Kosovo precedent for 200 territories—Lavrov

Exactly Mr. Lavrov!
And one of those 200 territorries would be Republika Srpska, which would happily join Serbia based on the 'Kosovo precedent'. Another one would be the northern Kosovo Mitrovica pocket.
On a lighter note, go Novak, go Jelena, and go Ana!!! Three Serbs making it to the semi finals of a grand slam tournament is a fantastic achievement.
Cheers!

Absolutely so Mr Lavrov. What is good for one it is good for the other side as well. That other side includes Republika Srpska and I will be looking forward seeing Srpska within Serbia's boundaries. Of course North of Kosovo must merge to Serbia as it originally was . Serbs living south of the Ibar River must be moved to the North and all Serbian holly churches an monasteries must and that is -the must- be physically moved in Serbia or in North of Kosovo. That will be very expensive project but it will be financed and must be financed by the IC. We have to protect Serbs and other non-Albanians as well as to preserve our cultural heritage from further destruction by the Albanians. I doubt that they would take any care of our heritage.

All this said should take place only in the case of independence which I doubt it will ever happen.

"Recognition of Kosovo's unilateral independence would set a precedent for some 200 territories, Sergei Lavrov says."

I wonder if he included Chechnya in that list.

I wonder if the EU have cinsidered events closer to home - no not the usual Corisca for France or Basque for Spain but the 30%+ ethnic Russians in Latvia and Estonia!!!

If this folly is imposed then all Serbs forced out of their province should all head to the UK and demand asylum, concentrate in one region alone and in years to come turn this self determination on its head and seccede - after all this is what is being suggested for Serbia's sovereign province one wonders if whats is good for the goose....

Lavrov is alright. It’s definitely an opportunity for the people living these 200 territories like Chechens, Tibetans, etc. to liberate from oppressing and cruel regimes and give an end to chronic ethnic cleansing atmosphere like this one, Kosovars have been enduring during few decades under the Serbian regime.

Perhaps mr Lavrov needs to be reminded how Kosovo came to this 'precedential' conundrum.

To refresh his memory here's an article from the Dec 31, 1912 New York Times

http://www.seguraweb.nl/archive/Kosovo_Crimes_NYTimesArticle_Year1912.pdf

FINALLY!!!
Russia admits to the fact that there is nothing that ccould be done to stop Kosovo from being an indipendent sovran state. (you know what i mean)GAME OVER. please please lets get on with our lives. As far as these 200 hundred places seeking indipendence all the luck to them I hope the conntries occupying them will start to realize that they will be much better off without them. including republika serpska. why not! people should have the right of self-determination.
cheers
spunky

"all Serbian holly churches an monasteries must and that is -the must- be physically moved in Serbia or in North of Kosovo."
Couldn’t believe my eyes when I red the above.
This kind of statement makes Bin Laden look like an angel. (He probably is to this persons eyes)
People with this kind of mentality should get into this holly places turn them into space ships and fly of to another planet. Just wander if there will be enough room

I'll signs Ron's petition on anti-Kosova when Russia signs the recognition of Chechnya State in the middle of Russia.

BRAVO Mr. Lavrov!!

When will EVERYONE realize this is bigger than just KosovO?

It's just not happening!!

CCCC

Thanks for bringing that article to light, Kreshnik Bejko. It's easy to forget the horrible massacres against Albanians of 100 years ago, and the oppression of the 20th century, but we never should. Maybe if the Serbian government hadn't tried to stomp out the Albanian identity for generations, they wouldn't be in the poor situations they are in today.

Spunky,
where did you find basis in the article for your conclusion:
"Russia admits to the fact that there is nothing that ccould be done to stop Kosovo from being an indipendent sovreign"
I was reading it twice - but there is nothing that leads to your conclusion!? Just use your logic - avoid wishful thinking.
You can read about merit of Serbia's claim (any UDI) won't change the facts, at state.http://europe.courrierinternational.com/eurotopics/article.asp?langue=uk&publication=04/01/2008&cat=REFLECTIONS&pi=0

There can even be 200 minorities in the world, each of those situations is unique and depends on a lot of factors, how much the people involved like each-other (for instance it is a much renown fact how albanians and serbs have always been best buddies), what kind of fire-power they have, I mean is one of them a superpower with atomic weapons or not, are they in the middle of Europe or not etc etc etc. And most importantly how they deal with situations, what type of leaders they have.
As far as I know for example, Spain has never tried to deal with Basque separatists by burning entire villages and killing people, or letting animals of the likes of arkan roam free. I am not saying that the requests of basques or the spanish are right or wrong. I don't know the details... The same for France and Corsica. The same for Scotland. Just for not being answered with some link about Richard Lionheart, I am talking about the last years, not about medieval times.

