions and acting like a separate state? Of course not, and Kosovo Provice will do the same. Under this example, northern Kosovo can declare its independence, be recognized by Belgrade, and function as its own state, or as part of Serbia, which it's doing now. It matters little whether or not the statelet can function without the significant investment of another. What matters is that the people living there think and act as if they're independent.
3. Ethnicity has now been officially recognized as trumping rational politics. Albanians were unhappy living in Serbia so they seek for form a state of their own. Without even seriously pushing Pristina to negotiate with Serbia, the idiot-prone State Department realizes that two ethnicities can never live together, and it's best to haphazardly draw a new border. Of course Serbs living in Kosovo Province are not as lucky.
Forgive me if I sound too much of a pessimist, but in order for Kosovo Province to actually create the peace and stability the talking heads in Washington and Brussels keep repeating will happen, we actually need a piece of land that is profitable and stable for investors to place their money. The very same newspapers that were so gung-ho about Kosovo's UDD, blatantly remind its readers that the region has been, currently is, and is very well destined to remain, the poorest and most mismanaged part of Europe for the indefinite future.
If this gloomy scenario is turned around, it will only come at the substantial increase of EU oversight and the decline of actual sovereignty in Pristina, once again invalidating the argument that Kosovo is anything resembling an independent state. I wish the EU colony the best of luck because a growing region helps everyone else out, but I really cannot see how this can be done without literally taking over Kosovo and running it top down.
Mr Ahtisari you (your anti-serb gang) had Milosevic in *YOUR* courts for 7 years, and you couldn't prove anything.
The casualties of Serbs in ALL wars (beginning from 1389 and on), were ALWAYS among the largest.
WWI, WWII, Bosnia, Croatia, 500,000 homeless FORCED OUT of Croatia, 200,000 forced out of kosovo under the blessing of YOUR GANG mr "whats your name".
But that was not the biggest crime.
Bigger than that was the STEALING of kosovo.
Bigger than that are the lies that you try to feed the public.
And the biggest of all, the end of the world order as we know it.
Anyone should start immediately preparing new deadly guns since that is the only way to survive.
Had the Serbs the S300, no nato plane would dare to come even close.
All this retoric hurt the albanians, who will be left alone when their friends find smth "more" interested to deal with and redraw from KosovO,
or (even better) when they get simply weak.
So, does Mr Marti Ahtisaari admit that he was just a tallyman in the entire process? He actually did everything that the USA dictates. Mr Ahtisaari, shame on you! Now, I even believe in the rumours that he actually have been dearly bribed for real to accept this chicken role. I just feel sorry that majority of Finns trust him and they do trust him because they are very passive when it comes to Finnish foreign policy.
As for crimes that Mr Ahtisaari refers to, I just say that he could have a word in private with Mrs Helena Ranta. She might be able to help Mr Ahtisaari and tell him the truth about alleged crimes in Kosovo. Her pathological report full of lies served as reason for bombardment of Serbia. While I was in Finland, there were those rumours that she falsified report because she was forced to do it. The rumours suddenly stopped and her name was never mentioned publicly ever again. It is also worth to mention that she is only a dental pathologist.
Organised crime is no jusrice and no justice will bring no peace...pounding that this is an end to something negative and the beginning of something better is not enough to make it so,"NOTHING IS OVER"because no justice will bring no peace.
Mr Ahtisari you (your anti-serb gang) had Milosevic in *YOUR* courts for 7 years, and you couldn't prove anything.
The casualties of Serbs in ALL wars (beginning from 1389 and on), were ALWAYS among the largest.
WWI, WWII, Bosnia, Croatia, 500,000 homeless FORCED OUT of Croatia, 200,000 forced out of kosovo under the blessing of YOUR GANG mr "whats your name".
But that was not the biggest crime.
Bigger than that was the STEALING of kosovo.
Bigger than that are the lies that you try to feed the public.
And the biggest of all, the end of the world order as we know it.
Anyone should start immediately preparing new deadly guns since that is the only way to survive.
Had the Serbs the S300, no nato plane would dare to come even close.
