Plassnik: Kosovo - maturity test for EU

As i read this article Ms Plassnik is telling European colleges that ; Eurpe has to correct the wrongs of the past in regard to Albanians. Now is the time at last jsutice will prevail, by admitting the wrongs of the past.

Sure Ahmet:-)This must be marked,no doubt!LOL

Plassnik said Kosovo was (is) “the test of maturity for its (EU) common foreign policy”. Translation; how far has the other EU nations come in recognizing and accepting German dominance of Europe through the so-called “success of multilateralism”. The fact is that the new EU “treaty” which is virtually the same as the failed constitution was rammed through Brussels without a democratic vote and this is just a taste of what is to come. The EU belongs to Germany and its foreign policy will closely resemble that of German foreign policy. This does not bode well for countries that opposed Germany in the two world wars and that includes France who up to now has been in lock step with Germany, I guess some people never learn. Russia will never join the EU (only one dominant member allowed) so the Germans need to bring the rest of the EU on board to form a common front against the only other European power that can rival Germany. Serbia’s choice is not between Europe and Russia since all are European but between German dominance or Russian friendship. Make your choice wisely; those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it!

Thank you for your sightseeing advice and make no mistake about the fact that the US has been the best friend that the Jewish people can ever have and we LOVE this country for it has allowed us to prosper but that does not mean that I agree with all the policies of our respective administrations.If the US can use its veto in support of Israel against the whole world then Russia has the right to use its veto.This is called poetic justice.Abraham Lincoln is still considered a war criminal by people in the South and many Illinoisans with license plates reading "Land of Lincoln" have had their cars mistreated while vacationing in the South.One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter and all groups have their angels and demons but to demonize all Serbs is ridiculous for the policies of a little man(Milosevic)who suffered from the Napoleonic complex.I will gladly welcome all 6 million Albanians to America if I had the power but not the kind who went sightseeing at Fort Dix.Shalom

“BUT, it is also a fact that no Serbs protested when he went on an all-out attack against Kosovar Albanians.”

“If you're going to wait one thousand years, then I'd have to say, I admire your patience. I doubt most Serbs agree with you on that though.”

Actually I’m in my early 20’s and live in Novi Sad. Which country do you live in? Do you get your news from CNN? I think you are misinformed and misunderstand the Serbian mentality / resolve. Please don’t tell us what’s best for us. We really dig our heals in when people do that!

Simple minded people understand things in simple terms.You can love America but disagree with certain policies of the past,present or future administrations.I have never slung mud at the American people so do not put words in my mouth and I have told you that every Albanian who wants to come and RESPECT the laws of my country is welcome to do so.Please spare me the I have Jewish friends nonsense.Read Elie Wiesel about how friendly Hungarians and Croats have been to Jews(JOE)You do not respect anything that does not fit in with your twisted personal view of events so do not lecture me about where I should live because the US Constitution guarantees the right of FREE speech and the right to a dissenting view as long as you do not advocate VIOLENCE.So if you do not have respect for an American's right to disagree with you then obviously you do not belong in my country.Bush is the worst president we have ever had and even people in the Republican Party are distancing themselves from him.Are Albanians advocating violence if they do not get recognition?Against whom?Read Mr.Montgomery's last article and you might enlighten yourself as to what is to come.The US cannot solve the pressing problems alone by a long shot nor just by having a few European countries on board.If Russia does not get respect in Europe then it will turn to Asia and that will be bad news for US national security.Imagine the Russians selling weapons to the Taleban in order for them to kill 50k American soldiers like in Vietnam.Imagine the Russians flooding the American and EU heroin market with the pure heroin they get from the Afghans in return for arms and the thousands of youth who will overdose on an annual basis.Imagine Putin going along with Chavez and Ahmedijan in setting the price of oil at $200 a gallon.Imagine the Chinese converting their 1.3 TRILLION US dollars into euros.You do not need an economics degree to understand what would happen to the value of the US dollar.Imagine the Russians selling their advanced weapons to the Iraqi insurgents and to Hamas and Hezbollah and to Iran as many nuclear submarines as the Iranians can afford and having them prowling near the US shore.Imagine having Chinese nuclear missiles in Cuba,Nicaragua,Bolivis or Venezuela.Do not disrespect the bear or the dragon because in the nuclear age armed conflict is suicide and any American who talks about armed conflict with Russia or China is an IDIOT.But of course I respect his right to be an idiot without telling him he should leave America.There are 300 million people in this country with 300 million different minds and only sheep follow blindly.

