Ilić visits Filaret, cancels Montenegro trip

Let's put it another way. Let's say instead of a Serbian bishop it was a Croatian priest. Now let's say this hypothetical Croatian minister was known to be a huge Tudjman supporter in the 1990s: Gotovina supporter, Pavelic apologist, the whole nine yards. Now let's say he was trying to admister to his diocsese in Vojvodina. Does anyone honestly think the Serbian government would allow him to cross the border? People here would be calling for his dismissal, his defrocking, and his arrest to the Hague. This is one time I have to side against the SPC and take the view that if there are still controversial elements within its ranks, the church needs a good spring cleaning. At the very least, he should be relieved of his bishop duties and quietly retire to a monastery. Another Serbian bishop in his place without an international block on him would easily cross the Serbian-Montenegrin border without any hassle whatsoever. But for this to get into the very echelons of government is getting out of hand.

I don't see what the issue is. Montenegro is a sovereign state and can refuse entry to any foreign national, for whatever reason, just as Britain, the USA and Serbia itself can. The Hague believe he may have had a part in protecting war criminals. He would be banned from most countries for such a suspicion. He would do himself better trying to prove his innocence and making a statement condemning the protection of war criminals than going on hunger strike.

When is Kostunica going there to kiss the bishop's hand and pay tribute to this war criminal supporter?
It is a shame that the Serbian government openly supports this man. Unfortunately it is line with the state policy of protecting the war criminals, responsible for the genocide in Srebrenica.

I hope the Montenegrin government will keep strict on this.

By the way, it is nothing special that a person's health suffers from hunger strike. But lets not forget the poor bishop is voluntary not eating, nobody is forcing him.

Maybe he can use him time on the border to pray for all the victims of the massacres caused by Karadzic and Mladic.

The Bishop needs to know by now that Montenegro is not corupted like Belgrad leaders so his tricks can work ony in Serbia and nowhere else.
I wounder how much weight Bishop lost in nine days or he might snacked some food through the night he is not anymore to be trusted.

the church that makes this man "dignitary" needs to ask itself some hard questions
i'm not always on the side of my governments decisions but this time its too easy
http://www.vreme.com/g/file.jpg

"Maybe he can use his time on the border to pray for all the victims of the massacres caused by Karadzic and Mladic."
Jack

Jack, unfortunately that would be the last thing this "holly" man would do.

Joe,
I know that he will not do that. He will pray for his friends Karadzic and Mladic.

I thought Serbia is a secular state, but it seems Serbian ministers are subordinate to (questionable) church bishops.

The whole issue with the holy Filaret is another example of the Serbian Orthodox Church creating problems and conflicts. The list gets impressive: blessing Serbian troops in Bosnia committing serious war crimes, continuous conflicts with the Macedonian Orthodox Church, implicitly denying the Macedonian state and now provocations to Montenegro, implicitly denying the Montenegrin state. What kind of church is that.......

From my understanding of the Serbian Constitution. Serbia is a secular country. Therefore no religion should take priority and the state should there not show any favouritism to any religion. What it seems here is that Ilic is trying to win political points over something that does not concern him. He is the Minister for Infrastructure, i didnt know that included promoting religion as part of his mandate as a Minister.

Mike I think your analogy is way off mark this time considering that Montenegro & Serbia peacefully partitioned and that there was no conflict between Montenegro & Serbia. Filaret is being denied access because he is on a list of names that the hague has created with a clearly partisan intention. One could suggest that all government officials in Serbia are complicit in harbouring Mladic but the same could be said of Montegrin politicians for harbouring Karadzic and equally Croatia for Gotovina etc etc... Clearly a way round needs to found but if this bishop dies in the next few weeks there will be a great deal of sour relations and this might be teh intention of the few elite in Montenegro who would rather escalate matters so as not to deal with internal problems of poor ecomonic development of the majority while a select few are doing very nicely indeed!

Princip,
I thought the development in Montenegro - especially in tourism with a lot of Russian money - is going well.
I did not get a chance to visit it yet but I heard the coastline is really beautiful. And the real estate prices are going through the roof. I think it is even more expensive than some good areas of France (except the Cote d'Azur).

Although I am in general not very happy with the comments made on all things what is happening in Serbia (Especially when it comes to Kosovo) this time I am surprised and happy with many comments. It is a disgrace that a minister turns around and cancels a meeting with his counterparts because of a hungerstrike of a priest. How many people are hungry in Serbia because of corruption? Is he taking care of that? No, the Orthodox church has a far too big influence in this country. It reminds me that a month or so ago many intellectuals in Russia signed apetition, warning for the increase of the power of the Russian Orthodox Church. And here it is the same. A dangerous situation and clearly it shows that it is NOT a secular state anymore and that Ministers find religion more important then the progress of the economic situation in a country. I wonder how long it will last till it will change. But I am not very hopefull when I see all Serbs running behind the church nowadays.

