Tuesday, 11.12.2007.
09:06
On the day the Troika mandate ended, the Russian envoy voiced Moscow's support for continued Kosovo negotiations.
Izvor: B92
IMAGE SOURCE
pre 16 godina
Kosovo has been part of Serbia for 700 years!! The Basc People are the OLDEST EUROPEANS in the continent..they have been living in which TODAY is called "Spain" for ...75.000 years.. have their own UNIQUE language.. even diferent blood groups .. My question is Don´t they have 74.300 reasons MORE then the Kosovan Albanians to declare INDEPENDANCE fron SPAIN??
Ernst - Germany
pre 16 godina
Rade
Clean Cut obviously doesn't know that Slavs originate from Western Ukraine/Eastern Poland, we just colonized lands eastward. We have been in Europe for thousands of years, and they know it. They just try to provoke us. Nobody will kick us out, we are too strong for anyone.
Don't worry about the Nazis and the Greater Albania thing, without the Nazis they would not have achieved a thing. They even went on to betray the Nazis when the Soviets were winning. Albanian military history is known for its swinging of alliances to suit their political agenda.
Now their best friend is the US, next it will be India.
pre 16 godina
Peter, Clean Cut's comment seems to be that as Slavs, the Serbs originate from Russia, which in his opinion is an Asian country. Other Albanian posters have expressed similar views, that Slavs are newcomers to Europe and that they would like for 'real' Europeans to kick them out.
One Albanian poster even lamented for the good times of 1941 when the Nazis created a greater albania,in a recent post.
The Serbs will never agree to gift their territory to assist the creation of a Nazi inspired entity.
pre 16 godina
Clean Cut
I am not sure if I understood correctly, but you claim that Serbia has never belonged in Europe???
pre 16 godina
Clean Cut, the Serbs have always been a European people. The Albanians on the other hand, originate from Caucasian Albania, smack dab in the middle of Asia. So much for the Illiryian myth.
How would you like it if we told you to 'go backto Asia'?
pre 16 godina
"As far as Kosova's independence goes Russia is little more than a paper tiger. It was actually Serbia's greatest mistake to place its hopes solely on Russia because it was certain to antagonize the West, as it did.
As an Albanian I feel we owe Russia a big debt of gratitude for doing our job for us. I mean just look at the EU and how Russia managed to make them all, minus Cyprus, support independence. I wonder if we Albanians could have ever done that as effectively as the Russians did. And the recent declarations by the EU on 26 of its members accepting the independence of Kosova was as big a "in your face" to Russia as such things come. That ought to show you guys how much Russia counts in this issue.
Kosova is gone and the only thing that remains to be solved now is the North, but not independence.
And guys: A diplomat's duty is to get results for his country and not to please its adversaries. So as far as diplomats go this Russian guy is a diplomat who has just failed. Miserably.
(teni, 11 December 2007 17:18)"
teni,
this "paper tiger" (your words) can prevent Kosovo from entering the UN forever. No UN means no WHO, IMF, large scale foreign investments ..... need I say more??? You will become permanently dependent on the West for charity -- no different from Darfur or Somalia.
I think you also need to be more updated about that blustering Luxembourg minister's claim that all EU except Cyprus support Kosovo independence. This is far from the truth --read the other reports on B92 today -- the lastest was that Romania is in no hurry to recognize Kosovo's breakaway. And countries like Greece, Spain, Slovakia, Hungary have all asked the EU to consider Serbia's views and their own preference for a negotiated settlement. For example read http://www.serbianna.com/news/2007/03060.shtml and http://www.serbianna.com/news/2007/03061.shtml
My point is this: don't count your chickens before they are hatched.
pre 16 godina
"Kosova is an European problem. An European decision inside Europe is legal. Russian interference in Europe's business is illegal. Serbia itself can go as far East as possible, as soon as possible. It has never belonged to Europe, ever. So, let Serbia be an Asian problem and Asian nations decide about its fate. How does that sound to you? I know it sounds great to me."
American business in Europe is also illegal, but for some reason the Europeans accept that without making noise any noise. Kosovo (and its Kosovo Albanian inhabitants) should maybe move South East so they can join Turkey or Iran (that is where they belong). If the Serbs should move eastwards then you should also mention the Croats, Bulgarians, Hungarians (descendents of the Mongols (same as the Fins) if you understand languages) but you seem to forget that. It seems that you look down to Asian people (no surprise considering the longing to a pure country), but you will be sorry when you realize that the Russians (also true Europeans like the Serbs) and the Chinese will be able to block your fantasy dream for independence. Maybe the US and NATO should bomb Moscow and Beijing to make them change their minds! I hope this reasonable explanation will prevent you from making future comments.
pre 16 godina
"serb camp is singing still the song:
who dares say it that serbia is small, well it is small now" according to BBC
but now the song is:
who dares say it that kosova is gone" well it'seems is gone according to us
(doni, 11 December 2007 21:29)”
B92, this smells of trolling-nothing else.
Doni, don’t worry, even rump serbia is still bigger than all of the former yugoslav republics, but when did size matter anyway?
pre 16 godina
Well Princip, don't just scan the comments try to understand a little from what you read.
My point was that there have already been declaration of independence and nothing drastic has happened? Why? Because no-one cares.
BUT is seems that this stance is different for Kosova, and therein lies another flavor of its uniqueness.
EU wants an independent Kosovak and that matters a lot!!
pre 16 godina
Please all Albanian posters, since were all speaking English here I suggest that you follow your prime minister Ceku when speaking English. Use the English word Kosovo, not the Albanian word Kosova when describing the region we are talking about in English. Otherwise it will be a lot more complicated if using regional languages when talking in English. For example refering to Greece as Hellas, Serbia as Srbija, Germany as Deutschland
pre 16 godina
Kosova is an European problem. An European decision inside Europe is legal. Russian interference in Europe's business is illegal. Serbia itself can go as far East as possible, as soon as possible. It has never belonged to Europe, ever. So, let Serbia be an Asian problem and Asian nations decide about its fate. How does that sound to you? I know it sounds great to me.
pre 16 godina
"serb camp is singing still the song:
who dares say it that serbia is small, well it is small now" according to BBC
but now the song is:
who dares say it that kosova is gone" well it'seems is gone according to us
pre 16 godina
bmrusila, south stream is a lifeline for Germany, not for Serbia.
