32

Friday, 28.12.2007.

09:24

Action plan in case of Kosovo independence

Dušan Proroković, DSS, says an action plan is in place in case of a proclamation of Kosovo's independence.

Izvor: B92

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32 Komentari

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peggy

pre 16 godina

Clean cut that sounds like a master plan to me. Those ignorant Serbs will never know wht's hit them when you unleash this brilliant plan.

How many of you are so rich that you can start to build corporations just to fool the Serbs? You've already tried this cunning approach when so many came across the border from Albania and presented themselves as Serbian citizens (Kosovo residents).

How about K-Albanian refugees on other countries. Are they all from Kosovo or just travelling with inaccurate papers?

These sort of tactics have been discovered already. I think you won't be able to do it time and time again.

Clean Cut

pre 16 godina

@ Canadian

Really? You think so? Well, I got news for you. Suposse that me and my cousins are all planning to buy houses in Belgrade as soon as Serbia enters EU. Now, what are you gonna do about that? Stop us? How? Are you gonna let Dutch or Americans buy houses in Belgrade as well? How about if I open a company and buy houses in the company name, how will you find out if the company is Albanian-owned or Russian-owned? Your fears lead only to your self-destruction dear friend! Oh, one more thing. How about I change my name to Nikolai Shevchenko, does that make me any less Albanian in heart and mind? Are you still gonna let me buy a house in Belgrade or move in/out the "border" of tomorrow? How are you gonna find out who is who and what is what?

guida

pre 16 godina

Lazar,
re-read your comment, look at yourself in the mirror and think about it really hard.

...........................

you deny the massacres, you refuse to take responsibility for what serbia has done, you deny albanian history and anything that has to do with the region.
that's why we don't want to be part of serbia.

Martin John

pre 16 godina

"...the establishment of Serbian institutions on the territory of Kosovo."

Briliant idea - that gives Albanians right of establishment of Albanian institutions on the Territory of Serbia. South .... by the way Churches in Kosovo dont belong to serbs only. Albanians before accepting Islam were Orthodox.

NIKO

pre 16 godina

Establishment of Serbian institutions in Kosovo is more than great step. Wthin resolution 1244 Kosovo is a part of Serbia and as such enables to open and reopen all the institutions that will be of use for the Serbs. The most important is that resolution 1244 is not breached and every step should me made accordingly including return of Serbian forces within province of Kosovo and Metohija.

For those who might think that this is some flagrant violation of 1244, please read once more what does the resolution say. And it is really funny to read that kind of comments that one day deny existance of 1244 resolution and the next day when it suits them they acknowledge 1244 existance.

Serbian government runs wise policy, everything is done according to law.
(bmrusila, 28 December 2007 14:26)
Last time I checked, resolution 1244 speaks about Yugoslavia, which doesnt exist anymore as a country. Now Serbia claims it's the country which inherited what's left of Yugoslavia. I beg to differ on that! Why not Croatia? Or "Macedonia"?
Serbs should have thought about international law when they changed the internal borders in 1944 (Socialist Republic Of Macedonia), in 1992 when Macedonia declared indipendence, not to mention Montenegro lately. So the state of Yugoslavia of 1918 or even Serbia of 1913 doesnt exist anymore. It's ridicoulous to speak about "international law" when serbs violated every letter of it in the last 15 years.
For the first time on it's history, the voice for people of Kosovo will not come from Belgrade, Tirana or Istanbul, but from it's capital, Prishtina.
Based on "international law" again resolution 1244 was calling for the retreat of Yugoslav Army ONLY. When NATO troops entered Kosovo they didn't find even one (literally) representative of Yugoslavia or Serbia-Montenegro. No police, no customs, no local leaders, no banks.
Everyone ABANDONDED Kosovo. So serbs cannot claim as their territory something they already abandoned. That is the reason why Kosovo will be indipendent.

Alban

pre 16 godina

So Serbia has got a plan for Kosovo.. I really wonder, after reading all of this comments here, how important is Kosovo for the Serbian state and serbian people?

They want the territory, but not the people in it, that's not how it works in this world.

lowe

pre 16 godina

"As long as serbia will try peacefully to estabilish paralel institutions in serb areas with K-serbs working in there, we the albanian camp agree. If they fail or if they succeed in their project, we dont care. The important is that they try, and it is peaceful, and they do not behave agresively in case of failure. We will have our own country, and state institutions. If serbia helps to create paralel institution where only K-serbs are employeed it is good, because this will help us to integrate them at one point in the future with Kosova institution.
(Doni, 28 December 2007 14:02) "

Doni,

Don't be so naive. Parallel institutions will only further solidify the separation of K-Serbs in the north from the rest of Kosovo. What you will end up with, and which I predict will be the eventual result, is de facto partition, eventually leading to de jure in the future and not the integration that you hope for.

lowe

pre 16 godina

"Given the fact that Serb controlled areas were going to get autonomy in Kosova anyway I think that what Belgrade is doing cannot harm anyone. And in any case without the approval of NATO or the EU the North of Kosova cannot secede, so why not.
What is important I think is that finally Belgrade is coming out with what has been its plan all along: partition. Whether it will be allowed to happen or not it's another matter, but at least it marks a lowering of the demands from Serbia.
(teni, 28 December 2007 15:59)"

teni,

it will be more accurate to say that Kosovo cannot become independent and join the UN without Moscow's (and Beijing's) approval. North Kosovo is already de facto separated from Pristina -- do you see Nato or UNMIK (and EU later presumably) do anything to prevent that?

lowe

pre 16 godina

"Maybe the UN should expell Serbia?
Serbia's politicians, especially the ones from DSS, are playing a dirty game with Kosovar Serbs.
(lazer, nyc usa, 28 December 2007 13:11) "

And who is going to support the expulsion of Serbia? Russian and China won't. And I will bet you such a resolution will be vetoed by even the US, UK and France too!

