Vienna: Security provisions stumbling block

"Samardžić went on to say that the Albanian delegation tried to portray Serbian cultural heritage in Kosovo as the heritage of Kosovo Serbs, rather than the Serbian nation in its entirety."

At the level of Serbians left in Kosovo, doesn't that equate to around one church or monastery per 10 people?

"On the other hand, we’ve had seven years to learn how to conduct ourselves and organize our own security troops"

- yeah right that is why since 1999 thousands of non-Albanians are dead or missing and 220,000 have been ethnically cleansed and have no return in sight. If this is how they have learnt to conduct themselve imagine what will happen if NATO did step aside - the UN and OSCE have been unable to protect themselves and their own property let alone non-Albanians.

That's hilarious, no Albanian would ever agree to another Serbian troop stepping foot in Kosova. No matter who's asking, let alone Serbia. How long does it take for them to understand that once you try to ethnically cleanse a people, you have completely depleted your trust reserve.

As teenager I remember very well that no serb from serbia ever came to visit Deqani Monastery(talking about mid 1970)and slo during Miloseivs era, and now all of sudden this Monastery and others are the craddle of serbia.Kosovar Albanians were the one who cared and guarded these Monasteries untill Milosevis started his opresion and killing of Albanians.During the war we all know what happened to Albaninans and religious sites, the atrocities commited by serb army, paramilitaries, police and serb civilians.Askid in 1971,72,73 used to go camping near Deqani Mostery where KFOR camp is located now. This area did not belong to Monastery but was socialy owned and now Monastery is trying to claimed as theirs. These are things that K-Albaninas are being oushed to to divorce from serbia and even hate them with pasion.
Princip, give me facts about thousands killed after the war and 220000 chased out. serbs that left Kosova as NATO solders were moving, wheere the ones that comitted the worst crimes against their neighbors.Every serb with clean hands is living in Kosova right now, but if you got blood in your hands abviously you are not going to come back because you have to face justice.Stop lying with figures again Princip.

Some sort of Serbian cultural protection may be a reasonable request. So long as their jurisdiction is strictly constrained to the cultural sights it could work kind of like something between the US's National Park Police and a museum guard. You could make it a requirement that they be Kosovars (but with no restriction on ethnicity) but paid and regulated by a commission run mostly by Serbs.

If it is really a reasonable request, its doable. If its a negotiating tactic to reintroduce regular Serbian police or army, it will become obvious in the discussions.

Ahmet, are you on serious?? Dont forget Yugoslavia was communist during Tito, and we know how communists felt about religion!!! So based on that, you are saying that we have NO right to out religous monuments and OUR HERITAGE?? And THE SERBS HAVE BEEN LEAVING KOCOBO EVER SINCE ALBANIANS HAVE BEEN ENTERING ILLEGALY BECAUSE ALBANIA WAS A 3RD WORLD COUNTRY FOR DECADES WITH NO FUTURE! But most recently they left because theyre lives were in serious and constant danger! BELIEVE ME, KOCOBO WILL NEVER BE TAKEN FROM SRBIJA!

The SOP should be given Vatican level status, with its own right to a "Vatican Guard" type of thing. I suggest we also use the Swiss for this, or members of some other neutral foreign country. I understand Albanian concerns about having Serbian troops stationed in parts of Kosovo, but we Serbs must also have real protection for our what we consider to represent the very cradle of our Civilization. The current troops in Kosovo have failed miserably in protecting our heritage and culture. I personally can not buy into Ceku's claims that our people and monuments will be protected, after all, even the EU gave up on "Standards before Status" and to me, it’s a little insulting to claim otherwise. If the Kosovar government wanted to make the claim that minorities and historical sites would be fully protected, they should have stuck firmly to the idea of "Standards" and not given up on it. You can not abandon "Standards" and then claim to protect minorities, its contradictory.

Maybe we should consider going back to implementing "Standards" first? Then the Kosovar government would be fully in their rights to claim they will protect minorities and their institutions. However, as it stands now, Minority protections are non-existent, putting protections on paper again doesn't change that.

