Ratko, I will not say good job by Macenian police but insted an excelent job by Kosova Police Services. I tell you why:"KPS are the ones that told Macedonian police about the exact location due to phone tapping and they pinpointed the location to Macedonians.
The actions of the police were totally justified. In which country is it ok to walk around with guns and bazookas?
And for the Albanians who think with rage and rather than logic, have a think about the murdered Macedonian policeman two weeks ago, he was the sole supporter of his family and his wife is 7 months pregnant. Hence the actions were totally justified and NO they were not to heavy handed. Trying to justify the actions of these murderous thugs is very offensive indeed.
Everybody signed the Ohrid agreement, but macedonian authorities are backtracking. Just the other week they outlawed the use of albanian flags on goverment buildings, which WAS part of the agreement. Not a very smart move, in my opinion. And considering that 25 - 30 % of population is albanian, the national anthem, symbols, flag, and anything with authority does not reflected that.
However, almost all albanians do not support these armed gangs, which is what they are. However Macedonian authorities should be careful to not throw fuel to the fire.
And by the way, the only reason why albanians in the past have resorted to violence, is because they have been opressed by the slavs in Balkans for the last 100 years. And after diplomacy and peacful means failed to get the world attention, the only desperate option was to fight back.
However, I hope that time for violence in Balkans is over now.
Peter Sudyka
Serbia didn't go full swing against the Albanian population, not in the beginning at least, only after the NATO-bombing started. Serbia used exactly the same methods as Macedonia uses now I would say.
Why are Albanians resorting to violence again here? I thought everything was regulated by the Ohrid Agreement and that Macedonia complied to the Copenhagen Criteria two years ago already and is an EU candidate, so what's the problem? Is this some kind of standard strategy by Albanian separatists to provoke the authorities of the country they are living in in order to have military force used against them with aims of intervention from the international community? Or are Albanians being treated as lesser citizens in Macedonia (I am not there, so I don't know, but I doubt it from what I have read on the matter)?
Is there really an aspiration in the minds of some Albanians to a Greater Albania and is this the way they try to achieve it? I sincerely hope not, because then it is obvious that Kosovo will set the first precedent for this!
Though I see that Macedonia is playing this one wisely, not going in with full swing and cracking down on the Albanian population like Serbia did. I hope more terrorists are neutralized, because I doubt these are fighting against "Macedonian oppression", these are just separatists and terrorists, nothing more.
I dont remember Serbs going into Albania starting war.. i do remember albanians coming to serbia starting war, so what does everyone know? obviously you dont know.
seems like the albanians are inciting another conflict. just like they did in kosovo: provoke a reaction by government authorities (police, army) by murdering people, police, etc., hire propagandists to spread lies about genocide and rape while the authorities try to regain control, and get the international community to 'intervene' and run a half of macedonia. then, after several years, demand independence and nothing less because of all of the 'injustices' that were fabricated by the propagandists, and encouraged by their own people.
Macedonians should done this months ago,just like Montenegrians.Gotta nip it in the bud brfore they start shooting innocent people.
Awesome job Macedonians.
"On the other hand no Macedonian houses or churches are burned when they arrest Macedonians."
This leaves out the Macedonian churches and monasteries damaged and ruined during the 2001 skirmish there. Partly it was because the Albanian militants were using the churches and monasteries as places to shoot or mortar from.
In this case they may have been hiding in the mosques and houses which explains things. This did happend during the Balkans wars too which is why the damage and destruction of mosques and churches DURING a war isn't necessarily aiming at them but at the militants, police or army which is using them in the midst of the fighter, or as ammo depots.
On the other hand, Albanians dynamited Serbian churches and monasteries when there was no war and no Serb police or army using them.
This is a great result for Macedonia and the region. The lack of international support for this small country in combating its terrorist/criminal problem is shameful so it's reassuring to see the Macedonians pull off an operation like this using their own resources.