Lazar

pre 16 godina

Clean Cut, if that is your opinion then why do you need an independent KosovO? WHY, WHY, WHY? What's so wrong with it staying within Serbia? We have significantly improved our economy and will rebuild all of Kosovo for Serbs and Albanians alike? What are you affraid of? We have nothing against you, we just want our land to stay ours. I think that's not too much to ask, think, if we went to Albania and suddenly started yelling independence and oh Russia just steps in to help how would you feel? Also I thing that if you declare independence we should ban all the Albanians from Serbia in case and cease all border activity for those who don't hold a Serbian passport and identify as Serbian. If you don't want to be with us we don't want to be with you. Also why are there so many of you here if it is so bad in SERBIA? Why did you come here? You haven't earned it, you don't deserve Kosovo! All of the alleged killings of Albanians are fabrications of your president. There is no legal or moral basis for your claim, there is only the support of the USA and EU which will own you for the rest of your lives. They don't want you in their institutions and it will be forever before you are accepted. This is a ploy to CONTAIN YOUR DRUG/PEOPLE TRAFFICKING ACTIVITIES. The EU doesn't want you, they don't like you and have the same problem with their own muslim populations. They want Serbia but don't want you to be a part of it and will keep you OUT. You are very naive if you think your independence comes with no strings attached, you will never be free and the autonomy deal is the best one on the table for you because if you side with US they will control you for far longer.

Canadian

pre 16 godina

Clean Cut said >> Tomorrow, when borders will be inexistent, and people, Serbian or Albanians will move freely in/out,

Clean Cut, if the Albanians declare illegal Independence, the "tomorrow" you speak of for the Albanians to freely cross borders across Europe will never come because Kosovo will be illegal and have ZERO chance of ever entering the EU, there are too many countries in the EU that will veto you, furthermore no Kosovo Albanian will be permitted to enter Serbia without proper Serbian documentation, and good luck in getting those documents from Serbia.

Open borders will never apply to the Albanians in Kosovo, just another price you will have to pay,... is it worth it?

Clean Cut

pre 16 godina

Action plan...sure, any money that enters Kosova from now on is good only for Kosova, be that in the north or south, Mitrovica or Prishtina. This is something that some people still can't understand. Tomorrow, when borders will be inexistent, and people, Serbian or Albanians will move freely in/out, locals (in any Balkan city) will wander where the money is or went and why that promissed bridge or new school is not yet being built. Politicians in Belgrade still think like in the 19-th century, trying to create Serbian "bunkers" all over the Balkans, while the future represents the free movement of people, ideas and money. Who and how will anyone or anything stop an Albanian, Serbian, Russian, American, or even Chinese from buying or renting tomorrow a house or farmland in Mitrovica or Prishtina or Belgrade? This is what politicians in Belgrade should tell their people in Belgrade or Serbs in Mitrovica. There is a clear alternative in front of Serbian people at this point, an alternative that other nations have had to deal with before: Isolation or Participation. If Serbia decides to be the North Korea of Balkans, then Europe and the rest of the civilized world surely have a solution for that as well. It will be the Serbian nation ALONE that will suffer the consequences, just like North Koreans, Cubans, Cambodians, etc, have suffered and suffer. The balance still stays like this: The World - Serbia = The World.

GSP

pre 16 godina

The residents of KosovO who do not hold a UNMIK passport are homeless & without a country. For those residents who applied for a Serbian passport, they are residents of Serbia & should support all that Serbia stands for.

I agree with you completely, Tom O'D - the albanians have had it their way too long! Enough is enough!

Joe

pre 16 godina

Yes Tom. Most Serbian refugees would be sent to Vojvodina, where the authorities made an inventory of all available or not owner-occupied buildings months ago.

Joe

pre 16 godina

Zoran,

Charge 10 times more for the bad guys? How do you dream up all this? Even the Serbian radicals would lough at your idea.
1. Serbia can be bypassed..in many ways already bypassed.
2. All those countries you would like to punish could retaliate badly.
Zoran you can not play the lion if you are just a cat.

Peter Sudyka

pre 16 godina

lazer, nyc usa

There is nothing dirty in what Serbia is doing. This shows that Serbia is coming to grips with the reality that they will probably lose Kosovo, and this is the next best thing they can do in order to maintain influence on the Serb-controlled region. Why should Kosovo Albanians care about Serbia's interests in the North? As long as they don't resort to military force, why should this be considered a "dirty game"? Expecting this group of Serbs to integrate into Kosovo is an extremely difficult task, why not rather let Serbia establish these administrative bodies in the North, especially if it will soften their stance towards Kosovo's independence? It will not make any difference on sovereignty, so why not? Try to be a bit more realistic.

About kicking Serbia out of the UN, sorry to disappoint you, but only a majority General Assembly vote, with the endorsement of a unanimous UNSC vote, can lead to such a thing. In other words, the chances of Serbia getting kicked out of the UN are about as low as Kosovo getting into the UN. Besides, why should Serbia get kicked out of the UN?

Mike

pre 16 godina

It remains to be seen what these offices and institutions in Kosovo will do. We can already expect at least three such offices to be set up in North Kosovo, if they aren't set up already. We can also acknowledge that for all intents and purposes, Northern Mitrovica is a separate city.

Now what remains is whether more institutions will be set up in the rest of Kosovo - most likely Gracanica, Novo Brdo, and Strpce. These areas, like what some here have already pointed out, are going to be de facto Serbian territory anyway under the AP. Smaller places like Orahovac, Gniljane, and the enclaves in Pec and Decani may just empty with Serbs moving to these larger areas. In any event, Serbia has every right to establish such parallel instititions in Kosovo, regardless of the final status.

Beka

pre 16 godina

I agree with Teni. According to the Ahtisaari plan Serbs get autonomous status within Kosovo anyway. A de facto partition exists now and will do in the future but once in EU it will make no difference. Northern Kosovo will belong to Serbia as much as Preshevo Valley will belong to Kosovo.

Ratko

pre 16 godina

albanian independece = western dependence. The only thing that will prosper for albans in KiM is drug/people trade. This is their number one export, and lets not fool anyone because this is the truth.

Tom

pre 16 godina

Does Serbian government expect any refugee crisis in case of Kosovo independence? Are there any plans for humanitarian camps for Serb refugees from Kosovo?

Olf

pre 16 godina

Zoran and Tom
Macedonia and Bulgaria are not scared of your measures let alone EU countries.
Bring on the measures I cannot wait to face them.

teni

pre 16 godina

Given the fact that Serb controlled areas were going to get autonomy in Kosova anyway I think that what Belgrade is doing cannot harm anyone. And in any case without the approval of NATO or the EU the North of Kosova cannot secede, so why not.
What is important I think is that finally Belgrade is coming out with what has been its plan all along: partition. Whether it will be allowed to happen or not it's another matter, but at least it marks a lowering of the demands from Serbia.

ahmet isufi

pre 16 godina

I must say that I agree with Zoran's ideas. I hope Serbia will do just what you said and in no time Serbia will be the next North Korea in Balkans.Faced gentelman the game is over.

bmrusila

pre 16 godina

Establishment of Serbian institutions in Kosovo is more than great step. Wthin resolution 1244 Kosovo is a part of Serbia and as such enables to open and reopen all the institutions that will be of use for the Serbs. The most important is that resolution 1244 is not breached and every step should me made accordingly including return of Serbian forces within province of Kosovo and Metohija.