Frau Merkel will have to choose - to support terrorist takeover of Kosovo or to have safe intake of gas for Germany, something Americans try to prevent.
Shirt is closer than the vest. No matter what Germans feel for their former Hitler's ally, guess what they will choose?
Germany has a poker face and plays wisely, let fools in EU do the talking. With German behind the scenes support, small EU countries in EU inexplicably have "teeth" and slowly, EU support to Kosovo terrorists crumbles. Yesterday, it was "only one country", today One country plus Romania, when the vote comes, it will be only American lapdogs within EU.
The problem Serbia has is a hostile population of some 1.5 m. It will change with time. Albanians will have to decide - to live like normal people or to continue to daydream.
They daydream is a nightmare for civilized Europe.
pre 16 godina
As far as Kosova's independence goes Russia is little more than a paper tiger. It was actually Serbia's greatest mistake to place its hopes solely on Russia because it was certain to antagonize the West, as it did.
As an Albanian I feel we owe Russia a big debt of gratitude for doing our job for us. I mean just look at the EU and how Russia managed to make them all, minus Cyprus, support independence. I wonder if we Albanians could have ever done that as effectively as the Russians did. And the recent declarations by the EU on 26 of its members accepting the independence of Kosova was as big a "in your face" to Russia as such things come. That ought to show you guys how much Russia counts in this issue.
Kosova is gone and the only thing that remains to be solved now is the North, but not independence.
And guys: A diplomat's duty is to get results for his country and not to please its adversaries. So as far as diplomats go this Russian guy is a diplomat who has just failed. Miserably.
pre 16 godina
miri,
I dare to say that you know nothing about Russia. Please inform your self more on Russia nowadays its diplomatic relations, economical growth, and so on. It is nonsence to speak of Russia being isolated without any economy, that is trully funny and makes you look....(add the word yourself). I know that many of you are not happy with this fact but it is a fact.
Btw,Russia presented to Serbian government its project on gaspipline. Apperantly the South torrent (or what ever they call it)will go through Serbia. Now, that is truely good investment for both countries.
pre 16 godina
Like Dragan has mentioned in his post. This is a true diplomat. Unlike the americans who only know how to give orders and blackmail countries.
In the UN albright used to walk around to different tables where countries' representatives sat; and she would say to them, "would you like to have Serbia as a friend or america?"
pre 16 godina
Miri,
"So is Trandniestr, with its own army an parlament, but no one has recognizied it either. So what precedence are we talking about?"
- the one where the US and a "few" EU states start the dominoes falling and can not stop what they begun - why do you think none of theose you mention have not been recognised? Could it be everyone wanted to respect UN resolutions and international norms and laws. When US start breaking them then there is no longer any credibility an dthe precedent will be set so expect a huge numebr of destabilsing declarations as the dominoes fall one after the other following this US flagarnt disregard for international law!
pre 16 godina
Beautifuly said Mr. Kharchenko. He makes sense, he is logical, and he is honest. Spoken like a true diplomat. He has put all those others, such as Solana, Miliband, Rice, and Kouchner, to shame. He has shown them what a true diplomat is.
pre 16 godina
And what is Russia is going to do about UDI? Nothing, not troops in the ground, politically and diplomatically isolated, with a dictatorial regime on the rise. Russia's only card is UNSC, but no one is interested to play that card anymore. And for those that think Russian oil will change the situation, they can compare the EU stance now and before 4 months. Russians can keep it their card for another time. And as South Ossetia, Abkhazia, Transdniestr...etc. who is preventing them to declare their independence? This is not about declaration, this is about recognition. North Cyprus has already declared its independence since 1983 but no one, except Turkey, has recognized it? So is Trandniestr, with its own army an parlament, but no one has recognizied it either. So what precedence are we talking about?
pre 16 godina
Other words he is saying "if you dont abide by our vision for Kosova/o and Serbia, we will help them destabilize the region:.
Which is in Russia's interest. It is in their interest to have a divided Europe, therefore a vulnerable US.
The cold war politics. Nobody pays attention to that any more, so passe.
Serbian and Russian politicians are living the past.
Different picture in NY yesterday, by UN. Thousands of Albanians demonstrating.
That might have made Kharchenko feel like "right at home", huh?
The guest speaker was Richard Holbrooke, next US Sec. of State.
Things are looking pretty good so far.
pre 16 godina
Well... If I were a serbian i wouldn't hold all my hopes on Russia. They're playing the 'big guy' here, and i don't blame them (I have to face it, their economy is getting strong lately, esp after the war in Iraq) but every time I hear a Russian diplomat making these kind of statements, i remember june 99. First KFOR forces entered Gracanica, and Kosovo serbs were so excited that even started talking n russian. I have to admit, HILARIOUS. Praising Russians as their savoiours, cursing Albanians, burning their flag as well as the american one... It was nice to see the serbian populace happy and all 'slavic' that day. But i wonder how did they feel after a week or two when they had to leave their houses and there was no Russian KFOR to make them feel more secured? Poor guys. Moreover, how did they feel that Russia forgot to mention any international law back in March 1999, when US unilaterally decided to start the bombing campaign against serbia, without the concent of UNSC, and Russia wasn't anywhere in the horizon? Betrayed, right? Twice in a year! I would. I wish all Kosovo serbs had better chances in Kosovo, but I really don't see it so far. It will take quite long since they would feel more secured in their homes (those who didn't sell them with astronomic prices, of course!). The reality is harsh for both sides, we shall all admit this. We both suffered enough. But we're both depended on Intl community decision. Neither of us is capable of setting a common agreement. But ANY UNSC decision would drop the 1244, and that would open a new opportunity for Kosovo albanians. Sorry guys, the ball seems to be in our side, AGAIN!
pre 16 godina
Russia to learn veto runs 2 ways. They can insist on anything but there are at least 4 vetos in the other direction.
pre 16 godina
An independent Kosovo is ILLEGAL. We are wittnesing the biggest robbery on this planet.