All this retoric hurt the albanians, who will be left alone when their friends find smth "more" interested to deal with and redraw from KosovO,
or (even better) when they get simply weak.
Kosovo's unilateral declaration of complete and absolute depednence on wealthy countries will certainly open a new chapter as Mr. Ahtisaari points out.
1. It will create the precedence for semi-sovereign political entities that until recently was only characterized by Northern Cyprus and possibly Taiwan. These are regions that are not really part of any other territory officially, but are basically alive due to the handouts and foreign aid of official states. By this definition alone, Kosovo Provice is not, and cannot be considered, independent in any meaningful sense. I'm relucant to include Taiwan here because of its own economy it can stand up on, but Kosovo, if we are to consider it a country of its own, is currently rated the 4th most corrupt economy in the world, behind Cameroon, Cambodia, and - yes you guessed it - Albania, as ranked by Transparency International.
2. It also cheapens the definition of sovereignty, when a handful of states recognize the so-called sovereignty of a particular territory, while the majority of states do not, and while international bodies who are given the responsibility for arbitration are either ignored or dismissed. Again, Northern Cyprus has enjoyed relative independence for over 30 years and has been recognized by only Turkey. Did that stop the Cypriot Turks from pushing ahead with parallel government institutions and acting like a separate state? Of course not, and Kosovo Provice will do the same. Under this example, northern Kosovo can declare its independence, be recognized by Belgrade, and function as its own state, or as part of Serbia, which it's doing now. It matters little whether or not the statelet can function without the significant investment of another. What matters is that the people living there think and act as if they're independent.
3. Ethnicity has now been officially recognized as trumping rational politics. Albanians were unhappy living in Serbia so they seek for form a state of their own. Without even seriously pushing Pristina to negotiate with Serbia, the idiot-prone State Department realizes that two ethnicities can never live together, and it's best to haphazardly draw a new border. Of course Serbs living in Kosovo Province are not as lucky.
Forgive me if I sound too much of a pessimist, but in order for Kosovo Province to actually create the peace and stability the talking heads in Washington and Brussels keep repeating will happen, we actually need a piece of land that is profitable and stable for investors to place their money. The very same newspapers that were so gung-ho about Kosovo's UDD, blatantly remind its readers that the region has been, currently is, and is very well destined to remain, the poorest and most mismanaged part of Europe for the indefinite future.
If this gloomy scenario is turned around, it will only come at the substantial increase of EU oversight and the decline of actual sovereignty in Pristina, once again invalidating the argument that Kosovo is anything resembling an independent state. I wish the EU colony the best of luck because a growing region helps everyone else out, but I really cannot see how this can be done without literally taking over Kosovo and running it top down.
Organised crime is no jusrice and no justice will bring no peace...pounding that this is an end to something negative and the beginning of something better is not enough to make it so,"NOTHING IS OVER"because no justice will bring no peace.
Eddie, it's you who are making no sense. I read your comment a few times to look for a point, but there's little else besides you seemingly foaming at the keyboard. You claim I have no regard for the history of the region yet you provide no evidence to show where I'm wrong or what counterpoint you have besides a few vague normative statements that at obviously flushed with emotional frustration.
You speak about persecution. Yet you choose to speak about only what you want to believe, and what you want to defend rather than looking at persecution as a crime committed by multiple groups simultaneously.
First, where was Europe when Serbs were being persecuted by the very people who claimed persecution from them? Where was Europe, or America for that matter, when persecution as you say, was, and is, taking place in Africa or Asia? Finally, I'm from the United States, the very country that's acting as your cash cow. I speak not as a Serbian nationalist, but as a frustrated American, angry at the decline in stature and objectivity my country has taken in the last decade. If you're worried at me "eating the stuff [my] government keeps feeding [me]", don't worry. I stopped paying attention to the spin doctors in the State Department a long time ago.
So, does Mr Marti Ahtisaari admit that he was just a tallyman in the entire process? He actually did everything that the USA dictates. Mr Ahtisaari, shame on you! Now, I even believe in the rumours that he actually have been dearly bribed for real to accept this chicken role. I just feel sorry that majority of Finns trust him and they do trust him because they are very passive when it comes to Finnish foreign policy.