«Ilić visits Filaret, cancels Montenegro trip.»

Ilic and Filaret are birds of the same feather!

Kostunica has shown in the past that he will never turn over Mladic, Karadzic and 100s of other Serbs who have 'fought' for the nation.

I don't think that Serbia is not ready to join the European Nation.

I have no doubts about what you say Princip, and yes Montenegro is clearly making this into an issue bigger than it's worth. Yet at the same time, let's not blindly defend someone simply because he is on our team. If there are concerns that Bishop Filaret has aided wanted fugitives, he should stand accountible and not use his cleric position as a form of immunity. I agree with you that certain officials in Podgorica are making this into an event to earn some well needed brownie points, but there's some shady business going around on all sides. Regardless, if Filaret does die or becomes severely ill, relations between Serbia and Montenegro will assuredly sour.

Joe,

You are partly right, but development in Montenegro is actually VERY slow.

Still no water during the summer in some costal parts or only during certain hours. This has been a problem for over 20 years, they have still not solved it. And this can not be blamed on Serbia or the serbs. This is something the Montenegrins have to solve by their own. But I suspect that they would rather wait another 20 years if only EU would pay for it.

Frequent electricity cuts, why is that?

Yes real estate prices are exploding due to the Russian "investements" But why are russians investing in Montenegro? Because Montenegro is the only country in Europe there they can go whithout a visa and can bring huge amounts of cash whithour declaring it. In which other airport or customs control can you bring millions of euros in cash without declaring it?

It is obvious that when prices are higher than in Greece and Spain that if russians lose their interest in this market, prices will fall

And finaly, yes the coastline is indeed beautiful, but if the montenegrins continue privatization of the beaches and put entrence fees on it like they did near Sveti Stefan with a 25 euro! fee, I belive that tourism will fail.

@Victor, you wrote:
"....I don't think that Serbia is not ready to join the European Nation...."
Your English? or you really
think Serbia is ready for the EU? (double negative=positive, remember from first class school?)

When is Kostunica going there to kiss the bishop's hand and pay tribute to this war criminal supporter?
It is a shame that the Serbian government openly supports this man. Unfortunately it is line with the state policy of protecting the war criminals, responsible for the genocide in Srebrenica.

I hope the Montenegrin government will keep strict on this.

By the way, it is nothing special that a person's health suffers from hunger strike. But lets not forget the poor bishop is voluntary not eating, nobody is forcing him.

Maybe he can use him time on the border to pray for all the victims of the massacres caused by Karadzic and Mladic.

"Maybe he can use his time on the border to pray for all the victims of the massacres caused by Karadzic and Mladic."
Jack

Jack, unfortunately that would be the last thing this "holly" man would do.

Joe,
I know that he will not do that. He will pray for his friends Karadzic and Mladic.

I thought Serbia is a secular state, but it seems Serbian ministers are subordinate to (questionable) church bishops.

The whole issue with the holy Filaret is another example of the Serbian Orthodox Church creating problems and conflicts. The list gets impressive: blessing Serbian troops in Bosnia committing serious war crimes, continuous conflicts with the Macedonian Orthodox Church, implicitly denying the Macedonian state and now provocations to Montenegro, implicitly denying the Montenegrin state. What kind of church is that.......

The Bishop needs to know by now that Montenegro is not corupted like Belgrad leaders so his tricks can work ony in Serbia and nowhere else.
I wounder how much weight Bishop lost in nine days or he might snacked some food through the night he is not anymore to be trusted.

Let's put it another way. Let's say instead of a Serbian bishop it was a Croatian priest. Now let's say this hypothetical Croatian minister was known to be a huge Tudjman supporter in the 1990s: Gotovina supporter, Pavelic apologist, the whole nine yards. Now let's say he was trying to admister to his diocsese in Vojvodina. Does anyone honestly think the Serbian government would allow him to cross the border? People here would be calling for his dismissal, his defrocking, and his arrest to the Hague. This is one time I have to side against the SPC and take the view that if there are still controversial elements within its ranks, the church needs a good spring cleaning. At the very least, he should be relieved of his bishop duties and quietly retire to a monastery. Another Serbian bishop in his place without an international block on him would easily cross the Serbian-Montenegrin border without any hassle whatsoever. But for this to get into the very echelons of government is getting out of hand.