I don't care what albanians have to say. They are stealing a piece of our land with false claims. The sad part of the story is that ignorant politiciants such as Bush don't have a clue of what has been the past history of kosovo, how these albanians managed to get into our land.
pre 16 godina
It is a win-win for Rusija.
This is some very firm language and I know what is going to come from the Albanians:"It does not matter what Rusija says because independence is around the corner" Sound right? I must say the empire is wriggling first they tried to take it out of the Un where Rusija would not have had a say.Second they had the troika and then they tried to say they were going back to the failed Ahtisaari
plan and Rusija is not having any of it.
pre 16 godina
The statement from Mr. Kharchenko is serious, reasonable and in the line with current international law.
Albanians that lives in Serbian province Kosovo i Metohija should stop to behave like a spoiled child. They have to understand that they live in Serbia, not Albania.
They had more rights than any ethnical minority in the world. They had free education in Albanian language. They had free medical security, their own TV stations. They had even more rights than Serbs by taking in consideration that they used electricity and water free of charge as well as regular driving of non-registered cars (Albanians from Kosovo I Metohija didn’t bother to pay bills and nobody from Yugoslavia forced them to pay). Now you want Serbian land. No way, because Kosovo I Metohija is Serbian scared place. You had reasonable offer in your hands, from Serbian government. You refused, but the offer is still within your reach. This is much more than empty promises of so called “civilised West”. West looks after their interests and when costs of independence overpass benefits, you will loose what you got in this moment of time. My advice to you is to measure three times before you make a cut!
pre 16 godina
Oh my, just like so many commentators suggested the Russians have backed down havn't they ??
Tomorrow they pull out of CFE too!
Now lets recall what we were "informed" last year;
Ceku: Independence in early 2007 - 20 November 2006
http://www.b92.net/eng/news/comments.php?nav_id=38102
"PM Ceku is going to Russia and Serb politicians are unable to sway Russians otherwise. I wonder what Russians would tell PM in close door meetings, and what would they say to Serbia and in public. Mark my word that the coin has two sides and that is what you will hear."
(Ahmet Isufi, 29 November 2006, 12:57)
http://www.b92.net/eng/news/comments.php?nav_id=38279
"Recent deal to let Russia join the WTO is the message many Serbs failed to recognize. That Russia has been brought on board the Kosova Independence speeding bullet train. Excellent mentors, those democratic Americans."
(James, 12 November 2006, 00:09)
http://www.b92.net/eng/news/comments.php?nav_id=37907
Where is Ceku ? It's over a year after speaking to the Russians and giving the false impression to these dreaming commentators that the Russians had backed down last year - why can't he do the decent thing and tell them to accept the state they are in and start woring on forging reconcilation and trust for all in Serbia irrespective of ethnicity ? Come Ceku is it not about time you came clean on what you were informed last year by the Russians ?
What is clear is very few in Serbia's province believe in Uncle Sam's false promise given the small gathering in Pristina yesterday!
Moreover, that supposed illegal 'novel' approach by a "few" EU states clearly did not bring a unified position - and they have had their 120 days they suggested they needed. Reality is that if there was ever to have been an acceptance of US foreign policy over EU it would have happened on the 10th June 1999 when the US, UK and France formulated, agreed and signed 1244 "re-affirming" Serbia's soverignity over all its territory!
Uncle Sam can be heard saying;
Oh what a tangled web I weave when I falsely promise and deceive......hehehe!!!
pre 16 godina
rightly so sir! the US decisions without UN approval such as the NATO bombing in Serbia and IRAQ invasion should not be repeated. why dont the US focus on war torn countries like SOMALIA and BURMA which definitely needs humanitarian help. is it because there is no US interest in those places? no oil? not a strategic military place? you could not even compare the standard of living of Kosovars with the Somalis and Burmese the latters being in dire living conditions.
pre 16 godina
Pristina must be getting this sinking feeling about now.
pre 16 godina
Oh my, just like so many commentators suggested the Russians have backed down havn't they ??
Tomorrow they pull out of CFE too!
Now lets recall what we were "informed" last year;
Ceku: Independence in early 2007 - 20 November 2006
http://www.b92.net/eng/news/comments.php?nav_id=38102
"PM Ceku is going to Russia and Serb politicians are unable to sway Russians otherwise. I wonder what Russians would tell PM in close door meetings, and what would they say to Serbia and in public. Mark my word that the coin has two sides and that is what you will hear."
(Ahmet Isufi, 29 November 2006, 12:57)
http://www.b92.net/eng/news/comments.php?nav_id=38279
"Recent deal to let Russia join the WTO is the message many Serbs failed to recognize. That Russia has been brought on board the Kosova Independence speeding bullet train. Excellent mentors, those democratic Americans."
(James, 12 November 2006, 00:09)
http://www.b92.net/eng/news/comments.php?nav_id=37907
Where is Ceku ? It's over a year after speaking to the Russians and giving the false impression to these dreaming commentators that the Russians had backed down last year - why can't he do the decent thing and tell them to accept the state they are in and start woring on forging reconcilation and trust for all in Serbia irrespective of ethnicity ? Come Ceku is it not about time you came clean on what you were informed last year by the Russians ?
What is clear is very few in Serbia's province believe in Uncle Sam's false promise given the small gathering in Pristina yesterday!
Moreover, that supposed illegal 'novel' approach by a "few" EU states clearly did not bring a unified position - and they have had their 120 days they suggested they needed. Reality is that if there was ever to have been an acceptance of US foreign policy over EU it would have happened on the 10th June 1999 when the US, UK and France formulated, agreed and signed 1244 "re-affirming" Serbia's soverignity over all its territory!