Joe:

Wait, you are telling me about propaganda? The only reason the Serbs still exist is because we were on the winning side! had the allies lost the Germans/Hungarians/Croatians would have completed what they had started! Are you denying the Genocide? That is a crime in many countries except maybe in Hungary or Croatia. Maybe you just don't know any history, better you don't write such foolish statements!

“We will also see if the European Union will be able to find its single profile towards Russia.”

This lady gotta be kidding! The EU can't even agree on something as basic as their constitution to even begin to think about a single profile towards Russia or anybody else!

Ursula and I should take a romantic cruise on the Danube and listen to John Lennon's song "Imagine" while looking into each other's eyes.I hope she does not hold the fact that I have an American passport against me-LOL-if we hit it off right I might consider trading it in for a EU one.What color is a EU passport anyway?

Luciano

I know the U.S. is a friend to Israel. My sightseeing invitation was meant for another friendly nation as well. The one you're slinging mud on buddy.

Those two Albanians you talked about are a disgrace to Albanians everywhere. If you had bothered reading the reactions in both Albania and anywhere else, you would know that... and a few other facts as well.

As for demonizing Serbs for the sake of Milosevic, no one here is saying that ALL Serbs are Milosevic wannabe-s.

BUT, it is also a fact that no Serbs protested when he went on an all-out attack against Kosovar Albanians.

It is also a fact that Milosevic's party still holds a significant position in the Serbian parliament and Albanians can hardly find that endearing.

Hope you guys the EU get it right this time. Thats OK we serbs can wait a thousand years in a diplomatic stalemate if need be. No rush!

A message clear as a bell. No solution without Russia and no unilateral decisions. These are binding principles of EU.

Prince Lazar

If you're going to wait one thousand years, then I'd have to say, I admire your patience. I doubt most Serbs agree with you on that though.

As for Plassnik's comment, one thing only was very clear. She herself does not consider Russia as "European." It's "us" (the EU) vs. Russia.

The meaning and scope of "partnership" was deliberately left vague and it's allowing both Albos and Serbs here to read in it whatever they wish.
Moral of this comment? This is the typical political fluff that basically doesn't mean much at all one way or the other.

Zoran

OK... let's assume it's indeed a choice between Germany and Russia.

Germany today:
--------------

1. still the economic engine of the EU.

2. post WWII it is extremely weary of sending the armed troups anywhere even for peace keeping missions. It has become pacifist to a fault. Same goes for Japan.

3. Germans are among the biggest donors of humanitarian efforts in the third world and probably the biggest contributors to the EU budget.

4. Biggest foreign investors in Serbia... Austria, France, Germany, Italy, the United States


Russia today:
-------------

1. An autocratic state. Fiefdom of ex-KGB agents.

2. Lousy human rights records. Regular use of harrassment, poisoning, assassination, jailing etc.

3. One of the most corrupt countries in the world (see Transparency International)

4. Relationships with neighbouring countries are typically characterized by military harrassment, economic blockades, blatant meddling in internal affairs.

5. Econonmy based largely on oil/gas exports and little else. Characterized by extreme polarization of wealth.


You're right about one thing... some people/countries never evolve.

"Milosevic is dead" & there are a number of people including myself who danced in the streets when he was arrested. Too bad he didn't get to spend one day sentenced!

"It is also a fact that Milosevic's party still holds a significant position in the Serbian parliament and Albanians can hardly find that endearing."
(Ment, 27. August 2007 23:07)

MENT - how can a Serb residing in KosovO, which may I remind you is SERBIAN land, have any trust or faith that you won't continue to commit the crimes that have happened in the last two weeks, let alone the last decade? You are able to make everyone be accountable for any wrong-doings except yourself & the people that actually give you a "recommendary" rating on this website.

Luciano

From your previous comments and the whole "Shalom" greeting, we've established your religious affiliation.

One day maybe you should take a trip to Brooklyn to a certain Memorial Park in Shiphead's Bay. There's a relevant plaque there.

Thanks in advance for the gratitude... or rather the lack of it.

luciano,
I have Jewish friends and colleagues and yes they love this country and they are very loyal to it. But you? Based on your posts of the last few mounths constantly bad mouthing the US I have my serious doubts. Maybe because of your Serbian connection? Anyway if you dislike so much our country why are you not moving back to Serbia or democratic Russia? Be logical with yourself.

luciano,
I read your shaky arguments with real amusement. Apparently you know much more about Elie Wiesel than about economics. You display a childish ignorance when you try to paint the end of the world scenario for the US in case China would convert her 1,300 billion dollars into euros. You completely forget how China and the EU would be hurt by such an action...perhaps even more than the US. The exchange rate could go from the current 1.37 to 4.5 or 5 or even higher. This way China could loose 80% of the value of her reserve and Europe would go belly up. I heard this lovely scenario of yours from many staunchly anti-american French on French sites already few years ago, who day dreamed about all the possible scenarios, who could cause the complete economic and politic collapse of the US. They also hoped that Putin, Chavez and the mad Iranian president would KO the US. You would have terribly enjoyed the company of these anti-americans. Russia would do this, Russia would do that and in your very bizzare univers the EU and the US would simply allow
all that. You almost seem to suggest that the US play dead, simply give up to all your dear foreign friends. In your case I could easily imagine that you would exchange your US passport against one of those countries of your preferred list. But please remain in the US. You seem harmless to the security of our country. You were just too much influenced by some evil people, who would love to see the complete ruin of the US.

Ment:

Twice in one century the Germans conducted a war of extermination against the Serbs!
Russia came to our rescue at great cost to themselves many times and now again!
The rest is irrelevant!!!!
Yes some people never learn!!!

Ya exactly Peter, tell him like it is!

Zoran,
You really like to use propaganda-like populist statements, which however sound hollow. If the Germans would have conducted real war of extermination against you than today they would be no Serbs.

Prince Lazar

I was born and raised in Albania. I got the news from CNN and from my parents in Tirana who went regularly to the refugee camp set up a couple of hundred meters away from their house.
I don't know about Serb resolve, but I got to know enough about Serb viciousness.

Peace.

Zoran

There's a saying in Albania;

Don't ask "how have you been before"... ask "how you are now."

I thought the change in Germany's attitude has been evident for the past 50 odd years. I guess that's not enough for some.

GSP

You may have danced indeed, but that was too little too late. People like you should have protested when it mattered.

As for the second part, I'm assuming you're talking about the assault on the Serb couple.

Here's my take on it. When/if those 4 Albanians who did it get caught, I hope they get sent to a Serb jail. Whichever Serb inmate castrates them there has my blessings.

With regard to the other crimes done against the Serbs in Kosovo, I don't know whether they have been deliberately orchastrated or whether they're cases of tit-for-tat violence. This is the Balkans after all. People rarely forget and almost never forgive.

Either way it is disgusting but the presence of the radicals only adds fuel to the fire.

Plassnik said Kosovo was (is) “the test of maturity for its (EU) common foreign policy”. Translation; how far has the other EU nations come in recognizing and accepting German dominance of Europe through the so-called “success of multilateralism”. The fact is that the new EU “treaty” which is virtually the same as the failed constitution was rammed through Brussels without a democratic vote and this is just a taste of what is to come. The EU belongs to Germany and its foreign policy will closely resemble that of German foreign policy. This does not bode well for countries that opposed Germany in the two world wars and that includes France who up to now has been in lock step with Germany, I guess some people never learn. Russia will never join the EU (only one dominant member allowed) so the Germans need to bring the rest of the EU on board to form a common front against the only other European power that can rival Germany. Serbia’s choice is not between Europe and Russia since all are European but between German dominance or Russian friendship. Make your choice wisely; those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it!

Luciano

I know the U.S. is a friend to Israel. My sightseeing invitation was meant for another friendly nation as well. The one you're slinging mud on buddy.

Those two Albanians you talked about are a disgrace to Albanians everywhere. If you had bothered reading the reactions in both Albania and anywhere else, you would know that... and a few other facts as well.

As for demonizing Serbs for the sake of Milosevic, no one here is saying that ALL Serbs are Milosevic wannabe-s.

BUT, it is also a fact that no Serbs protested when he went on an all-out attack against Kosovar Albanians.

It is also a fact that Milosevic's party still holds a significant position in the Serbian parliament and Albanians can hardly find that endearing.

“BUT, it is also a fact that no Serbs protested when he went on an all-out attack against Kosovar Albanians.”

“If you're going to wait one thousand years, then I'd have to say, I admire your patience. I doubt most Serbs agree with you on that though.”

Actually I’m in my early 20’s and live in Novi Sad. Which country do you live in? Do you get your news from CNN? I think you are misinformed and misunderstand the Serbian mentality / resolve. Please don’t tell us what’s best for us. We really dig our heals in when people do that!

luciano,
I have Jewish friends and colleagues and yes they love this country and they are very loyal to it. But you? Based on your posts of the last few mounths constantly bad mouthing the US I have my serious doubts. Maybe because of your Serbian connection? Anyway if you dislike so much our country why are you not moving back to Serbia or democratic Russia? Be logical with yourself.

