Coalition partners expect clear backing from Koštunica

Panic stations only the yesterday DS officials were so certain!

It is not Kostunica who needs to show clarity but DS and Tadic that the EU future they talk of is not at the price of partition and dismemberment of the Serbian Republic - something the vast majority of the electorate have stated that they would not want!

Yes they would like an EU future but not for Kosovo & Meohija!

For Tadic to win now he needs to show confidence, total belief and strength in his words that only a Soverign and territorial integral Serbia can join the EU.

The statement to the Serbian electorate and the EU technocrats can be as simple as;
All of Serbia in the EU or not at all!

The Serbian electorate have shown they are very aware of the importance of the elections and they can make an intelligent choice so give them the respect they deserve and don't count on their vote but respect and fight for their vote - every single one!

EU should abandon their misconception that Serbia will roll over and not let up in upholding its sovereignty and that the EU cannot do the US bidding any more if they truly wish to see Serbia as a whole one of its partner and equal states!

Lets hear some strong messages from DS and Tadic if they really do respect the Serbian electorate and are deserving of the Presidency.

Olf,

Serbian people will vote for Tadic in second round if Tadic gives firm guarantees that Serbia won’t sign any SAA as partitioned country. Tadic must send clear message to the people. Tadic have to speak about Kosovo because Kosovo is Serbian southern province and will never give up its province. That is the fact that Albanians should count on, once when the new world order change and that might happen soon, sooner than we thought.

Another thing that it bothers me when it comes to you Albanians is depriving Serbian Diaspora of having an opinion on Kosovo and Serbia’s internal affairs. Serbia is the homeland and the home of all the Serbs where ever they live. Besides, I am the one living in Serbia and strongly oppose Kosovo independence and firmly support our current government and the steps that were taken and will be taken in future.
Next time try to find better arguments.

Princip, you are absolutely right.
"The EU offers very little to the well educated youth of Poland beyond unskilled low paid jobs in the west." and will offer very little or even less to youth of Serbia. Serbia is in Europe for hundreds of years and made huge contribution to is culture (see KiM).

Serbia can not be isolated because its strategic position. This is a reason that Solana said :"EU needs Serbia". Serbia's citizens can make their own decision and peoples like Princip or Jovan have a full right to be involved in the process. What about Albanian diaspora that sent a weapon to KLA?

You can ask about a Serbia's youth prospect in the West your friends in USA and Europe. If you go to the bar in Chicago or New York, then you will be shocked that 50% of bartenders are Polish girls speaking good English and having master degrees from well known Polish universities.

The best for Serbia is to be neutral. I congratulate Serbian government for signing an agreement with Gasprom. Now Serbia has a power for negotiations.

Now we can wait for February 3, but US and Europe should stop their interference to the election process of Serbia.

Olf,

how funny you are suggesting that my opinion means little and is not realistic because I live in the UK! How very dare you ! (A comical line used by a UK comic)

I think with all due respect my opinion is very valid and important since it reflects my extended family viewpoint. Let me assure you that many in Serbia are very well prepared for the best future possible when they uphold what they know to be right even if it means hardship in the short term.

The EU offers very little to the well educated youth of Poland beyond unskilled low paid jobs in the west - as I am sure Peter Sudyka can inform you but that is another debate regarding the cost vs benefit of accession.

Beyond that the economic cycle is shifting against the US and the western economies who have manipulated their own economic model of "free market" so much so that its about to whack back with force to the natural equilibria. Meddle with the equlibria at peril in the long run!

bmrusila, thanks for the support but I very much doubt Oaf will fully comprehend the point you succintly put across.

MLKG,
the real deal is that the EU get the message come the 28th Jan - Serbia as a whole or not at all!

Kostunica's support does not guarantee Tadic a victory in the second round of voting, what nonsense to assume this to be a fact!

One has to consider that the socialist party received 6% of the overall votes in the first round and you can safely assume that 95% of them will vote for Nikolic in the run-off, that alone should be enough for Nikolic to secure a victory even if Kostunica supports Tadic!

Nikolic will win by 2% to 3% in February.

The will of the people seems to suggest they demand change and the preservation of Kosovo, rather than pipe-dreams about improving their lives living under the EU, all you have to do is look at Bulgaria's living standards to know that all of the EU is not equal!

The deal has already been made:
Kostunica gets the energy-deal with Russia (which means a lot of money for his 'business associates' in the coming decade). And in return Tadic will get the support needed to again become president of Serbia.

Princip,
As far as I am concern Serbia can do whatever wants, orientate towards Russia or towards West. I don’t blame you for looking for what’s in the best interest for Serbians. Having said this, similarly it’s only natural for K-Albanians to look at what’s in their best interest. Therefore, I sense that you guys are failing to recognize that.

Someone might say why do I read these comments? The answer is very simple! It is in my interest to know the views and opinions of my neighbors, and that includes Serbia.

All the best on choosing to go East or West!

Olf,

Please back your claims with relevant source of information. What you claim is highly exaggerated. If you have no source for your cliams then do not post such nonsense.

My view is that Tadic has earned the votes of those that think he is worth being a president and keeping Kosova in Serbia. Now he has to show to Serbs that he is FOR entry to EU without mentioning Kosova at all. Mentioning Kosova would only confuse it's current voters and make them look as fools since they know that Kosova belongs to people that live there. In addition, Kosova Serbs have not voted form him and they will not vote for him so why should he take the risk of Kosova or EU.
These elections have shown that the real democratic block is gaining power.

Princip, voters of your candidate form SPS are going to vote for who in the second round.
Retaining Kosova at any price is not the motto is Serbian people in Serbia. it might be your since you are in nice and hot seat in UK nut not Serbs form Serbia proper.

Your opinion is as valid as mine Princip, so no worries. I have stated that just because many Serbs say this, not only me, so if there is someone to blame for that is Serbs not me.
Princip: Let me assure you that many in Serbia are very well prepared for the best future possible when they uphold what they know to be right even if it means hardship in the short term.

I am not so sure about this one. According to what I have heard from a big number of Serbs in Kosova and Serbia and read in b92 Serbian comments it seams that they are really not prepared for another phase of darkness just for sake of Milosevic supporters.

Princip: The EU offers very little to the well educated youth of Poland beyond unskilled low paid jobs in the west
Have in mind that I don’t know your education background and I can only presume that you are highly educated person.

Well Princip, what is the percentage of highly educated people in Serbia? I’ll tell you. Data says that regardless of the significant percentage of highly educated and qualified human resources, the educational structure of the population is unfavourable. Almost 50% of the adult population has only elementary educational level or less. This means that around 3 million people above 15 are without adequate working skills and competences and that huge percentage has problems to find a job and keep jobs. The other 21 percent have secondary school or gymnasium finished but poorly trained. So, this could be one of the reasons why majority of Serbs want EU, cause they can find unskilled jobs easier.

I know that free market is in crisis but this is not such a good news. After all, the last big crisis that, which I don’t remember, ended with catastrophic consequences for all no matter the nationality.

Princip, did you participate the conference in London?

Zbyszek,

Nobody forces those Polish girls to be bartenders in Chicago. Apparently they do it because the money is much bigger than in a office in Varsovie. Would they like to work in an office in the US? It is possible but for that they most likely do not have the required qualifications and experience. It is a joke how many so-called "economists" and "lawyers" get mass-produced nowadays in ex-communists countries. The quality of those diplomes is questionable. That is the main problem. US firms have the luxury to select among the brightest applicants, which include Americans of the prestigious Ivy League schools. Europeans have the best chance if they have a technical background. There some of them excel.

Zbyszek raises a very good point about the EU, while it will speed up development of infrastructure in Kosovo (when it becomes independent) and Serbia (if it decides to join) by attracting investment due to favorable EU business policies, it will more than likely cause a massive brain drain on the country, driving out the youth to the West in search of more money, due to the rise in prices that will happen in these EU states (which are disproportionate when compared to earnings).

I myself know so many people, my friends, as well as family members from my fiancee's family who have moved West in search of jobs. Poland was simply not ready to join the EU because it is so far behind, and if Poland was in too early, imagine Serbia, let alone Kosovo with its economy!

I personally think Serbia and especially Kosovo need to wait a long time before they think of joining, I would imagine that the negative elements that come with EU membership would outnumber the positive at this stage of development.

Joe, you are absolutely right. Nobody forces those Polish girls to be bartenders in Chicago. Apparently they do it because the money is much bigger than in a office in Varsovie (I would say Warsaw).

This is exactly what will happen with majority of Serbian youths. Those young, well educated people would go to Germany, France, England and other EU countries to just make more money. Some, perhaps, most bright will be lucky enough to get much better job for a pay of half of that what their Germen college.

It is nothing else as drainage of intellectual forces of Serbia (or any other country).

"US firms have the luxury to select among the brightest applicants, which include Americans of the prestigious Ivy League schools."