Uncle Sam can be heard saying;
Oh what a tangled web I weave when I falsely promise and deceive......hehehe!!!
pre 16 godina
Beautifuly said Mr. Kharchenko. He makes sense, he is logical, and he is honest. Spoken like a true diplomat. He has put all those others, such as Solana, Miliband, Rice, and Kouchner, to shame. He has shown them what a true diplomat is.
pre 16 godina
The statement from Mr. Kharchenko is serious, reasonable and in the line with current international law.
Albanians that lives in Serbian province Kosovo i Metohija should stop to behave like a spoiled child. They have to understand that they live in Serbia, not Albania.
They had more rights than any ethnical minority in the world. They had free education in Albanian language. They had free medical security, their own TV stations. They had even more rights than Serbs by taking in consideration that they used electricity and water free of charge as well as regular driving of non-registered cars (Albanians from Kosovo I Metohija didn’t bother to pay bills and nobody from Yugoslavia forced them to pay). Now you want Serbian land. No way, because Kosovo I Metohija is Serbian scared place. You had reasonable offer in your hands, from Serbian government. You refused, but the offer is still within your reach. This is much more than empty promises of so called “civilised West”. West looks after their interests and when costs of independence overpass benefits, you will loose what you got in this moment of time. My advice to you is to measure three times before you make a cut!
pre 16 godina
Like Dragan has mentioned in his post. This is a true diplomat. Unlike the americans who only know how to give orders and blackmail countries.
In the UN albright used to walk around to different tables where countries' representatives sat; and she would say to them, "would you like to have Serbia as a friend or america?"
pre 16 godina
An independent Kosovo is ILLEGAL. We are wittnesing the biggest robbery on this planet.
I don't care what albanians have to say. They are stealing a piece of our land with false claims. The sad part of the story is that ignorant politiciants such as Bush don't have a clue of what has been the past history of kosovo, how these albanians managed to get into our land.
pre 16 godina
Pristina must be getting this sinking feeling about now.
pre 16 godina
It is a win-win for Rusija.
This is some very firm language and I know what is going to come from the Albanians:"It does not matter what Rusija says because independence is around the corner" Sound right? I must say the empire is wriggling first they tried to take it out of the Un where Rusija would not have had a say.Second they had the troika and then they tried to say they were going back to the failed Ahtisaari
plan and Rusija is not having any of it.
pre 16 godina
Miri,
"So is Trandniestr, with its own army an parlament, but no one has recognizied it either. So what precedence are we talking about?"
- the one where the US and a "few" EU states start the dominoes falling and can not stop what they begun - why do you think none of theose you mention have not been recognised? Could it be everyone wanted to respect UN resolutions and international norms and laws. When US start breaking them then there is no longer any credibility an dthe precedent will be set so expect a huge numebr of destabilsing declarations as the dominoes fall one after the other following this US flagarnt disregard for international law!
pre 16 godina
rightly so sir! the US decisions without UN approval such as the NATO bombing in Serbia and IRAQ invasion should not be repeated. why dont the US focus on war torn countries like SOMALIA and BURMA which definitely needs humanitarian help. is it because there is no US interest in those places? no oil? not a strategic military place? you could not even compare the standard of living of Kosovars with the Somalis and Burmese the latters being in dire living conditions.
pre 16 godina
And what is Russia is going to do about UDI? Nothing, not troops in the ground, politically and diplomatically isolated, with a dictatorial regime on the rise. Russia's only card is UNSC, but no one is interested to play that card anymore. And for those that think Russian oil will change the situation, they can compare the EU stance now and before 4 months. Russians can keep it their card for another time. And as South Ossetia, Abkhazia, Transdniestr...etc. who is preventing them to declare their independence? This is not about declaration, this is about recognition. North Cyprus has already declared its independence since 1983 but no one, except Turkey, has recognized it? So is Trandniestr, with its own army an parlament, but no one has recognizied it either. So what precedence are we talking about?
pre 16 godina
miri,
I dare to say that you know nothing about Russia. Please inform your self more on Russia nowadays its diplomatic relations, economical growth, and so on. It is nonsence to speak of Russia being isolated without any economy, that is trully funny and makes you look....(add the word yourself). I know that many of you are not happy with this fact but it is a fact.
Btw,Russia presented to Serbian government its project on gaspipline. Apperantly the South torrent (or what ever they call it)will go through Serbia. Now, that is truely good investment for both countries.
pre 16 godina
bmrusila, south stream is a lifeline for Germany, not for Serbia.
Frau Merkel will have to choose - to support terrorist takeover of Kosovo or to have safe intake of gas for Germany, something Americans try to prevent.
Shirt is closer than the vest. No matter what Germans feel for their former Hitler's ally, guess what they will choose?
Germany has a poker face and plays wisely, let fools in EU do the talking. With German behind the scenes support, small EU countries in EU inexplicably have "teeth" and slowly, EU support to Kosovo terrorists crumbles. Yesterday, it was "only one country", today One country plus Romania, when the vote comes, it will be only American lapdogs within EU.
The problem Serbia has is a hostile population of some 1.5 m. It will change with time. Albanians will have to decide - to live like normal people or to continue to daydream.
They daydream is a nightmare for civilized Europe.
pre 16 godina
Please all Albanian posters, since were all speaking English here I suggest that you follow your prime minister Ceku when speaking English. Use the English word Kosovo, not the Albanian word Kosova when describing the region we are talking about in English. Otherwise it will be a lot more complicated if using regional languages when talking in English. For example refering to Greece as Hellas, Serbia as Srbija, Germany as Deutschland
pre 16 godina
"serb camp is singing still the song:
who dares say it that serbia is small, well it is small now" according to BBC
but now the song is:
who dares say it that kosova is gone" well it'seems is gone according to us
(doni, 11 December 2007 21:29)”
B92, this smells of trolling-nothing else.
Doni, don’t worry, even rump serbia is still bigger than all of the former yugoslav republics, but when did size matter anyway?
pre 16 godina
As far as Kosova's independence goes Russia is little more than a paper tiger. It was actually Serbia's greatest mistake to place its hopes solely on Russia because it was certain to antagonize the West, as it did.
