"Russia rejects Kosovo deadlines"

Michael John - I hope those cards are not mortgaged by sub-prime loans - in which case expect them to be a poorly managed house of cards on the verge of collapse.

“A unilateral proclamation of independence is impossible without the support from the West, and those in favor of the idea would have to take over an immense load of responsibility,” he said, stressing that the consequences of such unilateral moves could be "disastrous".
For those of you who can not 'read between the lines', let me spell out what the Russian gentleman meant here.
Unilateral recognition of a greater albania means unilateral recognition by Russia of Republika Srpska, the end of Georgia as we know it, the end of Moldova as we know it, the unilateral recognition of separatist movements all over the world who are watching very, very closely what happens in Kosovo. Inviolabilty of sovereign borders and international law as we know it will be turned upside down, all based on the 'Kosovo precedent'.

Teni,
How can you be so sure that its not the albanians that will lose everything with their all or nothing stance?
What IF the us would withdraw their support?

Remember what happend to the Krajina serbs in croatia when saying no to automonomy offered by Croatia in the early 90:s?

But regardless of which party it is, its a dangerous game if putting everything on one bet. I think that the albanians have offered no compromise to their stance of full indepence compared to Belgrade that is offering everything to be run locally in Kosovo...

Michael John
Yes, yes all the important cards.

Especially the ones like, IRAQ, Afghanistan, Iran, Sudan, Venezvela. While Russia is supplying EU with the much needed natural resources, and energy (oil and gas). So I dont believe it when you say EU will follow the US.

CCCC

Even Kouchner is agreeing that the timeline is extendable

"Speaking after his talks with Lavrov, Kouchner voiced hope that the Serbs and Kosovo's ethnic Albanians could reach a consensus.

He said later on Ekho Moskvy radio that the talks could be extended by another six months if no deal is reached."
http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/A39F18A8-7E8D-4166-A05D-13E879400DD0.htm
- yes the link is from Al Jazeera I guess I have a wide scope!

Michael John - On the contrary. You seem to have missed the most fundamental point of the article. Russia doesn't need to be on a par with the US militarily to drive home this point - the fact that recognising Kosovo would set a precedent in international law. As a permanent member of the UN security council, they have a say in how international law is formulated. The options for the Albanians in Kosovo are very limited: 1) Agree some deal with Belgrade (seems unlikely at the moment with both sides sticking to their positions - a mutually agreed deal would be good news for both sides in my view, i.e. a partition), or 2)declare unilateral independence which in reality would mean economic aid from the US permanently, NOT from the EU, as member countries such as Cyprus and Spain would veto any recognition in keeping with their own national interests, and currently their is an "all or nothing" voting system in the EU, so any country can veto aid to Kosovo.

As Ischinger said, how would you survive? The US would only provide very limited economic support and there would be no EU integration for Kosovo. Other Albanian commentators here have said that they could survive like the Swiss and Taiwanese economies, but the comparison is flawed. Kosovo's economy is on a par with northern Cyprus and Nagorno Karabakh, both of which have had stagnating economies for years/decades due to their illegality.

Kosovo Albanians should wake up. It's crucial to your future how you achieve independence. The wrong path will lead to endless disillusionment and no hope. Serbia, on the other hand can merrily carry on it's business and improve and prosper, with or without Kosovo. that is a luxury Kosovo simply doesn't have - i.e. a seat at the UN. That's the difference between prosperity and poverty. Choose carefully.

Teni - And what will Kosovo do when it runs out of assets to privatise? If there is no agreement, the defacto partition of Serbia will no doubt remain, but so will the defacto partition of Kosovo. The US simply cannot afford to back the KLA in trying to fight a war for northern Kosovo. It wouldn't look good in western newspapers. And as i explained to Michael John, with no legal recognition, many countries and businesses simply won't do business in Kosovo. Serbia is a larger market and they would take their investment there instead and not risk upsetting Serbia. Ceku's intransigence is bad news for Kosovo Albanians. If he isn't willing to compromise which in my view would mean partition then he's sealed your fate to that of an economic backwater reliant on handouts from the US. As Milton Friedman said , there ain't no such thing as a free lunch. The US will not be providing you with luxurious lifestyles, more likely a subsistence lifestyle. It'll be like Enver Hoxer back in power again.