For those who might think that this is some flagrant violation of 1244, please read once more what does the resolution say. And it is really funny to read that kind of comments that one day deny existance of 1244 resolution and the next day when it suits them they acknowledge 1244 existance.

Serbian government runs wise policy, everything is done according to law.

Zoran

pre 16 godina

Tom O'Donoghue

I agree with you that it is brilliant idea, but let us not forget other side of the coin. Mr Prorokovic. did not mention the retaliation measures toward countries that recognises illegal independence declaration. It could include nationalisation of all assets that belongs to countries that support proclamation of Kosovo I Metohija independence. It will hurt sponsors of independence taking in consideration that Kosovo I Metohija could not gain independence legally without Serbia’s government approval. I am sure that any kind of transits of goods through Serbia by illegal independence sponsors will be charged 10 times more than for others.
It will be interesting to see what Serbian government prepares for “third party” independence pushers. I am sure that most of them will “change side” after reading the declaration of economic measures that could affect them.

xheffo

pre 16 godina

...the establishment of Serbian institutions on the territory of Kosovo...
Of course mr.Prorokovic, you can open embassy. Embassy of Republic of Serbia in Pristina.

Doni

pre 16 godina

As long as serbia will try peacefully to estabilish paralel institutions in serb areas with K-serbs working in there, we the albanian camp agree. If they fail or if they succeed in their project, we dont care. The important is that they try, and it is peaceful, and they do not behave agresively in case of failure. We will have our own country, and state institutions. If serbia helps to create paralel institution where only K-serbs are employeed it is good, because this will help us to integrate them at one point in the future with Kosova institution.

Tom O'Donoghue

pre 16 godina

"...the establishment of Serbian institutions on the territory of Kosovo."
Brilliant idea. A peaceful yet meaningful initiative. I await some more equally imaginative proposals over the coming weeks. The Albanians have had it all their own way for too long now - time to get proactive. Keep at it!

lazer, nyc usa

pre 16 godina

Maybe the UN should expell Serbia?
Serbia's politicians, especially the ones from DSS, are playing a dirty game with Kosovar Serbs.

peggy

pre 16 godina

Yeah, and the UN has done such a great job of repsecting the resolution.
Not to mention the US and some EU players openly trying to break the same resolution.

Serbia has more right to administer Kosovo than the very countries who hide behind the UN and are trying to grab it for their own purposes.

If anyone is breaking the law here it is the major players in the EU.

Aleksandër

pre 16 godina

"[...]Serbia must take steps in order to constitute its local admnistrative bodies and organize a life and system which has been functioning for seven years now,” said Proroković. Pay attention to "which has been functioning for seven years now". By establishing paralel institutions in Kosovo, Serbia has been flagrantly violating the UNSC Resolution 1244 of 1999. UNSCR 1244 (1999) established an interim UN administration in Kosovo, responsible for all forms of administration and processes of government with all concomitant privileges and duties. In effect the sovereign rights of Serbia are suspended in respect of the territory of Kosovo and are exercised by UNMIK.

Olf

pre 16 godina

Cant wait to see the steps that Serbian government will take.
Action plan motioned in this article is supposed to make every Serb feel in Serbia. Nothing is stopping them from feeling the same now too, but they cannot see Serbia anywhere that’s the problem. Nothing has stopped them from having such offices now but there is no need for those offices, unless they’ll act as Serbia liaison offices in Kosova.
Opening such offices could be allowed but the legacy of them is the question. Will anything issued by those offices be official for Kosova institutions? People here are working especially on issue of legacy of the documents issued by these offices not on the issue of closing them or something similar. Legacy of them once is nil, the importance of those offices will be the same.
In addition, for those offices to function you need staff. Is there enough staff or will there be staff to work on those offices? Will there people that those offices would serve?
My dear friends, in order to claim for a territory yours you need the support of the majority of population. In Kosova situation you have nothing to hold on to.

Oh, what are the other steps that would make any Serb feel as if in Serbia?

Tom O'Donoghue

pre 16 godina

"...the establishment of Serbian institutions on the territory of Kosovo."
Brilliant idea. A peaceful yet meaningful initiative. I await some more equally imaginative proposals over the coming weeks. The Albanians have had it all their own way for too long now - time to get proactive. Keep at it!

peggy

pre 16 godina

Yeah, and the UN has done such a great job of repsecting the resolution.
Not to mention the US and some EU players openly trying to break the same resolution.

Serbia has more right to administer Kosovo than the very countries who hide behind the UN and are trying to grab it for their own purposes.

If anyone is breaking the law here it is the major players in the EU.

Ratko

pre 16 godina

albanian independece = western dependence. The only thing that will prosper for albans in KiM is drug/people trade. This is their number one export, and lets not fool anyone because this is the truth.

bmrusila

pre 16 godina

Establishment of Serbian institutions in Kosovo is more than great step. Wthin resolution 1244 Kosovo is a part of Serbia and as such enables to open and reopen all the institutions that will be of use for the Serbs. The most important is that resolution 1244 is not breached and every step should me made accordingly including return of Serbian forces within province of Kosovo and Metohija.

For those who might think that this is some flagrant violation of 1244, please read once more what does the resolution say. And it is really funny to read that kind of comments that one day deny existance of 1244 resolution and the next day when it suits them they acknowledge 1244 existance.

Serbian government runs wise policy, everything is done according to law.

Zoran

pre 16 godina

Tom O'Donoghue

I agree with you that it is brilliant idea, but let us not forget other side of the coin. Mr Prorokovic. did not mention the retaliation measures toward countries that recognises illegal independence declaration. It could include nationalisation of all assets that belongs to countries that support proclamation of Kosovo I Metohija independence. It will hurt sponsors of independence taking in consideration that Kosovo I Metohija could not gain independence legally without Serbia’s government approval. I am sure that any kind of transits of goods through Serbia by illegal independence sponsors will be charged 10 times more than for others.
It will be interesting to see what Serbian government prepares for “third party” independence pushers. I am sure that most of them will “change side” after reading the declaration of economic measures that could affect them.

xheffo

pre 16 godina

...the establishment of Serbian institutions on the territory of Kosovo...
Of course mr.Prorokovic, you can open embassy. Embassy of Republic of Serbia in Pristina.

lazer, nyc usa

pre 16 godina

Maybe the UN should expell Serbia?
Serbia's politicians, especially the ones from DSS, are playing a dirty game with Kosovar Serbs.

