26

Friday, 09.11.2007.

10:28

German foreign minister believes in compromise

Frank-Walter Steinmeier says a negotiated solution for Kosovo’s status is still a possibility.

Izvor: Beta

German foreign minister believes in compromise IMAGE SOURCE
IMAGE DESCRIPTION

26 Komentari

Sortiraj po:

peg

pre 16 godina

Johny, let's get one thing straight here. Most of the Serbian population had already been expelled from Kosovo under the watchful eye of NATO.
Read a book titled "The new rulers of the world", by John Pilger and see what he writes about this.
Sure some of the remaining Serbs would've left as well but most were already out.
So please stop with this nonesense of Serbs ethnically cleansing Albanians. This is typical CNN propaganda that won you some sympathy initially, but the world is waking up to this lie.
Gregory Clark, Noam Chomsky, Gen L. McKenzie all have a different point of view.
These are all well informed and intelligent men who don't agree with your verison.

johny

pre 16 godina

Peggy said: "You see, it was only AFTER NATO bombing that the exodus began."

Peggy did you live in your bunker all the time when the bombing was taking place. I can't find any other way to explain your naivety and irresponsible comment.

Can you explain to me why according to you only Albanians left Kosova/o from the bombs and not Serbs of Kosova/o. Are you saying that Serbs are so brave they have the guts to stay in Kosova/o while bombs fall in their backyards and houses while Albanians couldn't stand that and decided in a very organized way to just leave. That would make the Serbs of Kosova/a either very brave or very stupid.
Since the Serbs of Kosova decided to stay while the bombs where falling on their heads can you tell me how many thousand Serbs from Kosova where killed from the NATO bombing?
Are you suggesting that NATO made some new bombs that targeted only inhabitants of Albanian ethnicity, and not those of Serb ethnicity, and that is why only Albanians left Kosova/o.
Are you suggesting that the real target of NATO was the Albanian populated areas and that they wanted the Albanians of Kosova/o to leave Kosova/o.
If that is true than what was the point of bombing Serbia.
Can you tell me how many thousand Serbs fled Serbia because NATO was bombing Serbia? Can you tell me how many Serbs were part of the Serbian exodus after NATO bombs were dropped in Serbia.
If such an exodus after NATO bombed Serbia did not occur, then can you explain to me why would such an exodus happen only with Albanians.

doni

pre 16 godina

so now the serb camp is accepting that;
"If Germany was going to recognise you they would have announced it like US France and England. But they didnt.
(Cvele, 10. November 2007 01:26)"

US, France(old serb ally) and England(UK), hahahaha look at him, he still hopes, he hopes for Germany and ally of Albania, or Italy to not recognize Kosova, what a dream.
but anyway, even Poland will recognize Kosovo, because of mother russia, believe it or not

Clean Cut

pre 16 godina

Kosova is de facto independent since 8 years. It will be de jure independent in a few weeks and everyone will be happy that this story ended.

Germany has been a promotor of independence for Kosova since 1941, but some of you don't recall those days. Lets see what Oily Bear will do about it.

Peggy

pre 16 godina

EA the predictor.
You claim that Kosovo will become independent because of the ethnic cleansing. Did you mean the ethnic cleaning done by the Albanians? Many Serbs have been expelled from Kosovo and that is ethnic cleansing.

If you are talking about Albanians being ethnically cleansed, well for that you have to blame NATO. You see, it was only AFTER NATO bombing that the exodus began.

So obviously you are very proud of the way you ethnically cleansed Kosovo of Serbs and other non Albanian population and now wish to get your reward of the form of your own country.

I am afraid it is you who will not be rewarded for ethnic cleansing. Don't think that the truth isn't finally coming out. Don't think that it is not known how k
K-Albanians want their great Albania. You talk of great Serbia. Serbia is only holding onto what is theirs and not trying to steal it like the Albanians are.

EA

pre 16 godina

Dragan, Cvele, Jovan and others,

Immoral and unscrupolous is the ethnic cleansing orchastrated by the Serbian State against the Kosovar Albanians. That is why Kosova is becoming fully independent and one more thing. Vojvodina will be part of the Hong Kong plan))

johny

pre 16 godina

This is indeed funiest thing ever posted overhere. Did you actually mean working visa? Or tourist? I suppose you meant working visa since Kosovo is such developed part seeking extra labour.:)
(bmrusila, 9. November 2007 18:27)

You know this ironic comments are very smart and well found especially coming from someone who suggests that Kosova/o is an inseparable part of Serbia, and as such I would expect a person with these views who hold Kosova/o so dear to their heart to not ridicule it. All I see is here is Serbs ridiculing Kosova/o on a daily basis, and yet at the same time the claim Serbia will cease to exist if Kosova/o becomes independent, they claim the world will be in turmoil, they claim Armageddon if their beloved heartland is ripped apart from Serbia's body. Yet the ridicule and make fun of it everyday. Something is clearly wrong here, and what is wrong I believe is the sincerity of the Serbians of how dear Kosova/o is to them. I know for sure I wouldn't dare make fun and ridicule Kosova/o because my relatives have given their lives for it, I would do the same too, because Kosova/o is dear to me.

