Russian patriarch: Kosovo sacred for Serbs

Thanks for the offer but no thanks Alexy II. You can not even settle the dispute with your fellow christian in Vatican and never even made an attempt to meet with Pope , and you are offering to negotiate for settlement of Kosova. Forget about it, first set up a meeting with Pope and than we can talk.

It's very good that Alexy is educating Europe on what is really going on in Kosovo - the destruction and attempted eradication of centuries of Serbian culture, destruction of UNESCO heritage sites, Serbs living behind barbed wire, no freedom of movement, no human rights for minorities, daily assaults, intimidation and a brutal ethnic cleansing campaign against Serbs and tacitly supported by the US. This is the wonderful state that the US wants to reward by creating a 'greater albania' on Serbian soil. How they can propose such a thing is unbelievable. No morals, no guilt, I guess.

Surprise,surprise Alexy II is getting involved in politics, helping the world to solve Kosovo problem.
How does he dare to say that people have not been in Kosovo and they do not know about Kosovo.He should help people in Russia first and than talk about EU problems.
He his not any different from Filaret.

He was just reminding the world of muslim hatred of everything christian in Kosovo and albanians ignorance to history.World has to remember how albanians send pictures of his friend reliving himself on Serbian monastery that was build in 11th.century.And protecting this monuments from albanians has to be a priority.

"The Russian Orthodox Church has considerable experience in peace-building and peacemaking, and we stand ready to help" oh thank you Alexei II but I wonder where was your offer during the '90 when your brothers serbs were pursuing an aparthide politics in kosovo? nad what about 1999 almost 1 million people was forced to leave their homes where ware you? As far as it concerns to the people that have nnever been in kosova - i agree with you their opinion should not be considered - thats the case with the utmost majority of the serbs- they have never been in kosova.

It would surely be easier in terms of effort in typing words with their keyboards for all of the above posters to say "I hate Serbs" in their comments and nothing more, and people would get the message without the need for further effort on the part of the writer in writing more or the reader in reading more. They could then 'recommend' each others posts, as well as their own, and be done with it.

This is one of the things which shows that the Serbs are not the only instigators of violence in Kosovo, it is also the Albanian population that needs to take the blame for what happened and what is happening in Kosovo.

It is proof that one cannot favoritize one side due to actions of the other, as both are indeed responsible and both arguments need to be taken into account in order to work towards compromize.

If Kosovo breaks away form Serbia, these age-old churches that are an integral part of the Serbian culture will fall out of their control, and who knows what might happen to them. We have already seen that many of them have been destroyed and that the Albanian population does not have any respect for this culture, and they too need to be saved, as they are a part of European culture, especially considering some of them are UNESCO sites.

If the churches cannot be safe in Kosovo, what does that say about the Serbian population there? Albanians offering friendship? I don't think they will stop vandalizing Serbian churches and assaulting Serbian citizens the moment they gain independence... it is not a solution that will bring stability to the region, that is for sure!

On the other hand, if the opposite happens, Albanians in Serbia also have no guarentee of safety under Serbian control, this I can understand very well from the Albanian perspective, as well as their culture (their mosques etc.).

Now try to find a solution to this problem, hahaha. We have a saying in Poland for exactly this kind of thing and it goes like this:

Bac tu madry i pisz wiersze (which means now be clever and write poems).

"I would like to ask you all to leave the religion aside since it has to do nothing with the religion."

Obviously, there are those in Kosovo who do believe that religion plays a role in the Kosovo issue. We would be naive to believe otherwise.

From the Detoit Free Press newspaper 5/08/07
Mufti Naim Ternava, president of the Islamic Community of Kosovo, is in Michigan 4 months ago. He is quoted as saying…
“Pray for the independence of Kosovo,” The Mufti said, through a translator at the Muslim Center of Detroit. “Thousands of miles away from here, there are Muslim brothers in Kosovo who suffered for many, many years and who…went as shahids (martyrs) during all these sufferings [in Kosovo].” He also urged the crowd to follow the teachings of Islam.
“Islam is such a comprehensive religion which includes all what the family needs and what an individual needs in this world,” he said. “Help others to understand it. Teach it to others.”

1.Thanks anyway Alexei but you can mind your bussines in your homeland,I think you have a lot to do there in matter of Chechens.Has you solved that problem yet?
2. For you Polish commentator: just to remind you that Albanian culture is not founded on Mosques only.

to Agim, the smart expert...

a meeting between the above mentioned russian cleric and the leader of the catholics, namely the pope, was planned, but blown off due to the lack of time of the pope.
so much for your information.

since the Vatican has made clear it favours a compromise within the UN... I would like to know whether you would criticize the Vatican or the pope too?

