"U.S. pursues brutal policy of force"

Thanks to Milloshevic and Koshtunica Kosova will be the newest independent country in the world.
Serbia will never join the European Union without recognising Kosova. These irresponsible leaders are creating a big problem for their future of their own people.

Hej I thought thet Milosevic is dad already or I was wrong, can somebody tell me or I am the only one confused here. If he is still alive and still runing Serbia.

Fair play to Kostunica, his comments sound reasonable. US policy on Kosovo is a bad Orwellian joke. I also take heart from his comments about NATO, it is good to hear a European statesman speak in such a way about that fig-leaf for American hegemony. Please Serbia, do not join NATO, be like us here in Ireland!

Go Vojo Go!!! I've been very disappointed lately by the Serbian politicians to the extent I crticized the entire process. Here's one Serb politician and a true statesman who tells it like it is. With politicians like him around, the Albanian illusion will soon become a thing of the past. I'm a believer once again!!!

It is very sickening, this so called foreign policy of the U.S.. But remember, they supported Afghanistan, Iraq and Iran, then later they bombed Afghanistan, Iraq and now are about to bomb Iran. So yes, just let the ethnic albanians follow their islamic brothers strategy and using the U.S. support.

If I were an Albanian who wanted independence I would be very concerned by this: "Annex 11 of the Ahtisaari plan explicitly says that NATO is the final body of authority in Kosovo."

Notice that NATO is the final authority -- not the elected ethnic Albanian officials. What sort of "independence" is this? Ah yes, it is "supervised independence" which means no independence at all.

Too many people look at the Kosovo status process through the narrow prism of Serb or Albanian interests, but not through the prism that is dictating events -- NATO interests.

NATO doesn't care about Albanians, it just wants to base itself in Kosovo so that it can attack Eurasia and the Middle East if it decides to.

The Americans are being friendly with the Albanians right now, but the Americans have a nasty habit of turning against their friends. As soon as the Albanians get their own ideas about how Kosovo ought to be run, you'll see that relationship sour.

I'm sure Saddam Hussein (if the Americans hadn't had him killed) and Manuel Noriega could tell you all about American friendship.

Nowadays, 8 years after the bombing of Serbia, most of the involved countries feel ashamed what they did. They bombed a sovereign European state because of an internal conflict. Yes, a conflict, not a war. A few people call it a war with war heroes and such nonsence, but it was a conflict, nothing more, nothing less. You seldom hear any European country speak about this because we feel guilt. Most diplomats, high level officials and even military leaders today say that it was a huge failure and mistake. The product of this mess is a small landlocked, dirty place called Kosovo/a. This small piece of land is sinked in criminality (every intelligence bureau on this globe knows exactly what is going on with prostitution, weapons, drugs, money-laundering, smuggling etc etc and who is behind it and who is linked to it.) The mess created is also a huge problem to UN, US, EU and Russia. Its like a Catch 22 (Joseph Heller, 1961). How ever you do now, it will be bad. One thing that most openeyed people see today are that there will not be any 1. Pre 1999 situation and 2. Kosovo/a will NOT be a new country (independence). This is for sure and absolutely obvious. In my opinion, not much will really happen. It will be a frozen conflict like many others in the world. Also, I am not so sure anymore (I was sure before) that US will say yes to unilateral independence whe the time comes.

I am not surprised that Kostunica is saying these things, any politician who is confronted with a part of his country being given independence would say them.

I just wonder how it will be if Kosovo does get independence and then the Serbs north of the Ibar River begin threatening with separatism (they too have their reasons, fear of living as a Serb minority in an Albanian country etc.), what exactly will happen then.

This is why probably any outcome after Dec 10 might open up a can of worms as the British might say and why I always hope in the back of my mind that an agreement will be reached before the deadline.

Why can't it be like in an ideal world where you guys agree on something and everyone lives happily ever after?

I supported the NATO humanitarian intervention. I did not support a NATO invasion to grab land. NATO will lose it's humanitarian credentials.

Contrary to myth, not all Serbs are Milosevic lovers - he is is actively detested by most that I know! NATO did a favour to Serbia by making his position untenable. That was not a justification for the current land grab - Serbia is democratic and moving in the right direction (although it is time someone was brave enough to arrest Mladic).

An independent Kosovo is a wrong solution. Why not an independent Serb republic within Bosnia or an independent Krijina (the Serbs there had a better case that the Albanians in Kosovo)?