As an Albanian I feel we owe Russia a big debt of gratitude for doing our job for us. I mean just look at the EU and how Russia managed to make them all, minus Cyprus, support independence. I wonder if we Albanians could have ever done that as effectively as the Russians did. And the recent declarations by the EU on 26 of its members accepting the independence of Kosova was as big a "in your face" to Russia as such things come. That ought to show you guys how much Russia counts in this issue.
Kosova is gone and the only thing that remains to be solved now is the North, but not independence.
And guys: A diplomat's duty is to get results for his country and not to please its adversaries. So as far as diplomats go this Russian guy is a diplomat who has just failed. Miserably.
pre 16 godina
Well Princip, don't just scan the comments try to understand a little from what you read.
My point was that there have already been declaration of independence and nothing drastic has happened? Why? Because no-one cares.
BUT is seems that this stance is different for Kosova, and therein lies another flavor of its uniqueness.
EU wants an independent Kosovak and that matters a lot!!
pre 16 godina
"Kosova is an European problem. An European decision inside Europe is legal. Russian interference in Europe's business is illegal. Serbia itself can go as far East as possible, as soon as possible. It has never belonged to Europe, ever. So, let Serbia be an Asian problem and Asian nations decide about its fate. How does that sound to you? I know it sounds great to me."
American business in Europe is also illegal, but for some reason the Europeans accept that without making noise any noise. Kosovo (and its Kosovo Albanian inhabitants) should maybe move South East so they can join Turkey or Iran (that is where they belong). If the Serbs should move eastwards then you should also mention the Croats, Bulgarians, Hungarians (descendents of the Mongols (same as the Fins) if you understand languages) but you seem to forget that. It seems that you look down to Asian people (no surprise considering the longing to a pure country), but you will be sorry when you realize that the Russians (also true Europeans like the Serbs) and the Chinese will be able to block your fantasy dream for independence. Maybe the US and NATO should bomb Moscow and Beijing to make them change their minds! I hope this reasonable explanation will prevent you from making future comments.
pre 16 godina
Peter, Clean Cut's comment seems to be that as Slavs, the Serbs originate from Russia, which in his opinion is an Asian country. Other Albanian posters have expressed similar views, that Slavs are newcomers to Europe and that they would like for 'real' Europeans to kick them out.
One Albanian poster even lamented for the good times of 1941 when the Nazis created a greater albania,in a recent post.
The Serbs will never agree to gift their territory to assist the creation of a Nazi inspired entity.
pre 16 godina
Rade
Clean Cut obviously doesn't know that Slavs originate from Western Ukraine/Eastern Poland, we just colonized lands eastward. We have been in Europe for thousands of years, and they know it. They just try to provoke us. Nobody will kick us out, we are too strong for anyone.
Don't worry about the Nazis and the Greater Albania thing, without the Nazis they would not have achieved a thing. They even went on to betray the Nazis when the Soviets were winning. Albanian military history is known for its swinging of alliances to suit their political agenda.
Now their best friend is the US, next it will be India.
pre 16 godina
Well... If I were a serbian i wouldn't hold all my hopes on Russia. They're playing the 'big guy' here, and i don't blame them (I have to face it, their economy is getting strong lately, esp after the war in Iraq) but every time I hear a Russian diplomat making these kind of statements, i remember june 99. First KFOR forces entered Gracanica, and Kosovo serbs were so excited that even started talking n russian. I have to admit, HILARIOUS. Praising Russians as their savoiours, cursing Albanians, burning their flag as well as the american one... It was nice to see the serbian populace happy and all 'slavic' that day. But i wonder how did they feel after a week or two when they had to leave their houses and there was no Russian KFOR to make them feel more secured? Poor guys. Moreover, how did they feel that Russia forgot to mention any international law back in March 1999, when US unilaterally decided to start the bombing campaign against serbia, without the concent of UNSC, and Russia wasn't anywhere in the horizon? Betrayed, right? Twice in a year! I would. I wish all Kosovo serbs had better chances in Kosovo, but I really don't see it so far. It will take quite long since they would feel more secured in their homes (those who didn't sell them with astronomic prices, of course!). The reality is harsh for both sides, we shall all admit this. We both suffered enough. But we're both depended on Intl community decision. Neither of us is capable of setting a common agreement. But ANY UNSC decision would drop the 1244, and that would open a new opportunity for Kosovo albanians. Sorry guys, the ball seems to be in our side, AGAIN!
pre 16 godina
Other words he is saying "if you dont abide by our vision for Kosova/o and Serbia, we will help them destabilize the region:.
Which is in Russia's interest. It is in their interest to have a divided Europe, therefore a vulnerable US.
The cold war politics. Nobody pays attention to that any more, so passe.
Serbian and Russian politicians are living the past.
Different picture in NY yesterday, by UN. Thousands of Albanians demonstrating.
That might have made Kharchenko feel like "right at home", huh?
The guest speaker was Richard Holbrooke, next US Sec. of State.
Things are looking pretty good so far.
pre 16 godina
Russia to learn veto runs 2 ways. They can insist on anything but there are at least 4 vetos in the other direction.
pre 16 godina
"serb camp is singing still the song:
who dares say it that serbia is small, well it is small now" according to BBC
but now the song is:
who dares say it that kosova is gone" well it'seems is gone according to us
pre 16 godina
Kosova is an European problem. An European decision inside Europe is legal. Russian interference in Europe's business is illegal. Serbia itself can go as far East as possible, as soon as possible. It has never belonged to Europe, ever. So, let Serbia be an Asian problem and Asian nations decide about its fate. How does that sound to you? I know it sounds great to me.
pre 16 godina
"As far as Kosova's independence goes Russia is little more than a paper tiger. It was actually Serbia's greatest mistake to place its hopes solely on Russia because it was certain to antagonize the West, as it did.