Seriban Churches and monasteries have a vital role to play to the Kossovo heritage and culture. This also applies to mosques and other muslin shrines.
It is natural for a Christian church leader to advocate to this direction.
those who oppose this kind of statements are those who encourage religious and ethnic division and hatred.
In north Cyprus which is under the Turkish occupation are over 1000 churches that are abandoned to destruction for over 34 years due to the same attidute anf ignorance. K-Albanians and K-Serbs must be protecting these shrines and understand that these belong to their history and culture.
Educate your people and help them understand, do not fill their hearts with poison.

"Peter the churches were never ever attached by albaninas. The only precednt was 2004. If we wanted to destroy them.. brick by brick they wouldn't have existed many years ago...
the kosova issue is very simple it was given to serbia after the WW1. You surely remeber what the german ambasodor in Belgarde told teh serbs in this regard couple a months ago?
(ben, 3. October 2007 12:02) "

I am not blaming all Albanians, this would be stupid. The actions of the Serbs in 1999 were also not performed by the entire population. There are rotten apples anywhere, and they need to be disciplined for such actions. Serbs and Albanians cannot be blamed as a whole for anything that happened, it's always the actions of a small percentage.

Questions is how much bias is attached to these incidents. This is what I mean when I speak of "Serbs" and "Albanians".

I know the story of Kosovo, not sure what the ambassador said, but that is just one opinon I am sure.

"Finally we have the perfect mediator,orthodox,slav in short,totally impartial and with indisputable credentials,anyway better than ahtisaris,straight from god
i guess who is the real hypocrite here this monk or or the valley albanians?!
(Endri, 3. October 2007 12:33) "

I think when something that this man has dedicated his life to is under threat as it is now, I am pretty sure he will respond like he did.

Sometimes, when I read the intolerances of these KiM Albanians, I reach out not for UN resolution 1244, but for John 12:44.

"Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on me, believeth not on me, but on him that sent me."

It is really sad to see many of you that clam to be moderate in your views mixing religion with this conflict. Many postings in here show that the tolerance is really thin and that many are prepared to use a very dangerous card ‘religion ‘ to achieve their goal not being aware of the consequences. People, Kosova issue has to do with Albanians and Serbs not only with Albanians or Serbs. These two nations not matter what the outcome would will have to live next to one another.
I would like to ask you all to leave the religion aside since it has to do nothing with the religion.

Peter the churches were never ever attached by albaninas. The only precednt was 2004. If we wanted to destroy them.. brick by brick they wouldn't have existed many years ago...
the kosova issue is very simple it was given to serbia after the WW1. You surely remeber what the german ambasodor in Belgarde told teh serbs in this regard couple a months ago?

Look who is talking, this Alexis, The Russian Filaret. Where was he when almost 1 million K-Albanians were forced from their homes and civilians were bombed in Chechnia? This man even cooperated with the Soviets in anti-religious measures. It is a shame that such a man with no moral credentials can even speak before such a European forum.

AGIM:

How the relationship between Orthodox Church and the Vatican got to do with Serbia??

Strange how the Russian Orthodox Church hasn't used it "experience" in Chechnya, how they haven't condemned the crimes that happened there and how they haven't addressed the social ills that plague Russia today. It's typical really: the Russians can't help sticking their noses everywhere in the world, playing "big power" but they don't really seem to care of their own country.
And it's even stranger that B92 didn't report Alexy's very open minded and progressive attitude to gays.
It seems to me that unfortunately the Serbian Orthodox Church has come under the embrace of the Russian one just as Serbia is gradually being swallowed up by Russia; a fact that as an Orthodox makes me very happy indeed that the Albanian Autocefalous Church has steered clear of the influence of the Slavic churches.
There was one positive remark however that shows that Alexey II is much more in touch with the reality than most of Serbia. He said "Kosovo WAS sacred to the Serbs".

I've got an even better idea. Hold a joint-mediation led by Pope Benedict XVI and Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew I. Both leaders are on very good terms with each other, both represent the heads of the Catholic and Orthodox churces, both are proponents of inter-religious dialogue, and neither of them carry any overt political baggage.

This article made me laugh.
Why was he allowed to speak?