Mr. Delic:
Russia is not in a position to make demands, despite all her bluster. Remember, the US is holding all the important cards. The EU will follow the US.
Have a good day!

And what cards would they be?

Well it looks as if the Russians got it made in Serbia. They have pretty much bought it all and the Serbs are thanking them! I guess it is pointless to warn you that the maximum the Russians can do is get Serbia the northern bit of Kosovo if anything at all. But in the process the Serbs will have lost everything to the likes of Lugovoi & company. I wonder how you guys will feel then.

A compromize is needed. Both sides have to agree: we can't get it all.

Solution: a very high level of autonomy!

When the US gives up Texas & Southern CA to Mexico, Serbia will give up KosovO

# A compromize is needed. Both sides have to agree: we can't get it all.

Solution: a very high level of autonomy!
(Ron, 19. September 2007 23:50)

Agree. Both sides have to agree: we can't get it all.

No union of Kosovo to Albania. No remaining of Kosovo in Serbia. Solution, INDEPENDENCE.

Language is irrelevent
That land belong to Serbia. If they want to speak albanian or english or serbian or mongolian I say let them. Quebeckers speak French in Canada. What the problem is that law cannot be broken in this case. Serbia and Kosovo are one in the same. Kosovo is a province of Serbia and therfor no matter who lives there they are all Serbian citizens.

Language actually is relevant. If you speak serbian, you are serbian and you create a country which is called Serbia. What you suggest here is that some people which has nothing to do with serbs, and which doesnt speak serbian, and which have been mistreated and massacred by serbs after serbs occupied their land, now, should call themselves "Serbs". It is shameful. No albanian will never ever accept this. Serbs broked the law when they occupied Kosovo. Now the others should eat this as legal and stop any movement to make justice, because of an illusion serbs created during this years.

They can continue talking for as long as they like. No outcome will keep Serbia out of Kosovo for longer. At some stage the two sides will tire along with the International community and the status quo will stay unchanged. For those who need some clarity on the current status. “The Kosovars have been independent from Serbia since 1999.” Although officially unrecognized who cares if you’re an Albanian living in Kosovo/a. It’ll be a China Taiwan syndrome with Serbia the bigger neighbor itching to get hold of Kosovo for the next 50-60 years and who knows how much longer? By then the two communities would have grown so much further apart culturally and economically, which is happening today. In fact the Serbian language will become somewhat extinct in Kosovo/a alone. The children in Kosovo/a no longer speak Serbian unlike their parents. If it’s in Serbia’s interest to prolong this exercise they’ll need to thing more carefully. It’s in their interests to overcome this hurdle not the other way around.

Taiwan
Language is irrelevent
That land belong to Serbia. If they want to speak albanian or english or serbian or mongolian I say let them. Quebeckers speak French in Canada. What the problem is that law cannot be broken in this case. Serbia and Kosovo are one in the same. Kosovo is a province of Serbia and therfor no matter who lives there they are all Serbian citizens.

PB,

It is funny to see that you from all people try to make believe again and again that your main concern is the economic well-being of the K-Albanians. I don't know what you do for a living. Hopefully you are not in sales of any kind.

i still really cannot understad some serb talking about kosovo should have this or that i will like to ask anyone ,do you people from serbia know anything about kosovo or how the life was there before war and after or before 80,70,60,50 till 40 or if you don't know dont hasle your self you can ask your dad's or grandparents BUT ONLY IF THEY SERV OR LIVE THERE so i will like to here from you so please do that THANK YOU....

For the above posters and Mr. Ischinger which cares how we can live if we get independence without money.
Don't worry everybody knows how to survive. For us is thousand time better to divorce from Serbia compared with death.
So please don't worry about our money.

Don't worry everybody knows how to survive. For us is thousand time better to divorce from Serbia compared with death.
So please don't worry about our money.
(Kosovar, 20. September 2007 08:32)

To the poster above - not your money, money owed Serbia.