So, what will the ramifications of ignoring the "Standards" requirements? This is a point the Serbian negotiating team needs to emphasize and not back down on.

Right back Ahmet,

"220,000 chased out. serbs that left Kosova as NATO solders were moving, wheere the ones that comitted the worst crimes against their neighbors."

In your warped sense of history are we to believe that the thousands of people displaced when the bombardment started were all moving out because they had blood on their hands?

Oh by the way yes you were right and I was wrong on the 31st May UNHCR total displaced was 240,000

"There are still more than 20,000 internally displaced people in Kosovo, mostly Serbs and Roma. In addition, more than 220,000 internally displaced remain in Serbia and Montenegro."
[
http://www.unhcr.org/cgi-bin/texis/vtx/news/opendoc.htm?tbl=NEWS&id=447db6262&page=news
]

Regarding the familes who have suffered at the hands of ethnic-Albanians read the following article about the dead body returned of a 57 who was kidnapped from her flat on June 28 1999 and many others missing,
[
http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,3604,541595,00.html
]

For a list of those killed
[
http://www.decani.org/killed.html
]

Serb posters like my self have at least said that we are saddened by what individual Serbs have commited against ethnic-Albanians and condemn these atrocities and believe that those who have commited atrocities should face justcice - Is it not time we heard the same form you?

Also you are only too aware that many Serbs did visit Decani and other places but in doing so would have had their name added to a list. regarding socially owned land that is what communism did but surely it is only right that the Church had its property rightfully returned or dod you think like the communists that it is right to misappropriate land that does not belong to you?

Ahmet and other Albanians,
The whole world knows who committed the crimes and the whole world knows the figures. There is no point arguing with Serbs about that.
The Serbian viewpoint switches with the direction of the wind. Look at what happened with Srebrenica. Serbs had been denying the whole thing ever happened. Now, after the Hague decision, they quickly decided to admit it. The same will happen with their crimes in Kosova. The day will come when they will join the rest of the world and admitt them. We do not have to waste time with them about this in the mean time. I hope Kosova will very soon have its own army to guarantee that Serbia will never again committ any massacres on Kosova's soil.

Matthew, I agree with you to some extend and I know that most of Serbs living in Kosovo do not trust local Albanian authorities, but seriously there wasn't ever a considerable attempt to collaborate with provisional Kosovar institutions. It hurts that Belgrade manipulates Kosovo's Serbs for numerous reasons and have inept them for integrating into Kosovo's community. Yes, they may not feel secure for time being, but Belgrade should help reconciliation with Albanians and this is matter of time. I myself, am Milosevic war survivor and trust me I will never do things that Serbian paramilitaries did to my family, such as killing two of my uncles. Aside from that, don't expect that I would be a close to close friend with Serbs in a short period of time, we are human beings and we need time to reconciliate, but we can achieve that by mutual interest, living and doing business together. I look forward to an independent Kosovo, but I look forward to stability and peace in this part of Europe. It's time to move on and progresses economically, generations are coming without future.

NATO troops just watch as Orthodox churches and monasteries are burned and destoryed by Albanians mobs. The only people who will prevent mobs from attacking and destroying Serb landmarks are Serbs.

The churches are the heritage of Kosovo Serbs only?? The Albanians are acting OUTRAGEOUSLY!!

Belgrade:Serbian Police to Guard the Monasteries.
What a joke!
Some people just don't get it.
After what happened with the late Prime Minister Djindjic who can trust Serbian Police!Monasteries will be protected by Kosovan Police.Could be an Kosovan Albanian policeman or a Kosovan Serb policeman.
In few years time when in Europe will be no borders all the interesting people can visit their hitorical heritage places,no problem.
Now why politicising the religion so much,or maybe they have an excuse after what happened in March 2004!
Always something for Serbs,when they are going to take the reality check.Maybe never!!!

Do you not understand that Albanians are the ones destroying Serbian religious landmarks while Albanians in power do nothing about it? Serbs are supposed to trust Albanians not to destory the churches and monasteries? RIDICULOUS.