As an Albanian I feel we owe Russia a big debt of gratitude for doing our job for us. I mean just look at the EU and how Russia managed to make them all, minus Cyprus, support independence. I wonder if we Albanians could have ever done that as effectively as the Russians did. And the recent declarations by the EU on 26 of its members accepting the independence of Kosova was as big a "in your face" to Russia as such things come. That ought to show you guys how much Russia counts in this issue.
Kosova is gone and the only thing that remains to be solved now is the North, but not independence.
And guys: A diplomat's duty is to get results for his country and not to please its adversaries. So as far as diplomats go this Russian guy is a diplomat who has just failed. Miserably.
(teni, 11 December 2007 17:18)"
teni,
this "paper tiger" (your words) can prevent Kosovo from entering the UN forever. No UN means no WHO, IMF, large scale foreign investments ..... need I say more??? You will become permanently dependent on the West for charity -- no different from Darfur or Somalia.
I think you also need to be more updated about that blustering Luxembourg minister's claim that all EU except Cyprus support Kosovo independence. This is far from the truth --read the other reports on B92 today -- the lastest was that Romania is in no hurry to recognize Kosovo's breakaway. And countries like Greece, Spain, Slovakia, Hungary have all asked the EU to consider Serbia's views and their own preference for a negotiated settlement. For example read http://www.serbianna.com/news/2007/03060.shtml and http://www.serbianna.com/news/2007/03061.shtml
My point is this: don't count your chickens before they are hatched.
pre 16 godina
Clean Cut, the Serbs have always been a European people. The Albanians on the other hand, originate from Caucasian Albania, smack dab in the middle of Asia. So much for the Illiryian myth.
How would you like it if we told you to 'go backto Asia'?
pre 16 godina
Clean Cut
I am not sure if I understood correctly, but you claim that Serbia has never belonged in Europe???
pre 16 godina
Kosovo has been part of Serbia for 700 years!! The Basc People are the OLDEST EUROPEANS in the continent..they have been living in which TODAY is called "Spain" for ...75.000 years.. have their own UNIQUE language.. even diferent blood groups .. My question is Don´t they have 74.300 reasons MORE then the Kosovan Albanians to declare INDEPENDANCE fron SPAIN??
Ernst - Germany
pre 16 godina
Other words he is saying "if you dont abide by our vision for Kosova/o and Serbia, we will help them destabilize the region:.
Which is in Russia's interest. It is in their interest to have a divided Europe, therefore a vulnerable US.
The cold war politics. Nobody pays attention to that any more, so passe.
Serbian and Russian politicians are living the past.
Different picture in NY yesterday, by UN. Thousands of Albanians demonstrating.
That might have made Kharchenko feel like "right at home", huh?
The guest speaker was Richard Holbrooke, next US Sec. of State.
Things are looking pretty good so far.
pre 16 godina
Well... If I were a serbian i wouldn't hold all my hopes on Russia. They're playing the 'big guy' here, and i don't blame them (I have to face it, their economy is getting strong lately, esp after the war in Iraq) but every time I hear a Russian diplomat making these kind of statements, i remember june 99. First KFOR forces entered Gracanica, and Kosovo serbs were so excited that even started talking n russian. I have to admit, HILARIOUS. Praising Russians as their savoiours, cursing Albanians, burning their flag as well as the american one... It was nice to see the serbian populace happy and all 'slavic' that day. But i wonder how did they feel after a week or two when they had to leave their houses and there was no Russian KFOR to make them feel more secured? Poor guys. Moreover, how did they feel that Russia forgot to mention any international law back in March 1999, when US unilaterally decided to start the bombing campaign against serbia, without the concent of UNSC, and Russia wasn't anywhere in the horizon? Betrayed, right? Twice in a year! I would. I wish all Kosovo serbs had better chances in Kosovo, but I really don't see it so far. It will take quite long since they would feel more secured in their homes (those who didn't sell them with astronomic prices, of course!). The reality is harsh for both sides, we shall all admit this. We both suffered enough. But we're both depended on Intl community decision. Neither of us is capable of setting a common agreement. But ANY UNSC decision would drop the 1244, and that would open a new opportunity for Kosovo albanians. Sorry guys, the ball seems to be in our side, AGAIN!
pre 16 godina
And what is Russia is going to do about UDI? Nothing, not troops in the ground, politically and diplomatically isolated, with a dictatorial regime on the rise. Russia's only card is UNSC, but no one is interested to play that card anymore. And for those that think Russian oil will change the situation, they can compare the EU stance now and before 4 months. Russians can keep it their card for another time. And as South Ossetia, Abkhazia, Transdniestr...etc. who is preventing them to declare their independence? This is not about declaration, this is about recognition. North Cyprus has already declared its independence since 1983 but no one, except Turkey, has recognized it? So is Trandniestr, with its own army an parlament, but no one has recognizied it either. So what precedence are we talking about?
pre 16 godina
Kosova is an European problem. An European decision inside Europe is legal. Russian interference in Europe's business is illegal. Serbia itself can go as far East as possible, as soon as possible. It has never belonged to Europe, ever. So, let Serbia be an Asian problem and Asian nations decide about its fate. How does that sound to you? I know it sounds great to me.
pre 16 godina
Oh my, just like so many commentators suggested the Russians have backed down havn't they ??
Tomorrow they pull out of CFE too!
Now lets recall what we were "informed" last year;
Ceku: Independence in early 2007 - 20 November 2006
http://www.b92.net/eng/news/comments.php?nav_id=38102
"PM Ceku is going to Russia and Serb politicians are unable to sway Russians otherwise. I wonder what Russians would tell PM in close door meetings, and what would they say to Serbia and in public. Mark my word that the coin has two sides and that is what you will hear."
(Ahmet Isufi, 29 November 2006, 12:57)
http://www.b92.net/eng/news/comments.php?nav_id=38279
"Recent deal to let Russia join the WTO is the message many Serbs failed to recognize. That Russia has been brought on board the Kosova Independence speeding bullet train. Excellent mentors, those democratic Americans."