As for crimes that Mr Ahtisaari refers to, I just say that he could have a word in private with Mrs Helena Ranta. She might be able to help Mr Ahtisaari and tell him the truth about alleged crimes in Kosovo. Her pathological report full of lies served as reason for bombardment of Serbia. While I was in Finland, there were those rumours that she falsified report because she was forced to do it. The rumours suddenly stopped and her name was never mentioned publicly ever again. It is also worth to mention that she is only a dental pathologist.
Some of the worst crimes of the 21st century are being commited against Serbia. Ahtisaaris plan got REJECTED from the UN Security council and is long dead. Ahtisaari himself got fired after rumours of taking bribes from albanian "businessman" Behgjet Pacolli. He is also on the ICG payroll. Nobody should be taking a word from Ahtisaari seriously.
You make no sense!! If history teaches us anything is that it repeats itself. The ethnic groups in the former Yugoslavia fought each other since the beggining. What amazes me is your utter disregard of the history of the region. This is even more astonishing given the fact that it wasn't that long ago that people were being systematically persecuted. It happened in EUROPE! EUROPE!! In the eyes of the the whole region, in violation of your so called" international law" and every human rights principle ever discussed by humanity.
The world--that includes EU and the US-- are tired at doing nothing. history is full of examples when forces of good are indiferent--WWII for example.
Free will is the ultimate gift God gave us. Kosovars are happy to be independent.
give me a break, and stop eating the stuff your government keeps feeding you. you are wrong!!
Ahtisaari said:
"...it was clear to him from the outset, on the basis of documents given to him by U.S. Under Secretary of State Nicholas Burns, that Kosovo would not be able to return to Belgrade's sovereignty."
Documents from Burns??
What a joke!
If I met Burns I would make sure to keep an eye on my wallet.
"They tell us that everything that is happening is the price that must be paid for the declaration and recognition of independence. Such were called the concessions made to Serbia in Vienna – the price for independence. As was the continuation of governance by an international mission, the division of Kosovo and usurping of our culture and heritage, the de-nationalization of Albanians in Kosovo, the double majority (a practical veto) for minority deputies, the prohibition of the right to self-defence – all these have become the price for independence. When the truth is precisely the opposite: exactly the refusal of this would have been independence."
The rest of the article is very interesting.
Now, at last we see Albanians and Serbs united - they agree, the "independence" is a joke.
The comments are interesting... some Albanian readers can only say, "Vetvendosje is Troyan Horse within Kosovo estabilished by Serbian state army and police Security Agencies"... Sure, and I am the Dalai Lama.
So if Albanian "New Kosova Report" say, they don't feel independent - what can be said?
From the fear of being censured yet AGAIN, I am trying to keep this as short as i can.
Our Serb friend will excuse us if we do not share their gloomy outlook on Kosova’s future. In fact, the complete opposite is true for us. Trying not to sound too cocky, we are ecstatic with what we have achieved so far. This mood is beautifully reflected by a spontaneous the upsurge of folk literature among other things. Even Antihsari is mentioned a few times. I was cuffed to her that Bjork too had dedicated a song to our independence. ‘Raising the flag’ like any other crucial moments in history will have a huge impact in arts, literature, and popular culture. Our fight has been one for freedom, equality, and every freedom and peace-loving person should rejoice.
It is understandable that the other side will try to downplay the significance of the independence but in a day like this, even their cynicism is forgiven.
The simple fact that Martti is repeating the same story as NATO/US/EU means he is in bed with them. In that case he was not fit to propose a balanced solution for Kosovo.
This man like the other finnish(ed) guy Rhen, are Serbophobes because they reminds them of the Russians the hate so much for fighting against Finnish and German Nazis. Like the Estonians they are very proud of their fascistic past...
Sir,... but you didn't get your plan through the UN, so it isn't that good. Nowhere did you take account of the will of the Serbian people. You did what Burns your master said instead.