"I myself, am Milosevic war survivor and trust me I will never do things that Serbian paramilitaries did to my family, such as killing two of my uncles.(Kushtrim, Thursday, 1 March, 2007, 20:07)"
Kushtrim, I am truly sorry for your loss and what you suffered. In many ways, it is similar to what my family experienced in Krajina during WWII and Operation Storm, at least the feelings are the same (My wife was 16 at the time of Operation Storm). I strongly condemn violence of any kind regardless of the perpetrators.
Let us hope that we can find a solution to our present situation that brings long term stability to our region. I do respect the Albanian people greatly, and I find your history fascinating. We have regional issues and common interests that will bind us together in the future. I grew up in the US, and I consider anyone from the Balkans a brother, and they do as well.
My only concern is for what I consider the very foundation of Serbian civilization. To me, and many other Serbians, it is sacred. I do wish a real compromise and real security could be put in place for my people. It’s the International Communities fault that we don't have better security there, they were the ones in the position to implement it. I personally do not believe that the majority of the Albanian people are planning to destroy our heritage. However, it only takes a few extremists to cause great damage, and who knows what random event might cause another 2004 style riot, which happened because of rampant rumors.
Hopefully both our politicians will get their act together and come up with a compromise that helps the Presevo Albanians in exchange for some of our needs in Kosovo.

Hey, I for one am tiring of the Albanians who come here to say to the Serbs over and over again: "get a reality check!"

YOU folks are the ones who are in NEED of a reality check.

In 1995, according to the USA govt. and the CIA, your present KLA leaders took money to fund their terrorist actions in Serbian region of Kosovo, from OSAMA BIN LADEN and his bankers, at a meeting in Tirana.

The American GOVT NOW knows it; American citizens NOW know it!

The story has been in news many, many times. All the many Christian TV and radio stations have told the story often. The "cat's out of the bag boys!!

Since 9/11 2001, any connection with old OBL makes the KLA really look BAD.

The West holds the war criminal charges over Ceku's head and he is their puppet. He WILL do as they tell him or he can "Do" the Hague court too.

Now, here is another reality check for you: AMERICANS want out of Kosovo!! Springtime in Afganistan looks to be a battle royal! And Iraq is a true diaster. Congress is about to cut the funding in a big way.

Your lobbyists in the USA do not have enough money or power to break up a country now. They couldn't get your pal John Kerry elected. They cannot block a Russian veto at the UNSC.

The American secretly want the Serbs to fight this new UN proposal and they want Ahtisaari to be forced to resign. The man is even an embarassment to his old boss, George Soros.

Just like the Russians, the AMERICANS want a compromise agreement and they will support the side WILLING to work within a compromise. That means, NO independence.

Even the large Muslim nation of Indonesia has had with your stubborn attitudes. They do not want to lose Papua territory in their own country. Their govt. has said, JUST TODAY, that taking Kosovo from a LEGITIMATE, UN member state is simply NOT LEGAL.

Serbs have MUCH more potential financial progre$$ to offer the West than a "greater" Albania called "kosova" with gangsters and drug smugglers.

And last but not least, AMERICANS want to make money in the Balkans and a poor economically challenged "Kosova" has been nothing but a money pit. The Monks at Decani make MORE money on their handiwork that the rest of the province of Kosovo.

THINK PROFIT. Albanians in Kosovo are NOT profitable enough. Bottom line all that counts.

America has no friends, just financial interests, it appears.

Princip,

I took a look at your sources, and here is what I found;

From the UNCHR website; “There are still more than 20,000 internally displaced people in Kosovo, mostly Serbs and Roma. In addition, more than 220,000 internally displaced remain in Serbia and Montenegro.” Only 20,000 are displaced that are identified as non-Albanians in Kosova. As for the 220,000, (I cannot see a study conducted about that number in the site) it is not even identifying what ethnic group that number is divided in – if that number were indeed correct, I wouldn’t even be surprised if a lot of them were Albanians. Plus, the whole article was about Roma getting housing, not Serbs. Kosova with their measly and borderline pathetic budget is getting families housing, whereas Serbian government hasn’t even attempted to repair what they have destroyed mercilessly. So choose your articles to suit your argument better next time.