(James, 12 November 2006, 00:09)
http://www.b92.net/eng/news/comments.php?nav_id=37907
Where is Ceku ? It's over a year after speaking to the Russians and giving the false impression to these dreaming commentators that the Russians had backed down last year - why can't he do the decent thing and tell them to accept the state they are in and start woring on forging reconcilation and trust for all in Serbia irrespective of ethnicity ? Come Ceku is it not about time you came clean on what you were informed last year by the Russians ?
What is clear is very few in Serbia's province believe in Uncle Sam's false promise given the small gathering in Pristina yesterday!
Moreover, that supposed illegal 'novel' approach by a "few" EU states clearly did not bring a unified position - and they have had their 120 days they suggested they needed. Reality is that if there was ever to have been an acceptance of US foreign policy over EU it would have happened on the 10th June 1999 when the US, UK and France formulated, agreed and signed 1244 "re-affirming" Serbia's soverignity over all its territory!
Uncle Sam can be heard saying;
Oh what a tangled web I weave when I falsely promise and deceive......hehehe!!!
pre 16 godina
Rade
Clean Cut obviously doesn't know that Slavs originate from Western Ukraine/Eastern Poland, we just colonized lands eastward. We have been in Europe for thousands of years, and they know it. They just try to provoke us. Nobody will kick us out, we are too strong for anyone.
Don't worry about the Nazis and the Greater Albania thing, without the Nazis they would not have achieved a thing. They even went on to betray the Nazis when the Soviets were winning. Albanian military history is known for its swinging of alliances to suit their political agenda.
Now their best friend is the US, next it will be India.
pre 16 godina
The statement from Mr. Kharchenko is serious, reasonable and in the line with current international law.
Albanians that lives in Serbian province Kosovo i Metohija should stop to behave like a spoiled child. They have to understand that they live in Serbia, not Albania.
They had more rights than any ethnical minority in the world. They had free education in Albanian language. They had free medical security, their own TV stations. They had even more rights than Serbs by taking in consideration that they used electricity and water free of charge as well as regular driving of non-registered cars (Albanians from Kosovo I Metohija didn’t bother to pay bills and nobody from Yugoslavia forced them to pay). Now you want Serbian land. No way, because Kosovo I Metohija is Serbian scared place. You had reasonable offer in your hands, from Serbian government. You refused, but the offer is still within your reach. This is much more than empty promises of so called “civilised West”. West looks after their interests and when costs of independence overpass benefits, you will loose what you got in this moment of time. My advice to you is to measure three times before you make a cut!
pre 16 godina
Russia to learn veto runs 2 ways. They can insist on anything but there are at least 4 vetos in the other direction.
pre 16 godina
An independent Kosovo is ILLEGAL. We are wittnesing the biggest robbery on this planet.
I don't care what albanians have to say. They are stealing a piece of our land with false claims. The sad part of the story is that ignorant politiciants such as Bush don't have a clue of what has been the past history of kosovo, how these albanians managed to get into our land.
pre 16 godina
Beautifuly said Mr. Kharchenko. He makes sense, he is logical, and he is honest. Spoken like a true diplomat. He has put all those others, such as Solana, Miliband, Rice, and Kouchner, to shame. He has shown them what a true diplomat is.
pre 16 godina
As far as Kosova's independence goes Russia is little more than a paper tiger. It was actually Serbia's greatest mistake to place its hopes solely on Russia because it was certain to antagonize the West, as it did.
As an Albanian I feel we owe Russia a big debt of gratitude for doing our job for us. I mean just look at the EU and how Russia managed to make them all, minus Cyprus, support independence. I wonder if we Albanians could have ever done that as effectively as the Russians did. And the recent declarations by the EU on 26 of its members accepting the independence of Kosova was as big a "in your face" to Russia as such things come. That ought to show you guys how much Russia counts in this issue.
Kosova is gone and the only thing that remains to be solved now is the North, but not independence.
And guys: A diplomat's duty is to get results for his country and not to please its adversaries. So as far as diplomats go this Russian guy is a diplomat who has just failed. Miserably.
pre 16 godina
rightly so sir! the US decisions without UN approval such as the NATO bombing in Serbia and IRAQ invasion should not be repeated. why dont the US focus on war torn countries like SOMALIA and BURMA which definitely needs humanitarian help. is it because there is no US interest in those places? no oil? not a strategic military place? you could not even compare the standard of living of Kosovars with the Somalis and Burmese the latters being in dire living conditions.
pre 16 godina
Pristina must be getting this sinking feeling about now.
pre 16 godina
It is a win-win for Rusija.
This is some very firm language and I know what is going to come from the Albanians:"It does not matter what Rusija says because independence is around the corner" Sound right? I must say the empire is wriggling first they tried to take it out of the Un where Rusija would not have had a say.Second they had the troika and then they tried to say they were going back to the failed Ahtisaari
plan and Rusija is not having any of it.
pre 16 godina
Like Dragan has mentioned in his post. This is a true diplomat. Unlike the americans who only know how to give orders and blackmail countries.
In the UN albright used to walk around to different tables where countries' representatives sat; and she would say to them, "would you like to have Serbia as a friend or america?"
pre 16 godina
Miri,
"So is Trandniestr, with its own army an parlament, but no one has recognizied it either. So what precedence are we talking about?"
- the one where the US and a "few" EU states start the dominoes falling and can not stop what they begun - why do you think none of theose you mention have not been recognised? Could it be everyone wanted to respect UN resolutions and international norms and laws. When US start breaking them then there is no longer any credibility an dthe precedent will be set so expect a huge numebr of destabilsing declarations as the dominoes fall one after the other following this US flagarnt disregard for international law!
pre 16 godina
miri,
I dare to say that you know nothing about Russia. Please inform your self more on Russia nowadays its diplomatic relations, economical growth, and so on. It is nonsence to speak of Russia being isolated without any economy, that is trully funny and makes you look....(add the word yourself). I know that many of you are not happy with this fact but it is a fact.
Btw,Russia presented to Serbian government its project on gaspipline. Apperantly the South torrent (or what ever they call it)will go through Serbia. Now, that is truely good investment for both countries.
pre 16 godina
bmrusila, south stream is a lifeline for Germany, not for Serbia.