The Albanians blame the Serbs but actually they never wanted integration - they have been ethnically cleansing Kosovo of Serbs for years.

An independent Kosovo will be within Serbian borders - it's existence will not be legal and it will not be for all time. It will be independent in name but territorially insecure forever.

The best way forward is an agreed solution that gives autonomy to the region and which guarantees progress for all within the EU.

The US has not been heard to address the issues within Serbia - they behave in an imperious (if not imperial) fashion.

Peter Sudyka wrote "Why can't it be like in an ideal world where you guys agree on something and everyone lives happily ever after?"

-In Kosova we all agree on the fact that we all like Vanilla. There is no fear for serbs to be a minority in Kosova because they will be a majority in the north and other serb enclaves. Being a majority means that policemen, police chiefs, judges, teachers and any other relevant community worker will be a serb. Nobody will be able to do any harm to serbs. This is all under Ahtisaari plan. Serb people should favor this plan because it serves them well. anyway, what would the future of Kosova will be time will tell. It is likely that Kosova will declare independece, be recognized by U. S. Britain, France and majority of EU. It is also likely that status of serbs in Kosova might get compromised if they do not support its independence. My advice to Kosova Serbs is to "love the one you're with." Embrace the state of Kosova and accept Ahtisaari plan. And, of course, Albanians and Serbs will continue to agree on the fact that they both like Vanilla. However, Mr. Kostunica does not know this yet!!!

oh my dear mh...

I checked your "sources" ..and now I am really confident. if all Albanians rely on this kind of "scientific" proof... then everything will be fine! =)

you should do your "research" a little bit more properly, I guess.

check the archeological faculty of Chicago, their archeologists together with historians went to southern Serbia in the late 1980´s and found no, but ...really no single sign whatsoever that would indicate any albanian connection to the illyrians or furthermore to that region.

posting "sources" that speak of a "reputedly" illyrian descent indicates that your really WISH to be a descendant of the illyrians.

if that is all you can present, my dear mh, better let it be. you would only be disappointed of the outcome of a real research.

last but not least, thank you for providing those links. you are perfectly displaying how weak those arguments are, on which the Albanians illegal demands are based.

you did a good job against the illegal grab of serbian land!
thanks for that!

Just ahead Kostunica, here we are again with a 15%... I thought was forgotten.

Kosova will, also not allow or acknowledge the setting up an illegal occupation of its territory – NEVER. We are free and democratic, so if you want good neighborly relations here we are, if not you can proceed on your own, but will not let you drag us down with you! Not any longer!

EA, instead of telling us the same old story why not going to Belgrade and tell 'em your point of view!?!

Then since you are in a moment of confusion I suggest you "?" Restaurant the oldest and best in Beograd!

Uping up the ante is not going to help Koshtunica and his DSS cronies.
Usually people who attack US policy dont get too far either.
He knows the fact that Kosova/o will be INDEPENDENT, and NOTHING he can do or not do!
If, he was smart, he would not make these kind of comments. America knows the notion of GOOD COP, BAD COP, for a very long time. Actually it was created in America.

It is Prime Minister Vojislav Kostunica's duty and right to remind the US everyday, if need be, that Kosovo and Metohija is part of sovereign territory of Serbia. To remind the US everyday that 15% of Serbian territory cannot be taken away from the Serbian nation.
That international law over-rides every force.
That broad autonomy is the best and only solution for the ethnic Albanians living in Kosovo and Metohija.
That the Serbs living in Kosovo and Metohija have the right to live in Serbia and not forced somewhere else.

Bob,

Lets not forget that Serbs only turned on Milosevic when poverty and unemployment came knocking in the door. Milosevic was ousted for corruption and other economic reasons, his crimes against humanity were not one of the reasons the people who ousted him had in mind.

Kostunica is the same as Milosevic. In fact i think he's worse than Milosevic, because unlike him, i sometimes think Kosunica really believes what he's saying.

"Paddy,

What could give Ireland to NATO anyway?
(Joe, 16. October 2007 22:34)"

Joe, a little bit of info for your benefit. We were asked to join NATO on many occasions but we turned them down on each one. As I recall, the last time NATO asked us to join was in the late 1980's and it was flatly turned down. What benefit do we have of joining an increasingly irrelevant alliance that looks out of place in today's world. Ireland has followed a very successful policy of neutrality since independence in 1922 and we have no desire to fight and die for the latest US resource war.

Predictor
Well too bad. Because looks like it is autonomy all the way.