As for the guardian article – they are interviewing a couple of people who lost loved ones, which is also a tragedy. One life lost is one too much, and there is no justification for killing innocent people, but let me put things into perspective. A lot of what they are saying is biased up the ying yang. Graves in northern Albania, prison/labor camps …. Oh come on. All of what allegedly happened was in mid June of ’99. That’s the time when NATO forces were just getting in – and the Serbian military and paramilitary forces pulling out. Till that time, the Serb forces reigned supreme, so KLA wasn’t even able to confront the Serb forces, let alone have enough land and resources to have secret prisons and labor camps in Kosova without being seen and exterminated by the Serb military and paramilitary units. Then again, as I pointed out, this is an article about a couple of people who have been interviewed and Guardian wrote about how they described of what is going on. Not a study at all to enforce an argument, in my opinion. I can give you articles like this about what people went through all you want, but getting some studies done by international bodies is what matters when trying to enforce an argument.

As for the Serb propaganda site, I take that with a grain of salt. I am not denying that some Serbs have indeed been murdered, but I am not buying what that site says for a second (looks awfully similar to www.kosovo.net ). Given the track record of Milosevic’s government’s skill in forging votes (I am sure you’ve seen numerous incidents where it was found that people who had died two decades earlier, were casting their ballots for Milosevic? Can you prove that this is not a stunt that was borrowed from Milosevic’s book? Or even blatantly fabricated?), I am sure there is some inflation on that list. Have you got an international STUDY to confirm that list? If you do, please post it; I am interested to see if it confirms it (even if it disproves it, but still has people who have indeed been murdered, I am still interested in seeing it).

Until then, your sources aren’t looking very good.



Now commenting on the article;

I really think that Serbian delegation is indeed politicizing the religious and historical monuments in Kosova. If they cared so dearly about them, and wanted to make sure of their safety, why don’t they train Kosova’s police or some other entity to guard these? I mean, it seems that it automatically has to be a Serbian organ to come down there and “protect” them. This translates to Serbia having sovereignty on those premises, with their protection as a pretext. Think of it as having hundreds of embassies with a good amount of land all over a small territory such as that of Kosova. Give me a break! Does the Serb delegation think that people are that stupid to fall for it?


What I and a lot of other Kosovars would gladly accept, as Matthew pointed out, is have an international force protect these places (without having complete immunity of the Kosovar law or Vatican style status). Then Serb delegation can rest assured that their monuments are protected by someone other than Kosovars. This way (and I hate saying this, since Princip pretty much has a trade mark and a monopoly on the word) it’s a win-win solution.

The reason for displaced Kosovo Serbs is that they fear retribution if they return to Kosovo. Serbs love to point out they are the victims but refuse to admit how it got to that position. Simple, serbian army marched on kosovo, killing alabanians and dispelling them. When NATO bombed and they lost, they feared retribution. And now they play the "we are victims" game.

Same in croatia, for 5 years they cleansed Krajina out of Croats and many other places in croatia and then when Croats fought back, all of a sudden they feel they are the victims but dont realise how themselves they contributed to their own downfall. In fact, most of the world sees it as serbs getting what they deserved. Their own medicine.

Serbs want to control the whole of area they live in. Seselj even has said that Croatia is catholic Serbia. While it takes two to tango, in case of what serbs did, the other partner had their legs and arms tied. JNA military strength was inflicted upon croatia and bosnia who had no military early on. its not defence but opportunism. Not to mention cowardly.

Jeton,

is it not time that you accepted the reality that innocent non-Albanians civilians have been kiled in the most barbourous way at the hands of ethnic-Albanians for the fact that they were not Albanian - you clearly can read but it is time for commentators like yourself to accept the barbarity commited by other ethnic-Albanians and realise that all there is no guarantee of security for non-Albanians.

Daniel the same can be said by yourself regarding the killings of Serbs and destruction to their homes and centuries old communities. Matthew has pointed out that Croats have been just as atrocias in the rampage of throughout Krajina. DO you think a innocent Serb civilians life is less then any other human or do you agree that it is ok to kill Serbs as they are lesser humans? Does their death not warrant the same justice - if so then why do you try to make so little of it?