Frau Merkel will have to choose - to support terrorist takeover of Kosovo or to have safe intake of gas for Germany, something Americans try to prevent.
Shirt is closer than the vest. No matter what Germans feel for their former Hitler's ally, guess what they will choose?
Germany has a poker face and plays wisely, let fools in EU do the talking. With German behind the scenes support, small EU countries in EU inexplicably have "teeth" and slowly, EU support to Kosovo terrorists crumbles. Yesterday, it was "only one country", today One country plus Romania, when the vote comes, it will be only American lapdogs within EU.
The problem Serbia has is a hostile population of some 1.5 m. It will change with time. Albanians will have to decide - to live like normal people or to continue to daydream.
They daydream is a nightmare for civilized Europe.
pre 16 godina
Please all Albanian posters, since were all speaking English here I suggest that you follow your prime minister Ceku when speaking English. Use the English word Kosovo, not the Albanian word Kosova when describing the region we are talking about in English. Otherwise it will be a lot more complicated if using regional languages when talking in English. For example refering to Greece as Hellas, Serbia as Srbija, Germany as Deutschland
pre 16 godina
Well Princip, don't just scan the comments try to understand a little from what you read.
My point was that there have already been declaration of independence and nothing drastic has happened? Why? Because no-one cares.
BUT is seems that this stance is different for Kosova, and therein lies another flavor of its uniqueness.
EU wants an independent Kosovak and that matters a lot!!
pre 16 godina
"serb camp is singing still the song:
who dares say it that serbia is small, well it is small now" according to BBC
but now the song is:
who dares say it that kosova is gone" well it'seems is gone according to us
(doni, 11 December 2007 21:29)”
B92, this smells of trolling-nothing else.
Doni, don’t worry, even rump serbia is still bigger than all of the former yugoslav republics, but when did size matter anyway?
pre 16 godina
"Kosova is an European problem. An European decision inside Europe is legal. Russian interference in Europe's business is illegal. Serbia itself can go as far East as possible, as soon as possible. It has never belonged to Europe, ever. So, let Serbia be an Asian problem and Asian nations decide about its fate. How does that sound to you? I know it sounds great to me."
American business in Europe is also illegal, but for some reason the Europeans accept that without making noise any noise. Kosovo (and its Kosovo Albanian inhabitants) should maybe move South East so they can join Turkey or Iran (that is where they belong). If the Serbs should move eastwards then you should also mention the Croats, Bulgarians, Hungarians (descendents of the Mongols (same as the Fins) if you understand languages) but you seem to forget that. It seems that you look down to Asian people (no surprise considering the longing to a pure country), but you will be sorry when you realize that the Russians (also true Europeans like the Serbs) and the Chinese will be able to block your fantasy dream for independence. Maybe the US and NATO should bomb Moscow and Beijing to make them change their minds! I hope this reasonable explanation will prevent you from making future comments.
pre 16 godina
"As far as Kosova's independence goes Russia is little more than a paper tiger. It was actually Serbia's greatest mistake to place its hopes solely on Russia because it was certain to antagonize the West, as it did.
As an Albanian I feel we owe Russia a big debt of gratitude for doing our job for us. I mean just look at the EU and how Russia managed to make them all, minus Cyprus, support independence. I wonder if we Albanians could have ever done that as effectively as the Russians did. And the recent declarations by the EU on 26 of its members accepting the independence of Kosova was as big a "in your face" to Russia as such things come. That ought to show you guys how much Russia counts in this issue.
Kosova is gone and the only thing that remains to be solved now is the North, but not independence.
And guys: A diplomat's duty is to get results for his country and not to please its adversaries. So as far as diplomats go this Russian guy is a diplomat who has just failed. Miserably.
(teni, 11 December 2007 17:18)"
teni,
this "paper tiger" (your words) can prevent Kosovo from entering the UN forever. No UN means no WHO, IMF, large scale foreign investments ..... need I say more??? You will become permanently dependent on the West for charity -- no different from Darfur or Somalia.
I think you also need to be more updated about that blustering Luxembourg minister's claim that all EU except Cyprus support Kosovo independence. This is far from the truth --read the other reports on B92 today -- the lastest was that Romania is in no hurry to recognize Kosovo's breakaway. And countries like Greece, Spain, Slovakia, Hungary have all asked the EU to consider Serbia's views and their own preference for a negotiated settlement. For example read http://www.serbianna.com/news/2007/03060.shtml and http://www.serbianna.com/news/2007/03061.shtml
My point is this: don't count your chickens before they are hatched.
pre 16 godina
Clean Cut, the Serbs have always been a European people. The Albanians on the other hand, originate from Caucasian Albania, smack dab in the middle of Asia. So much for the Illiryian myth.
How would you like it if we told you to 'go backto Asia'?
pre 16 godina
Clean Cut
I am not sure if I understood correctly, but you claim that Serbia has never belonged in Europe???
pre 16 godina
Peter, Clean Cut's comment seems to be that as Slavs, the Serbs originate from Russia, which in his opinion is an Asian country. Other Albanian posters have expressed similar views, that Slavs are newcomers to Europe and that they would like for 'real' Europeans to kick them out.
One Albanian poster even lamented for the good times of 1941 when the Nazis created a greater albania,in a recent post.
The Serbs will never agree to gift their territory to assist the creation of a Nazi inspired entity.
pre 16 godina
"serb camp is singing still the song:
who dares say it that serbia is small, well it is small now" according to BBC
but now the song is:
who dares say it that kosova is gone" well it'seems is gone according to us
pre 16 godina
Kosovo has been part of Serbia for 700 years!! The Basc People are the OLDEST EUROPEANS in the continent..they have been living in which TODAY is called "Spain" for ...75.000 years.. have their own UNIQUE language.. even diferent blood groups .. My question is Don´t they have 74.300 reasons MORE then the Kosovan Albanians to declare INDEPENDANCE fron SPAIN??
Ernst - Germany
28 Komentari
Sortiraj po: