Ivanov: Appoint new UN Kosovo envoy

So yesterday some commentators said I was dreaming - I guess today those commentators must be waking up to a nightmare.

Look all I have said all along is that the Serbian leadership and those of the ethnic-Albanians need to come together and properly negotiate a solution that both parties can agree on and that in this respect can be stable and lasting - Independence is not stable and creates so many more issues then it resolves locally, regionally and globally.

Serbia is ready to negotiate - there must be a way for all to be staisfied and ways in which all can start to reconciliate - surely win-win is the best way forward for all those to whom it affects across Serbia as a whole!

If some ethnic-Albanians can live in Serbia what is different for those who happen to live in Kosovo & Metohija?

I would want to promote a new democratic Serbia that is a beacon to show that the Balkans is not a constant war zone where all ethnicities can live peacefully and prosper.

It is time that Win-Win is given serious and real consideration!

http://www.kosovocompromise.com/pages/kosovo_tommorow/sub_links/15/15.htm

Princip

You keep posting the same thing over and over again.

Yes, we have all heard you 'win-win' phrase before, and it makes no sense, since there is no win-win. There is either a 'win-lose' or 'lose-lose'.

SC resolution or not, Kosovo will become independent. USA and UK, France, Belgiulm, Holland, Albania, will recognize it straight away. slowly other countries will follow as well.

One thing is clear, serbia will never have any sovregnity over Kosovo. and the biggest loser will be Kosovan serbs.

So if serbs aregenuinely concerned about kosovan serbs and churches, than think about before you get excited about russian veto. which I doubt will happen anyway.

Nikshala,you are saying USA & UK will recognize you etc. etc.,great...there is just one "little" problem:north of Kosovo is not Rio Grande which you can swim over or dig some tunnel and sneak into US:-)Instead of that on the north of Kosovo is Serbia.So,how do you intend to go to central/western/northern Europe which loves Albanian immigrants so much if you don't have money for plane?I'm sure you will go by some great new highway to Albania and then by ship to the EU,huh?By the way ,i am sure UK,France,NL will be very generous and pour billions into independent Kosovo,especially France after Sarkozy becomes president he will open all borders and doors for you...LOL

Ahtisaari should have taken into account the requirements of all the stakeholders and given them equal consideration. Instead he has weighed in on the side of the Kosovo Albanians and the US, this makes him a poor mediator, so yes he should have been and should be replaced. It is an easy mistake to make, to appease what one assumes to be the most powerful stakeholder and paymaster, in this case the US. Let's hope that the US and any future negotiator/mediator realises that this strategy of bullying one side into submission won't work. Impartiality is a key quality for any negotiator/mediator.

Yea sure. What happened to your compatriots living in the eastern Croatia. Wasn't it in the border with Serbia or something?

Tell me what happened to them, I am curious?

Peace

Peter,
Just a short answer to your question, "So,how do you intend to go to central/western/northern Europe which loves Albanian immigrants so much if you don't have money for plane?"
-Don't you worry to much about that, because as far as I am informed K-Albanians go back and forth to Europe through Serbia every day, and all they need to have is a 5 Euro bill to give to the Serbian "well paid" police and the road will be free like for the VIP-es. Thanks for your concern.

Princip, First and foremost, there have been negotiations. I find myself repeating this over and over. The grounds on which Albanians and Serbs stand are on the opposite ends. Let me clarify – Albanians want outright independence from Serbia – anything less is unacceptable. Serbs only want to give a “broad autonomy”, nothing more. So there is no such thing as a win win solution, given the fact that there is no middle ground on what both sides claim. If Albanians get what they want, Serbs are the losers. If Serbs get what they want, Albanians are the losers.

Was that still complicated for you? If it is, please let me know what is unclear and I will explain in more detail.

Peter – I have no idea what you wrote. What does Rio Grande have anything to do with north of Kosova?

Pera – the primary stakeholders in this conflict are Albanians, followed by the Serbs. Given the nature of where each side stand as far as the status of the province is concerned, one of those groups is bound to be a loser. So by your rationale, since Albanians somehow got “favored”, the whole process is unfair? What if it were the other way around? I am sure you would be saying that you had nothing to do with it – and international body came to the conclusion that Kosova should remain under Serbia, so everything sounds Kosher. Additionally, let me remind you that Serbia is responsible for starting 4 wars in less than a decade, so the PR battle you would have to fight would be a long and excruciating one (let alone that no reasonable attempt has been done to give anyone a hint that Milosevic’s policies have been retired).

It’s funny seeing desperate last minute cries that makes no sense – the simple fact of the matter is that, if Albanians were not hunted down and killed like flies, not treated like second class citizens, and the Kosovar Serbs not being used as peons by Belgrade, things would’ve been quite different. I guess Milosevic’s Kool-Aid is still strong among the large extremist and nationalist robots (which sadly still roam at large everywhere, even in this very thread).


Princip – get your passport ready my friend and come down once the independence goes through so we can feast on some nice food and beer, and drive from end to end in free and independent Kosova without being scared of getting robbed, beaten, butchered and/or killed by Serbian MUP or VJ personnel just because the person you are next to happens to be an Albanian.

Peace and good day to all.

Kosovo’s institutions need to focus on implementing the standards. For example, there are still problems related to the return of refugees, rule of law, and other things, but the report will basically be positive,” Ruecker said....and this is coming from the UNMIK chief. But NATO is pushing to give the K-albanians speedy independence. What is wrong with this picture? Of course a new and IMPARTIAL and UNBIASED mediator should be apponted. Why not have the Russians select a new mediator? That would be fair, since the last one was selected by the West.

Albo, is this a comment of hate? Those people in Croatia got ethniclly cleansed, are you suggesting same thing will happen to Serbs in Kosovo?

Why do you cry when it happens to you then if you re suggesting it now when you know you have USA behind you.

Does more talks equal to ethnic cleasing to you or to use your brain a little bit more?

Peter,

You talk of impartiality. As far as I have followed the negotiations, Serbs haven't given a single inch in their demands. All they have done is presented mythical slogans. You seem to be an expert on how much the west dislikes Albanian immigrants. That's fine. That's your point of view as gruesome as it may sound. The fact is that Milosevic's and his supporter's barbarism is responsible for creating this situation not only in Kosovo, but Bosnia, Croatia and throughout Ballkans. Face it, the only card is left to play for Serbia is Russia's vetoe, which I sincerely doubt Russians would jeopardise their relations and economical benefits deriving from EU simply to protect Serbia, who if I may add has produced nothing more than graveyards throughout the 20TH Century. You forget to notice that Russia is not the only country in the world that sells petrolium products. A simple embargo by the west, would leave Russia in shambles. They did it during the cold war, what makes you believe they may not do it again. No, one in the west wants strong Russia as they are fully aware that one day they may just have to deal with a country possessing an equal obstructive mentality as to Serbias.

As you may be aware, Serbia was given a chance in 1913 by the same countries who are Pro-Kosovo today to do some good in Kosovo. All it did was murdered, repressed, and left Kosovo as the poorest province in Europe if not in the world. If in 100 years Serbia has shown nothing more than dismal progress in every aspect of life in Kosovo, what fools would believe the notion that Serbia may improve the situation in 3 or 5 years from now.

(don't forget Serbs burned 140000 homes, schools mosques, catholic churches, and Albanians in vengeance did the same, which is very shameful act if I may say so. But work out your property damage numbers and you will see who has paid a bigger price.)

As far as your partition idea which I saw on yesterday's post, you fail to realise that even in the North of Kosovo, Serbs enjoy a majority status by only a few percent. So, what are you going to partition? Even if Serbia offered Presevo valley, I don't think anyone will fall for it. And I understand, why give up 5 % of north for less than 1 percent of territory which if I may add again, Serbia has left as the poorest aerea in the world simply for being inhabitted by Albanians.

Western countries had credibility to convince both parties to sit and negotiate and that is what happened, however, Russia does not have that credibility to convice both parties, in this case Albanian. This gets further, if Kosovo government receives advises from the US, UK and EU technical assistance missions within the Government to not accept further negotiations. At the end, Western Countries because of Kosovo deviated from UN SC and created a fact in Kosovo and went back to UN SC. Hope that you will not say that I'm dreaming, cause I'm lucky to be part of that technical assistance :).

nikshala,

yes, Princip is repeating it, but, aren´t the Albanians also repeating on and on their wishful thinking? the difference is, what he´s writes has some substance, sometimes he even provides some links.
you are only talking.
and are you really sure that "other countries will follow slowly"? better do not count on that!

let´s see what future brings, I am confident.

"This also means that the situation that has taken shape between the parties, must be discussed, and if no agreement has been forged - we understand it has not - the talks must be continued and a new special envoy should be appointed," Ivanov said.” –this dude , Kostunica and Milosoveic have something in common.
“Russia will neither assume, nor share responsibility for thoughtless decisions of this sort,"- Ivanov sad ---in other word read between the lines –NO VETO

Alban Castro :"A simple embargo by the west, would leave Russia in shambles."

Jeez man...you really made me laugh:-)Do you think EU wouldn't buy oil&gas from some other country if they had much choice???LOL.Anyway,Russia is exporting more and more oil to China ,i forgot the numbers but they are huge,so EU is becomming less important.Its obvious you never had any economy class at Uni...but thats your problem.Oh and stories about 1912.,"mass torture of poor Albanians" blah blah ...you think anybody in the West/Eeast gives a damn about that?
So,Russians said Ahtisaari and his plan are dead.What are you going to do now?Show your guts,like Kurti,and declare independence now! What are you waiting for?

I would like to clarify two things for the pro-Albanian lobby on this thread.

Firstly, the IDEAL outcome for Belgrade is total reintegration of the province of Kosovo into Serbia proper, so the Serbians have shown their willingness to compromise by offering massive autonomy concessions for the province. Meanwhile the Albanians have not moved one inch from there initial demand for independence.

Secondly, the misnomer that Kosovo has been treated badly by Serbia/Yugoslavia. If you know anything about what has happened in Kosovo in the last 50 years you will know that between 1954 and 1980 industrial production increased by 1800 percent; agriculture by 300 percent; the province got electricity, secondary and higher education institutions; modern roads; health care, social welfare and cultural facilities for all citizens.

Rapid development of the province was paid for by a special fund within the federal budget which was established from taxes from all over Yugoslavia. This fund financed 70 percent of all investments in Kosovo between 1971 and 1985. 70percent of the money for the fund was raised solely from Serbian taxes. Between 1978 and 1985, the fund also granted investment to the extent of 1.83 percent of national GDP at rates of upto 25 percent more favourable than other under developed areas of SFRY.

So to say that Serbia or SFRY never did anything for Kosovo is just one more of the gross lies made by Albanians that has created all the trouble that has befallen in Kosovo.

RE ;don't forget Serbs burned 140000 homes, schools mosques, catholic churches, and Albanians in vengeance did the same, which is very shameful act if I may say so.


Find the source of your accusations and figures, print facts not propoganda.

So yesterday some commentators said I was dreaming - I guess today those commentators must be waking up to a nightmare.

Look all I have said all along is that the Serbian leadership and those of the ethnic-Albanians need to come together and properly negotiate a solution that both parties can agree on and that in this respect can be stable and lasting - Independence is not stable and creates so many more issues then it resolves locally, regionally and globally.

Serbia is ready to negotiate - there must be a way for all to be staisfied and ways in which all can start to reconciliate - surely win-win is the best way forward for all those to whom it affects across Serbia as a whole!

If some ethnic-Albanians can live in Serbia what is different for those who happen to live in Kosovo & Metohija?

I would want to promote a new democratic Serbia that is a beacon to show that the Balkans is not a constant war zone where all ethnicities can live peacefully and prosper.

It is time that Win-Win is given serious and real consideration!

http://www.kosovocompromise.com/pages/kosovo_tommorow/sub_links/15/15.htm

Princip

You keep posting the same thing over and over again.

Yes, we have all heard you 'win-win' phrase before, and it makes no sense, since there is no win-win. There is either a 'win-lose' or 'lose-lose'.

SC resolution or not, Kosovo will become independent. USA and UK, France, Belgiulm, Holland, Albania, will recognize it straight away. slowly other countries will follow as well.

One thing is clear, serbia will never have any sovregnity over Kosovo. and the biggest loser will be Kosovan serbs.

So if serbs aregenuinely concerned about kosovan serbs and churches, than think about before you get excited about russian veto. which I doubt will happen anyway.

Nikshala,you are saying USA & UK will recognize you etc. etc.,great...there is just one "little" problem:north of Kosovo is not Rio Grande which you can swim over or dig some tunnel and sneak into US:-)Instead of that on the north of Kosovo is Serbia.So,how do you intend to go to central/western/northern Europe which loves Albanian immigrants so much if you don't have money for plane?I'm sure you will go by some great new highway to Albania and then by ship to the EU,huh?By the way ,i am sure UK,France,NL will be very generous and pour billions into independent Kosovo,especially France after Sarkozy becomes president he will open all borders and doors for you...LOL

Ahtisaari should have taken into account the requirements of all the stakeholders and given them equal consideration. Instead he has weighed in on the side of the Kosovo Albanians and the US, this makes him a poor mediator, so yes he should have been and should be replaced. It is an easy mistake to make, to appease what one assumes to be the most powerful stakeholder and paymaster, in this case the US. Let's hope that the US and any future negotiator/mediator realises that this strategy of bullying one side into submission won't work. Impartiality is a key quality for any negotiator/mediator.

Yea sure. What happened to your compatriots living in the eastern Croatia. Wasn't it in the border with Serbia or something?

Tell me what happened to them, I am curious?

Peace

Peter,
Just a short answer to your question, "So,how do you intend to go to central/western/northern Europe which loves Albanian immigrants so much if you don't have money for plane?"
-Don't you worry to much about that, because as far as I am informed K-Albanians go back and forth to Europe through Serbia every day, and all they need to have is a 5 Euro bill to give to the Serbian "well paid" police and the road will be free like for the VIP-es. Thanks for your concern.

Princip, First and foremost, there have been negotiations. I find myself repeating this over and over. The grounds on which Albanians and Serbs stand are on the opposite ends. Let me clarify – Albanians want outright independence from Serbia – anything less is unacceptable. Serbs only want to give a “broad autonomy”, nothing more. So there is no such thing as a win win solution, given the fact that there is no middle ground on what both sides claim. If Albanians get what they want, Serbs are the losers. If Serbs get what they want, Albanians are the losers.

Was that still complicated for you? If it is, please let me know what is unclear and I will explain in more detail.

Peter – I have no idea what you wrote. What does Rio Grande have anything to do with north of Kosova?

Pera – the primary stakeholders in this conflict are Albanians, followed by the Serbs. Given the nature of where each side stand as far as the status of the province is concerned, one of those groups is bound to be a loser. So by your rationale, since Albanians somehow got “favored”, the whole process is unfair? What if it were the other way around? I am sure you would be saying that you had nothing to do with it – and international body came to the conclusion that Kosova should remain under Serbia, so everything sounds Kosher. Additionally, let me remind you that Serbia is responsible for starting 4 wars in less than a decade, so the PR battle you would have to fight would be a long and excruciating one (let alone that no reasonable attempt has been done to give anyone a hint that Milosevic’s policies have been retired).

It’s funny seeing desperate last minute cries that makes no sense – the simple fact of the matter is that, if Albanians were not hunted down and killed like flies, not treated like second class citizens, and the Kosovar Serbs not being used as peons by Belgrade, things would’ve been quite different. I guess Milosevic’s Kool-Aid is still strong among the large extremist and nationalist robots (which sadly still roam at large everywhere, even in this very thread).


Princip – get your passport ready my friend and come down once the independence goes through so we can feast on some nice food and beer, and drive from end to end in free and independent Kosova without being scared of getting robbed, beaten, butchered and/or killed by Serbian MUP or VJ personnel just because the person you are next to happens to be an Albanian.

Peace and good day to all.

Kosovo’s institutions need to focus on implementing the standards. For example, there are still problems related to the return of refugees, rule of law, and other things, but the report will basically be positive,” Ruecker said....and this is coming from the UNMIK chief. But NATO is pushing to give the K-albanians speedy independence. What is wrong with this picture? Of course a new and IMPARTIAL and UNBIASED mediator should be apponted. Why not have the Russians select a new mediator? That would be fair, since the last one was selected by the West.

Albo, is this a comment of hate? Those people in Croatia got ethniclly cleansed, are you suggesting same thing will happen to Serbs in Kosovo?

Why do you cry when it happens to you then if you re suggesting it now when you know you have USA behind you.

Does more talks equal to ethnic cleasing to you or to use your brain a little bit more?

Peter,

You talk of impartiality. As far as I have followed the negotiations, Serbs haven't given a single inch in their demands. All they have done is presented mythical slogans. You seem to be an expert on how much the west dislikes Albanian immigrants. That's fine. That's your point of view as gruesome as it may sound. The fact is that Milosevic's and his supporter's barbarism is responsible for creating this situation not only in Kosovo, but Bosnia, Croatia and throughout Ballkans. Face it, the only card is left to play for Serbia is Russia's vetoe, which I sincerely doubt Russians would jeopardise their relations and economical benefits deriving from EU simply to protect Serbia, who if I may add has produced nothing more than graveyards throughout the 20TH Century. You forget to notice that Russia is not the only country in the world that sells petrolium products. A simple embargo by the west, would leave Russia in shambles. They did it during the cold war, what makes you believe they may not do it again. No, one in the west wants strong Russia as they are fully aware that one day they may just have to deal with a country possessing an equal obstructive mentality as to Serbias.