Bmrusila: The question of who started it is like the chicken and egg dilemma. As an Albanian I know you started it; as a Serb you blame that on us. But there is one other thing: what the Serbs did was much worse and of far greater scale than what the Albanians could have ever done and for you it was state policy in Croatia, Bosnia and Kosova. So even if we assume that the Albanians started it, would Serbia have been justified for acting as it did? Because if we follow that logic then if Serbia was justified then the K-Albanians certainly were too for taking revenge on the K-Serbs.
As for Macedonia, if these guys were who the Macedonians claim they were, well they had it coming. The only thing I have a problem with is that whenever the Macedonian police arrests or kills Albanian 'criminals' they burn a few houses and mosques in the process. On the other hand no Macedonian houses or churches are burned when they arrest Macedonians. For that matter when the Albanian police arrests criminals however well armed they may be, no houses are ever burned. How come the Macedonians like the Serbs in times past have to go in so heavy handed? Given the times our region is going through that is stupid and the interests of Macedonia would be better served by showing restraint I think and winning hearts and minds. Otherwise a year from now we might be arguing who started it.
No Macedonian Helicopter got shot down, there has been misinformation by ahm, Albanians, that helicopter was shot down, Macedonian Police and KFOR both denied it (read the news).
In the shootout, most of the Kosovo criminals were killed, and 6 surrendered, among them Habit Ameti (one of 'ANA' leaders).
I hope more criminals from Kosovo choose Macedonia as their hiding destination, so our Special Forces can practice.
bmrusila , if you are a serb than you have absolutely no moral right to talk about violence, since everyboduy know who commited the most violent crimes in the Balkans
(tosi,
I do have right to say what I actually think. Serbs only responded on the aggression that was coming from Albanian side. Each country in this world has right to defend its people from terrorists with separatistic aspirations (or this rule does not apply to Serbs since have no support form the West). As I said before I am disgraced by the crimes that my people did and never supported the war and violence as a meaning of reaching the goals. However, for the time being, I have learnt that Albanians just expect something to be given to them and if not satisfied they use force and violence as the only instrument. But, hey, Serbian war criminals are nearly all behind the bars and yours are stil free and rule over Kosovo. How do you see that? How do you see barbed-wired Serbs with very limited freedom of movement in 21.century. Few years back, when you were governed under Serbs, as I remember you have not been limited to move, to speek in your own language, you could do everything you liked (it was your right to refuse everything that you have been offered). So, yes I see you the way I see you and stated so.
If Macedonian authority doesn’t respect Ohrid agreement, amnesty offered to all former Albanian fighters, and stop applying Serbian tactics of treating Albanians as seconds class citizens therefore denying basic human and civil rights then the helicopter that got shutdown (fiercely denied by Macedonian authority, KFOR confirmed it two times) it’s a taste what could they get in the near future.
The West is obviously interested in their own benefits in the Balkans and nothing else. There is no way in the world Albanian separatists deserve independence based on their behavior. Just look at all the violence they perpetrate. Keep your head in the sand and avoid reality, that is the West's MO.
Nehat and Tosi,
If you want to close your eyes to anything before and after 1991-1999, you may be slightly right. Although all warring sides perpetrated war crimes, don't kid yourselves. I guess expelling 100,000+ people from your region to make it ethnically pure isnt a crime if you allow 3 refugee families to return.
If you want to go before that, then maybe we can talk about the harassment and persecution committed on the serbs up until 1991, especially in the 80s in Kosovo, as well as in WWII by both the croats, bosniaks, and albanians, that eclipses anything the serbs have ever done by at least 10 fold. Not to mention 600 years of harassment, rape, abuse by balkan muslims while the ottomans were in rule. Let's not start pointing fingers ok guys?
Now let's talk after. What happened since the 99 bombings? how many serbs were kicked out of Kosovo? How many were allowed to return to Kosovo, Croatia, and the Federation of BiH? Why is it that RS has the most returned refugees in the entire former Yugoslavia? I guess it must be cause serbs are such bad people....
bmrusila , if you are a serb than you have absolutely no moral right to talk about violence, since everyboduy know who commited the most violent crimes in the Balkans
No Macedonian Helicopter got shot down, there has been misinformation by ahm, Albanians, that helicopter was shot down, Macedonian Police and KFOR both denied it (read the news).
In the shootout, most of the Kosovo criminals were killed, and 6 surrendered, among them Habit Ameti (one of 'ANA' leaders).
I hope more criminals from Kosovo choose Macedonia as their hiding destination, so our Special Forces can practice.
The West is obviously interested in their own benefits in the Balkans and nothing else. There is no way in the world Albanian separatists deserve independence based on their behavior. Just look at all the violence they perpetrate. Keep your head in the sand and avoid reality, that is the West's MO.
Nehat and Tosi,
If you want to close your eyes to anything before and after 1991-1999, you may be slightly right. Although all warring sides perpetrated war crimes, don't kid yourselves. I guess expelling 100,000+ people from your region to make it ethnically pure isnt a crime if you allow 3 refugee families to return.
If you want to go before that, then maybe we can talk about the harassment and persecution committed on the serbs up until 1991, especially in the 80s in Kosovo, as well as in WWII by both the croats, bosniaks, and albanians, that eclipses anything the serbs have ever done by at least 10 fold. Not to mention 600 years of harassment, rape, abuse by balkan muslims while the ottomans were in rule. Let's not start pointing fingers ok guys?
Now let's talk after. What happened since the 99 bombings? how many serbs were kicked out of Kosovo? How many were allowed to return to Kosovo, Croatia, and the Federation of BiH? Why is it that RS has the most returned refugees in the entire former Yugoslavia? I guess it must be cause serbs are such bad people....
bmrusila , if you are a serb than you have absolutely no moral right to talk about violence, since everyboduy know who commited the most violent crimes in the Balkans
(tosi,
I do have right to say what I actually think. Serbs only responded on the aggression that was coming from Albanian side. Each country in this world has right to defend its people from terrorists with separatistic aspirations (or this rule does not apply to Serbs since have no support form the West). As I said before I am disgraced by the crimes that my people did and never supported the war and violence as a meaning of reaching the goals. However, for the time being, I have learnt that Albanians just expect something to be given to them and if not satisfied they use force and violence as the only instrument. But, hey, Serbian war criminals are nearly all behind the bars and yours are stil free and rule over Kosovo. How do you see that? How do you see barbed-wired Serbs with very limited freedom of movement in 21.century. Few years back, when you were governed under Serbs, as I remember you have not been limited to move, to speek in your own language, you could do everything you liked (it was your right to refuse everything that you have been offered). So, yes I see you the way I see you and stated so.
This is a great result for Macedonia and the region. The lack of international support for this small country in combating its terrorist/criminal problem is shameful so it's reassuring to see the Macedonians pull off an operation like this using their own resources.
I dont remember Serbs going into Albania starting war.. i do remember albanians coming to serbia starting war, so what does everyone know? obviously you dont know.
Macedonians should done this months ago,just like Montenegrians.Gotta nip it in the bud brfore they start shooting innocent people.
Awesome job Macedonians.
bmrusila , if you are a serb than you have absolutely no moral right to talk about violence, since everyboduy know who commited the most violent crimes in the Balkans
seems like the albanians are inciting another conflict. just like they did in kosovo: provoke a reaction by government authorities (police, army) by murdering people, police, etc., hire propagandists to spread lies about genocide and rape while the authorities try to regain control, and get the international community to 'intervene' and run a half of macedonia. then, after several years, demand independence and nothing less because of all of the 'injustices' that were fabricated by the propagandists, and encouraged by their own people.
If Macedonian authority doesn’t respect Ohrid agreement, amnesty offered to all former Albanian fighters, and stop applying Serbian tactics of treating Albanians as seconds class citizens therefore denying basic human and civil rights then the helicopter that got shutdown (fiercely denied by Macedonian authority, KFOR confirmed it two times) it’s a taste what could they get in the near future.
"On the other hand no Macedonian houses or churches are burned when they arrest Macedonians."
This leaves out the Macedonian churches and monasteries damaged and ruined during the 2001 skirmish there. Partly it was because the Albanian militants were using the churches and monasteries as places to shoot or mortar from.
In this case they may have been hiding in the mosques and houses which explains things. This did happend during the Balkans wars too which is why the damage and destruction of mosques and churches DURING a war isn't necessarily aiming at them but at the militants, police or army which is using them in the midst of the fighter, or as ammo depots.
On the other hand, Albanians dynamited Serbian churches and monasteries when there was no war and no Serb police or army using them.
Bmrusila: The question of who started it is like the chicken and egg dilemma. As an Albanian I know you started it; as a Serb you blame that on us. But there is one other thing: what the Serbs did was much worse and of far greater scale than what the Albanians could have ever done and for you it was state policy in Croatia, Bosnia and Kosova. So even if we assume that the Albanians started it, would Serbia have been justified for acting as it did? Because if we follow that logic then if Serbia was justified then the K-Albanians certainly were too for taking revenge on the K-Serbs.
As for Macedonia, if these guys were who the Macedonians claim they were, well they had it coming. The only thing I have a problem with is that whenever the Macedonian police arrests or kills Albanian 'criminals' they burn a few houses and mosques in the process. On the other hand no Macedonian houses or churches are burned when they arrest Macedonians. For that matter when the Albanian police arrests criminals however well armed they may be, no houses are ever burned. How come the Macedonians like the Serbs in times past have to go in so heavy handed? Given the times our region is going through that is stupid and the interests of Macedonia would be better served by showing restraint I think and winning hearts and minds. Otherwise a year from now we might be arguing who started it.
Peter Sudyka
Serbia didn't go full swing against the Albanian population, not in the beginning at least, only after the NATO-bombing started. Serbia used exactly the same methods as Macedonia uses now I would say.
The actions of the police were totally justified. In which country is it ok to walk around with guns and bazookas?
And for the Albanians who think with rage and rather than logic, have a think about the murdered Macedonian policeman two weeks ago, he was the sole supporter of his family and his wife is 7 months pregnant. Hence the actions were totally justified and NO they were not to heavy handed. Trying to justify the actions of these murderous thugs is very offensive indeed.
Why are Albanians resorting to violence again here? I thought everything was regulated by the Ohrid Agreement and that Macedonia complied to the Copenhagen Criteria two years ago already and is an EU candidate, so what's the problem? Is this some kind of standard strategy by Albanian separatists to provoke the authorities of the country they are living in in order to have military force used against them with aims of intervention from the international community? Or are Albanians being treated as lesser citizens in Macedonia (I am not there, so I don't know, but I doubt it from what I have read on the matter)?
Is there really an aspiration in the minds of some Albanians to a Greater Albania and is this the way they try to achieve it? I sincerely hope not, because then it is obvious that Kosovo will set the first precedent for this!
Though I see that Macedonia is playing this one wisely, not going in with full swing and cracking down on the Albanian population like Serbia did. I hope more terrorists are neutralized, because I doubt these are fighting against "Macedonian oppression", these are just separatists and terrorists, nothing more.
Everybody signed the Ohrid agreement, but macedonian authorities are backtracking. Just the other week they outlawed the use of albanian flags on goverment buildings, which WAS part of the agreement. Not a very smart move, in my opinion. And considering that 25 - 30 % of population is albanian, the national anthem, symbols, flag, and anything with authority does not reflected that.
However, almost all albanians do not support these armed gangs, which is what they are. However Macedonian authorities should be careful to not throw fuel to the fire.
And by the way, the only reason why albanians in the past have resorted to violence, is because they have been opressed by the slavs in Balkans for the last 100 years. And after diplomacy and peacful means failed to get the world attention, the only desperate option was to fight back.
However, I hope that time for violence in Balkans is over now.
Ratko, I will not say good job by Macenian police but insted an excelent job by Kosova Police Services. I tell you why:"KPS are the ones that told Macedonian police about the exact location due to phone tapping and they pinpointed the location to Macedonians.
bmrusila , if you are a serb than you have absolutely no moral right to talk about violence, since everyboduy know who commited the most violent crimes in the Balkans
Ratko, I will not say good job by Macenian police but insted an excelent job by Kosova Police Services. I tell you why:"KPS are the ones that told Macedonian police about the exact location due to phone tapping and they pinpointed the location to Macedonians.
If Macedonian authority doesn’t respect Ohrid agreement, amnesty offered to all former Albanian fighters, and stop applying Serbian tactics of treating Albanians as seconds class citizens therefore denying basic human and civil rights then the helicopter that got shutdown (fiercely denied by Macedonian authority, KFOR confirmed it two times) it’s a taste what could they get in the near future.
Everybody signed the Ohrid agreement, but macedonian authorities are backtracking. Just the other week they outlawed the use of albanian flags on goverment buildings, which WAS part of the agreement. Not a very smart move, in my opinion. And considering that 25 - 30 % of population is albanian, the national anthem, symbols, flag, and anything with authority does not reflected that.
However, almost all albanians do not support these armed gangs, which is what they are. However Macedonian authorities should be careful to not throw fuel to the fire.
And by the way, the only reason why albanians in the past have resorted to violence, is because they have been opressed by the slavs in Balkans for the last 100 years. And after diplomacy and peacful means failed to get the world attention, the only desperate option was to fight back.
However, I hope that time for violence in Balkans is over now.
The West is obviously interested in their own benefits in the Balkans and nothing else. There is no way in the world Albanian separatists deserve independence based on their behavior. Just look at all the violence they perpetrate. Keep your head in the sand and avoid reality, that is the West's MO.
Bmrusila: The question of who started it is like the chicken and egg dilemma. As an Albanian I know you started it; as a Serb you blame that on us. But there is one other thing: what the Serbs did was much worse and of far greater scale than what the Albanians could have ever done and for you it was state policy in Croatia, Bosnia and Kosova. So even if we assume that the Albanians started it, would Serbia have been justified for acting as it did? Because if we follow that logic then if Serbia was justified then the K-Albanians certainly were too for taking revenge on the K-Serbs.
As for Macedonia, if these guys were who the Macedonians claim they were, well they had it coming. The only thing I have a problem with is that whenever the Macedonian police arrests or kills Albanian 'criminals' they burn a few houses and mosques in the process. On the other hand no Macedonian houses or churches are burned when they arrest Macedonians. For that matter when the Albanian police arrests criminals however well armed they may be, no houses are ever burned. How come the Macedonians like the Serbs in times past have to go in so heavy handed? Given the times our region is going through that is stupid and the interests of Macedonia would be better served by showing restraint I think and winning hearts and minds. Otherwise a year from now we might be arguing who started it.
Nehat and Tosi,
If you want to close your eyes to anything before and after 1991-1999, you may be slightly right. Although all warring sides perpetrated war crimes, don't kid yourselves. I guess expelling 100,000+ people from your region to make it ethnically pure isnt a crime if you allow 3 refugee families to return.
If you want to go before that, then maybe we can talk about the harassment and persecution committed on the serbs up until 1991, especially in the 80s in Kosovo, as well as in WWII by both the croats, bosniaks, and albanians, that eclipses anything the serbs have ever done by at least 10 fold. Not to mention 600 years of harassment, rape, abuse by balkan muslims while the ottomans were in rule. Let's not start pointing fingers ok guys?
Now let's talk after. What happened since the 99 bombings? how many serbs were kicked out of Kosovo? How many were allowed to return to Kosovo, Croatia, and the Federation of BiH? Why is it that RS has the most returned refugees in the entire former Yugoslavia? I guess it must be cause serbs are such bad people....
No Macedonian Helicopter got shot down, there has been misinformation by ahm, Albanians, that helicopter was shot down, Macedonian Police and KFOR both denied it (read the news).
In the shootout, most of the Kosovo criminals were killed, and 6 surrendered, among them Habit Ameti (one of 'ANA' leaders).
I hope more criminals from Kosovo choose Macedonia as their hiding destination, so our Special Forces can practice.
I dont remember Serbs going into Albania starting war.. i do remember albanians coming to serbia starting war, so what does everyone know? obviously you dont know.
Peter Sudyka
Serbia didn't go full swing against the Albanian population, not in the beginning at least, only after the NATO-bombing started. Serbia used exactly the same methods as Macedonia uses now I would say.
bmrusila , if you are a serb than you have absolutely no moral right to talk about violence, since everyboduy know who commited the most violent crimes in the Balkans
(tosi,
I do have right to say what I actually think. Serbs only responded on the aggression that was coming from Albanian side. Each country in this world has right to defend its people from terrorists with separatistic aspirations (or this rule does not apply to Serbs since have no support form the West). As I said before I am disgraced by the crimes that my people did and never supported the war and violence as a meaning of reaching the goals. However, for the time being, I have learnt that Albanians just expect something to be given to them and if not satisfied they use force and violence as the only instrument. But, hey, Serbian war criminals are nearly all behind the bars and yours are stil free and rule over Kosovo. How do you see that? How do you see barbed-wired Serbs with very limited freedom of movement in 21.century. Few years back, when you were governed under Serbs, as I remember you have not been limited to move, to speek in your own language, you could do everything you liked (it was your right to refuse everything that you have been offered). So, yes I see you the way I see you and stated so.
This is a great result for Macedonia and the region. The lack of international support for this small country in combating its terrorist/criminal problem is shameful so it's reassuring to see the Macedonians pull off an operation like this using their own resources.
Macedonians should done this months ago,just like Montenegrians.Gotta nip it in the bud brfore they start shooting innocent people.
Awesome job Macedonians.
"On the other hand no Macedonian houses or churches are burned when they arrest Macedonians."
This leaves out the Macedonian churches and monasteries damaged and ruined during the 2001 skirmish there. Partly it was because the Albanian militants were using the churches and monasteries as places to shoot or mortar from.
In this case they may have been hiding in the mosques and houses which explains things. This did happend during the Balkans wars too which is why the damage and destruction of mosques and churches DURING a war isn't necessarily aiming at them but at the militants, police or army which is using them in the midst of the fighter, or as ammo depots.
On the other hand, Albanians dynamited Serbian churches and monasteries when there was no war and no Serb police or army using them.
seems like the albanians are inciting another conflict. just like they did in kosovo: provoke a reaction by government authorities (police, army) by murdering people, police, etc., hire propagandists to spread lies about genocide and rape while the authorities try to regain control, and get the international community to 'intervene' and run a half of macedonia. then, after several years, demand independence and nothing less because of all of the 'injustices' that were fabricated by the propagandists, and encouraged by their own people.
Why are Albanians resorting to violence again here? I thought everything was regulated by the Ohrid Agreement and that Macedonia complied to the Copenhagen Criteria two years ago already and is an EU candidate, so what's the problem? Is this some kind of standard strategy by Albanian separatists to provoke the authorities of the country they are living in in order to have military force used against them with aims of intervention from the international community? Or are Albanians being treated as lesser citizens in Macedonia (I am not there, so I don't know, but I doubt it from what I have read on the matter)?
Is there really an aspiration in the minds of some Albanians to a Greater Albania and is this the way they try to achieve it? I sincerely hope not, because then it is obvious that Kosovo will set the first precedent for this!
Though I see that Macedonia is playing this one wisely, not going in with full swing and cracking down on the Albanian population like Serbia did. I hope more terrorists are neutralized, because I doubt these are fighting against "Macedonian oppression", these are just separatists and terrorists, nothing more.
The actions of the police were totally justified. In which country is it ok to walk around with guns and bazookas?
And for the Albanians who think with rage and rather than logic, have a think about the murdered Macedonian policeman two weeks ago, he was the sole supporter of his family and his wife is 7 months pregnant. Hence the actions were totally justified and NO they were not to heavy handed. Trying to justify the actions of these murderous thugs is very offensive indeed.
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