This kind of talks to scare people about setting dangerous precedents were made also in the 1998-99 and nothing catastrophic has happened. It is an argument that is used just to gather naive public opinion.

Gezim Disha, 23 January 2008 22:03

And why are you insulting Bmrusilas post with Bin Laden comparements? Its very rude of you, and not appropriate here. Even if we are on completely different sides I still like to argue with the albanians here in a cilivized way, as I am sure that most albanians here also like.

But to your post, unfortunately you are wrong and Bmrusila is right. The only two way to save the churches from vandals or total destruction is the following:

1 Build a safe jail like wall or fence around them, with total surveilance and deny all albanians to visit them due to the risk of vandalisation. Sorry for insulting the honest albanians here, but that is unfortunatley the truth, just look at this youtube clip and se how an albanian mob cheers when they set a church on fire

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fiw2Dntuh8Q

2. Move all churches and Monastires to Serbia or norhtern Kosovo which will NEVER again be under albanian control.

Which is the best alternative of the 2?

I am sick of listening Russians speaking about illegality and International Law. Simply they are not in the position and neither have a historical credibility to speak as the only defenders of IL and the west as pure ignorant and irresponsible.

The issue here is quite simple, through kosova/serbia russian wants to maintain or better to reestablish her influence in south east Europe.

The question is Russia so keen to IL when Chechnya is in question?

The other question, associated to the previous one, is would Russia negotiate when here national interests are in question like Chechnya or Ukraine in NATO? the answer is simply NO.

So why EU and US should/are negotiating with Russia when their interests are in question patently, like the Kosova issue?

Just take teh decision and declare the independence

spunky,

So that means Northern Kosovo can stay within Serbia?

And RS can join Serbia?

And Western Albania can join Kosovo/Albania?

Well, personally I would have no problem with such deal!!

Spunky and others,
About half of Lavrov's metaphoric 200 (which may be off by only a factor of 2) are located in the Russian Federation. That is why they take Kosovo so seriously and why the Americans take Kosovo seriously. Remember that Russians are, above all, Europeans.

Srboslav, 24 January 2008 10:21

I do thankyou for lecturing me about how to behave.
I wander what makes you feel you can do that? Do you feel superior?
Is it this superiority complex that makes you think you can preach anybody about any thing?
God my friend doesn’t build churches or mosques. God made human. It is human life that is most sacred on earth. Not your churches. It is humans that your friend(s) should respect the most.
As for your dilemma, behave like civilised humans show some respect, and everything can easily be solved.

Lavrov is alright. It’s definitely an opportunity for the people living these 200 territories like Chechens, Tibetans, etc. to liberate from oppressing and cruel regimes and give an end to chronic ethnic cleansing atmosphere like this one, Kosovars have been enduring during few decades under the Serbian regime.

Absolutely so Mr Lavrov. What is good for one it is good for the other side as well. That other side includes Republika Srpska and I will be looking forward seeing Srpska within Serbia's boundaries. Of course North of Kosovo must merge to Serbia as it originally was . Serbs living south of the Ibar River must be moved to the North and all Serbian holly churches an monasteries must and that is -the must- be physically moved in Serbia or in North of Kosovo. That will be very expensive project but it will be financed and must be financed by the IC. We have to protect Serbs and other non-Albanians as well as to preserve our cultural heritage from further destruction by the Albanians. I doubt that they would take any care of our heritage.

All this said should take place only in the case of independence which I doubt it will ever happen.

"Recognition of Kosovo's unilateral independence would set a precedent for some 200 territories, Sergei Lavrov says."

I wonder if he included Chechnya in that list.

Exactly Mr. Lavrov!
And one of those 200 territorries would be Republika Srpska, which would happily join Serbia based on the 'Kosovo precedent'. Another one would be the northern Kosovo Mitrovica pocket.
On a lighter note, go Novak, go Jelena, and go Ana!!! Three Serbs making it to the semi finals of a grand slam tournament is a fantastic achievement.
Cheers!

Perhaps mr Lavrov needs to be reminded how Kosovo came to this 'precedential' conundrum.

To refresh his memory here's an article from the Dec 31, 1912 New York Times

http://www.seguraweb.nl/archive/Kosovo_Crimes_NYTimesArticle_Year1912.pdf

FINALLY!!!
Russia admits to the fact that there is nothing that ccould be done to stop Kosovo from being an indipendent sovran state. (you know what i mean)GAME OVER. please please lets get on with our lives. As far as these 200 hundred places seeking indipendence all the luck to them I hope the conntries occupying them will start to realize that they will be much better off without them. including republika serpska. why not! people should have the right of self-determination.
cheers
spunky

"all Serbian holly churches an monasteries must and that is -the must- be physically moved in Serbia or in North of Kosovo."
Couldn’t believe my eyes when I red the above.
This kind of statement makes Bin Laden look like an angel. (He probably is to this persons eyes)
People with this kind of mentality should get into this holly places turn them into space ships and fly of to another planet. Just wander if there will be enough room

I wonder if the EU have cinsidered events closer to home - no not the usual Corisca for France or Basque for Spain but the 30%+ ethnic Russians in Latvia and Estonia!!!

