Croatia goes after cleared Vukovar officer

They all trumpet the Hague but when they dont get the result they want it's an outcry. Sorry, but it go all your way Mr. Ivo "Jasenovac never happened, let's all cry about Bleiburg instead" Sanader.

If Gotovina is cleared or gets set free.....the Hague will be your favourite example of justice again wont it!

The Hague is a double edged sword...deal with it!

Victor you are sounding like an emotially scratched record who isnt interested in the facts.

First fact is that Radic was a captain not a general.

The second fact is that the evidence produced is all there for you to see in the Hague transcrips.

So if you 'cannot understand on which ground the judges could let go this general (captain) who was in Vukovar the day 300 patients were remove from the hospital' I advise you to read the sumnation of the verdict or the transcripts. You will understand then. Or is it a case of you not wanting to understand because its easier (more black / white) that way?

Stop acting emotionally and start checking the facts. That is, I have to say, a common problem of yours even if you seem to not be a bad sort.

croatia should go after their own war criminals, and make a real apology for all the crimes they have committed upon Serbs!

They need to worry about how to enable Serbs to return to their land, and build them the homes they destroyed when they ethnically clensed them from croatia.

Bravo Mr Sanader, all perpetrators should be punished! Please look into the file of the retired Croatian general, Petar Stipetic - his "Command Responsibilities" for the killing og several refugees in the Glina region, August 1995, has never been a subject of interest. Please make justice rule your country before you knock the door to EU.

«Ivo Sanader said that an international warrant for the arrest of Miroslav Radić will be issued.»

I agree with Mr Sanader. I cannot understand on which ground the judges could let go this general who was in Vukovar the day 300 patients were remove from the hospital. At least, he could have used his 'power of dissuasion' and explained to others that there are rules of wars that protect people in an hospital!

How come General Radic was not more aggressive for basic justice on that day?

Man, it seems like Victor witnesses everything first hand. You should be a witness at the trials!

'Man, it seems like Victor witnesses everything first hand. '

Milan,

Common sense is at times just more credible than the 'established' evidence. I have doubts that 'CAPTAIN RADIC' was on the terrain the day this massacre was committed and he has nothing to do with it. Even though there is no 'evidence' against Captain Radic, it does not mean that he did not participate in the massacre.

"Even though there is no 'evidence' against Captain Radic, it does not mean that he did not participate in the massacre."

Yeah, Victor! Who needs evidence when you have popular opinion? I mean, common sense tells you the Earth is flat!

They can try him as long as he's given a fair trial and their court isn't biased. But we all know in Croatian courts he'd be guilty until proven innocent, and even if proven innocent he'd still be sentenced to at least 20 years.

Victor always uses exaggerating numbers and counts soldiers as civilians.

There were dead Serb civilians piles all around Vukovar from what those Croat forces did before they fled to the hospital to hide from the Serb troops.

They were scared to fight against other soldiers but sure butchered the Serb civilians - pictures of these butchered Serb civilians, identified are on the internet.

Victor,

do you remember we read two days ago a report like this:
(Ramush Haradinaj in court in the Hague, accused -among other things- of responsibility to the murder of a albanian girl)
"The prosecution claims that the KLA units from Barane were under the command of Ramush Haradinaj, who addressed them when they were "sworn in" on July 20 1998 in the make-shift barracks in the village.

"[Wittness] Shaban Balaj, however, denied that Haradinaj is responsible, claiming that his sister was killed by "self-proclaimed commanders who were not under anyone’s control.".

He told the judges he was "sure Ramush would never have allowed such a crime."

Maybe The Hague court believed that neither Radic "would never have allowed such a crime [as he was accused of]"...

I remember when - many years ago - a Serb woman said me "It is absolutely impossible that Serb soldiers could make the attrocities of which they are accused of."
Two or three days later I was told the very same thing, now by a Croat man about Croatian soldiers.

I only could conclude that neither Serbs nor Croats know their own people. I wonder if that is the case with K-Albanians, too?

«They were scared to fight against other soldiers but sure butchered the Serb civilians»

Ida,

do you have proofs to support such an accucation? And even though they had killed civilians, at the minute that they surrendered, they were POW, and were protected by international laws and the Geneva Convention. Captain Radic knew this, just as his buddies the two generals but, on the presumption that the «had killed Serb civilians»(sic), they decided that they should be executed without formal proofs! Don't you find this a terrible denial of justice?

Ratko, Croatia does go after croats who have commited crimes against Serbs. The fact that there are more serb war criminals than croat does not mean croatian war criminals have gotten away with their crimes.
There are those that have been convicted and also there are ones awaiting trial. There have been many serbs who have been trialled in Croatia and found NOT GUILTY also. Radic will be extradited to Croatia.

I wont deny there have been hate crimes and revenge crimes against innocent serbs but facts are that serb military was in croatia and not vice versa and when u have a military in foreign country, it never looks good and is illegal according international law. And this was after UN recognision of Croatia. We are also not talking about JNA but also serb palamilitaries. Serbs blatantly violated UN human rights laws and no amount of mud-throwing will change that. Vukovar was significantly destroyed and images and proof of this will never disappear no matter how much denial there is.