Jovan

pre 16 godina

in regard to that comment by KS...
about Serbs going to need visa-papers...

right now it´s quite the opposite: many Albanians are travelling to Niš in order to apply for serbian documents...

bmrusila

pre 16 godina

Soon after 10th you'll need a VISA to enter Kosovo, or you can keep posting here for years about how Kosovo is part of Serbia


This is indeed funiest thing ever posted overhere. Did you actually mean working visa? Or tourist? I suppose you meant working visa since Kosovo is such developed part seeking extra labour.:)

Ratko

pre 16 godina

Don't worry Jovan I agree with you 100%.

albanians speak as if KiM is theirs to bargain with.

But they will get a wake up call from their beloved amrican friends, that independence is a failed promise.

Olf

pre 16 godina

I would not like to say a lot before the end of January but I recon that the only feasible solution is Ahtisaari plan. Neither sides liked it but K-Albanians side accepted it, now turn is on Serbian side to accept it.
Lets be realistic, this way the International law( right for Self Determination) will be respected as well as the will of the majority of the population of Kosova.
There might be other scenarios but I don’t think that there are that suitable and acceptable for K-Albanian population. I intentionally mention K-Albanian since they are the ones that would be deciding factor not Serbian politicians, politicians that are not mentioning nor representing anyone except Milosevic, themselves and some of you here.
Polls in Serbia say that only 7% of Serbs believe that Kosova will remain as part of Serbia.
By the way Italy is for implemantion of Ahtisaari plan

AS TIA

pre 16 godina

Kate.
Your words about international law are really touching. You speak about it like you invented it.

Thank you for finally accepting that there will be some kind of independence for Kosova.
You say:
I am sure that there will be some form of partial independence such as the 'Hong Kong' plan, but it is becoming clearer by the day that there will be no outright independence.

Yes Kate there will be supervised independence. Supervised, in order for the minorities in Kosova to be safe specially the Serb minority. We Albanians respect other ethnicities but after what happened in the 90’s in Kosova the West and I mean the West is just scared that suffrage could come back as hatred. That’s why there will be Supervised Independence. And we agree with it just so Serbs in Kosova can feel safe. This is what international law is for. To make people safe at their own homes.

teni

pre 16 godina

Kate the other guiding principle has been a people's right to self-determination. As a Brit you should know because that's how you lost your colonies. And that is exactly what is happening in this case too.
Anyway that's an academic matter and maybe someone can write a good MA or PhD thesis on it, arguing its rights and wrongs, because Kosova will declare its independence and the US and most of the EU - including the UK - are gonna recognize it. Tough luck for the Serbs but to be completely honest we don't really give a damn about it being against international law or whatever because history has shown that international law is not set in stone and it can change depending on the support one gets for doing so. And don't forget that most of the former colonial powers said that the struggles for independence of their colonial subjects were against international law, were being fought by terrorist etc etc etc. Much good it did you.

Lenard

pre 16 godina

Kate! Kate! Kate! you said Europe and other areas would have numerous major problems arising. How started and predetermined these intractable problems by taking arms against there neighbors by murders ,violence ,rape ,destruction ,hate ,ethnic cleansing ,killings which likes and doings have not been seen since world war 2 . The wars that Serbia started hoping to expand at the expense of its neighbors. Now you want the world to see it in Serbias favor your dreaming and also the Serbs. Did Serbia follow the rule of law or take them in to consecration only when it suited or in Serbia favor other wise they were thrown out.Did Serbia rectify or even try to have damage reversed it had done in Bosnia... NO! It is trying to add it to its territory. Until Serbia and the Serbian people face reality. Europe will have numerous major problems arising like you said ,it will only be with Serbia & Srpska like it has now.

miri

pre 16 godina

""Kosovo is part of Serbia, and territorial integrity has been the guiding principle of international law ever since the UN was established."

We all know how much in its heart Serbia had the international law during 90's. It started 4 wars with intent for territorial gains over its neighbor countries. It commited the most horrendous crimes since WW2 in Europe. It still continues to interfere in the politics of sovereign countries for its own shovinistic agenda. Thousands of people dead, displaced, orphans. Hundreds of thousands properties burnt and destroyed because Serbia couldn't control its megalomaniac attitude, the same attitude that is driving its political processes even today. International law is above all about humanity and humanism, something that Serbia and its political class had stepped on with its own two feet for decades.

nikshala

pre 16 godina

"Belgrade is not a guarantor of regional stability. It is the largest source of conflict in the region. In that sense, little has changed since 1992," James Lyon

The sad thing Jovan, is that Belgrade has absolutely no control of Kosovo, at least the albaian parts. and whatever you might think that the future will bring, I am certian one thing that it WON'T bring, and thats any kind of presence of Serbian state in Kosovo. Soon after 10th you'll need a VISA to enter Kosovo, or you can keep posting here for years about how Kosovo is part of Serbia. Whatever floats your boat.

sunny

pre 16 godina

its just a pity all serbs didnt take the moral high ground in respect to international law when thousands were being slautered. international law is to be respected and how does that apply to those who have continually disrespected international law and all norms of modern society and how it deals with its citizens as it once was, you are free to have your ideals of what is right and wrong weather kosovo should or shouldnt be apart of serbia. the reality is that serbia wanted to eliminate a race of people who co existed with the serbs for centuries and that in it self has a price. no return to pre 1999 ( how ever you interpret that) no joining another country and according to the will of the majority of kosovo and not serbia. feel free to fight for what you believe, however it should start with apologies, and sice toppoling milosovic none has been foth comming

Lenard

pre 16 godina

It is a don deal Kosovo will be permanently independent of Serbia. It is time for Serbs to look reality in the face and at them selfs & move on. It is no use of beating a dead donkey.