How many graduates these schools produces? Several thousands a year? Requirement is many times higher and I hope you are aware about the problems of American education system. Many graduates of high school is unable to write and read on required level.

In most cases there are no entrance exams for high education institutions, just so called "placement test". Other big problem is drop out ratio. Huge percentage of American youths do not finish a high school.

www.civicenterprises.net/pdfs/thesilentepidemic3-06.pdf

"There is a high school dropout epidemic in America. Each year, almost one
third of all public high school students – and nearly one half of all blacks,
Hispanics and Native Americans – fail to graduate from public high school
with their class. Many of these students abandon school with less than two years
to complete their high school education."

So, again you are wrong. Thousand of US universities can not even compare with old, prestigious universities of Europe including Polish, Serbians, Russian and other.

Princip, did you participate the conference in London?
(Olf, 22 January 2008 17:09)

- now why do you ask that I would of thought the answer was obvious! I think you should do as bmrusila asks and back up much of your unsubstantiated claims!

Joe

Polish girls don't work in offices in the US because they are not allowed to. VISA is still required, despite the fact that Bush promised to scrap the idea after Poland joined America in all their wars worldwide. Since then Bush has not lived up to his promise, thus Tusk has decided to pull Polish troops out of Iraq. And also to correct you, the diplomas in ex-Communist countries are not of questionable quality. People simply have to work hard to achieve something in Eastern Europe and thus work extremely hard to be somebody, unlike in the States where everything is handed to you on a plate and still people are too lazy or too dumb to go to university, we have some of the best tertiary institutes in the world, which US companies fear, thus they do not hire people from Poland and others.

Olf,

It does not exist, I have checked out all the relevant sites conserning the % of the high, higer or secondary and primary education of the people. There is only about the general literacy of population. Maybe I failed to find and thus do link me the source.

‘What about Albanian diaspora that sent a weapon to KLA?’
(Zbyszek, 22 January 2008 16:01)

- I think there was more than A weapon. But anyway I think it would be in Serbia’s interest for Tadic to win. Russia is using Serbia to penetrate into Europe and weaken EU. Serbia should choose Brussels not Moscow.

bmrusila

data exist in the internet on Serbian government site and you are aware of this very well but you dont wnat to accept it. Until you accept the reality there will be these kind of problems in Serbia for those there.

My view is that Tadic has earned the votes of those that think he is worth being a president and keeping Kosova in Serbia. Now he has to show to Serbs that he is FOR entry to EU without mentioning Kosova at all. Mentioning Kosova would only confuse it's current voters and make them look as fools since they know that Kosova belongs to people that live there. In addition, Kosova Serbs have not voted form him and they will not vote for him so why should he take the risk of Kosova or EU.
These elections have shown that the real democratic block is gaining power.

Princip, voters of your candidate form SPS are going to vote for who in the second round.
Retaining Kosova at any price is not the motto is Serbian people in Serbia. it might be your since you are in nice and hot seat in UK nut not Serbs form Serbia proper.

The deal has already been made:
Kostunica gets the energy-deal with Russia (which means a lot of money for his 'business associates' in the coming decade). And in return Tadic will get the support needed to again become president of Serbia.

Your opinion is as valid as mine Princip, so no worries. I have stated that just because many Serbs say this, not only me, so if there is someone to blame for that is Serbs not me.
Princip: Let me assure you that many in Serbia are very well prepared for the best future possible when they uphold what they know to be right even if it means hardship in the short term.

I am not so sure about this one. According to what I have heard from a big number of Serbs in Kosova and Serbia and read in b92 Serbian comments it seams that they are really not prepared for another phase of darkness just for sake of Milosevic supporters.

Princip: The EU offers very little to the well educated youth of Poland beyond unskilled low paid jobs in the west
Have in mind that I don’t know your education background and I can only presume that you are highly educated person.

Well Princip, what is the percentage of highly educated people in Serbia? I’ll tell you. Data says that regardless of the significant percentage of highly educated and qualified human resources, the educational structure of the population is unfavourable. Almost 50% of the adult population has only elementary educational level or less. This means that around 3 million people above 15 are without adequate working skills and competences and that huge percentage has problems to find a job and keep jobs. The other 21 percent have secondary school or gymnasium finished but poorly trained. So, this could be one of the reasons why majority of Serbs want EU, cause they can find unskilled jobs easier.

I know that free market is in crisis but this is not such a good news. After all, the last big crisis that, which I don’t remember, ended with catastrophic consequences for all no matter the nationality.

Princip, did you participate the conference in London?