Mike

pre 16 godina

It remains to be seen what these offices and institutions in Kosovo will do. We can already expect at least three such offices to be set up in North Kosovo, if they aren't set up already. We can also acknowledge that for all intents and purposes, Northern Mitrovica is a separate city.

Now what remains is whether more institutions will be set up in the rest of Kosovo - most likely Gracanica, Novo Brdo, and Strpce. These areas, like what some here have already pointed out, are going to be de facto Serbian territory anyway under the AP. Smaller places like Orahovac, Gniljane, and the enclaves in Pec and Decani may just empty with Serbs moving to these larger areas. In any event, Serbia has every right to establish such parallel instititions in Kosovo, regardless of the final status.

Olf

pre 16 godina

Cant wait to see the steps that Serbian government will take.
Action plan motioned in this article is supposed to make every Serb feel in Serbia. Nothing is stopping them from feeling the same now too, but they cannot see Serbia anywhere that’s the problem. Nothing has stopped them from having such offices now but there is no need for those offices, unless they’ll act as Serbia liaison offices in Kosova.
Opening such offices could be allowed but the legacy of them is the question. Will anything issued by those offices be official for Kosova institutions? People here are working especially on issue of legacy of the documents issued by these offices not on the issue of closing them or something similar. Legacy of them once is nil, the importance of those offices will be the same.
In addition, for those offices to function you need staff. Is there enough staff or will there be staff to work on those offices? Will there people that those offices would serve?
My dear friends, in order to claim for a territory yours you need the support of the majority of population. In Kosova situation you have nothing to hold on to.

Oh, what are the other steps that would make any Serb feel as if in Serbia?

Aleksandër

pre 16 godina

"[...]Serbia must take steps in order to constitute its local admnistrative bodies and organize a life and system which has been functioning for seven years now,” said Proroković. Pay attention to "which has been functioning for seven years now". By establishing paralel institutions in Kosovo, Serbia has been flagrantly violating the UNSC Resolution 1244 of 1999. UNSCR 1244 (1999) established an interim UN administration in Kosovo, responsible for all forms of administration and processes of government with all concomitant privileges and duties. In effect the sovereign rights of Serbia are suspended in respect of the territory of Kosovo and are exercised by UNMIK.

GSP

pre 16 godina

The residents of KosovO who do not hold a UNMIK passport are homeless & without a country. For those residents who applied for a Serbian passport, they are residents of Serbia & should support all that Serbia stands for.

I agree with you completely, Tom O'D - the albanians have had it their way too long! Enough is enough!

Peter Sudyka

pre 16 godina

lazer, nyc usa

There is nothing dirty in what Serbia is doing. This shows that Serbia is coming to grips with the reality that they will probably lose Kosovo, and this is the next best thing they can do in order to maintain influence on the Serb-controlled region. Why should Kosovo Albanians care about Serbia's interests in the North? As long as they don't resort to military force, why should this be considered a "dirty game"? Expecting this group of Serbs to integrate into Kosovo is an extremely difficult task, why not rather let Serbia establish these administrative bodies in the North, especially if it will soften their stance towards Kosovo's independence? It will not make any difference on sovereignty, so why not? Try to be a bit more realistic.

About kicking Serbia out of the UN, sorry to disappoint you, but only a majority General Assembly vote, with the endorsement of a unanimous UNSC vote, can lead to such a thing. In other words, the chances of Serbia getting kicked out of the UN are about as low as Kosovo getting into the UN. Besides, why should Serbia get kicked out of the UN?

Joe

pre 16 godina

Zoran,

Charge 10 times more for the bad guys? How do you dream up all this? Even the Serbian radicals would lough at your idea.
1. Serbia can be bypassed..in many ways already bypassed.
2. All those countries you would like to punish could retaliate badly.
Zoran you can not play the lion if you are just a cat.

Clean Cut

pre 16 godina

Action plan...sure, any money that enters Kosova from now on is good only for Kosova, be that in the north or south, Mitrovica or Prishtina. This is something that some people still can't understand. Tomorrow, when borders will be inexistent, and people, Serbian or Albanians will move freely in/out, locals (in any Balkan city) will wander where the money is or went and why that promissed bridge or new school is not yet being built. Politicians in Belgrade still think like in the 19-th century, trying to create Serbian "bunkers" all over the Balkans, while the future represents the free movement of people, ideas and money. Who and how will anyone or anything stop an Albanian, Serbian, Russian, American, or even Chinese from buying or renting tomorrow a house or farmland in Mitrovica or Prishtina or Belgrade? This is what politicians in Belgrade should tell their people in Belgrade or Serbs in Mitrovica. There is a clear alternative in front of Serbian people at this point, an alternative that other nations have had to deal with before: Isolation or Participation. If Serbia decides to be the North Korea of Balkans, then Europe and the rest of the civilized world surely have a solution for that as well. It will be the Serbian nation ALONE that will suffer the consequences, just like North Koreans, Cubans, Cambodians, etc, have suffered and suffer. The balance still stays like this: The World - Serbia = The World.

Doni

pre 16 godina

As long as serbia will try peacefully to estabilish paralel institutions in serb areas with K-serbs working in there, we the albanian camp agree. If they fail or if they succeed in their project, we dont care. The important is that they try, and it is peaceful, and they do not behave agresively in case of failure. We will have our own country, and state institutions. If serbia helps to create paralel institution where only K-serbs are employeed it is good, because this will help us to integrate them at one point in the future with Kosova institution.

Tom

pre 16 godina

Does Serbian government expect any refugee crisis in case of Kosovo independence? Are there any plans for humanitarian camps for Serb refugees from Kosovo?

Canadian

pre 16 godina

Clean Cut said >> Tomorrow, when borders will be inexistent, and people, Serbian or Albanians will move freely in/out,

Clean Cut, if the Albanians declare illegal Independence, the "tomorrow" you speak of for the Albanians to freely cross borders across Europe will never come because Kosovo will be illegal and have ZERO chance of ever entering the EU, there are too many countries in the EU that will veto you, furthermore no Kosovo Albanian will be permitted to enter Serbia without proper Serbian documentation, and good luck in getting those documents from Serbia.