CCCC

European,

Please read Annex 9 and 11. Annex 9 gives final authority on all civilian matters to the ICR (international civilian representative, i.e. NATO), and Annex 11 gives final authoritry on all military matters to the IMP (international military presence, i.e. NATO).

It's no wonder why the Americans and NATO support the Ahtisaari plan -- it gives them total control over Kosovo. They get to occupy the territory and push the local government around without having to worry about the welfare of the population.

You can't talk about any "independence" under the Ahtisaari plan. The only thing you can talk about is a NATO-installed dictatorship.

The Albanians are only supporting this plan because most of them don't understand what it is. They think they're going to get independence, but they're not going to.

We have a saying in America "cutting off ones nose to spite ones face", and that is precisely what the Albanians are doing in Kosovo.

Serbia is offering them more autonomy, less oversight, and even greater self government than the Ahtisaari plan, but they won't take it because they want to spite Serbia worse than they want meaningful self government or a functioning economy.

With this kind of retoric, I believe that Serbia and its citizens are on the right path to EU. This is exactly what other Europeans have been thinking and still think about U.S., especially after WWII, when U.S. with its brutal policy saved Europe from Nazis and from becoming a "communist garden" like the unfortunate half of Europe, that now is still sees U.S. as the force behind freedom from KGB-type leaders like Putin and Co.

Good luck!

I, and Jovan had this covrsacion:

"Albanians have more than 4000 years in Balkan."

written by "m.h."
…………
dear m.h.:

I can understand that you desperately wish that to be true... but,unfortunately the Illyrian myth is simply an Albanian dream! Your "friends" the Americans de-mystified that invention...and have scientifically proven that you came from the Caucasus at the same time as the Serbs arrived in the Balkans.

so, these attempts to present yourself as the native owners of that part of Europe is only a lousy joke.

by the way, did you know that the Slovenians call themselves the descendants of the Illyrians?
(Jovan, 13. October 2007 20:48)
Jovan, Check out.
The Library of Congress
Albania
THE ANCIENT ILLYRIANS

Mystery enshrouds the exact origins of today's Albanians. Most historians of the Balkans believe the Albanian people are in large part descendants of the ancient Illyrians, who, like other Balkan peoples, were subdivided into tribes and clans. The name Albania is derived from the name of an Illyrian tribe called the Arber, or Arbereshë, and later Albanoi, that lived near Durrës.
Linc:
http://lcweb2.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/r?frd/cstdy:@field(DOCID+al0014)
U.S. Department of State
PEOPLE AND HISTORY

….Scholars believe the Albanian people are descended from a non-Slavic, non-Turkic group of tribes known as Illyrians, who arrived in the Balkans around 2000 BC…..
http://www.state.gov/r/pa/ei/bgn/3235.htm

ENCYCLOPEDIA BRITANICA
…..The origins of the Albanian people are not definitely known, but data drawn from history and from linguistic, archaeological, and anthropological studies have led to the conclusion that Albanians are the direct descendants of the ancient Illyrians and that the latter were natives of the lands they inhabited. Similarly, the Albanian language derives from the language of the Illyrians, the transition from Illyrian to Albanian apparently occurring between the 4th and 6th centuries AD…..
http://www.britannica.com/eb/article-42640/Albania

The Columbia Encyclopedia, 2007

Historic Albania

The Albanians are reputedly descendants of Illyrian and Thracian tribes that settled the region in ancient times. The area then comprised parts of Illyria and Epirus and was known to the ancient Greeks for its mines. The coastal towns, Epidamnus (Durrës) and Apollonia , were colonies of Corcyra (Kérkira) and Corinth, but the interior formed an independent kingdom that reached its height in the 3d cent. AD

After the division (395) of the Roman Empire, Albania passed to Byzantium. While nominally (until 1347) under Byzantine rule, N Albania was invaded (7th cent.) by the Serbs, and S Albania was annexed (9th cent.) by Bulgaria. In 101 were continued by the Neapolitan Angevins; in 1272, Charles I of Naples was proclaimed king of Albania. In the 14th cent., however, the Serbs under Stephen Dušan conquered most of the country…….
http://www.bartleby.com/65/al/Albania.html

ENCARTA ENCYCLOPEDIA
Illyria
Encyclopedia Article
….Illyria, ancient region of Europe which, at its greatest extent, included the western part of the Balkan Peninsula from the Danube River to Epirus. About 1300 BC, Illyrians, people of Indo-European stock who are considered ancestors of modern Albanians, settled on the northern and eastern coasts of the Adriatic Sea. Included among them were the Dalmatians and the Pannonians.
http://encarta.msn.com/encyclopedia_761564668/Illyria.html

Dear Jovan, I guess you need more.