If you had been less lazy, and if the US had not made the decision to lie when 1244 was signed, the possibility of strong autonomy was on the table. It is specifically what is required by 1244. This Kosovo UDI 'solution' is a pitiful imposition - the strength of Europe has been its ability to negotiate - in the case here the EU have failed badly because it lacked the imagination.
What is the point of having a democratic Serbia if you still punish it because of the past? You are as hooked into history as any Balkan nationalist. Forget the mass punishment of Serbia that has been the bedrock of US policy. Collective punishment is in itself a crime.
We are all aware that the cause of the Kosovo conflict is because of the determined mono-ethnic ambition of Albanians - they have ethnically cleansed and you are wrongly rewarding that.
Serbia has not agreed to this UDI and people will not forget. The situation has no guarantee of stability. Don't get too comfortable - history hasn't stopped yet.
You have created a new contention for the future - it was unnecessary and not what was envisioned in 1244. Instead of bringing people together, it is driving them apart. In my view you have done wrong.
Yes Serbia should be in the EU - it should also retain the territorial integrity that happened to be mentioned in the UN documents under which everyone has been working until recently.
It opens a new chapter of violence in the world. If these guys are supposed to be right, why do they have to keep defending their policies? Americans follow the practice that if you tell the same lie again and again, it magically becomes the "truth". This practice became widespread when b. clinton could have been easily thrown out of office for lying under oath and was let go by the us senate. The us has been in decline ever seen.
Mike, it's in vain. For some here the only truth is Albanian truth. Any American who is not supporting Albanian truth is automatically Serb, didn't you know? :(
They know precisely, I am a Serb. I won't mind if that would be the case - but unfortunately neither I nor the Serbian government know it yet.
Dear serbian readers, its not words that move but actions. You can complain about kosovo as much as you want but at the end of the day it still has a stronger parliament than its neighbour. It is still committed to piece and multi-ethnic government. How do the the other minority's feel in serbia seeing that "kosovo is serbia" is used by nationalist who are enrolling all the hungarians for the army?
Both nations will survive together but with no myths and religions in between.
As for the wishful thinking of north kosovo, for kosovo serbia changed a couple of governments, for the northern part they will keep on dreaming. or the consequences are would be worst for serbia than for kosovo.
Being nominated for the nobel peace prize does not mean anything. Yasser Arafat who ordered many terrorist acts was even given the peace prize!!!
(Marco, Amsterdam, 9 March 2008 12:41)
RE: Noble Peace Prize
As the UN organization has been ignored and its reputation destroyed by the independant policies of a few nations, so has the Noble Peace Price with undue influence.
Al Gore was awarded the Nobel Peace Prize for his piece on the Global Warming Propoganda. Outrageous, this man along with Clinton dropped Uranium Depleted bombs in both Serbia and Kosovo along with lighting a fertilizer plant afire during the illegal NATO Bombings in 1999 releasing chemcials into the atmoshphere. The bridge over to NOVI SAD was blown to bits caushing an environmental disaster in th e Sava River Basin. The Pancevo refinery plants were blown to bits again releasing toxins to the sky. Finally, only through the direct intervention of world scientists, NATO was restrained from bombing the nuclear facility in Serbia.
The Nobel Peace prize is worth as much as a roll of used toilet paper. In fact, it is worth more flushed down the toilet into the sewer into the garbage dump and never to be recycled.
I have a pretty good idea about how much money albanians paid the clinton administration & company. But does anyone know how much money this guy got from albanians?
Also, this is his job, to the Serb and Albanian posters here, don't take what Ahtisaari says as personal. It is not that he likes or dislikes Serbs or Albanians, it is just that he saw the situation and came up with a plan to solve it.
You make no sense!! If history teaches us anything is that it repeats itself. The ethnic groups in the former Yugoslavia fought each other since the beggining. What amazes me is your utter disregard of the history of the region. This is even more astonishing given the fact that it wasn't that long ago that people were being systematically persecuted. It happened in EUROPE! EUROPE!! In the eyes of the the whole region, in violation of your so called" international law" and every human rights principle ever discussed by humanity.