Princip,
As far as I am concern Serbia can do whatever wants, orientate towards Russia or towards West. I don’t blame you for looking for what’s in the best interest for Serbians. Having said this, similarly it’s only natural for K-Albanians to look at what’s in their best interest. Therefore, I sense that you guys are failing to recognize that.

Someone might say why do I read these comments? The answer is very simple! It is in my interest to know the views and opinions of my neighbors, and that includes Serbia.

All the best on choosing to go East or West!

Zbyszek,

Nobody forces those Polish girls to be bartenders in Chicago. Apparently they do it because the money is much bigger than in a office in Varsovie. Would they like to work in an office in the US? It is possible but for that they most likely do not have the required qualifications and experience. It is a joke how many so-called "economists" and "lawyers" get mass-produced nowadays in ex-communists countries. The quality of those diplomes is questionable. That is the main problem. US firms have the luxury to select among the brightest applicants, which include Americans of the prestigious Ivy League schools. Europeans have the best chance if they have a technical background. There some of them excel.

Zbyszek raises a very good point about the EU, while it will speed up development of infrastructure in Kosovo (when it becomes independent) and Serbia (if it decides to join) by attracting investment due to favorable EU business policies, it will more than likely cause a massive brain drain on the country, driving out the youth to the West in search of more money, due to the rise in prices that will happen in these EU states (which are disproportionate when compared to earnings).

I myself know so many people, my friends, as well as family members from my fiancee's family who have moved West in search of jobs. Poland was simply not ready to join the EU because it is so far behind, and if Poland was in too early, imagine Serbia, let alone Kosovo with its economy!

I personally think Serbia and especially Kosovo need to wait a long time before they think of joining, I would imagine that the negative elements that come with EU membership would outnumber the positive at this stage of development.

Panic stations only the yesterday DS officials were so certain!

It is not Kostunica who needs to show clarity but DS and Tadic that the EU future they talk of is not at the price of partition and dismemberment of the Serbian Republic - something the vast majority of the electorate have stated that they would not want!

Yes they would like an EU future but not for Kosovo & Meohija!

For Tadic to win now he needs to show confidence, total belief and strength in his words that only a Soverign and territorial integral Serbia can join the EU.

The statement to the Serbian electorate and the EU technocrats can be as simple as;
All of Serbia in the EU or not at all!

The Serbian electorate have shown they are very aware of the importance of the elections and they can make an intelligent choice so give them the respect they deserve and don't count on their vote but respect and fight for their vote - every single one!

EU should abandon their misconception that Serbia will roll over and not let up in upholding its sovereignty and that the EU cannot do the US bidding any more if they truly wish to see Serbia as a whole one of its partner and equal states!

Lets hear some strong messages from DS and Tadic if they really do respect the Serbian electorate and are deserving of the Presidency.

Olf,

Serbian people will vote for Tadic in second round if Tadic gives firm guarantees that Serbia won’t sign any SAA as partitioned country. Tadic must send clear message to the people. Tadic have to speak about Kosovo because Kosovo is Serbian southern province and will never give up its province. That is the fact that Albanians should count on, once when the new world order change and that might happen soon, sooner than we thought.

Another thing that it bothers me when it comes to you Albanians is depriving Serbian Diaspora of having an opinion on Kosovo and Serbia’s internal affairs. Serbia is the homeland and the home of all the Serbs where ever they live. Besides, I am the one living in Serbia and strongly oppose Kosovo independence and firmly support our current government and the steps that were taken and will be taken in future.
Next time try to find better arguments.

Olf,

how funny you are suggesting that my opinion means little and is not realistic because I live in the UK! How very dare you ! (A comical line used by a UK comic)

I think with all due respect my opinion is very valid and important since it reflects my extended family viewpoint. Let me assure you that many in Serbia are very well prepared for the best future possible when they uphold what they know to be right even if it means hardship in the short term.

The EU offers very little to the well educated youth of Poland beyond unskilled low paid jobs in the west - as I am sure Peter Sudyka can inform you but that is another debate regarding the cost vs benefit of accession.

Beyond that the economic cycle is shifting against the US and the western economies who have manipulated their own economic model of "free market" so much so that its about to whack back with force to the natural equilibria. Meddle with the equlibria at peril in the long run!

bmrusila, thanks for the support but I very much doubt Oaf will fully comprehend the point you succintly put across.

MLKG,
the real deal is that the EU get the message come the 28th Jan - Serbia as a whole or not at all!