Paddy,

What could give Ireland to NATO anyway?

Supevised or unsupervised it does not matter as long as Kosovo is indipendent from Serbia.
For Kosovo Albanians is not important who they are supervised from as long as it is not Serbia or the big sister Russia.
For Kosovo Albanians any kind of freedom is better then being under Serbian umbrella.
They have tried it and they did not like it.
So you see what the problem is?
The problem is the way you
Serbs treatd Kosovo Albanians. You are never going to have another chance even if really you are trying to make things better, which I personaly doubt.

Lazer,

I fully agree with you. Attacking the US policy, badmouthing the US never helped. Milosevic and Saddam did that. You know the rest.
The more statements like these from Kostunica the better for the Albanians of Kosova.

Kostunica only gets away with this kind of pedantic rhetoric because most people have not read Annex 11 - READ it please - it gives the International MIlitary presence final authority "in theatre regarding interpretation of those aspects of the Settlement which refer to IMP" -- It in no ways puts IMP in a position of authority over the ICR or Kosovo authorities.

Lazer,

My approving comment was suppressed by B92. With more pressure and censure from "above" (ment government) B92 resorts to censure more and more. At least 2/3 of my comments get suppressed. I am glad that yours get through but how long?

"My advice to Kosova Serbs is to "love the one you're with." Embrace the state of Kosova and accept Ahtisaari plan. "

Blerim Rexhaj

Hehe, you have repeated my words. I wish it was that simple that both sides say yes.

YES, supervised independence with NATO as the final authority, or even something else it can not be worst than staying inside the serbija borders. The worst scenario without serbija is better than any other scenario staying under serbija rule.

Joe, some of my comments have been edited in the past, but most dont.
That is 'cause I writte realisticaly and with facts, and have an insight in policy of USA and as well know the Serbian Political strategy.
I also am not a Serb hater, I like all the nations of former Yugo, and what happened in Bosnia, Croatis and Kosova/o is works of a mad man who really thought he will get away with it.
As a matter of fact I think he created all the wars so he can robb the National Bank of Yugoslavia, where there were missing about 23 BILLION US $$$.
That is why people in Serbia and all over Yugoslavia have been living in half poverty and miserable conditions. He basicaly applied the Russian model of Catherine the Great who also spent the treasure of Russia hiring the italian renesance painters and sculptors to do things for her. This way she robbed the later generations of Russians their future. And Russia was so poor that Communism took over, YOU KNOW THE REST.
Now a days its people like Koshtunica who are throwing Serbia in poverty, and he is trying through Kosova/o to stay in power and cause problems, but lets wait and see.
There is an old say:
"Give him enough rope and he will hang himself".
America has not gotten serious yet with him, and America has not tightened the screws yet.
That will come...US goes slow, very slow, but once they get you...ITS OVER!!!

"Such policy is "aimed at preventing Kosovo Albanians from accepting a compromise solution," the prime minister said."

Mr. Kostunica what are you saying. Do you evene listen to the words that are coming from your mouth. If you and your ministers are really able to come with a real compromise, then that would mean you've already convinced the Albanians and they have accepted that that specific solution is a compromise. How in can you prevent someone from not accepting a compromise is beyond logic? Why would someone not accept a real compromise when that means better lives for everyone. Unless we're not really talking about compromise but some solution which Kostunica has in mind, labels it a compromise and and wants to force Albanians to accept it and call it a compromise because it is politically good for him. Then one could just as easily talk about Russia preventing Serbs from accepting the compromise Mr. Ahtisari came up with.
I gotta say though great PR from Kostunica for internal consumption. He'll be soon working with Schroeder for the Russian gas company,Gasprom.

Anyways, I want to thank the Serb friend and our international friend here for warning us Albanians against the NATO. If it wasn't for Serbia, NATO would have killed more than 10 000 Albanian civilians and it would have ethnically cleansed more than 1 million Albanians. However Serbia put a stop to NATO crimes by bombing NATO. Thanks to Serbia now we live in peace, out lives are not at risk from NATO, and we can make decisions for our own. thank you Serbia for once and forever getting rid of NATO for us and saving us Albanians from NATO. For those of you who still don't get it; it is supposed to be ironic.