Peter you can't put all in the same basket what serbs did in 1999 and 10 years before that it was a state/institutional policy and there was no voice from the "democratic" opposition
It's completely different situation in kosova where the institutions assumed the responsibility and helped to rebuild the churches.
But above all it was an individual action of the angry people not an institutional organized attack.

As far as concerns the ambassador it is not just a personal opinion, he is representative of Germany not of his self and Germany was on the table after ww 1 when kosova was awarded to serbia as reward- sponsored as always by Russia. Anyone that knows a bit of history knows that - and of course German ambassador knows it well.

Peter Sudyka
“If Kosovo breaks away form Serbia, these age-old churches that are an integral part of the Serbian culture will fall out of their control, and who knows what might happen to them”

(Peter Sudyka, 3. October 2007 11:00)

Just to refresh your mind, Peter, Kosova was under Serbian control starting from 1913-1999, so my question is: what happened to these sites before that for 8 centuries? Are they still standing?
Another question would be: what makes these churches Serbian, as you all know that Albanian people in Kosova were not of Muslim religion at the time when they are built, as well as Slav people were not in the region in a mass yet at that time. Question is who built them? Are you sure that they are built by Serbs? As Turkey had opened their archive history now, I hope many things will be clarified.

predictor

Before Ottoman invasion, the region that is now Kosovo was firmly in the Kingdom of Serbia. The Slavs settled there somewhere in the 6th century. It was only in the 14th century that the Ottomans invaded the region and made it a part of their empire. That is 8 centuries of Serb rule, followed by 5 centuries of Turkish rule, now you tell me when was there ever Albanian rule over the province of Kosovo???

I hate to say this, but Kosovo is not an Albanian province, because after WWII, it was 50% Serb and 50% Albanian, it has only become demographically Albanian in the last 50 years due to several reasons.

Finally we have the perfect mediator,orthodox,slav in short,totally impartial and with indisputable credentials,anyway better than ahtisaris,straight from god
i guess who is the real hypocrite here this monk or or the valley albanians?!

I hope the Supreme Pontiff Papa Benedict and the Russian Patriarch can once again reunite Christendom, that they may be one!

TO KS:

For the same reason that you can express your opinion on this website: Welcome Democracy a word that you wont find on albanian voculabory.

Wish you all a good day!

Thanks for the offer but no thanks Alexy II. You can not even settle the dispute with your fellow christian in Vatican and never even made an attempt to meet with Pope , and you are offering to negotiate for settlement of Kosova. Forget about it, first set up a meeting with Pope and than we can talk.

Surprise,surprise Alexy II is getting involved in politics, helping the world to solve Kosovo problem.
How does he dare to say that people have not been in Kosovo and they do not know about Kosovo.He should help people in Russia first and than talk about EU problems.
He his not any different from Filaret.

This is one of the things which shows that the Serbs are not the only instigators of violence in Kosovo, it is also the Albanian population that needs to take the blame for what happened and what is happening in Kosovo.

It is proof that one cannot favoritize one side due to actions of the other, as both are indeed responsible and both arguments need to be taken into account in order to work towards compromize.

If Kosovo breaks away form Serbia, these age-old churches that are an integral part of the Serbian culture will fall out of their control, and who knows what might happen to them. We have already seen that many of them have been destroyed and that the Albanian population does not have any respect for this culture, and they too need to be saved, as they are a part of European culture, especially considering some of them are UNESCO sites.

If the churches cannot be safe in Kosovo, what does that say about the Serbian population there? Albanians offering friendship? I don't think they will stop vandalizing Serbian churches and assaulting Serbian citizens the moment they gain independence... it is not a solution that will bring stability to the region, that is for sure!

On the other hand, if the opposite happens, Albanians in Serbia also have no guarentee of safety under Serbian control, this I can understand very well from the Albanian perspective, as well as their culture (their mosques etc.).

Now try to find a solution to this problem, hahaha. We have a saying in Poland for exactly this kind of thing and it goes like this:

Bac tu madry i pisz wiersze (which means now be clever and write poems).

"The Russian Orthodox Church has considerable experience in peace-building and peacemaking, and we stand ready to help" oh thank you Alexei II but I wonder where was your offer during the '90 when your brothers serbs were pursuing an aparthide politics in kosovo? nad what about 1999 almost 1 million people was forced to leave their homes where ware you? As far as it concerns to the people that have nnever been in kosova - i agree with you their opinion should not be considered - thats the case with the utmost majority of the serbs- they have never been in kosova.