Open borders will never apply to the Albanians in Kosovo, just another price you will have to pay,... is it worth it?

ahmet isufi

pre 16 godina

I must say that I agree with Zoran's ideas. I hope Serbia will do just what you said and in no time Serbia will be the next North Korea in Balkans.Faced gentelman the game is over.

teni

pre 16 godina

Given the fact that Serb controlled areas were going to get autonomy in Kosova anyway I think that what Belgrade is doing cannot harm anyone. And in any case without the approval of NATO or the EU the North of Kosova cannot secede, so why not.
What is important I think is that finally Belgrade is coming out with what has been its plan all along: partition. Whether it will be allowed to happen or not it's another matter, but at least it marks a lowering of the demands from Serbia.

lowe

pre 16 godina

"Maybe the UN should expell Serbia?
Serbia's politicians, especially the ones from DSS, are playing a dirty game with Kosovar Serbs.
(lazer, nyc usa, 28 December 2007 13:11) "

And who is going to support the expulsion of Serbia? Russian and China won't. And I will bet you such a resolution will be vetoed by even the US, UK and France too!

lowe

pre 16 godina

"Given the fact that Serb controlled areas were going to get autonomy in Kosova anyway I think that what Belgrade is doing cannot harm anyone. And in any case without the approval of NATO or the EU the North of Kosova cannot secede, so why not.
What is important I think is that finally Belgrade is coming out with what has been its plan all along: partition. Whether it will be allowed to happen or not it's another matter, but at least it marks a lowering of the demands from Serbia.
(teni, 28 December 2007 15:59)"

teni,

it will be more accurate to say that Kosovo cannot become independent and join the UN without Moscow's (and Beijing's) approval. North Kosovo is already de facto separated from Pristina -- do you see Nato or UNMIK (and EU later presumably) do anything to prevent that?

peggy

pre 16 godina

Clean cut that sounds like a master plan to me. Those ignorant Serbs will never know wht's hit them when you unleash this brilliant plan.

How many of you are so rich that you can start to build corporations just to fool the Serbs? You've already tried this cunning approach when so many came across the border from Albania and presented themselves as Serbian citizens (Kosovo residents).

How about K-Albanian refugees on other countries. Are they all from Kosovo or just travelling with inaccurate papers?

These sort of tactics have been discovered already. I think you won't be able to do it time and time again.

Olf

pre 16 godina

Zoran and Tom
Macedonia and Bulgaria are not scared of your measures let alone EU countries.
Bring on the measures I cannot wait to face them.

Beka

pre 16 godina

I agree with Teni. According to the Ahtisaari plan Serbs get autonomous status within Kosovo anyway. A de facto partition exists now and will do in the future but once in EU it will make no difference. Northern Kosovo will belong to Serbia as much as Preshevo Valley will belong to Kosovo.

Lazar

pre 16 godina

Clean Cut, if that is your opinion then why do you need an independent KosovO? WHY, WHY, WHY? What's so wrong with it staying within Serbia? We have significantly improved our economy and will rebuild all of Kosovo for Serbs and Albanians alike? What are you affraid of? We have nothing against you, we just want our land to stay ours. I think that's not too much to ask, think, if we went to Albania and suddenly started yelling independence and oh Russia just steps in to help how would you feel? Also I thing that if you declare independence we should ban all the Albanians from Serbia in case and cease all border activity for those who don't hold a Serbian passport and identify as Serbian. If you don't want to be with us we don't want to be with you. Also why are there so many of you here if it is so bad in SERBIA? Why did you come here? You haven't earned it, you don't deserve Kosovo! All of the alleged killings of Albanians are fabrications of your president. There is no legal or moral basis for your claim, there is only the support of the USA and EU which will own you for the rest of your lives. They don't want you in their institutions and it will be forever before you are accepted. This is a ploy to CONTAIN YOUR DRUG/PEOPLE TRAFFICKING ACTIVITIES. The EU doesn't want you, they don't like you and have the same problem with their own muslim populations. They want Serbia but don't want you to be a part of it and will keep you OUT. You are very naive if you think your independence comes with no strings attached, you will never be free and the autonomy deal is the best one on the table for you because if you side with US they will control you for far longer.

lowe

pre 16 godina

"As long as serbia will try peacefully to estabilish paralel institutions in serb areas with K-serbs working in there, we the albanian camp agree. If they fail or if they succeed in their project, we dont care. The important is that they try, and it is peaceful, and they do not behave agresively in case of failure. We will have our own country, and state institutions. If serbia helps to create paralel institution where only K-serbs are employeed it is good, because this will help us to integrate them at one point in the future with Kosova institution.
(Doni, 28 December 2007 14:02) "

Doni,

Don't be so naive. Parallel institutions will only further solidify the separation of K-Serbs in the north from the rest of Kosovo. What you will end up with, and which I predict will be the eventual result, is de facto partition, eventually leading to de jure in the future and not the integration that you hope for.

Alban

pre 16 godina

So Serbia has got a plan for Kosovo.. I really wonder, after reading all of this comments here, how important is Kosovo for the Serbian state and serbian people?

They want the territory, but not the people in it, that's not how it works in this world.

Martin John

pre 16 godina

"...the establishment of Serbian institutions on the territory of Kosovo."

Briliant idea - that gives Albanians right of establishment of Albanian institutions on the Territory of Serbia. South .... by the way Churches in Kosovo dont belong to serbs only. Albanians before accepting Islam were Orthodox.

guida

pre 16 godina

Lazar,
re-read your comment, look at yourself in the mirror and think about it really hard.

...........................

you deny the massacres, you refuse to take responsibility for what serbia has done, you deny albanian history and anything that has to do with the region.
that's why we don't want to be part of serbia.

Joe

pre 16 godina

Yes Tom. Most Serbian refugees would be sent to Vojvodina, where the authorities made an inventory of all available or not owner-occupied buildings months ago.

NIKO

pre 16 godina

Establishment of Serbian institutions in Kosovo is more than great step. Wthin resolution 1244 Kosovo is a part of Serbia and as such enables to open and reopen all the institutions that will be of use for the Serbs. The most important is that resolution 1244 is not breached and every step should me made accordingly including return of Serbian forces within province of Kosovo and Metohija.

For those who might think that this is some flagrant violation of 1244, please read once more what does the resolution say. And it is really funny to read that kind of comments that one day deny existance of 1244 resolution and the next day when it suits them they acknowledge 1244 existance.

Serbian government runs wise policy, everything is done according to law.
(bmrusila, 28 December 2007 14:26)
Last time I checked, resolution 1244 speaks about Yugoslavia, which doesnt exist anymore as a country. Now Serbia claims it's the country which inherited what's left of Yugoslavia. I beg to differ on that! Why not Croatia? Or "Macedonia"?
Serbs should have thought about international law when they changed the internal borders in 1944 (Socialist Republic Of Macedonia), in 1992 when Macedonia declared indipendence, not to mention Montenegro lately. So the state of Yugoslavia of 1918 or even Serbia of 1913 doesnt exist anymore. It's ridicoulous to speak about "international law" when serbs violated every letter of it in the last 15 years.
For the first time on it's history, the voice for people of Kosovo will not come from Belgrade, Tirana or Istanbul, but from it's capital, Prishtina.
Based on "international law" again resolution 1244 was calling for the retreat of Yugoslav Army ONLY. When NATO troops entered Kosovo they didn't find even one (literally) representative of Yugoslavia or Serbia-Montenegro. No police, no customs, no local leaders, no banks.
Everyone ABANDONDED Kosovo. So serbs cannot claim as their territory something they already abandoned. That is the reason why Kosovo will be indipendent.

Clean Cut

pre 16 godina

@ Canadian

Really? You think so? Well, I got news for you. Suposse that me and my cousins are all planning to buy houses in Belgrade as soon as Serbia enters EU. Now, what are you gonna do about that? Stop us? How? Are you gonna let Dutch or Americans buy houses in Belgrade as well? How about if I open a company and buy houses in the company name, how will you find out if the company is Albanian-owned or Russian-owned? Your fears lead only to your self-destruction dear friend! Oh, one more thing. How about I change my name to Nikolai Shevchenko, does that make me any less Albanian in heart and mind? Are you still gonna let me buy a house in Belgrade or move in/out the "border" of tomorrow? How are you gonna find out who is who and what is what?

ahmet isufi

pre 16 godina

I must say that I agree with Zoran's ideas. I hope Serbia will do just what you said and in no time Serbia will be the next North Korea in Balkans.Faced gentelman the game is over.

Olf

pre 16 godina

Cant wait to see the steps that Serbian government will take.
Action plan motioned in this article is supposed to make every Serb feel in Serbia. Nothing is stopping them from feeling the same now too, but they cannot see Serbia anywhere that’s the problem. Nothing has stopped them from having such offices now but there is no need for those offices, unless they’ll act as Serbia liaison offices in Kosova.
Opening such offices could be allowed but the legacy of them is the question. Will anything issued by those offices be official for Kosova institutions? People here are working especially on issue of legacy of the documents issued by these offices not on the issue of closing them or something similar. Legacy of them once is nil, the importance of those offices will be the same.
In addition, for those offices to function you need staff. Is there enough staff or will there be staff to work on those offices? Will there people that those offices would serve?
My dear friends, in order to claim for a territory yours you need the support of the majority of population. In Kosova situation you have nothing to hold on to.

Oh, what are the other steps that would make any Serb feel as if in Serbia?

lazer, nyc usa

pre 16 godina

Maybe the UN should expell Serbia?
Serbia's politicians, especially the ones from DSS, are playing a dirty game with Kosovar Serbs.

Doni

pre 16 godina

As long as serbia will try peacefully to estabilish paralel institutions in serb areas with K-serbs working in there, we the albanian camp agree. If they fail or if they succeed in their project, we dont care. The important is that they try, and it is peaceful, and they do not behave agresively in case of failure. We will have our own country, and state institutions. If serbia helps to create paralel institution where only K-serbs are employeed it is good, because this will help us to integrate them at one point in the future with Kosova institution.

xheffo

pre 16 godina

...the establishment of Serbian institutions on the territory of Kosovo...
Of course mr.Prorokovic, you can open embassy. Embassy of Republic of Serbia in Pristina.

Aleksandër

pre 16 godina

"[...]Serbia must take steps in order to constitute its local admnistrative bodies and organize a life and system which has been functioning for seven years now,” said Proroković. Pay attention to "which has been functioning for seven years now". By establishing paralel institutions in Kosovo, Serbia has been flagrantly violating the UNSC Resolution 1244 of 1999. UNSCR 1244 (1999) established an interim UN administration in Kosovo, responsible for all forms of administration and processes of government with all concomitant privileges and duties. In effect the sovereign rights of Serbia are suspended in respect of the territory of Kosovo and are exercised by UNMIK.

Olf

pre 16 godina

Zoran and Tom
Macedonia and Bulgaria are not scared of your measures let alone EU countries.
Bring on the measures I cannot wait to face them.

teni

pre 16 godina

Given the fact that Serb controlled areas were going to get autonomy in Kosova anyway I think that what Belgrade is doing cannot harm anyone. And in any case without the approval of NATO or the EU the North of Kosova cannot secede, so why not.
What is important I think is that finally Belgrade is coming out with what has been its plan all along: partition. Whether it will be allowed to happen or not it's another matter, but at least it marks a lowering of the demands from Serbia.

Beka

pre 16 godina

I agree with Teni. According to the Ahtisaari plan Serbs get autonomous status within Kosovo anyway. A de facto partition exists now and will do in the future but once in EU it will make no difference. Northern Kosovo will belong to Serbia as much as Preshevo Valley will belong to Kosovo.

Joe

pre 16 godina

Zoran,

Charge 10 times more for the bad guys? How do you dream up all this? Even the Serbian radicals would lough at your idea.
1. Serbia can be bypassed..in many ways already bypassed.
2. All those countries you would like to punish could retaliate badly.
Zoran you can not play the lion if you are just a cat.

Clean Cut

pre 16 godina

Action plan...sure, any money that enters Kosova from now on is good only for Kosova, be that in the north or south, Mitrovica or Prishtina. This is something that some people still can't understand. Tomorrow, when borders will be inexistent, and people, Serbian or Albanians will move freely in/out, locals (in any Balkan city) will wander where the money is or went and why that promissed bridge or new school is not yet being built. Politicians in Belgrade still think like in the 19-th century, trying to create Serbian "bunkers" all over the Balkans, while the future represents the free movement of people, ideas and money. Who and how will anyone or anything stop an Albanian, Serbian, Russian, American, or even Chinese from buying or renting tomorrow a house or farmland in Mitrovica or Prishtina or Belgrade? This is what politicians in Belgrade should tell their people in Belgrade or Serbs in Mitrovica. There is a clear alternative in front of Serbian people at this point, an alternative that other nations have had to deal with before: Isolation or Participation. If Serbia decides to be the North Korea of Balkans, then Europe and the rest of the civilized world surely have a solution for that as well. It will be the Serbian nation ALONE that will suffer the consequences, just like North Koreans, Cubans, Cambodians, etc, have suffered and suffer. The balance still stays like this: The World - Serbia = The World.

peggy

pre 16 godina

Yeah, and the UN has done such a great job of repsecting the resolution.
Not to mention the US and some EU players openly trying to break the same resolution.

Serbia has more right to administer Kosovo than the very countries who hide behind the UN and are trying to grab it for their own purposes.

If anyone is breaking the law here it is the major players in the EU.

Tom O'Donoghue

pre 16 godina

"...the establishment of Serbian institutions on the territory of Kosovo."
Brilliant idea. A peaceful yet meaningful initiative. I await some more equally imaginative proposals over the coming weeks. The Albanians have had it all their own way for too long now - time to get proactive. Keep at it!

Peter Sudyka

pre 16 godina

lazer, nyc usa

There is nothing dirty in what Serbia is doing. This shows that Serbia is coming to grips with the reality that they will probably lose Kosovo, and this is the next best thing they can do in order to maintain influence on the Serb-controlled region. Why should Kosovo Albanians care about Serbia's interests in the North? As long as they don't resort to military force, why should this be considered a "dirty game"? Expecting this group of Serbs to integrate into Kosovo is an extremely difficult task, why not rather let Serbia establish these administrative bodies in the North, especially if it will soften their stance towards Kosovo's independence? It will not make any difference on sovereignty, so why not? Try to be a bit more realistic.

About kicking Serbia out of the UN, sorry to disappoint you, but only a majority General Assembly vote, with the endorsement of a unanimous UNSC vote, can lead to such a thing. In other words, the chances of Serbia getting kicked out of the UN are about as low as Kosovo getting into the UN. Besides, why should Serbia get kicked out of the UN?

Joe

pre 16 godina

Yes Tom. Most Serbian refugees would be sent to Vojvodina, where the authorities made an inventory of all available or not owner-occupied buildings months ago.

Alban

pre 16 godina

So Serbia has got a plan for Kosovo.. I really wonder, after reading all of this comments here, how important is Kosovo for the Serbian state and serbian people?

They want the territory, but not the people in it, that's not how it works in this world.

guida

pre 16 godina

Lazar,
re-read your comment, look at yourself in the mirror and think about it really hard.

...........................

you deny the massacres, you refuse to take responsibility for what serbia has done, you deny albanian history and anything that has to do with the region.
that's why we don't want to be part of serbia.

Clean Cut

pre 16 godina

@ Canadian

Really? You think so? Well, I got news for you. Suposse that me and my cousins are all planning to buy houses in Belgrade as soon as Serbia enters EU. Now, what are you gonna do about that? Stop us? How? Are you gonna let Dutch or Americans buy houses in Belgrade as well? How about if I open a company and buy houses in the company name, how will you find out if the company is Albanian-owned or Russian-owned? Your fears lead only to your self-destruction dear friend! Oh, one more thing. How about I change my name to Nikolai Shevchenko, does that make me any less Albanian in heart and mind? Are you still gonna let me buy a house in Belgrade or move in/out the "border" of tomorrow? How are you gonna find out who is who and what is what?

bmrusila

pre 16 godina

Establishment of Serbian institutions in Kosovo is more than great step. Wthin resolution 1244 Kosovo is a part of Serbia and as such enables to open and reopen all the institutions that will be of use for the Serbs. The most important is that resolution 1244 is not breached and every step should me made accordingly including return of Serbian forces within province of Kosovo and Metohija.

For those who might think that this is some flagrant violation of 1244, please read once more what does the resolution say. And it is really funny to read that kind of comments that one day deny existance of 1244 resolution and the next day when it suits them they acknowledge 1244 existance.

Serbian government runs wise policy, everything is done according to law.

Zoran

pre 16 godina

Tom O'Donoghue

I agree with you that it is brilliant idea, but let us not forget other side of the coin. Mr Prorokovic. did not mention the retaliation measures toward countries that recognises illegal independence declaration. It could include nationalisation of all assets that belongs to countries that support proclamation of Kosovo I Metohija independence. It will hurt sponsors of independence taking in consideration that Kosovo I Metohija could not gain independence legally without Serbia’s government approval. I am sure that any kind of transits of goods through Serbia by illegal independence sponsors will be charged 10 times more than for others.
It will be interesting to see what Serbian government prepares for “third party” independence pushers. I am sure that most of them will “change side” after reading the declaration of economic measures that could affect them.

Tom

pre 16 godina

Does Serbian government expect any refugee crisis in case of Kosovo independence? Are there any plans for humanitarian camps for Serb refugees from Kosovo?

NIKO

pre 16 godina

Establishment of Serbian institutions in Kosovo is more than great step. Wthin resolution 1244 Kosovo is a part of Serbia and as such enables to open and reopen all the institutions that will be of use for the Serbs. The most important is that resolution 1244 is not breached and every step should me made accordingly including return of Serbian forces within province of Kosovo and Metohija.

For those who might think that this is some flagrant violation of 1244, please read once more what does the resolution say. And it is really funny to read that kind of comments that one day deny existance of 1244 resolution and the next day when it suits them they acknowledge 1244 existance.

Serbian government runs wise policy, everything is done according to law.
(bmrusila, 28 December 2007 14:26)
Last time I checked, resolution 1244 speaks about Yugoslavia, which doesnt exist anymore as a country. Now Serbia claims it's the country which inherited what's left of Yugoslavia. I beg to differ on that! Why not Croatia? Or "Macedonia"?
Serbs should have thought about international law when they changed the internal borders in 1944 (Socialist Republic Of Macedonia), in 1992 when Macedonia declared indipendence, not to mention Montenegro lately. So the state of Yugoslavia of 1918 or even Serbia of 1913 doesnt exist anymore. It's ridicoulous to speak about "international law" when serbs violated every letter of it in the last 15 years.
For the first time on it's history, the voice for people of Kosovo will not come from Belgrade, Tirana or Istanbul, but from it's capital, Prishtina.
Based on "international law" again resolution 1244 was calling for the retreat of Yugoslav Army ONLY. When NATO troops entered Kosovo they didn't find even one (literally) representative of Yugoslavia or Serbia-Montenegro. No police, no customs, no local leaders, no banks.
Everyone ABANDONDED Kosovo. So serbs cannot claim as their territory something they already abandoned. That is the reason why Kosovo will be indipendent.