Thanks to Milloshevic and Koshtunica Kosova will be the newest independent country in the world.
Serbia will never join the European Union without recognising Kosova. These irresponsible leaders are creating a big problem for their future of their own people.

Hej I thought thet Milosevic is dad already or I was wrong, can somebody tell me or I am the only one confused here. If he is still alive and still runing Serbia.

Nowadays, 8 years after the bombing of Serbia, most of the involved countries feel ashamed what they did. They bombed a sovereign European state because of an internal conflict. Yes, a conflict, not a war. A few people call it a war with war heroes and such nonsence, but it was a conflict, nothing more, nothing less. You seldom hear any European country speak about this because we feel guilt. Most diplomats, high level officials and even military leaders today say that it was a huge failure and mistake. The product of this mess is a small landlocked, dirty place called Kosovo/a. This small piece of land is sinked in criminality (every intelligence bureau on this globe knows exactly what is going on with prostitution, weapons, drugs, money-laundering, smuggling etc etc and who is behind it and who is linked to it.) The mess created is also a huge problem to UN, US, EU and Russia. Its like a Catch 22 (Joseph Heller, 1961). How ever you do now, it will be bad. One thing that most openeyed people see today are that there will not be any 1. Pre 1999 situation and 2. Kosovo/a will NOT be a new country (independence). This is for sure and absolutely obvious. In my opinion, not much will really happen. It will be a frozen conflict like many others in the world. Also, I am not so sure anymore (I was sure before) that US will say yes to unilateral independence whe the time comes.

Peter Sudyka wrote "Why can't it be like in an ideal world where you guys agree on something and everyone lives happily ever after?"

-In Kosova we all agree on the fact that we all like Vanilla. There is no fear for serbs to be a minority in Kosova because they will be a majority in the north and other serb enclaves. Being a majority means that policemen, police chiefs, judges, teachers and any other relevant community worker will be a serb. Nobody will be able to do any harm to serbs. This is all under Ahtisaari plan. Serb people should favor this plan because it serves them well. anyway, what would the future of Kosova will be time will tell. It is likely that Kosova will declare independece, be recognized by U. S. Britain, France and majority of EU. It is also likely that status of serbs in Kosova might get compromised if they do not support its independence. My advice to Kosova Serbs is to "love the one you're with." Embrace the state of Kosova and accept Ahtisaari plan. And, of course, Albanians and Serbs will continue to agree on the fact that they both like Vanilla. However, Mr. Kostunica does not know this yet!!!

Just ahead Kostunica, here we are again with a 15%... I thought was forgotten.

Kosova will, also not allow or acknowledge the setting up an illegal occupation of its territory – NEVER. We are free and democratic, so if you want good neighborly relations here we are, if not you can proceed on your own, but will not let you drag us down with you! Not any longer!

EA, instead of telling us the same old story why not going to Belgrade and tell 'em your point of view!?!

Then since you are in a moment of confusion I suggest you "?" Restaurant the oldest and best in Beograd!

Fair play to Kostunica, his comments sound reasonable. US policy on Kosovo is a bad Orwellian joke. I also take heart from his comments about NATO, it is good to hear a European statesman speak in such a way about that fig-leaf for American hegemony. Please Serbia, do not join NATO, be like us here in Ireland!

I supported the NATO humanitarian intervention. I did not support a NATO invasion to grab land. NATO will lose it's humanitarian credentials.

Contrary to myth, not all Serbs are Milosevic lovers - he is is actively detested by most that I know! NATO did a favour to Serbia by making his position untenable. That was not a justification for the current land grab - Serbia is democratic and moving in the right direction (although it is time someone was brave enough to arrest Mladic).

An independent Kosovo is a wrong solution. Why not an independent Serb republic within Bosnia or an independent Krijina (the Serbs there had a better case that the Albanians in Kosovo)?

The Albanians blame the Serbs but actually they never wanted integration - they have been ethnically cleansing Kosovo of Serbs for years.

An independent Kosovo will be within Serbian borders - it's existence will not be legal and it will not be for all time. It will be independent in name but territorially insecure forever.

The best way forward is an agreed solution that gives autonomy to the region and which guarantees progress for all within the EU.

The US has not been heard to address the issues within Serbia - they behave in an imperious (if not imperial) fashion.

It is very sickening, this so called foreign policy of the U.S.. But remember, they supported Afghanistan, Iraq and Iran, then later they bombed Afghanistan, Iraq and now are about to bomb Iran. So yes, just let the ethnic albanians follow their islamic brothers strategy and using the U.S. support.