I don't see what the issue is. Montenegro is a sovereign state and can refuse entry to any foreign national, for whatever reason, just as Britain, the USA and Serbia itself can. The Hague believe he may have had a part in protecting war criminals. He would be banned from most countries for such a suspicion. He would do himself better trying to prove his innocence and making a statement condemning the protection of war criminals than going on hunger strike.

From my understanding of the Serbian Constitution. Serbia is a secular country. Therefore no religion should take priority and the state should there not show any favouritism to any religion. What it seems here is that Ilic is trying to win political points over something that does not concern him. He is the Minister for Infrastructure, i didnt know that included promoting religion as part of his mandate as a Minister.

Mike I think your analogy is way off mark this time considering that Montenegro & Serbia peacefully partitioned and that there was no conflict between Montenegro & Serbia. Filaret is being denied access because he is on a list of names that the hague has created with a clearly partisan intention. One could suggest that all government officials in Serbia are complicit in harbouring Mladic but the same could be said of Montegrin politicians for harbouring Karadzic and equally Croatia for Gotovina etc etc... Clearly a way round needs to found but if this bishop dies in the next few weeks there will be a great deal of sour relations and this might be teh intention of the few elite in Montenegro who would rather escalate matters so as not to deal with internal problems of poor ecomonic development of the majority while a select few are doing very nicely indeed!

Princip,
I thought the development in Montenegro - especially in tourism with a lot of Russian money - is going well.
I did not get a chance to visit it yet but I heard the coastline is really beautiful. And the real estate prices are going through the roof. I think it is even more expensive than some good areas of France (except the Cote d'Azur).

I have no doubts about what you say Princip, and yes Montenegro is clearly making this into an issue bigger than it's worth. Yet at the same time, let's not blindly defend someone simply because he is on our team. If there are concerns that Bishop Filaret has aided wanted fugitives, he should stand accountible and not use his cleric position as a form of immunity. I agree with you that certain officials in Podgorica are making this into an event to earn some well needed brownie points, but there's some shady business going around on all sides. Regardless, if Filaret does die or becomes severely ill, relations between Serbia and Montenegro will assuredly sour.

Although I am in general not very happy with the comments made on all things what is happening in Serbia (Especially when it comes to Kosovo) this time I am surprised and happy with many comments. It is a disgrace that a minister turns around and cancels a meeting with his counterparts because of a hungerstrike of a priest. How many people are hungry in Serbia because of corruption? Is he taking care of that? No, the Orthodox church has a far too big influence in this country. It reminds me that a month or so ago many intellectuals in Russia signed apetition, warning for the increase of the power of the Russian Orthodox Church. And here it is the same. A dangerous situation and clearly it shows that it is NOT a secular state anymore and that Ministers find religion more important then the progress of the economic situation in a country. I wonder how long it will last till it will change. But I am not very hopefull when I see all Serbs running behind the church nowadays.

the church that makes this man "dignitary" needs to ask itself some hard questions
i'm not always on the side of my governments decisions but this time its too easy
http://www.vreme.com/g/file.jpg

«Ilić visits Filaret, cancels Montenegro trip.»

Ilic and Filaret are birds of the same feather!

Kostunica has shown in the past that he will never turn over Mladic, Karadzic and 100s of other Serbs who have 'fought' for the nation.

I don't think that Serbia is not ready to join the European Nation.

Joe,

You are partly right, but development in Montenegro is actually VERY slow.

Still no water during the summer in some costal parts or only during certain hours. This has been a problem for over 20 years, they have still not solved it. And this can not be blamed on Serbia or the serbs. This is something the Montenegrins have to solve by their own. But I suspect that they would rather wait another 20 years if only EU would pay for it.

Frequent electricity cuts, why is that?

Yes real estate prices are exploding due to the Russian "investements" But why are russians investing in Montenegro? Because Montenegro is the only country in Europe there they can go whithout a visa and can bring huge amounts of cash whithour declaring it. In which other airport or customs control can you bring millions of euros in cash without declaring it?

It is obvious that when prices are higher than in Greece and Spain that if russians lose their interest in this market, prices will fall

And finaly, yes the coastline is indeed beautiful, but if the montenegrins continue privatization of the beaches and put entrence fees on it like they did near Sveti Stefan with a 25 euro! fee, I belive that tourism will fail.

@Victor, you wrote:
"....I don't think that Serbia is not ready to join the European Nation...."
Your English? or you really
think Serbia is ready for the EU? (double negative=positive, remember from first class school?)