Those killed in Ovcara were not killing during combat Ida, they were killed as unarmed and crippled prisoners of war which is against Geneva convention. Even serb government doesnt deny this.

As for apologies Ratko, as I said, serb military was in croatia and until that is apologised for, and until destruction of Vukovar is apologised for, there will be nothing coming from Croatia. Nor should it first. they should deny everything until serbs stop doing so. Babic was only man who did this and his testimony will always be around

Those killed in Ovcara were not killing during combat «Ida, they were killed as unarmed and crippled prisoners of war which is against Geneva convention. Even serb government doesnt deny this.»

Could you comment on this Ida?

I already posted this in another comment section. But I think it is interesting how some people here are praising international law as fair, just and right. Yet when outcomes are not favourable, all of a sudden the Hague court representing this "international law" is biased and run by American propaganda ;)

It is very interesting to see Croats expectations. Their expectations are completely unrealistic, it seems that Croats are living in a fantasy world where the sun revolves around them. If Radic was given a fair and unbiased trial which we all can hope happens at the Hague, probably more so then anywhere else, then Croatian popular opinion is completely invalid. I feel like I am reading the USA medias portrayal, completely run by yrs of propaganda.

Basic rule of law is if you do not have evidence against someone, you cannot assume he is guilty and that is what probably happened. Unfortunately thats the way it is or should I say fortunately. Indisputable evidence is the only way that you can win a case, stories and ferry tales will not work, no matter how much you try to convince the world they are true.

If he stood there and watched what happened, it is no guilt of his, we cannot judge him unless he was the one who pulled the trigger, which according to the Hague verdict he obviously didn't. How would each one of us react in such a situation? Can you say that you would defy your commanding officer in such a war? Why don't American soldiers do it in Iraq since the whole world knows that US war there is illegal. It is because that is the way the military system works, period. You usually do not question you are a pawn and you do as you are told. Nice try Victor, you are really are and interesting character, but you just constantly speak into the wind, it seems that nothing constructive or productive comes out of you , even though you seem to be fairly educated. Your emotions however make you sound irrelevant.

One question for Victor.
What are you expectations for such a trial?

Execute all prisoners without due process, just as the fate of civilians from this unfortunate war?

I would be very worried if Victor was my judge and jury .

«Victor, you are really are and interesting character, but you just constantly speak into the wind, it seems that nothing constructive or productive comes out of you , even though you seem to be fairly educated. Your emotions however make you sound irrelevant.»

Judge not, and you shall not be judged. Condemn not, and you shall not be condemned.

«Ivo Sanader said that an international warrant for the arrest of Miroslav Radić will be issued.»

I agree with Mr Sanader. I cannot understand on which ground the judges could let go this general who was in Vukovar the day 300 patients were remove from the hospital. At least, he could have used his 'power of dissuasion' and explained to others that there are rules of wars that protect people in an hospital!

How come General Radic was not more aggressive for basic justice on that day?

Victor always uses exaggerating numbers and counts soldiers as civilians.

There were dead Serb civilians piles all around Vukovar from what those Croat forces did before they fled to the hospital to hide from the Serb troops.

They were scared to fight against other soldiers but sure butchered the Serb civilians - pictures of these butchered Serb civilians, identified are on the internet.

Bravo Mr Sanader, all perpetrators should be punished! Please look into the file of the retired Croatian general, Petar Stipetic - his "Command Responsibilities" for the killing og several refugees in the Glina region, August 1995, has never been a subject of interest. Please make justice rule your country before you knock the door to EU.

'Man, it seems like Victor witnesses everything first hand. '

Milan,

Common sense is at times just more credible than the 'established' evidence. I have doubts that 'CAPTAIN RADIC' was on the terrain the day this massacre was committed and he has nothing to do with it. Even though there is no 'evidence' against Captain Radic, it does not mean that he did not participate in the massacre.

«They were scared to fight against other soldiers but sure butchered the Serb civilians»

Ida,

do you have proofs to support such an accucation? And even though they had killed civilians, at the minute that they surrendered, they were POW, and were protected by international laws and the Geneva Convention. Captain Radic knew this, just as his buddies the two generals but, on the presumption that the «had killed Serb civilians»(sic), they decided that they should be executed without formal proofs! Don't you find this a terrible denial of justice?

They all trumpet the Hague but when they dont get the result they want it's an outcry. Sorry, but it go all your way Mr. Ivo "Jasenovac never happened, let's all cry about Bleiburg instead" Sanader.

If Gotovina is cleared or gets set free.....the Hague will be your favourite example of justice again wont it!

The Hague is a double edged sword...deal with it!

Victor you are sounding like an emotially scratched record who isnt interested in the facts.

First fact is that Radic was a captain not a general.

The second fact is that the evidence produced is all there for you to see in the Hague transcrips.

So if you 'cannot understand on which ground the judges could let go this general (captain) who was in Vukovar the day 300 patients were remove from the hospital' I advise you to read the sumnation of the verdict or the transcripts. You will understand then. Or is it a case of you not wanting to understand because its easier (more black / white) that way?