Dragan

pre 16 godina

“Our vision is for Kosovo to be an independent, modern state, not only for the Albanian majority, but for all minorities, for the Serbian minority as well,” Sejdiu said.
This guy is obviously a comedian. Kosovo is anything but 'modern' and will never be independent. The way albanians treat their minorities is a crime against humanity. Shame on any country that supports their illegal and immoral 'greater albania' plan.

Rade

pre 16 godina

“Our vision is for Kosovo to be an independent, modern state, not only for the Albanian majority, but for all minorities, for the Serbian minority as well,” Sejdiu said, adding that Priština was prepared to work on implementing the status plan proposed by UN envoy Martti Ahtisaari.

The Albanian political leadership missed a golden opportunity to advance their argument for independence by treating the Serbs so abhorrently over the last 8 years.

Add to that their abysmal record on every indicator of good governance and their inability to purge their ranks of war criminals and mafia style dons and it is evident that they are their own worst enemy.

The myopic denial of anything negative associated with Albania and Albanians by pro-Albanian posters here is actually representative of an attitude that is endemic in their society from the top down.

The short of it is, they’ve frittered away any good will they may have had and now it’s just a question of letting the general populace down gently.

Serbia will not agree to voluntarily give away territory and rightly so. And Serbia is much more important to Europe than the discredited political leadership of its breakaway province, so no independence.

Funcakes

pre 16 godina

Good act from Germany I must say, keeping the "integrity of the Troika" intact...but who are we kidding, that trio has done nothing but make holes in the water...and benefit from the money we're paying as taxpayers from the countries that are sponsoring those useless negotiations.

If we all wanna pretend that these talk will end up in a grand agreement however, then sure...we can say everything is successful and a compromise is very likely to be achieved, and flowers will bloom in the middle winter for the first time ever.

It will be so awesome...

Rade

pre 16 godina

Jovan, these provincial 'wannabes' are unictited criminals and incompentent politicians to boot.

The UN and even the EU isn't a flea market, where quick and sleazy deals can be made.

The only arguments they've advanced is that they will not compromise and that they will incite their populace to violence if they don't get their way.

Jovan

pre 16 godina

I am really astonished that this man doesn´t feel ashamed to call the Serbs a minority in their own homeland...

absurd!


yeah, let´s see what they will "coordinate" after december 10th...

I guess it will be the right method to replace the word "independence" without losing face....

international law is not there to be broken by provincial wanna-be "politicians"!

kate

pre 16 godina

So, nothing seems cut and dry. There will be no declaration of independence unless it is coordinated with the EU and US.

I am sure that there will be some form of partial independence such as the 'Hong Kong' plan, but it is becoming clearer by the day that there will be no outright independence.

The stakes within Europe are just too high.

As another poster Allen so rightly said yesterday: "Kosovo is part of Serbia, and territorial integrity has been the guiding principle of international law ever since the UN was established.

"Kosovo's claim to independence is based on the assertion that ethnic self-determination trumps the principle of territorial integrity."

How true that is, and it can never be allowed to happen or Europe and other areas would have numerous major problems arising.

Jovan

pre 16 godina

I am really astonished that this man doesn´t feel ashamed to call the Serbs a minority in their own homeland...

absurd!


yeah, let´s see what they will "coordinate" after december 10th...

I guess it will be the right method to replace the word "independence" without losing face....

international law is not there to be broken by provincial wanna-be "politicians"!

kate

pre 16 godina

So, nothing seems cut and dry. There will be no declaration of independence unless it is coordinated with the EU and US.

I am sure that there will be some form of partial independence such as the 'Hong Kong' plan, but it is becoming clearer by the day that there will be no outright independence.

The stakes within Europe are just too high.

As another poster Allen so rightly said yesterday: "Kosovo is part of Serbia, and territorial integrity has been the guiding principle of international law ever since the UN was established.

"Kosovo's claim to independence is based on the assertion that ethnic self-determination trumps the principle of territorial integrity."

How true that is, and it can never be allowed to happen or Europe and other areas would have numerous major problems arising.

Rade

pre 16 godina

“Our vision is for Kosovo to be an independent, modern state, not only for the Albanian majority, but for all minorities, for the Serbian minority as well,” Sejdiu said, adding that Priština was prepared to work on implementing the status plan proposed by UN envoy Martti Ahtisaari.

The Albanian political leadership missed a golden opportunity to advance their argument for independence by treating the Serbs so abhorrently over the last 8 years.

Add to that their abysmal record on every indicator of good governance and their inability to purge their ranks of war criminals and mafia style dons and it is evident that they are their own worst enemy.