Peter the churches were never ever attached by albaninas. The only precednt was 2004. If we wanted to destroy them.. brick by brick they wouldn't have existed many years ago...
the kosova issue is very simple it was given to serbia after the WW1. You surely remeber what the german ambasodor in Belgarde told teh serbs in this regard couple a months ago?

Finally we have the perfect mediator,orthodox,slav in short,totally impartial and with indisputable credentials,anyway better than ahtisaris,straight from god
i guess who is the real hypocrite here this monk or or the valley albanians?!

1.Thanks anyway Alexei but you can mind your bussines in your homeland,I think you have a lot to do there in matter of Chechens.Has you solved that problem yet?
2. For you Polish commentator: just to remind you that Albanian culture is not founded on Mosques only.

Strange how the Russian Orthodox Church hasn't used it "experience" in Chechnya, how they haven't condemned the crimes that happened there and how they haven't addressed the social ills that plague Russia today. It's typical really: the Russians can't help sticking their noses everywhere in the world, playing "big power" but they don't really seem to care of their own country.
And it's even stranger that B92 didn't report Alexy's very open minded and progressive attitude to gays.
It seems to me that unfortunately the Serbian Orthodox Church has come under the embrace of the Russian one just as Serbia is gradually being swallowed up by Russia; a fact that as an Orthodox makes me very happy indeed that the Albanian Autocefalous Church has steered clear of the influence of the Slavic churches.
There was one positive remark however that shows that Alexey II is much more in touch with the reality than most of Serbia. He said "Kosovo WAS sacred to the Serbs".

Look who is talking, this Alexis, The Russian Filaret. Where was he when almost 1 million K-Albanians were forced from their homes and civilians were bombed in Chechnia? This man even cooperated with the Soviets in anti-religious measures. It is a shame that such a man with no moral credentials can even speak before such a European forum.

It is really sad to see many of you that clam to be moderate in your views mixing religion with this conflict. Many postings in here show that the tolerance is really thin and that many are prepared to use a very dangerous card ‘religion ‘ to achieve their goal not being aware of the consequences. People, Kosova issue has to do with Albanians and Serbs not only with Albanians or Serbs. These two nations not matter what the outcome would will have to live next to one another.
I would like to ask you all to leave the religion aside since it has to do nothing with the religion.

Sometimes, when I read the intolerances of these KiM Albanians, I reach out not for UN resolution 1244, but for John 12:44.

"Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on me, believeth not on me, but on him that sent me."

This article made me laugh.
Why was he allowed to speak?

Peter you can't put all in the same basket what serbs did in 1999 and 10 years before that it was a state/institutional policy and there was no voice from the "democratic" opposition
It's completely different situation in kosova where the institutions assumed the responsibility and helped to rebuild the churches.
But above all it was an individual action of the angry people not an institutional organized attack.

As far as concerns the ambassador it is not just a personal opinion, he is representative of Germany not of his self and Germany was on the table after ww 1 when kosova was awarded to serbia as reward- sponsored as always by Russia. Anyone that knows a bit of history knows that - and of course German ambassador knows it well.

to Agim, the smart expert...

a meeting between the above mentioned russian cleric and the leader of the catholics, namely the pope, was planned, but blown off due to the lack of time of the pope.
so much for your information.

since the Vatican has made clear it favours a compromise within the UN... I would like to know whether you would criticize the Vatican or the pope too?

It would surely be easier in terms of effort in typing words with their keyboards for all of the above posters to say "I hate Serbs" in their comments and nothing more, and people would get the message without the need for further effort on the part of the writer in writing more or the reader in reading more. They could then 'recommend' each others posts, as well as their own, and be done with it.

It's very good that Alexy is educating Europe on what is really going on in Kosovo - the destruction and attempted eradication of centuries of Serbian culture, destruction of UNESCO heritage sites, Serbs living behind barbed wire, no freedom of movement, no human rights for minorities, daily assaults, intimidation and a brutal ethnic cleansing campaign against Serbs and tacitly supported by the US. This is the wonderful state that the US wants to reward by creating a 'greater albania' on Serbian soil. How they can propose such a thing is unbelievable. No morals, no guilt, I guess.