Stop acting emotionally and start checking the facts. That is, I have to say, a common problem of yours even if you seem to not be a bad sort.

Victor,

do you remember we read two days ago a report like this:
(Ramush Haradinaj in court in the Hague, accused -among other things- of responsibility to the murder of a albanian girl)
"The prosecution claims that the KLA units from Barane were under the command of Ramush Haradinaj, who addressed them when they were "sworn in" on July 20 1998 in the make-shift barracks in the village.

"[Wittness] Shaban Balaj, however, denied that Haradinaj is responsible, claiming that his sister was killed by "self-proclaimed commanders who were not under anyone’s control.".

He told the judges he was "sure Ramush would never have allowed such a crime."

Maybe The Hague court believed that neither Radic "would never have allowed such a crime [as he was accused of]"...

I remember when - many years ago - a Serb woman said me "It is absolutely impossible that Serb soldiers could make the attrocities of which they are accused of."
Two or three days later I was told the very same thing, now by a Croat man about Croatian soldiers.

I only could conclude that neither Serbs nor Croats know their own people. I wonder if that is the case with K-Albanians, too?

croatia should go after their own war criminals, and make a real apology for all the crimes they have committed upon Serbs!

They need to worry about how to enable Serbs to return to their land, and build them the homes they destroyed when they ethnically clensed them from croatia.

Man, it seems like Victor witnesses everything first hand. You should be a witness at the trials!

"Even though there is no 'evidence' against Captain Radic, it does not mean that he did not participate in the massacre."

Yeah, Victor! Who needs evidence when you have popular opinion? I mean, common sense tells you the Earth is flat!

They can try him as long as he's given a fair trial and their court isn't biased. But we all know in Croatian courts he'd be guilty until proven innocent, and even if proven innocent he'd still be sentenced to at least 20 years.

It is very interesting to see Croats expectations. Their expectations are completely unrealistic, it seems that Croats are living in a fantasy world where the sun revolves around them. If Radic was given a fair and unbiased trial which we all can hope happens at the Hague, probably more so then anywhere else, then Croatian popular opinion is completely invalid. I feel like I am reading the USA medias portrayal, completely run by yrs of propaganda.

Basic rule of law is if you do not have evidence against someone, you cannot assume he is guilty and that is what probably happened. Unfortunately thats the way it is or should I say fortunately. Indisputable evidence is the only way that you can win a case, stories and ferry tales will not work, no matter how much you try to convince the world they are true.

If he stood there and watched what happened, it is no guilt of his, we cannot judge him unless he was the one who pulled the trigger, which according to the Hague verdict he obviously didn't. How would each one of us react in such a situation? Can you say that you would defy your commanding officer in such a war? Why don't American soldiers do it in Iraq since the whole world knows that US war there is illegal. It is because that is the way the military system works, period. You usually do not question you are a pawn and you do as you are told. Nice try Victor, you are really are and interesting character, but you just constantly speak into the wind, it seems that nothing constructive or productive comes out of you , even though you seem to be fairly educated. Your emotions however make you sound irrelevant.

One question for Victor.
What are you expectations for such a trial?

Execute all prisoners without due process, just as the fate of civilians from this unfortunate war?

I would be very worried if Victor was my judge and jury .

Ratko, Croatia does go after croats who have commited crimes against Serbs. The fact that there are more serb war criminals than croat does not mean croatian war criminals have gotten away with their crimes.
There are those that have been convicted and also there are ones awaiting trial. There have been many serbs who have been trialled in Croatia and found NOT GUILTY also. Radic will be extradited to Croatia.

I wont deny there have been hate crimes and revenge crimes against innocent serbs but facts are that serb military was in croatia and not vice versa and when u have a military in foreign country, it never looks good and is illegal according international law. And this was after UN recognision of Croatia. We are also not talking about JNA but also serb palamilitaries. Serbs blatantly violated UN human rights laws and no amount of mud-throwing will change that. Vukovar was significantly destroyed and images and proof of this will never disappear no matter how much denial there is.

Those killed in Ovcara were not killing during combat Ida, they were killed as unarmed and crippled prisoners of war which is against Geneva convention. Even serb government doesnt deny this.

As for apologies Ratko, as I said, serb military was in croatia and until that is apologised for, and until destruction of Vukovar is apologised for, there will be nothing coming from Croatia. Nor should it first. they should deny everything until serbs stop doing so. Babic was only man who did this and his testimony will always be around

«Victor, you are really are and interesting character, but you just constantly speak into the wind, it seems that nothing constructive or productive comes out of you , even though you seem to be fairly educated. Your emotions however make you sound irrelevant.»

Judge not, and you shall not be judged. Condemn not, and you shall not be condemned.

Those killed in Ovcara were not killing during combat «Ida, they were killed as unarmed and crippled prisoners of war which is against Geneva convention. Even serb government doesnt deny this.»

Could you comment on this Ida?

I already posted this in another comment section. But I think it is interesting how some people here are praising international law as fair, just and right. Yet when outcomes are not favourable, all of a sudden the Hague court representing this "international law" is biased and run by American propaganda ;)