The myopic denial of anything negative associated with Albania and Albanians by pro-Albanian posters here is actually representative of an attitude that is endemic in their society from the top down.

The short of it is, they’ve frittered away any good will they may have had and now it’s just a question of letting the general populace down gently.

Serbia will not agree to voluntarily give away territory and rightly so. And Serbia is much more important to Europe than the discredited political leadership of its breakaway province, so no independence.

Dragan

pre 16 godina

“Our vision is for Kosovo to be an independent, modern state, not only for the Albanian majority, but for all minorities, for the Serbian minority as well,” Sejdiu said.
This guy is obviously a comedian. Kosovo is anything but 'modern' and will never be independent. The way albanians treat their minorities is a crime against humanity. Shame on any country that supports their illegal and immoral 'greater albania' plan.

Rade

pre 16 godina

Jovan, these provincial 'wannabes' are unictited criminals and incompentent politicians to boot.

The UN and even the EU isn't a flea market, where quick and sleazy deals can be made.

The only arguments they've advanced is that they will not compromise and that they will incite their populace to violence if they don't get their way.

Ratko

pre 16 godina

Don't worry Jovan I agree with you 100%.

albanians speak as if KiM is theirs to bargain with.

But they will get a wake up call from their beloved amrican friends, that independence is a failed promise.

bmrusila

pre 16 godina

Soon after 10th you'll need a VISA to enter Kosovo, or you can keep posting here for years about how Kosovo is part of Serbia


This is indeed funiest thing ever posted overhere. Did you actually mean working visa? Or tourist? I suppose you meant working visa since Kosovo is such developed part seeking extra labour.:)

miri

pre 16 godina

""Kosovo is part of Serbia, and territorial integrity has been the guiding principle of international law ever since the UN was established."

We all know how much in its heart Serbia had the international law during 90's. It started 4 wars with intent for territorial gains over its neighbor countries. It commited the most horrendous crimes since WW2 in Europe. It still continues to interfere in the politics of sovereign countries for its own shovinistic agenda. Thousands of people dead, displaced, orphans. Hundreds of thousands properties burnt and destroyed because Serbia couldn't control its megalomaniac attitude, the same attitude that is driving its political processes even today. International law is above all about humanity and humanism, something that Serbia and its political class had stepped on with its own two feet for decades.

Jovan

pre 16 godina

in regard to that comment by KS...
about Serbs going to need visa-papers...

right now it´s quite the opposite: many Albanians are travelling to Niš in order to apply for serbian documents...

Lenard

pre 16 godina

It is a don deal Kosovo will be permanently independent of Serbia. It is time for Serbs to look reality in the face and at them selfs & move on. It is no use of beating a dead donkey.

Lenard

pre 16 godina

Kate! Kate! Kate! you said Europe and other areas would have numerous major problems arising. How started and predetermined these intractable problems by taking arms against there neighbors by murders ,violence ,rape ,destruction ,hate ,ethnic cleansing ,killings which likes and doings have not been seen since world war 2 . The wars that Serbia started hoping to expand at the expense of its neighbors. Now you want the world to see it in Serbias favor your dreaming and also the Serbs. Did Serbia follow the rule of law or take them in to consecration only when it suited or in Serbia favor other wise they were thrown out.Did Serbia rectify or even try to have damage reversed it had done in Bosnia... NO! It is trying to add it to its territory. Until Serbia and the Serbian people face reality. Europe will have numerous major problems arising like you said ,it will only be with Serbia & Srpska like it has now.

Peggy

pre 16 godina

EA the predictor.
You claim that Kosovo will become independent because of the ethnic cleansing. Did you mean the ethnic cleaning done by the Albanians? Many Serbs have been expelled from Kosovo and that is ethnic cleansing.

If you are talking about Albanians being ethnically cleansed, well for that you have to blame NATO. You see, it was only AFTER NATO bombing that the exodus began.

So obviously you are very proud of the way you ethnically cleansed Kosovo of Serbs and other non Albanian population and now wish to get your reward of the form of your own country.

I am afraid it is you who will not be rewarded for ethnic cleansing. Don't think that the truth isn't finally coming out. Don't think that it is not known how k
K-Albanians want their great Albania. You talk of great Serbia. Serbia is only holding onto what is theirs and not trying to steal it like the Albanians are.

sunny

pre 16 godina

its just a pity all serbs didnt take the moral high ground in respect to international law when thousands were being slautered. international law is to be respected and how does that apply to those who have continually disrespected international law and all norms of modern society and how it deals with its citizens as it once was, you are free to have your ideals of what is right and wrong weather kosovo should or shouldnt be apart of serbia. the reality is that serbia wanted to eliminate a race of people who co existed with the serbs for centuries and that in it self has a price. no return to pre 1999 ( how ever you interpret that) no joining another country and according to the will of the majority of kosovo and not serbia. feel free to fight for what you believe, however it should start with apologies, and sice toppoling milosovic none has been foth comming

nikshala

pre 16 godina

"Belgrade is not a guarantor of regional stability. It is the largest source of conflict in the region. In that sense, little has changed since 1992," James Lyon

The sad thing Jovan, is that Belgrade has absolutely no control of Kosovo, at least the albaian parts. and whatever you might think that the future will bring, I am certian one thing that it WON'T bring, and thats any kind of presence of Serbian state in Kosovo. Soon after 10th you'll need a VISA to enter Kosovo, or you can keep posting here for years about how Kosovo is part of Serbia. Whatever floats your boat.

teni

pre 16 godina

Kate the other guiding principle has been a people's right to self-determination. As a Brit you should know because that's how you lost your colonies. And that is exactly what is happening in this case too.
Anyway that's an academic matter and maybe someone can write a good MA or PhD thesis on it, arguing its rights and wrongs, because Kosova will declare its independence and the US and most of the EU - including the UK - are gonna recognize it. Tough luck for the Serbs but to be completely honest we don't really give a damn about it being against international law or whatever because history has shown that international law is not set in stone and it can change depending on the support one gets for doing so. And don't forget that most of the former colonial powers said that the struggles for independence of their colonial subjects were against international law, were being fought by terrorist etc etc etc. Much good it did you.

AS TIA

pre 16 godina

Kate.
Your words about international law are really touching. You speak about it like you invented it.

Thank you for finally accepting that there will be some kind of independence for Kosova.
You say:
I am sure that there will be some form of partial independence such as the 'Hong Kong' plan, but it is becoming clearer by the day that there will be no outright independence.

Yes Kate there will be supervised independence. Supervised, in order for the minorities in Kosova to be safe specially the Serb minority. We Albanians respect other ethnicities but after what happened in the 90’s in Kosova the West and I mean the West is just scared that suffrage could come back as hatred. That’s why there will be Supervised Independence. And we agree with it just so Serbs in Kosova can feel safe. This is what international law is for. To make people safe at their own homes.

Olf

pre 16 godina

I would not like to say a lot before the end of January but I recon that the only feasible solution is Ahtisaari plan. Neither sides liked it but K-Albanians side accepted it, now turn is on Serbian side to accept it.
Lets be realistic, this way the International law( right for Self Determination) will be respected as well as the will of the majority of the population of Kosova.
There might be other scenarios but I don’t think that there are that suitable and acceptable for K-Albanian population. I intentionally mention K-Albanian since they are the ones that would be deciding factor not Serbian politicians, politicians that are not mentioning nor representing anyone except Milosevic, themselves and some of you here.
Polls in Serbia say that only 7% of Serbs believe that Kosova will remain as part of Serbia.
By the way Italy is for implemantion of Ahtisaari plan

johny

pre 16 godina

This is indeed funiest thing ever posted overhere. Did you actually mean working visa? Or tourist? I suppose you meant working visa since Kosovo is such developed part seeking extra labour.:)
(bmrusila, 9. November 2007 18:27)

You know this ironic comments are very smart and well found especially coming from someone who suggests that Kosova/o is an inseparable part of Serbia, and as such I would expect a person with these views who hold Kosova/o so dear to their heart to not ridicule it. All I see is here is Serbs ridiculing Kosova/o on a daily basis, and yet at the same time the claim Serbia will cease to exist if Kosova/o becomes independent, they claim the world will be in turmoil, they claim Armageddon if their beloved heartland is ripped apart from Serbia's body. Yet the ridicule and make fun of it everyday. Something is clearly wrong here, and what is wrong I believe is the sincerity of the Serbians of how dear Kosova/o is to them. I know for sure I wouldn't dare make fun and ridicule Kosova/o because my relatives have given their lives for it, I would do the same too, because Kosova/o is dear to me.

EA

pre 16 godina

Dragan, Cvele, Jovan and others,

Immoral and unscrupolous is the ethnic cleansing orchastrated by the Serbian State against the Kosovar Albanians. That is why Kosova is becoming fully independent and one more thing. Vojvodina will be part of the Hong Kong plan))

Funcakes

pre 16 godina

Good act from Germany I must say, keeping the "integrity of the Troika" intact...but who are we kidding, that trio has done nothing but make holes in the water...and benefit from the money we're paying as taxpayers from the countries that are sponsoring those useless negotiations.

If we all wanna pretend that these talk will end up in a grand agreement however, then sure...we can say everything is successful and a compromise is very likely to be achieved, and flowers will bloom in the middle winter for the first time ever.

It will be so awesome...

Clean Cut

pre 16 godina

Kosova is de facto independent since 8 years. It will be de jure independent in a few weeks and everyone will be happy that this story ended.

Germany has been a promotor of independence for Kosova since 1941, but some of you don't recall those days. Lets see what Oily Bear will do about it.

doni

pre 16 godina

so now the serb camp is accepting that;
"If Germany was going to recognise you they would have announced it like US France and England. But they didnt.
(Cvele, 10. November 2007 01:26)"

US, France(old serb ally) and England(UK), hahahaha look at him, he still hopes, he hopes for Germany and ally of Albania, or Italy to not recognize Kosova, what a dream.
but anyway, even Poland will recognize Kosovo, because of mother russia, believe it or not

johny

pre 16 godina

Peggy said: "You see, it was only AFTER NATO bombing that the exodus began."

Peggy did you live in your bunker all the time when the bombing was taking place. I can't find any other way to explain your naivety and irresponsible comment.

Can you explain to me why according to you only Albanians left Kosova/o from the bombs and not Serbs of Kosova/o. Are you saying that Serbs are so brave they have the guts to stay in Kosova/o while bombs fall in their backyards and houses while Albanians couldn't stand that and decided in a very organized way to just leave. That would make the Serbs of Kosova/a either very brave or very stupid.
Since the Serbs of Kosova decided to stay while the bombs where falling on their heads can you tell me how many thousand Serbs from Kosova where killed from the NATO bombing?
Are you suggesting that NATO made some new bombs that targeted only inhabitants of Albanian ethnicity, and not those of Serb ethnicity, and that is why only Albanians left Kosova/o.
Are you suggesting that the real target of NATO was the Albanian populated areas and that they wanted the Albanians of Kosova/o to leave Kosova/o.
If that is true than what was the point of bombing Serbia.
Can you tell me how many thousand Serbs fled Serbia because NATO was bombing Serbia? Can you tell me how many Serbs were part of the Serbian exodus after NATO bombs were dropped in Serbia.
If such an exodus after NATO bombed Serbia did not occur, then can you explain to me why would such an exodus happen only with Albanians.

peg

pre 16 godina

Johny, let's get one thing straight here. Most of the Serbian population had already been expelled from Kosovo under the watchful eye of NATO.
Read a book titled "The new rulers of the world", by John Pilger and see what he writes about this.
Sure some of the remaining Serbs would've left as well but most were already out.
So please stop with this nonesense of Serbs ethnically cleansing Albanians. This is typical CNN propaganda that won you some sympathy initially, but the world is waking up to this lie.
Gregory Clark, Noam Chomsky, Gen L. McKenzie all have a different point of view.
These are all well informed and intelligent men who don't agree with your verison.

Lenard

pre 16 godina

It is a don deal Kosovo will be permanently independent of Serbia. It is time for Serbs to look reality in the face and at them selfs & move on. It is no use of beating a dead donkey.

Lenard

pre 16 godina

Kate! Kate! Kate! you said Europe and other areas would have numerous major problems arising. How started and predetermined these intractable problems by taking arms against there neighbors by murders ,violence ,rape ,destruction ,hate ,ethnic cleansing ,killings which likes and doings have not been seen since world war 2 . The wars that Serbia started hoping to expand at the expense of its neighbors. Now you want the world to see it in Serbias favor your dreaming and also the Serbs. Did Serbia follow the rule of law or take them in to consecration only when it suited or in Serbia favor other wise they were thrown out.Did Serbia rectify or even try to have damage reversed it had done in Bosnia... NO! It is trying to add it to its territory. Until Serbia and the Serbian people face reality. Europe will have numerous major problems arising like you said ,it will only be with Serbia & Srpska like it has now.

miri

pre 16 godina

""Kosovo is part of Serbia, and territorial integrity has been the guiding principle of international law ever since the UN was established."

We all know how much in its heart Serbia had the international law during 90's. It started 4 wars with intent for territorial gains over its neighbor countries. It commited the most horrendous crimes since WW2 in Europe. It still continues to interfere in the politics of sovereign countries for its own shovinistic agenda. Thousands of people dead, displaced, orphans. Hundreds of thousands properties burnt and destroyed because Serbia couldn't control its megalomaniac attitude, the same attitude that is driving its political processes even today. International law is above all about humanity and humanism, something that Serbia and its political class had stepped on with its own two feet for decades.

nikshala

pre 16 godina

"Belgrade is not a guarantor of regional stability. It is the largest source of conflict in the region. In that sense, little has changed since 1992," James Lyon

The sad thing Jovan, is that Belgrade has absolutely no control of Kosovo, at least the albaian parts. and whatever you might think that the future will bring, I am certian one thing that it WON'T bring, and thats any kind of presence of Serbian state in Kosovo. Soon after 10th you'll need a VISA to enter Kosovo, or you can keep posting here for years about how Kosovo is part of Serbia. Whatever floats your boat.

teni

pre 16 godina

Kate the other guiding principle has been a people's right to self-determination. As a Brit you should know because that's how you lost your colonies. And that is exactly what is happening in this case too.
Anyway that's an academic matter and maybe someone can write a good MA or PhD thesis on it, arguing its rights and wrongs, because Kosova will declare its independence and the US and most of the EU - including the UK - are gonna recognize it. Tough luck for the Serbs but to be completely honest we don't really give a damn about it being against international law or whatever because history has shown that international law is not set in stone and it can change depending on the support one gets for doing so. And don't forget that most of the former colonial powers said that the struggles for independence of their colonial subjects were against international law, were being fought by terrorist etc etc etc. Much good it did you.

Funcakes

pre 16 godina

Good act from Germany I must say, keeping the "integrity of the Troika" intact...but who are we kidding, that trio has done nothing but make holes in the water...and benefit from the money we're paying as taxpayers from the countries that are sponsoring those useless negotiations.

If we all wanna pretend that these talk will end up in a grand agreement however, then sure...we can say everything is successful and a compromise is very likely to be achieved, and flowers will bloom in the middle winter for the first time ever.

It will be so awesome...

sunny

pre 16 godina

its just a pity all serbs didnt take the moral high ground in respect to international law when thousands were being slautered. international law is to be respected and how does that apply to those who have continually disrespected international law and all norms of modern society and how it deals with its citizens as it once was, you are free to have your ideals of what is right and wrong weather kosovo should or shouldnt be apart of serbia. the reality is that serbia wanted to eliminate a race of people who co existed with the serbs for centuries and that in it self has a price. no return to pre 1999 ( how ever you interpret that) no joining another country and according to the will of the majority of kosovo and not serbia. feel free to fight for what you believe, however it should start with apologies, and sice toppoling milosovic none has been foth comming

AS TIA

pre 16 godina

Kate.
Your words about international law are really touching. You speak about it like you invented it.

Thank you for finally accepting that there will be some kind of independence for Kosova.
You say:
I am sure that there will be some form of partial independence such as the 'Hong Kong' plan, but it is becoming clearer by the day that there will be no outright independence.

Yes Kate there will be supervised independence. Supervised, in order for the minorities in Kosova to be safe specially the Serb minority. We Albanians respect other ethnicities but after what happened in the 90’s in Kosova the West and I mean the West is just scared that suffrage could come back as hatred. That’s why there will be Supervised Independence. And we agree with it just so Serbs in Kosova can feel safe. This is what international law is for. To make people safe at their own homes.

kate

pre 16 godina

So, nothing seems cut and dry. There will be no declaration of independence unless it is coordinated with the EU and US.

I am sure that there will be some form of partial independence such as the 'Hong Kong' plan, but it is becoming clearer by the day that there will be no outright independence.

The stakes within Europe are just too high.

As another poster Allen so rightly said yesterday: "Kosovo is part of Serbia, and territorial integrity has been the guiding principle of international law ever since the UN was established.

"Kosovo's claim to independence is based on the assertion that ethnic self-determination trumps the principle of territorial integrity."

How true that is, and it can never be allowed to happen or Europe and other areas would have numerous major problems arising.

Jovan

pre 16 godina

I am really astonished that this man doesn´t feel ashamed to call the Serbs a minority in their own homeland...

absurd!


yeah, let´s see what they will "coordinate" after december 10th...

I guess it will be the right method to replace the word "independence" without losing face....

international law is not there to be broken by provincial wanna-be "politicians"!

Olf

pre 16 godina

I would not like to say a lot before the end of January but I recon that the only feasible solution is Ahtisaari plan. Neither sides liked it but K-Albanians side accepted it, now turn is on Serbian side to accept it.
Lets be realistic, this way the International law( right for Self Determination) will be respected as well as the will of the majority of the population of Kosova.
There might be other scenarios but I don’t think that there are that suitable and acceptable for K-Albanian population. I intentionally mention K-Albanian since they are the ones that would be deciding factor not Serbian politicians, politicians that are not mentioning nor representing anyone except Milosevic, themselves and some of you here.
Polls in Serbia say that only 7% of Serbs believe that Kosova will remain as part of Serbia.
By the way Italy is for implemantion of Ahtisaari plan

johny

pre 16 godina

This is indeed funiest thing ever posted overhere. Did you actually mean working visa? Or tourist? I suppose you meant working visa since Kosovo is such developed part seeking extra labour.:)
(bmrusila, 9. November 2007 18:27)

You know this ironic comments are very smart and well found especially coming from someone who suggests that Kosova/o is an inseparable part of Serbia, and as such I would expect a person with these views who hold Kosova/o so dear to their heart to not ridicule it. All I see is here is Serbs ridiculing Kosova/o on a daily basis, and yet at the same time the claim Serbia will cease to exist if Kosova/o becomes independent, they claim the world will be in turmoil, they claim Armageddon if their beloved heartland is ripped apart from Serbia's body. Yet the ridicule and make fun of it everyday. Something is clearly wrong here, and what is wrong I believe is the sincerity of the Serbians of how dear Kosova/o is to them. I know for sure I wouldn't dare make fun and ridicule Kosova/o because my relatives have given their lives for it, I would do the same too, because Kosova/o is dear to me.

EA

pre 16 godina

Dragan, Cvele, Jovan and others,

Immoral and unscrupolous is the ethnic cleansing orchastrated by the Serbian State against the Kosovar Albanians. That is why Kosova is becoming fully independent and one more thing. Vojvodina will be part of the Hong Kong plan))

Clean Cut

pre 16 godina

Kosova is de facto independent since 8 years. It will be de jure independent in a few weeks and everyone will be happy that this story ended.

Germany has been a promotor of independence for Kosova since 1941, but some of you don't recall those days. Lets see what Oily Bear will do about it.

doni

pre 16 godina

so now the serb camp is accepting that;
"If Germany was going to recognise you they would have announced it like US France and England. But they didnt.
(Cvele, 10. November 2007 01:26)"

US, France(old serb ally) and England(UK), hahahaha look at him, he still hopes, he hopes for Germany and ally of Albania, or Italy to not recognize Kosova, what a dream.
but anyway, even Poland will recognize Kosovo, because of mother russia, believe it or not

johny

pre 16 godina

Peggy said: "You see, it was only AFTER NATO bombing that the exodus began."

Peggy did you live in your bunker all the time when the bombing was taking place. I can't find any other way to explain your naivety and irresponsible comment.

Can you explain to me why according to you only Albanians left Kosova/o from the bombs and not Serbs of Kosova/o. Are you saying that Serbs are so brave they have the guts to stay in Kosova/o while bombs fall in their backyards and houses while Albanians couldn't stand that and decided in a very organized way to just leave. That would make the Serbs of Kosova/a either very brave or very stupid.
Since the Serbs of Kosova decided to stay while the bombs where falling on their heads can you tell me how many thousand Serbs from Kosova where killed from the NATO bombing?
Are you suggesting that NATO made some new bombs that targeted only inhabitants of Albanian ethnicity, and not those of Serb ethnicity, and that is why only Albanians left Kosova/o.
Are you suggesting that the real target of NATO was the Albanian populated areas and that they wanted the Albanians of Kosova/o to leave Kosova/o.
If that is true than what was the point of bombing Serbia.
Can you tell me how many thousand Serbs fled Serbia because NATO was bombing Serbia? Can you tell me how many Serbs were part of the Serbian exodus after NATO bombs were dropped in Serbia.
If such an exodus after NATO bombed Serbia did not occur, then can you explain to me why would such an exodus happen only with Albanians.

Rade

pre 16 godina

“Our vision is for Kosovo to be an independent, modern state, not only for the Albanian majority, but for all minorities, for the Serbian minority as well,” Sejdiu said, adding that Priština was prepared to work on implementing the status plan proposed by UN envoy Martti Ahtisaari.

The Albanian political leadership missed a golden opportunity to advance their argument for independence by treating the Serbs so abhorrently over the last 8 years.

Add to that their abysmal record on every indicator of good governance and their inability to purge their ranks of war criminals and mafia style dons and it is evident that they are their own worst enemy.

The myopic denial of anything negative associated with Albania and Albanians by pro-Albanian posters here is actually representative of an attitude that is endemic in their society from the top down.

The short of it is, they’ve frittered away any good will they may have had and now it’s just a question of letting the general populace down gently.

Serbia will not agree to voluntarily give away territory and rightly so. And Serbia is much more important to Europe than the discredited political leadership of its breakaway province, so no independence.

Rade

pre 16 godina

Jovan, these provincial 'wannabes' are unictited criminals and incompentent politicians to boot.

The UN and even the EU isn't a flea market, where quick and sleazy deals can be made.

The only arguments they've advanced is that they will not compromise and that they will incite their populace to violence if they don't get their way.

Dragan

pre 16 godina

“Our vision is for Kosovo to be an independent, modern state, not only for the Albanian majority, but for all minorities, for the Serbian minority as well,” Sejdiu said.
This guy is obviously a comedian. Kosovo is anything but 'modern' and will never be independent. The way albanians treat their minorities is a crime against humanity. Shame on any country that supports their illegal and immoral 'greater albania' plan.

Ratko

pre 16 godina

Don't worry Jovan I agree with you 100%.

albanians speak as if KiM is theirs to bargain with.

But they will get a wake up call from their beloved amrican friends, that independence is a failed promise.

bmrusila

pre 16 godina

Soon after 10th you'll need a VISA to enter Kosovo, or you can keep posting here for years about how Kosovo is part of Serbia


This is indeed funiest thing ever posted overhere. Did you actually mean working visa? Or tourist? I suppose you meant working visa since Kosovo is such developed part seeking extra labour.:)

Jovan

pre 16 godina

in regard to that comment by KS...
about Serbs going to need visa-papers...

right now it´s quite the opposite: many Albanians are travelling to Niš in order to apply for serbian documents...

Peggy

pre 16 godina

EA the predictor.
You claim that Kosovo will become independent because of the ethnic cleansing. Did you mean the ethnic cleaning done by the Albanians? Many Serbs have been expelled from Kosovo and that is ethnic cleansing.

If you are talking about Albanians being ethnically cleansed, well for that you have to blame NATO. You see, it was only AFTER NATO bombing that the exodus began.

So obviously you are very proud of the way you ethnically cleansed Kosovo of Serbs and other non Albanian population and now wish to get your reward of the form of your own country.

I am afraid it is you who will not be rewarded for ethnic cleansing. Don't think that the truth isn't finally coming out. Don't think that it is not known how k
K-Albanians want their great Albania. You talk of great Serbia. Serbia is only holding onto what is theirs and not trying to steal it like the Albanians are.

peg

pre 16 godina

Johny, let's get one thing straight here. Most of the Serbian population had already been expelled from Kosovo under the watchful eye of NATO.
Read a book titled "The new rulers of the world", by John Pilger and see what he writes about this.
Sure some of the remaining Serbs would've left as well but most were already out.
So please stop with this nonesense of Serbs ethnically cleansing Albanians. This is typical CNN propaganda that won you some sympathy initially, but the world is waking up to this lie.
Gregory Clark, Noam Chomsky, Gen L. McKenzie all have a different point of view.
These are all well informed and intelligent men who don't agree with your verison.