The world--that includes EU and the US-- are tired at doing nothing. history is full of examples when forces of good are indiferent--WWII for example.
Free will is the ultimate gift God gave us. Kosovars are happy to be independent.
give me a break, and stop eating the stuff your government keeps feeding you. you are wrong!!
Dear serbian readers, its not words that move but actions. You can complain about kosovo as much as you want but at the end of the day it still has a stronger parliament than its neighbour. It is still committed to piece and multi-ethnic government. How do the the other minority's feel in serbia seeing that "kosovo is serbia" is used by nationalist who are enrolling all the hungarians for the army?
Both nations will survive together but with no myths and religions in between.
As for the wishful thinking of north kosovo, for kosovo serbia changed a couple of governments, for the northern part they will keep on dreaming. or the consequences are would be worst for serbia than for kosovo.
From the fear of being censured yet AGAIN, I am trying to keep this as short as i can.
Our Serb friend will excuse us if we do not share their gloomy outlook on Kosova’s future. In fact, the complete opposite is true for us. Trying not to sound too cocky, we are ecstatic with what we have achieved so far. This mood is beautifully reflected by a spontaneous the upsurge of folk literature among other things. Even Antihsari is mentioned a few times. I was cuffed to her that Bjork too had dedicated a song to our independence. ‘Raising the flag’ like any other crucial moments in history will have a huge impact in arts, literature, and popular culture. Our fight has been one for freedom, equality, and every freedom and peace-loving person should rejoice.
It is understandable that the other side will try to downplay the significance of the independence but in a day like this, even their cynicism is forgiven.
Some of the worst crimes of the 21st century are being commited against Serbia. Ahtisaaris plan got REJECTED from the UN Security council and is long dead. Ahtisaari himself got fired after rumours of taking bribes from albanian "businessman" Behgjet Pacolli. He is also on the ICG payroll. Nobody should be taking a word from Ahtisaari seriously.
The simple fact that Martti is repeating the same story as NATO/US/EU means he is in bed with them. In that case he was not fit to propose a balanced solution for Kosovo.
Kosovo's unilateral declaration of complete and absolute depednence on wealthy countries will certainly open a new chapter as Mr. Ahtisaari points out.
1. It will create the precedence for semi-sovereign political entities that until recently was only characterized by Northern Cyprus and possibly Taiwan. These are regions that are not really part of any other territory officially, but are basically alive due to the handouts and foreign aid of official states. By this definition alone, Kosovo Provice is not, and cannot be considered, independent in any meaningful sense. I'm relucant to include Taiwan here because of its own economy it can stand up on, but Kosovo, if we are to consider it a country of its own, is currently rated the 4th most corrupt economy in the world, behind Cameroon, Cambodia, and - yes you guessed it - Albania, as ranked by Transparency International.
2. It also cheapens the definition of sovereignty, when a handful of states recognize the so-called sovereignty of a particular territory, while the majority of states do not, and while international bodies who are given the responsibility for arbitration are either ignored or dismissed. Again, Northern Cyprus has enjoyed relative independence for over 30 years and has been recognized by only Turkey. Did that stop the Cypriot Turks from pushing ahead with parallel government institutions and acting like a separate state? Of course not, and Kosovo Provice will do the same. Under this example, northern Kosovo can declare its independence, be recognized by Belgrade, and function as its own state, or as part of Serbia, which it's doing now. It matters little whether or not the statelet can function without the significant investment of another. What matters is that the people living there think and act as if they're independent.
3. Ethnicity has now been officially recognized as trumping rational politics. Albanians were unhappy living in Serbia so they seek for form a state of their own. Without even seriously pushing Pristina to negotiate with Serbia, the idiot-prone State Department realizes that two ethnicities can never live together, and it's best to haphazardly draw a new border. Of course Serbs living in Kosovo Province are not as lucky.