If I were an Albanian who wanted independence I would be very concerned by this: "Annex 11 of the Ahtisaari plan explicitly says that NATO is the final body of authority in Kosovo."

Notice that NATO is the final authority -- not the elected ethnic Albanian officials. What sort of "independence" is this? Ah yes, it is "supervised independence" which means no independence at all.

Too many people look at the Kosovo status process through the narrow prism of Serb or Albanian interests, but not through the prism that is dictating events -- NATO interests.

NATO doesn't care about Albanians, it just wants to base itself in Kosovo so that it can attack Eurasia and the Middle East if it decides to.

The Americans are being friendly with the Albanians right now, but the Americans have a nasty habit of turning against their friends. As soon as the Albanians get their own ideas about how Kosovo ought to be run, you'll see that relationship sour.

I'm sure Saddam Hussein (if the Americans hadn't had him killed) and Manuel Noriega could tell you all about American friendship.

Paddy,

What could give Ireland to NATO anyway?

Go Vojo Go!!! I've been very disappointed lately by the Serbian politicians to the extent I crticized the entire process. Here's one Serb politician and a true statesman who tells it like it is. With politicians like him around, the Albanian illusion will soon become a thing of the past. I'm a believer once again!!!

With this kind of retoric, I believe that Serbia and its citizens are on the right path to EU. This is exactly what other Europeans have been thinking and still think about U.S., especially after WWII, when U.S. with its brutal policy saved Europe from Nazis and from becoming a "communist garden" like the unfortunate half of Europe, that now is still sees U.S. as the force behind freedom from KGB-type leaders like Putin and Co.

Good luck!

Uping up the ante is not going to help Koshtunica and his DSS cronies.
Usually people who attack US policy dont get too far either.
He knows the fact that Kosova/o will be INDEPENDENT, and NOTHING he can do or not do!
If, he was smart, he would not make these kind of comments. America knows the notion of GOOD COP, BAD COP, for a very long time. Actually it was created in America.

Lazer,

I fully agree with you. Attacking the US policy, badmouthing the US never helped. Milosevic and Saddam did that. You know the rest.
The more statements like these from Kostunica the better for the Albanians of Kosova.

Supevised or unsupervised it does not matter as long as Kosovo is indipendent from Serbia.
For Kosovo Albanians is not important who they are supervised from as long as it is not Serbia or the big sister Russia.
For Kosovo Albanians any kind of freedom is better then being under Serbian umbrella.
They have tried it and they did not like it.
So you see what the problem is?
The problem is the way you
Serbs treatd Kosovo Albanians. You are never going to have another chance even if really you are trying to make things better, which I personaly doubt.

Bob,

Lets not forget that Serbs only turned on Milosevic when poverty and unemployment came knocking in the door. Milosevic was ousted for corruption and other economic reasons, his crimes against humanity were not one of the reasons the people who ousted him had in mind.

Kostunica is the same as Milosevic. In fact i think he's worse than Milosevic, because unlike him, i sometimes think Kosunica really believes what he's saying.

Lazer,

My approving comment was suppressed by B92. With more pressure and censure from "above" (ment government) B92 resorts to censure more and more. At least 2/3 of my comments get suppressed. I am glad that yours get through but how long?

YES, supervised independence with NATO as the final authority, or even something else it can not be worst than staying inside the serbija borders. The worst scenario without serbija is better than any other scenario staying under serbija rule.

I am not surprised that Kostunica is saying these things, any politician who is confronted with a part of his country being given independence would say them.

I just wonder how it will be if Kosovo does get independence and then the Serbs north of the Ibar River begin threatening with separatism (they too have their reasons, fear of living as a Serb minority in an Albanian country etc.), what exactly will happen then.

This is why probably any outcome after Dec 10 might open up a can of worms as the British might say and why I always hope in the back of my mind that an agreement will be reached before the deadline.

Why can't it be like in an ideal world where you guys agree on something and everyone lives happily ever after?