If this folly is imposed then all Serbs forced out of their province should all head to the UK and demand asylum, concentrate in one region alone and in years to come turn this self determination on its head and seccede - after all this is what is being suggested for Serbia's sovereign province one wonders if whats is good for the goose....

BRAVO Mr. Lavrov!!

When will EVERYONE realize this is bigger than just KosovO?

It's just not happening!!

CCCC

I am sick of listening Russians speaking about illegality and International Law. Simply they are not in the position and neither have a historical credibility to speak as the only defenders of IL and the west as pure ignorant and irresponsible.

The issue here is quite simple, through kosova/serbia russian wants to maintain or better to reestablish her influence in south east Europe.

The question is Russia so keen to IL when Chechnya is in question?

The other question, associated to the previous one, is would Russia negotiate when here national interests are in question like Chechnya or Ukraine in NATO? the answer is simply NO.

So why EU and US should/are negotiating with Russia when their interests are in question patently, like the Kosova issue?

Just take teh decision and declare the independence

spunky,

So that means Northern Kosovo can stay within Serbia?

And RS can join Serbia?

And Western Albania can join Kosovo/Albania?

Well, personally I would have no problem with such deal!!

Thanks for bringing that article to light, Kreshnik Bejko. It's easy to forget the horrible massacres against Albanians of 100 years ago, and the oppression of the 20th century, but we never should. Maybe if the Serbian government hadn't tried to stomp out the Albanian identity for generations, they wouldn't be in the poor situations they are in today.

I'll signs Ron's petition on anti-Kosova when Russia signs the recognition of Chechnya State in the middle of Russia.

Spunky,
where did you find basis in the article for your conclusion:
"Russia admits to the fact that there is nothing that ccould be done to stop Kosovo from being an indipendent sovreign"
I was reading it twice - but there is nothing that leads to your conclusion!? Just use your logic - avoid wishful thinking.
You can read about merit of Serbia's claim (any UDI) won't change the facts, at state.http://europe.courrierinternational.com/eurotopics/article.asp?langue=uk&publication=04/01/2008&cat=REFLECTIONS&pi=0

There can even be 200 minorities in the world, each of those situations is unique and depends on a lot of factors, how much the people involved like each-other (for instance it is a much renown fact how albanians and serbs have always been best buddies), what kind of fire-power they have, I mean is one of them a superpower with atomic weapons or not, are they in the middle of Europe or not etc etc etc. And most importantly how they deal with situations, what type of leaders they have.
As far as I know for example, Spain has never tried to deal with Basque separatists by burning entire villages and killing people, or letting animals of the likes of arkan roam free. I am not saying that the requests of basques or the spanish are right or wrong. I don't know the details... The same for France and Corsica. The same for Scotland. Just for not being answered with some link about Richard Lionheart, I am talking about the last years, not about medieval times.

This kind of talks to scare people about setting dangerous precedents were made also in the 1998-99 and nothing catastrophic has happened. It is an argument that is used just to gather naive public opinion.

Gezim Disha, 23 January 2008 22:03

And why are you insulting Bmrusilas post with Bin Laden comparements? Its very rude of you, and not appropriate here. Even if we are on completely different sides I still like to argue with the albanians here in a cilivized way, as I am sure that most albanians here also like.

But to your post, unfortunately you are wrong and Bmrusila is right. The only two way to save the churches from vandals or total destruction is the following:

1 Build a safe jail like wall or fence around them, with total surveilance and deny all albanians to visit them due to the risk of vandalisation. Sorry for insulting the honest albanians here, but that is unfortunatley the truth, just look at this youtube clip and se how an albanian mob cheers when they set a church on fire

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fiw2Dntuh8Q

2. Move all churches and Monastires to Serbia or norhtern Kosovo which will NEVER again be under albanian control.

Which is the best alternative of the 2?

Spunky and others,
About half of Lavrov's metaphoric 200 (which may be off by only a factor of 2) are located in the Russian Federation. That is why they take Kosovo so seriously and why the Americans take Kosovo seriously. Remember that Russians are, above all, Europeans.

Srboslav, 24 January 2008 10:21

I do thankyou for lecturing me about how to behave.
I wander what makes you feel you can do that? Do you feel superior?
Is it this superiority complex that makes you think you can preach anybody about any thing?
God my friend doesn’t build churches or mosques. God made human. It is human life that is most sacred on earth. Not your churches. It is humans that your friend(s) should respect the most.
As for your dilemma, behave like civilised humans show some respect, and everything can easily be solved.