Forgive me if I sound too much of a pessimist, but in order for Kosovo Province to actually create the peace and stability the talking heads in Washington and Brussels keep repeating will happen, we actually need a piece of land that is profitable and stable for investors to place their money. The very same newspapers that were so gung-ho about Kosovo's UDD, blatantly remind its readers that the region has been, currently is, and is very well destined to remain, the poorest and most mismanaged part of Europe for the indefinite future.
If this gloomy scenario is turned around, it will only come at the substantial increase of EU oversight and the decline of actual sovereignty in Pristina, once again invalidating the argument that Kosovo is anything resembling an independent state. I wish the EU colony the best of luck because a growing region helps everyone else out, but I really cannot see how this can be done without literally taking over Kosovo and running it top down.
Mr Ahtisari you (your anti-serb gang) had Milosevic in *YOUR* courts for 7 years, and you couldn't prove anything.
The casualties of Serbs in ALL wars (beginning from 1389 and on), were ALWAYS among the largest.
WWI, WWII, Bosnia, Croatia, 500,000 homeless FORCED OUT of Croatia, 200,000 forced out of kosovo under the blessing of YOUR GANG mr "whats your name".
But that was not the biggest crime.
Bigger than that was the STEALING of kosovo.
Bigger than that are the lies that you try to feed the public.
And the biggest of all, the end of the world order as we know it.
Anyone should start immediately preparing new deadly guns since that is the only way to survive.
Had the Serbs the S300, no nato plane would dare to come even close.
All this retoric hurt the albanians, who will be left alone when their friends find smth "more" interested to deal with and redraw from KosovO,
or (even better) when they get simply weak.
Ahtisaari said:
"...it was clear to him from the outset, on the basis of documents given to him by U.S. Under Secretary of State Nicholas Burns, that Kosovo would not be able to return to Belgrade's sovereignty."
Documents from Burns??
What a joke!
If I met Burns I would make sure to keep an eye on my wallet.
Organised crime is no jusrice and no justice will bring no peace...pounding that this is an end to something negative and the beginning of something better is not enough to make it so,"NOTHING IS OVER"because no justice will bring no peace.
So, does Mr Marti Ahtisaari admit that he was just a tallyman in the entire process? He actually did everything that the USA dictates. Mr Ahtisaari, shame on you! Now, I even believe in the rumours that he actually have been dearly bribed for real to accept this chicken role. I just feel sorry that majority of Finns trust him and they do trust him because they are very passive when it comes to Finnish foreign policy.
As for crimes that Mr Ahtisaari refers to, I just say that he could have a word in private with Mrs Helena Ranta. She might be able to help Mr Ahtisaari and tell him the truth about alleged crimes in Kosovo. Her pathological report full of lies served as reason for bombardment of Serbia. While I was in Finland, there were those rumours that she falsified report because she was forced to do it. The rumours suddenly stopped and her name was never mentioned publicly ever again. It is also worth to mention that she is only a dental pathologist.
"They tell us that everything that is happening is the price that must be paid for the declaration and recognition of independence. Such were called the concessions made to Serbia in Vienna – the price for independence. As was the continuation of governance by an international mission, the division of Kosovo and usurping of our culture and heritage, the de-nationalization of Albanians in Kosovo, the double majority (a practical veto) for minority deputies, the prohibition of the right to self-defence – all these have become the price for independence. When the truth is precisely the opposite: exactly the refusal of this would have been independence."
The rest of the article is very interesting.
Now, at last we see Albanians and Serbs united - they agree, the "independence" is a joke.
The comments are interesting... some Albanian readers can only say, "Vetvendosje is Troyan Horse within Kosovo estabilished by Serbian state army and police Security Agencies"... Sure, and I am the Dalai Lama.
So if Albanian "New Kosova Report" say, they don't feel independent - what can be said?
This man like the other finnish(ed) guy Rhen, are Serbophobes because they reminds them of the Russians the hate so much for fighting against Finnish and German Nazis. Like the Estonians they are very proud of their fascistic past...
Sir,... but you didn't get your plan through the UN, so it isn't that good. Nowhere did you take account of the will of the Serbian people. You did what Burns your master said instead.
If you had been less lazy, and if the US had not made the decision to lie when 1244 was signed, the possibility of strong autonomy was on the table. It is specifically what is required by 1244. This Kosovo UDI 'solution' is a pitiful imposition - the strength of Europe has been its ability to negotiate - in the case here the EU have failed badly because it lacked the imagination.
What is the point of having a democratic Serbia if you still punish it because of the past? You are as hooked into history as any Balkan nationalist. Forget the mass punishment of Serbia that has been the bedrock of US policy. Collective punishment is in itself a crime.
We are all aware that the cause of the Kosovo conflict is because of the determined mono-ethnic ambition of Albanians - they have ethnically cleansed and you are wrongly rewarding that.
Serbia has not agreed to this UDI and people will not forget. The situation has no guarantee of stability. Don't get too comfortable - history hasn't stopped yet.
You have created a new contention for the future - it was unnecessary and not what was envisioned in 1244. Instead of bringing people together, it is driving them apart. In my view you have done wrong.
Yes Serbia should be in the EU - it should also retain the territorial integrity that happened to be mentioned in the UN documents under which everyone has been working until recently.
Eddie, it's you who are making no sense. I read your comment a few times to look for a point, but there's little else besides you seemingly foaming at the keyboard. You claim I have no regard for the history of the region yet you provide no evidence to show where I'm wrong or what counterpoint you have besides a few vague normative statements that at obviously flushed with emotional frustration.
You speak about persecution. Yet you choose to speak about only what you want to believe, and what you want to defend rather than looking at persecution as a crime committed by multiple groups simultaneously.
First, where was Europe when Serbs were being persecuted by the very people who claimed persecution from them? Where was Europe, or America for that matter, when persecution as you say, was, and is, taking place in Africa or Asia? Finally, I'm from the United States, the very country that's acting as your cash cow. I speak not as a Serbian nationalist, but as a frustrated American, angry at the decline in stature and objectivity my country has taken in the last decade. If you're worried at me "eating the stuff [my] government keeps feeding [me]", don't worry. I stopped paying attention to the spin doctors in the State Department a long time ago.
It opens a new chapter of violence in the world. If these guys are supposed to be right, why do they have to keep defending their policies? Americans follow the practice that if you tell the same lie again and again, it magically becomes the "truth". This practice became widespread when b. clinton could have been easily thrown out of office for lying under oath and was let go by the us senate. The us has been in decline ever seen.
Mike, it's in vain. For some here the only truth is Albanian truth. Any American who is not supporting Albanian truth is automatically Serb, didn't you know? :(
They know precisely, I am a Serb. I won't mind if that would be the case - but unfortunately neither I nor the Serbian government know it yet.
Also, this is his job, to the Serb and Albanian posters here, don't take what Ahtisaari says as personal. It is not that he likes or dislikes Serbs or Albanians, it is just that he saw the situation and came up with a plan to solve it.
Being nominated for the nobel peace prize does not mean anything. Yasser Arafat who ordered many terrorist acts was even given the peace prize!!!
(Marco, Amsterdam, 9 March 2008 12:41)
RE: Noble Peace Prize
As the UN organization has been ignored and its reputation destroyed by the independant policies of a few nations, so has the Noble Peace Price with undue influence.
Al Gore was awarded the Nobel Peace Prize for his piece on the Global Warming Propoganda. Outrageous, this man along with Clinton dropped Uranium Depleted bombs in both Serbia and Kosovo along with lighting a fertilizer plant afire during the illegal NATO Bombings in 1999 releasing chemcials into the atmoshphere. The bridge over to NOVI SAD was blown to bits caushing an environmental disaster in th e Sava River Basin. The Pancevo refinery plants were blown to bits again releasing toxins to the sky. Finally, only through the direct intervention of world scientists, NATO was restrained from bombing the nuclear facility in Serbia.
The Nobel Peace prize is worth as much as a roll of used toilet paper. In fact, it is worth more flushed down the toilet into the sewer into the garbage dump and never to be recycled.
I have a pretty good idea about how much money albanians paid the clinton administration & company. But does anyone know how much money this guy got from albanians?
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