I, and Jovan had this covrsacion:

"Albanians have more than 4000 years in Balkan."

written by "m.h."
…………
dear m.h.:

I can understand that you desperately wish that to be true... but,unfortunately the Illyrian myth is simply an Albanian dream! Your "friends" the Americans de-mystified that invention...and have scientifically proven that you came from the Caucasus at the same time as the Serbs arrived in the Balkans.

so, these attempts to present yourself as the native owners of that part of Europe is only a lousy joke.

by the way, did you know that the Slovenians call themselves the descendants of the Illyrians?
(Jovan, 13. October 2007 20:48)
Jovan, Check out.
The Library of Congress
Albania
THE ANCIENT ILLYRIANS

Mystery enshrouds the exact origins of today's Albanians. Most historians of the Balkans believe the Albanian people are in large part descendants of the ancient Illyrians, who, like other Balkan peoples, were subdivided into tribes and clans. The name Albania is derived from the name of an Illyrian tribe called the Arber, or Arbereshë, and later Albanoi, that lived near Durrës.
Linc:
http://lcweb2.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/r?frd/cstdy:@field(DOCID+al0014)
U.S. Department of State
PEOPLE AND HISTORY

….Scholars believe the Albanian people are descended from a non-Slavic, non-Turkic group of tribes known as Illyrians, who arrived in the Balkans around 2000 BC…..
http://www.state.gov/r/pa/ei/bgn/3235.htm

ENCYCLOPEDIA BRITANICA
…..The origins of the Albanian people are not definitely known, but data drawn from history and from linguistic, archaeological, and anthropological studies have led to the conclusion that Albanians are the direct descendants of the ancient Illyrians and that the latter were natives of the lands they inhabited. Similarly, the Albanian language derives from the language of the Illyrians, the transition from Illyrian to Albanian apparently occurring between the 4th and 6th centuries AD…..
http://www.britannica.com/eb/article-42640/Albania

The Columbia Encyclopedia, 2007

Historic Albania

The Albanians are reputedly descendants of Illyrian and Thracian tribes that settled the region in ancient times. The area then comprised parts of Illyria and Epirus and was known to the ancient Greeks for its mines. The coastal towns, Epidamnus (Durrës) and Apollonia , were colonies of Corcyra (Kérkira) and Corinth, but the interior formed an independent kingdom that reached its height in the 3d cent. AD

After the division (395) of the Roman Empire, Albania passed to Byzantium. While nominally (until 1347) under Byzantine rule, N Albania was invaded (7th cent.) by the Serbs, and S Albania was annexed (9th cent.) by Bulgaria. In 101 were continued by the Neapolitan Angevins; in 1272, Charles I of Naples was proclaimed king of Albania. In the 14th cent., however, the Serbs under Stephen Dušan conquered most of the country…….
http://www.bartleby.com/65/al/Albania.html

ENCARTA ENCYCLOPEDIA
Illyria
Encyclopedia Article
….Illyria, ancient region of Europe which, at its greatest extent, included the western part of the Balkan Peninsula from the Danube River to Epirus. About 1300 BC, Illyrians, people of Indo-European stock who are considered ancestors of modern Albanians, settled on the northern and eastern coasts of the Adriatic Sea. Included among them were the Dalmatians and the Pannonians.
http://encarta.msn.com/encyclopedia_761564668/Illyria.html

Dear Jovan, I guess you need more.

It is Prime Minister Vojislav Kostunica's duty and right to remind the US everyday, if need be, that Kosovo and Metohija is part of sovereign territory of Serbia. To remind the US everyday that 15% of Serbian territory cannot be taken away from the Serbian nation.
That international law over-rides every force.
That broad autonomy is the best and only solution for the ethnic Albanians living in Kosovo and Metohija.
That the Serbs living in Kosovo and Metohija have the right to live in Serbia and not forced somewhere else.

Kostunica only gets away with this kind of pedantic rhetoric because most people have not read Annex 11 - READ it please - it gives the International MIlitary presence final authority "in theatre regarding interpretation of those aspects of the Settlement which refer to IMP" -- It in no ways puts IMP in a position of authority over the ICR or Kosovo authorities.

"Paddy,

What could give Ireland to NATO anyway?
(Joe, 16. October 2007 22:34)"

Joe, a little bit of info for your benefit. We were asked to join NATO on many occasions but we turned them down on each one. As I recall, the last time NATO asked us to join was in the late 1980's and it was flatly turned down. What benefit do we have of joining an increasingly irrelevant alliance that looks out of place in today's world. Ireland has followed a very successful policy of neutrality since independence in 1922 and we have no desire to fight and die for the latest US resource war.

"My advice to Kosova Serbs is to "love the one you're with." Embrace the state of Kosova and accept Ahtisaari plan. "

Blerim Rexhaj

Hehe, you have repeated my words. I wish it was that simple that both sides say yes.

oh my dear mh...