Princip, you are absolutely right.
"The EU offers very little to the well educated youth of Poland beyond unskilled low paid jobs in the west." and will offer very little or even less to youth of Serbia. Serbia is in Europe for hundreds of years and made huge contribution to is culture (see KiM).

Serbia can not be isolated because its strategic position. This is a reason that Solana said :"EU needs Serbia". Serbia's citizens can make their own decision and peoples like Princip or Jovan have a full right to be involved in the process. What about Albanian diaspora that sent a weapon to KLA?

You can ask about a Serbia's youth prospect in the West your friends in USA and Europe. If you go to the bar in Chicago or New York, then you will be shocked that 50% of bartenders are Polish girls speaking good English and having master degrees from well known Polish universities.

The best for Serbia is to be neutral. I congratulate Serbian government for signing an agreement with Gasprom. Now Serbia has a power for negotiations.

Now we can wait for February 3, but US and Europe should stop their interference to the election process of Serbia.

Kostunica's support does not guarantee Tadic a victory in the second round of voting, what nonsense to assume this to be a fact!

One has to consider that the socialist party received 6% of the overall votes in the first round and you can safely assume that 95% of them will vote for Nikolic in the run-off, that alone should be enough for Nikolic to secure a victory even if Kostunica supports Tadic!

Nikolic will win by 2% to 3% in February.

The will of the people seems to suggest they demand change and the preservation of Kosovo, rather than pipe-dreams about improving their lives living under the EU, all you have to do is look at Bulgaria's living standards to know that all of the EU is not equal!

Olf,

Please back your claims with relevant source of information. What you claim is highly exaggerated. If you have no source for your cliams then do not post such nonsense.

‘What about Albanian diaspora that sent a weapon to KLA?’
(Zbyszek, 22 January 2008 16:01)

- I think there was more than A weapon. But anyway I think it would be in Serbia’s interest for Tadic to win. Russia is using Serbia to penetrate into Europe and weaken EU. Serbia should choose Brussels not Moscow.

Joe, you are absolutely right. Nobody forces those Polish girls to be bartenders in Chicago. Apparently they do it because the money is much bigger than in a office in Varsovie (I would say Warsaw).

This is exactly what will happen with majority of Serbian youths. Those young, well educated people would go to Germany, France, England and other EU countries to just make more money. Some, perhaps, most bright will be lucky enough to get much better job for a pay of half of that what their Germen college.

It is nothing else as drainage of intellectual forces of Serbia (or any other country).

"US firms have the luxury to select among the brightest applicants, which include Americans of the prestigious Ivy League schools."

How many graduates these schools produces? Several thousands a year? Requirement is many times higher and I hope you are aware about the problems of American education system. Many graduates of high school is unable to write and read on required level.

In most cases there are no entrance exams for high education institutions, just so called "placement test". Other big problem is drop out ratio. Huge percentage of American youths do not finish a high school.

www.civicenterprises.net/pdfs/thesilentepidemic3-06.pdf

"There is a high school dropout epidemic in America. Each year, almost one
third of all public high school students – and nearly one half of all blacks,
Hispanics and Native Americans – fail to graduate from public high school
with their class. Many of these students abandon school with less than two years
to complete their high school education."

So, again you are wrong. Thousand of US universities can not even compare with old, prestigious universities of Europe including Polish, Serbians, Russian and other.

Princip, did you participate the conference in London?
(Olf, 22 January 2008 17:09)

- now why do you ask that I would of thought the answer was obvious! I think you should do as bmrusila asks and back up much of your unsubstantiated claims!

bmrusila

data exist in the internet on Serbian government site and you are aware of this very well but you dont wnat to accept it. Until you accept the reality there will be these kind of problems in Serbia for those there.

Joe

Polish girls don't work in offices in the US because they are not allowed to. VISA is still required, despite the fact that Bush promised to scrap the idea after Poland joined America in all their wars worldwide. Since then Bush has not lived up to his promise, thus Tusk has decided to pull Polish troops out of Iraq. And also to correct you, the diplomas in ex-Communist countries are not of questionable quality. People simply have to work hard to achieve something in Eastern Europe and thus work extremely hard to be somebody, unlike in the States where everything is handed to you on a plate and still people are too lazy or too dumb to go to university, we have some of the best tertiary institutes in the world, which US companies fear, thus they do not hire people from Poland and others.

Olf,

It does not exist, I have checked out all the relevant sites conserning the % of the high, higer or secondary and primary education of the people. There is only about the general literacy of population. Maybe I failed to find and thus do link me the source.