Martin John

pre 16 godina

"...the establishment of Serbian institutions on the territory of Kosovo."

Briliant idea - that gives Albanians right of establishment of Albanian institutions on the Territory of Serbia. South .... by the way Churches in Kosovo dont belong to serbs only. Albanians before accepting Islam were Orthodox.

Ratko

pre 16 godina

albanian independece = western dependence. The only thing that will prosper for albans in KiM is drug/people trade. This is their number one export, and lets not fool anyone because this is the truth.

Mike

pre 16 godina

It remains to be seen what these offices and institutions in Kosovo will do. We can already expect at least three such offices to be set up in North Kosovo, if they aren't set up already. We can also acknowledge that for all intents and purposes, Northern Mitrovica is a separate city.

Now what remains is whether more institutions will be set up in the rest of Kosovo - most likely Gracanica, Novo Brdo, and Strpce. These areas, like what some here have already pointed out, are going to be de facto Serbian territory anyway under the AP. Smaller places like Orahovac, Gniljane, and the enclaves in Pec and Decani may just empty with Serbs moving to these larger areas. In any event, Serbia has every right to establish such parallel instititions in Kosovo, regardless of the final status.

GSP

pre 16 godina

The residents of KosovO who do not hold a UNMIK passport are homeless & without a country. For those residents who applied for a Serbian passport, they are residents of Serbia & should support all that Serbia stands for.

I agree with you completely, Tom O'D - the albanians have had it their way too long! Enough is enough!

Canadian

pre 16 godina

Clean Cut said >> Tomorrow, when borders will be inexistent, and people, Serbian or Albanians will move freely in/out,

Clean Cut, if the Albanians declare illegal Independence, the "tomorrow" you speak of for the Albanians to freely cross borders across Europe will never come because Kosovo will be illegal and have ZERO chance of ever entering the EU, there are too many countries in the EU that will veto you, furthermore no Kosovo Albanian will be permitted to enter Serbia without proper Serbian documentation, and good luck in getting those documents from Serbia.

Open borders will never apply to the Albanians in Kosovo, just another price you will have to pay,... is it worth it?

Lazar

pre 16 godina

Clean Cut, if that is your opinion then why do you need an independent KosovO? WHY, WHY, WHY? What's so wrong with it staying within Serbia? We have significantly improved our economy and will rebuild all of Kosovo for Serbs and Albanians alike? What are you affraid of? We have nothing against you, we just want our land to stay ours. I think that's not too much to ask, think, if we went to Albania and suddenly started yelling independence and oh Russia just steps in to help how would you feel? Also I thing that if you declare independence we should ban all the Albanians from Serbia in case and cease all border activity for those who don't hold a Serbian passport and identify as Serbian. If you don't want to be with us we don't want to be with you. Also why are there so many of you here if it is so bad in SERBIA? Why did you come here? You haven't earned it, you don't deserve Kosovo! All of the alleged killings of Albanians are fabrications of your president. There is no legal or moral basis for your claim, there is only the support of the USA and EU which will own you for the rest of your lives. They don't want you in their institutions and it will be forever before you are accepted. This is a ploy to CONTAIN YOUR DRUG/PEOPLE TRAFFICKING ACTIVITIES. The EU doesn't want you, they don't like you and have the same problem with their own muslim populations. They want Serbia but don't want you to be a part of it and will keep you OUT. You are very naive if you think your independence comes with no strings attached, you will never be free and the autonomy deal is the best one on the table for you because if you side with US they will control you for far longer.

lowe

pre 16 godina

"Maybe the UN should expell Serbia?
Serbia's politicians, especially the ones from DSS, are playing a dirty game with Kosovar Serbs.
(lazer, nyc usa, 28 December 2007 13:11) "

And who is going to support the expulsion of Serbia? Russian and China won't. And I will bet you such a resolution will be vetoed by even the US, UK and France too!

lowe

pre 16 godina

"As long as serbia will try peacefully to estabilish paralel institutions in serb areas with K-serbs working in there, we the albanian camp agree. If they fail or if they succeed in their project, we dont care. The important is that they try, and it is peaceful, and they do not behave agresively in case of failure. We will have our own country, and state institutions. If serbia helps to create paralel institution where only K-serbs are employeed it is good, because this will help us to integrate them at one point in the future with Kosova institution.
(Doni, 28 December 2007 14:02) "

Doni,

Don't be so naive. Parallel institutions will only further solidify the separation of K-Serbs in the north from the rest of Kosovo. What you will end up with, and which I predict will be the eventual result, is de facto partition, eventually leading to de jure in the future and not the integration that you hope for.

lowe

pre 16 godina

"Given the fact that Serb controlled areas were going to get autonomy in Kosova anyway I think that what Belgrade is doing cannot harm anyone. And in any case without the approval of NATO or the EU the North of Kosova cannot secede, so why not.
What is important I think is that finally Belgrade is coming out with what has been its plan all along: partition. Whether it will be allowed to happen or not it's another matter, but at least it marks a lowering of the demands from Serbia.
(teni, 28 December 2007 15:59)"

teni,

it will be more accurate to say that Kosovo cannot become independent and join the UN without Moscow's (and Beijing's) approval. North Kosovo is already de facto separated from Pristina -- do you see Nato or UNMIK (and EU later presumably) do anything to prevent that?

peggy

pre 16 godina

Clean cut that sounds like a master plan to me. Those ignorant Serbs will never know wht's hit them when you unleash this brilliant plan.

How many of you are so rich that you can start to build corporations just to fool the Serbs? You've already tried this cunning approach when so many came across the border from Albania and presented themselves as Serbian citizens (Kosovo residents).

How about K-Albanian refugees on other countries. Are they all from Kosovo or just travelling with inaccurate papers?

These sort of tactics have been discovered already. I think you won't be able to do it time and time again.