I checked your "sources" ..and now I am really confident. if all Albanians rely on this kind of "scientific" proof... then everything will be fine! =)

you should do your "research" a little bit more properly, I guess.

check the archeological faculty of Chicago, their archeologists together with historians went to southern Serbia in the late 1980´s and found no, but ...really no single sign whatsoever that would indicate any albanian connection to the illyrians or furthermore to that region.

posting "sources" that speak of a "reputedly" illyrian descent indicates that your really WISH to be a descendant of the illyrians.

if that is all you can present, my dear mh, better let it be. you would only be disappointed of the outcome of a real research.

last but not least, thank you for providing those links. you are perfectly displaying how weak those arguments are, on which the Albanians illegal demands are based.

you did a good job against the illegal grab of serbian land!
thanks for that!

Predictor
Well too bad. Because looks like it is autonomy all the way.

CCCC

European,

Please read Annex 9 and 11. Annex 9 gives final authority on all civilian matters to the ICR (international civilian representative, i.e. NATO), and Annex 11 gives final authoritry on all military matters to the IMP (international military presence, i.e. NATO).

It's no wonder why the Americans and NATO support the Ahtisaari plan -- it gives them total control over Kosovo. They get to occupy the territory and push the local government around without having to worry about the welfare of the population.

You can't talk about any "independence" under the Ahtisaari plan. The only thing you can talk about is a NATO-installed dictatorship.

The Albanians are only supporting this plan because most of them don't understand what it is. They think they're going to get independence, but they're not going to.

We have a saying in America "cutting off ones nose to spite ones face", and that is precisely what the Albanians are doing in Kosovo.

Serbia is offering them more autonomy, less oversight, and even greater self government than the Ahtisaari plan, but they won't take it because they want to spite Serbia worse than they want meaningful self government or a functioning economy.

Joe, some of my comments have been edited in the past, but most dont.
That is 'cause I writte realisticaly and with facts, and have an insight in policy of USA and as well know the Serbian Political strategy.
I also am not a Serb hater, I like all the nations of former Yugo, and what happened in Bosnia, Croatis and Kosova/o is works of a mad man who really thought he will get away with it.
As a matter of fact I think he created all the wars so he can robb the National Bank of Yugoslavia, where there were missing about 23 BILLION US $$$.
That is why people in Serbia and all over Yugoslavia have been living in half poverty and miserable conditions. He basicaly applied the Russian model of Catherine the Great who also spent the treasure of Russia hiring the italian renesance painters and sculptors to do things for her. This way she robbed the later generations of Russians their future. And Russia was so poor that Communism took over, YOU KNOW THE REST.
Now a days its people like Koshtunica who are throwing Serbia in poverty, and he is trying through Kosova/o to stay in power and cause problems, but lets wait and see.
There is an old say:
"Give him enough rope and he will hang himself".
America has not gotten serious yet with him, and America has not tightened the screws yet.
That will come...US goes slow, very slow, but once they get you...ITS OVER!!!

"Such policy is "aimed at preventing Kosovo Albanians from accepting a compromise solution," the prime minister said."

Mr. Kostunica what are you saying. Do you evene listen to the words that are coming from your mouth. If you and your ministers are really able to come with a real compromise, then that would mean you've already convinced the Albanians and they have accepted that that specific solution is a compromise. How in can you prevent someone from not accepting a compromise is beyond logic? Why would someone not accept a real compromise when that means better lives for everyone. Unless we're not really talking about compromise but some solution which Kostunica has in mind, labels it a compromise and and wants to force Albanians to accept it and call it a compromise because it is politically good for him. Then one could just as easily talk about Russia preventing Serbs from accepting the compromise Mr. Ahtisari came up with.
I gotta say though great PR from Kostunica for internal consumption. He'll be soon working with Schroeder for the Russian gas company,Gasprom.

Anyways, I want to thank the Serb friend and our international friend here for warning us Albanians against the NATO. If it wasn't for Serbia, NATO would have killed more than 10 000 Albanian civilians and it would have ethnically cleansed more than 1 million Albanians. However Serbia put a stop to NATO crimes by bombing NATO. Thanks to Serbia now we live in peace, out lives are not at risk from NATO, and we can make decisions for our own. thank you Serbia for once and forever getting rid of NATO for us and saving us Albanians from NATO. For those of you who still don't get it; it is supposed to be ironic.