Seriban Churches and monasteries have a vital role to play to the Kossovo heritage and culture. This also applies to mosques and other muslin shrines.
It is natural for a Christian church leader to advocate to this direction.
those who oppose this kind of statements are those who encourage religious and ethnic division and hatred.
In north Cyprus which is under the Turkish occupation are over 1000 churches that are abandoned to destruction for over 34 years due to the same attidute anf ignorance. K-Albanians and K-Serbs must be protecting these shrines and understand that these belong to their history and culture.
Educate your people and help them understand, do not fill their hearts with poison.

"Peter the churches were never ever attached by albaninas. The only precednt was 2004. If we wanted to destroy them.. brick by brick they wouldn't have existed many years ago...
the kosova issue is very simple it was given to serbia after the WW1. You surely remeber what the german ambasodor in Belgarde told teh serbs in this regard couple a months ago?
(ben, 3. October 2007 12:02) "

I am not blaming all Albanians, this would be stupid. The actions of the Serbs in 1999 were also not performed by the entire population. There are rotten apples anywhere, and they need to be disciplined for such actions. Serbs and Albanians cannot be blamed as a whole for anything that happened, it's always the actions of a small percentage.

Questions is how much bias is attached to these incidents. This is what I mean when I speak of "Serbs" and "Albanians".

I know the story of Kosovo, not sure what the ambassador said, but that is just one opinon I am sure.

"Finally we have the perfect mediator,orthodox,slav in short,totally impartial and with indisputable credentials,anyway better than ahtisaris,straight from god
i guess who is the real hypocrite here this monk or or the valley albanians?!
(Endri, 3. October 2007 12:33) "

I think when something that this man has dedicated his life to is under threat as it is now, I am pretty sure he will respond like he did.

He was just reminding the world of muslim hatred of everything christian in Kosovo and albanians ignorance to history.World has to remember how albanians send pictures of his friend reliving himself on Serbian monastery that was build in 11th.century.And protecting this monuments from albanians has to be a priority.

I've got an even better idea. Hold a joint-mediation led by Pope Benedict XVI and Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew I. Both leaders are on very good terms with each other, both represent the heads of the Catholic and Orthodox churces, both are proponents of inter-religious dialogue, and neither of them carry any overt political baggage.

AGIM:

How the relationship between Orthodox Church and the Vatican got to do with Serbia??

"I would like to ask you all to leave the religion aside since it has to do nothing with the religion."

Obviously, there are those in Kosovo who do believe that religion plays a role in the Kosovo issue. We would be naive to believe otherwise.

From the Detoit Free Press newspaper 5/08/07
Mufti Naim Ternava, president of the Islamic Community of Kosovo, is in Michigan 4 months ago. He is quoted as saying…
“Pray for the independence of Kosovo,” The Mufti said, through a translator at the Muslim Center of Detroit. “Thousands of miles away from here, there are Muslim brothers in Kosovo who suffered for many, many years and who…went as shahids (martyrs) during all these sufferings [in Kosovo].” He also urged the crowd to follow the teachings of Islam.
“Islam is such a comprehensive religion which includes all what the family needs and what an individual needs in this world,” he said. “Help others to understand it. Teach it to others.”

I hope the Supreme Pontiff Papa Benedict and the Russian Patriarch can once again reunite Christendom, that they may be one!

Peter Sudyka
“If Kosovo breaks away form Serbia, these age-old churches that are an integral part of the Serbian culture will fall out of their control, and who knows what might happen to them”

(Peter Sudyka, 3. October 2007 11:00)

Just to refresh your mind, Peter, Kosova was under Serbian control starting from 1913-1999, so my question is: what happened to these sites before that for 8 centuries? Are they still standing?
Another question would be: what makes these churches Serbian, as you all know that Albanian people in Kosova were not of Muslim religion at the time when they are built, as well as Slav people were not in the region in a mass yet at that time. Question is who built them? Are you sure that they are built by Serbs? As Turkey had opened their archive history now, I hope many things will be clarified.

TO KS:

For the same reason that you can express your opinion on this website: Welcome Democracy a word that you wont find on albanian voculabory.

Wish you all a good day!

predictor

Before Ottoman invasion, the region that is now Kosovo was firmly in the Kingdom of Serbia. The Slavs settled there somewhere in the 6th century. It was only in the 14th century that the Ottomans invaded the region and made it a part of their empire. That is 8 centuries of Serb rule, followed by 5 centuries of Turkish rule, now you tell me when was there ever Albanian rule over the province of Kosovo???

I hate to say this, but Kosovo is not an Albanian province, because after WWII, it was 50% Serb and 50% Albanian, it has only become demographically Albanian in the last 50 years due to several reasons.