As you may be aware, Serbia was given a chance in 1913 by the same countries who are Pro-Kosovo today to do some good in Kosovo. All it did was murdered, repressed, and left Kosovo as the poorest province in Europe if not in the world. If in 100 years Serbia has shown nothing more than dismal progress in every aspect of life in Kosovo, what fools would believe the notion that Serbia may improve the situation in 3 or 5 years from now.

(don't forget Serbs burned 140000 homes, schools mosques, catholic churches, and Albanians in vengeance did the same, which is very shameful act if I may say so. But work out your property damage numbers and you will see who has paid a bigger price.)

As far as your partition idea which I saw on yesterday's post, you fail to realise that even in the North of Kosovo, Serbs enjoy a majority status by only a few percent. So, what are you going to partition? Even if Serbia offered Presevo valley, I don't think anyone will fall for it. And I understand, why give up 5 % of north for less than 1 percent of territory which if I may add again, Serbia has left as the poorest aerea in the world simply for being inhabitted by Albanians.

Western countries had credibility to convince both parties to sit and negotiate and that is what happened, however, Russia does not have that credibility to convice both parties, in this case Albanian. This gets further, if Kosovo government receives advises from the US, UK and EU technical assistance missions within the Government to not accept further negotiations. At the end, Western Countries because of Kosovo deviated from UN SC and created a fact in Kosovo and went back to UN SC. Hope that you will not say that I'm dreaming, cause I'm lucky to be part of that technical assistance :).

nikshala,

yes, Princip is repeating it, but, aren´t the Albanians also repeating on and on their wishful thinking? the difference is, what he´s writes has some substance, sometimes he even provides some links.
you are only talking.
and are you really sure that "other countries will follow slowly"? better do not count on that!

let´s see what future brings, I am confident.

"This also means that the situation that has taken shape between the parties, must be discussed, and if no agreement has been forged - we understand it has not - the talks must be continued and a new special envoy should be appointed," Ivanov said.” –this dude , Kostunica and Milosoveic have something in common.
“Russia will neither assume, nor share responsibility for thoughtless decisions of this sort,"- Ivanov sad ---in other word read between the lines –NO VETO

Alban Castro :"A simple embargo by the west, would leave Russia in shambles."

Jeez man...you really made me laugh:-)Do you think EU wouldn't buy oil&gas from some other country if they had much choice???LOL.Anyway,Russia is exporting more and more oil to China ,i forgot the numbers but they are huge,so EU is becomming less important.Its obvious you never had any economy class at Uni...but thats your problem.Oh and stories about 1912.,"mass torture of poor Albanians" blah blah ...you think anybody in the West/Eeast gives a damn about that?
So,Russians said Ahtisaari and his plan are dead.What are you going to do now?Show your guts,like Kurti,and declare independence now! What are you waiting for?

I would like to clarify two things for the pro-Albanian lobby on this thread.

Firstly, the IDEAL outcome for Belgrade is total reintegration of the province of Kosovo into Serbia proper, so the Serbians have shown their willingness to compromise by offering massive autonomy concessions for the province. Meanwhile the Albanians have not moved one inch from there initial demand for independence.

Secondly, the misnomer that Kosovo has been treated badly by Serbia/Yugoslavia. If you know anything about what has happened in Kosovo in the last 50 years you will know that between 1954 and 1980 industrial production increased by 1800 percent; agriculture by 300 percent; the province got electricity, secondary and higher education institutions; modern roads; health care, social welfare and cultural facilities for all citizens.

Rapid development of the province was paid for by a special fund within the federal budget which was established from taxes from all over Yugoslavia. This fund financed 70 percent of all investments in Kosovo between 1971 and 1985. 70percent of the money for the fund was raised solely from Serbian taxes. Between 1978 and 1985, the fund also granted investment to the extent of 1.83 percent of national GDP at rates of upto 25 percent more favourable than other under developed areas of SFRY.

So to say that Serbia or SFRY never did anything for Kosovo is just one more of the gross lies made by Albanians that has created all the trouble that has befallen in Kosovo.

RE ;don't forget Serbs burned 140000 homes, schools mosques, catholic churches, and Albanians in vengeance did the same, which is very shameful act if I may say so.


Find the source of your accusations and figures, print facts not propoganda.