Joe:

Wait, you are telling me about propaganda? The only reason the Serbs still exist is because we were on the winning side! had the allies lost the Germans/Hungarians/Croatians would have completed what they had started! Are you denying the Genocide? That is a crime in many countries except maybe in Hungary or Croatia. Maybe you just don't know any history, better you don't write such foolish statements!

As i read this article Ms Plassnik is telling European colleges that ; Eurpe has to correct the wrongs of the past in regard to Albanians. Now is the time at last jsutice will prevail, by admitting the wrongs of the past.

Luciano

From your previous comments and the whole "Shalom" greeting, we've established your religious affiliation.

One day maybe you should take a trip to Brooklyn to a certain Memorial Park in Shiphead's Bay. There's a relevant plaque there.

Thanks in advance for the gratitude... or rather the lack of it.

Thank you for your sightseeing advice and make no mistake about the fact that the US has been the best friend that the Jewish people can ever have and we LOVE this country for it has allowed us to prosper but that does not mean that I agree with all the policies of our respective administrations.If the US can use its veto in support of Israel against the whole world then Russia has the right to use its veto.This is called poetic justice.Abraham Lincoln is still considered a war criminal by people in the South and many Illinoisans with license plates reading "Land of Lincoln" have had their cars mistreated while vacationing in the South.One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter and all groups have their angels and demons but to demonize all Serbs is ridiculous for the policies of a little man(Milosevic)who suffered from the Napoleonic complex.I will gladly welcome all 6 million Albanians to America if I had the power but not the kind who went sightseeing at Fort Dix.Shalom

luciano,
I read your shaky arguments with real amusement. Apparently you know much more about Elie Wiesel than about economics. You display a childish ignorance when you try to paint the end of the world scenario for the US in case China would convert her 1,300 billion dollars into euros. You completely forget how China and the EU would be hurt by such an action...perhaps even more than the US. The exchange rate could go from the current 1.37 to 4.5 or 5 or even higher. This way China could loose 80% of the value of her reserve and Europe would go belly up. I heard this lovely scenario of yours from many staunchly anti-american French on French sites already few years ago, who day dreamed about all the possible scenarios, who could cause the complete economic and politic collapse of the US. They also hoped that Putin, Chavez and the mad Iranian president would KO the US. You would have terribly enjoyed the company of these anti-americans. Russia would do this, Russia would do that and in your very bizzare univers the EU and the US would simply allow
all that. You almost seem to suggest that the US play dead, simply give up to all your dear foreign friends. In your case I could easily imagine that you would exchange your US passport against one of those countries of your preferred list. But please remain in the US. You seem harmless to the security of our country. You were just too much influenced by some evil people, who would love to see the complete ruin of the US.

Hope you guys the EU get it right this time. Thats OK we serbs can wait a thousand years in a diplomatic stalemate if need be. No rush!

Sure Ahmet:-)This must be marked,no doubt!LOL

A message clear as a bell. No solution without Russia and no unilateral decisions. These are binding principles of EU.

“We will also see if the European Union will be able to find its single profile towards Russia.”

This lady gotta be kidding! The EU can't even agree on something as basic as their constitution to even begin to think about a single profile towards Russia or anybody else!

Ya exactly Peter, tell him like it is!

Ursula and I should take a romantic cruise on the Danube and listen to John Lennon's song "Imagine" while looking into each other's eyes.I hope she does not hold the fact that I have an American passport against me-LOL-if we hit it off right I might consider trading it in for a EU one.What color is a EU passport anyway?

Prince Lazar

If you're going to wait one thousand years, then I'd have to say, I admire your patience. I doubt most Serbs agree with you on that though.

As for Plassnik's comment, one thing only was very clear. She herself does not consider Russia as "European." It's "us" (the EU) vs. Russia.

The meaning and scope of "partnership" was deliberately left vague and it's allowing both Albos and Serbs here to read in it whatever they wish.
Moral of this comment? This is the typical political fluff that basically doesn't mean much at all one way or the other.

Zoran

OK... let's assume it's indeed a choice between Germany and Russia.

Germany today:
--------------

1. still the economic engine of the EU.

2. post WWII it is extremely weary of sending the armed troups anywhere even for peace keeping missions. It has become pacifist to a fault. Same goes for Japan.

3. Germans are among the biggest donors of humanitarian efforts in the third world and probably the biggest contributors to the EU budget.