Mr. Delic:
Russia is not in a position to make demands, despite all her bluster. Remember, the US is holding all the important cards. The EU will follow the US.
Have a good day!

Well it looks as if the Russians got it made in Serbia. They have pretty much bought it all and the Serbs are thanking them! I guess it is pointless to warn you that the maximum the Russians can do is get Serbia the northern bit of Kosovo if anything at all. But in the process the Serbs will have lost everything to the likes of Lugovoi & company. I wonder how you guys will feel then.

Michael John
Yes, yes all the important cards.

Especially the ones like, IRAQ, Afghanistan, Iran, Sudan, Venezvela. While Russia is supplying EU with the much needed natural resources, and energy (oil and gas). So I dont believe it when you say EU will follow the US.

CCCC

A compromize is needed. Both sides have to agree: we can't get it all.

Solution: a very high level of autonomy!

i still really cannot understad some serb talking about kosovo should have this or that i will like to ask anyone ,do you people from serbia know anything about kosovo or how the life was there before war and after or before 80,70,60,50 till 40 or if you don't know dont hasle your self you can ask your dad's or grandparents BUT ONLY IF THEY SERV OR LIVE THERE so i will like to here from you so please do that THANK YOU....

For the above posters and Mr. Ischinger which cares how we can live if we get independence without money.
Don't worry everybody knows how to survive. For us is thousand time better to divorce from Serbia compared with death.
So please don't worry about our money.

# A compromize is needed. Both sides have to agree: we can't get it all.

Solution: a very high level of autonomy!
(Ron, 19. September 2007 23:50)

Agree. Both sides have to agree: we can't get it all.

No union of Kosovo to Albania. No remaining of Kosovo in Serbia. Solution, INDEPENDENCE.

Michael John - I hope those cards are not mortgaged by sub-prime loans - in which case expect them to be a poorly managed house of cards on the verge of collapse.

Michael John - On the contrary. You seem to have missed the most fundamental point of the article. Russia doesn't need to be on a par with the US militarily to drive home this point - the fact that recognising Kosovo would set a precedent in international law. As a permanent member of the UN security council, they have a say in how international law is formulated. The options for the Albanians in Kosovo are very limited: 1) Agree some deal with Belgrade (seems unlikely at the moment with both sides sticking to their positions - a mutually agreed deal would be good news for both sides in my view, i.e. a partition), or 2)declare unilateral independence which in reality would mean economic aid from the US permanently, NOT from the EU, as member countries such as Cyprus and Spain would veto any recognition in keeping with their own national interests, and currently their is an "all or nothing" voting system in the EU, so any country can veto aid to Kosovo.

As Ischinger said, how would you survive? The US would only provide very limited economic support and there would be no EU integration for Kosovo. Other Albanian commentators here have said that they could survive like the Swiss and Taiwanese economies, but the comparison is flawed. Kosovo's economy is on a par with northern Cyprus and Nagorno Karabakh, both of which have had stagnating economies for years/decades due to their illegality.

Kosovo Albanians should wake up. It's crucial to your future how you achieve independence. The wrong path will lead to endless disillusionment and no hope. Serbia, on the other hand can merrily carry on it's business and improve and prosper, with or without Kosovo. that is a luxury Kosovo simply doesn't have - i.e. a seat at the UN. That's the difference between prosperity and poverty. Choose carefully.

Teni - And what will Kosovo do when it runs out of assets to privatise? If there is no agreement, the defacto partition of Serbia will no doubt remain, but so will the defacto partition of Kosovo. The US simply cannot afford to back the KLA in trying to fight a war for northern Kosovo. It wouldn't look good in western newspapers. And as i explained to Michael John, with no legal recognition, many countries and businesses simply won't do business in Kosovo. Serbia is a larger market and they would take their investment there instead and not risk upsetting Serbia. Ceku's intransigence is bad news for Kosovo Albanians. If he isn't willing to compromise which in my view would mean partition then he's sealed your fate to that of an economic backwater reliant on handouts from the US. As Milton Friedman said , there ain't no such thing as a free lunch. The US will not be providing you with luxurious lifestyles, more likely a subsistence lifestyle. It'll be like Enver Hoxer back in power again.