4. Biggest foreign investors in Serbia... Austria, France, Germany, Italy, the United States


Russia today:
-------------

1. An autocratic state. Fiefdom of ex-KGB agents.

2. Lousy human rights records. Regular use of harrassment, poisoning, assassination, jailing etc.

3. One of the most corrupt countries in the world (see Transparency International)

4. Relationships with neighbouring countries are typically characterized by military harrassment, economic blockades, blatant meddling in internal affairs.

5. Econonmy based largely on oil/gas exports and little else. Characterized by extreme polarization of wealth.


You're right about one thing... some people/countries never evolve.

Simple minded people understand things in simple terms.You can love America but disagree with certain policies of the past,present or future administrations.I have never slung mud at the American people so do not put words in my mouth and I have told you that every Albanian who wants to come and RESPECT the laws of my country is welcome to do so.Please spare me the I have Jewish friends nonsense.Read Elie Wiesel about how friendly Hungarians and Croats have been to Jews(JOE)You do not respect anything that does not fit in with your twisted personal view of events so do not lecture me about where I should live because the US Constitution guarantees the right of FREE speech and the right to a dissenting view as long as you do not advocate VIOLENCE.So if you do not have respect for an American's right to disagree with you then obviously you do not belong in my country.Bush is the worst president we have ever had and even people in the Republican Party are distancing themselves from him.Are Albanians advocating violence if they do not get recognition?Against whom?Read Mr.Montgomery's last article and you might enlighten yourself as to what is to come.The US cannot solve the pressing problems alone by a long shot nor just by having a few European countries on board.If Russia does not get respect in Europe then it will turn to Asia and that will be bad news for US national security.Imagine the Russians selling weapons to the Taleban in order for them to kill 50k American soldiers like in Vietnam.Imagine the Russians flooding the American and EU heroin market with the pure heroin they get from the Afghans in return for arms and the thousands of youth who will overdose on an annual basis.Imagine Putin going along with Chavez and Ahmedijan in setting the price of oil at $200 a gallon.Imagine the Chinese converting their 1.3 TRILLION US dollars into euros.You do not need an economics degree to understand what would happen to the value of the US dollar.Imagine the Russians selling their advanced weapons to the Iraqi insurgents and to Hamas and Hezbollah and to Iran as many nuclear submarines as the Iranians can afford and having them prowling near the US shore.Imagine having Chinese nuclear missiles in Cuba,Nicaragua,Bolivis or Venezuela.Do not disrespect the bear or the dragon because in the nuclear age armed conflict is suicide and any American who talks about armed conflict with Russia or China is an IDIOT.But of course I respect his right to be an idiot without telling him he should leave America.There are 300 million people in this country with 300 million different minds and only sheep follow blindly.

"Milosevic is dead" & there are a number of people including myself who danced in the streets when he was arrested. Too bad he didn't get to spend one day sentenced!

"It is also a fact that Milosevic's party still holds a significant position in the Serbian parliament and Albanians can hardly find that endearing."
(Ment, 27. August 2007 23:07)

MENT - how can a Serb residing in KosovO, which may I remind you is SERBIAN land, have any trust or faith that you won't continue to commit the crimes that have happened in the last two weeks, let alone the last decade? You are able to make everyone be accountable for any wrong-doings except yourself & the people that actually give you a "recommendary" rating on this website.

Ment:

Twice in one century the Germans conducted a war of extermination against the Serbs!
Russia came to our rescue at great cost to themselves many times and now again!
The rest is irrelevant!!!!
Yes some people never learn!!!

Zoran,
You really like to use propaganda-like populist statements, which however sound hollow. If the Germans would have conducted real war of extermination against you than today they would be no Serbs.

Prince Lazar

I was born and raised in Albania. I got the news from CNN and from my parents in Tirana who went regularly to the refugee camp set up a couple of hundred meters away from their house.
I don't know about Serb resolve, but I got to know enough about Serb viciousness.

Peace.

Zoran

There's a saying in Albania;

Don't ask "how have you been before"... ask "how you are now."

I thought the change in Germany's attitude has been evident for the past 50 odd years. I guess that's not enough for some.

GSP

You may have danced indeed, but that was too little too late. People like you should have protested when it mattered.

As for the second part, I'm assuming you're talking about the assault on the Serb couple.

Here's my take on it. When/if those 4 Albanians who did it get caught, I hope they get sent to a Serb jail. Whichever Serb inmate castrates them there has my blessings.

With regard to the other crimes done against the Serbs in Kosovo, I don't know whether they have been deliberately orchastrated or whether they're cases of tit-for-tat violence. This is the Balkans after all. People rarely forget and almost never forgive.

Either way it is disgusting but the presence of the radicals only adds fuel to the fire.