“A unilateral proclamation of independence is impossible without the support from the West, and those in favor of the idea would have to take over an immense load of responsibility,” he said, stressing that the consequences of such unilateral moves could be "disastrous".
For those of you who can not 'read between the lines', let me spell out what the Russian gentleman meant here.
Unilateral recognition of a greater albania means unilateral recognition by Russia of Republika Srpska, the end of Georgia as we know it, the end of Moldova as we know it, the unilateral recognition of separatist movements all over the world who are watching very, very closely what happens in Kosovo. Inviolabilty of sovereign borders and international law as we know it will be turned upside down, all based on the 'Kosovo precedent'.

Teni,
How can you be so sure that its not the albanians that will lose everything with their all or nothing stance?
What IF the us would withdraw their support?

Remember what happend to the Krajina serbs in croatia when saying no to automonomy offered by Croatia in the early 90:s?

But regardless of which party it is, its a dangerous game if putting everything on one bet. I think that the albanians have offered no compromise to their stance of full indepence compared to Belgrade that is offering everything to be run locally in Kosovo...

PB,

It is funny to see that you from all people try to make believe again and again that your main concern is the economic well-being of the K-Albanians. I don't know what you do for a living. Hopefully you are not in sales of any kind.

They can continue talking for as long as they like. No outcome will keep Serbia out of Kosovo for longer. At some stage the two sides will tire along with the International community and the status quo will stay unchanged. For those who need some clarity on the current status. “The Kosovars have been independent from Serbia since 1999.” Although officially unrecognized who cares if you’re an Albanian living in Kosovo/a. It’ll be a China Taiwan syndrome with Serbia the bigger neighbor itching to get hold of Kosovo for the next 50-60 years and who knows how much longer? By then the two communities would have grown so much further apart culturally and economically, which is happening today. In fact the Serbian language will become somewhat extinct in Kosovo/a alone. The children in Kosovo/a no longer speak Serbian unlike their parents. If it’s in Serbia’s interest to prolong this exercise they’ll need to thing more carefully. It’s in their interests to overcome this hurdle not the other way around.

Language is irrelevent
That land belong to Serbia. If they want to speak albanian or english or serbian or mongolian I say let them. Quebeckers speak French in Canada. What the problem is that law cannot be broken in this case. Serbia and Kosovo are one in the same. Kosovo is a province of Serbia and therfor no matter who lives there they are all Serbian citizens.

Language actually is relevant. If you speak serbian, you are serbian and you create a country which is called Serbia. What you suggest here is that some people which has nothing to do with serbs, and which doesnt speak serbian, and which have been mistreated and massacred by serbs after serbs occupied their land, now, should call themselves "Serbs". It is shameful. No albanian will never ever accept this. Serbs broked the law when they occupied Kosovo. Now the others should eat this as legal and stop any movement to make justice, because of an illusion serbs created during this years.

And what cards would they be?

Even Kouchner is agreeing that the timeline is extendable

"Speaking after his talks with Lavrov, Kouchner voiced hope that the Serbs and Kosovo's ethnic Albanians could reach a consensus.

He said later on Ekho Moskvy radio that the talks could be extended by another six months if no deal is reached."
http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/A39F18A8-7E8D-4166-A05D-13E879400DD0.htm
- yes the link is from Al Jazeera I guess I have a wide scope!

When the US gives up Texas & Southern CA to Mexico, Serbia will give up KosovO

Taiwan
Language is irrelevent
That land belong to Serbia. If they want to speak albanian or english or serbian or mongolian I say let them. Quebeckers speak French in Canada. What the problem is that law cannot be broken in this case. Serbia and Kosovo are one in the same. Kosovo is a province of Serbia and therfor no matter who lives there they are all Serbian citizens.

Don't worry everybody knows how to survive. For us is thousand time better to divorce from Serbia compared with death.
So please don't worry about our money.
(Kosovar, 20. September 2007 08:32)

To the poster above - not your money, money owed Serbia.