I know what happend in both Krajina and Kosovo because like many "Yugoslav" families I have cousins and family who are Slovene, Croat & Serbs (Krajina, Bosnia & Kosovo - many who are refugees in Serbia proper) so I do know the difference between all the polarisation that goes on in suggesting only one is a victim and only one is the perpertrator. All are responsible and all have lost and each life is as precious as the next. The lies and exagerations that have clouded peoples perception do little to reconcile diffrences - they just store up the troubles - communist froze these conficts that democracy thawed but now lies and deceit will keep them boiling.

Princip,

If you read my post, you would see that I am indeed acknowledging that some people did indeed get killed. If that is not enough, do you want me to take a drum out and beat it to complement my screaming it out loud that there indeed have been victims? Would that satisfy thee, your majesty?
I like it how you pepper your paragraph with words like “barbaric”. I guess you should look in the mirror and see that Serbia gave a whole new meaning of what barbarism is, so don’t make yourself a hypocrite, it just demolishes whatever argument you are trying to make. Least you and anyone else can do is trying a constructive argument on how things should be mended and all people look forward to the future. Going back in history has never really made anyone prosper, and I don’t see why that would work now …

Good day to all.

“Jeton,

is it not time that you accepted the reality that innocent non-Albanians civilians have been kiled in the most barbourous way”

Princip, in Jeton’s defense, he has in fact both apologized and recognized that crimes were committed against the non-Albanian population. For that, he has my deep respect.

"Samardžić went on to say that the Albanian delegation tried to portray Serbian cultural heritage in Kosovo as the heritage of Kosovo Serbs, rather than the Serbian nation in its entirety."

At the level of Serbians left in Kosovo, doesn't that equate to around one church or monastery per 10 people?

"On the other hand, we’ve had seven years to learn how to conduct ourselves and organize our own security troops"

- yeah right that is why since 1999 thousands of non-Albanians are dead or missing and 220,000 have been ethnically cleansed and have no return in sight. If this is how they have learnt to conduct themselve imagine what will happen if NATO did step aside - the UN and OSCE have been unable to protect themselves and their own property let alone non-Albanians.

That's hilarious, no Albanian would ever agree to another Serbian troop stepping foot in Kosova. No matter who's asking, let alone Serbia. How long does it take for them to understand that once you try to ethnically cleanse a people, you have completely depleted your trust reserve.

As teenager I remember very well that no serb from serbia ever came to visit Deqani Monastery(talking about mid 1970)and slo during Miloseivs era, and now all of sudden this Monastery and others are the craddle of serbia.Kosovar Albanians were the one who cared and guarded these Monasteries untill Milosevis started his opresion and killing of Albanians.During the war we all know what happened to Albaninans and religious sites, the atrocities commited by serb army, paramilitaries, police and serb civilians.Askid in 1971,72,73 used to go camping near Deqani Mostery where KFOR camp is located now. This area did not belong to Monastery but was socialy owned and now Monastery is trying to claimed as theirs. These are things that K-Albaninas are being oushed to to divorce from serbia and even hate them with pasion.
Princip, give me facts about thousands killed after the war and 220000 chased out. serbs that left Kosova as NATO solders were moving, wheere the ones that comitted the worst crimes against their neighbors.Every serb with clean hands is living in Kosova right now, but if you got blood in your hands abviously you are not going to come back because you have to face justice.Stop lying with figures again Princip.

Some sort of Serbian cultural protection may be a reasonable request. So long as their jurisdiction is strictly constrained to the cultural sights it could work kind of like something between the US's National Park Police and a museum guard. You could make it a requirement that they be Kosovars (but with no restriction on ethnicity) but paid and regulated by a commission run mostly by Serbs.

If it is really a reasonable request, its doable. If its a negotiating tactic to reintroduce regular Serbian police or army, it will become obvious in the discussions.

Ahmet, are you on serious?? Dont forget Yugoslavia was communist during Tito, and we know how communists felt about religion!!! So based on that, you are saying that we have NO right to out religous monuments and OUR HERITAGE?? And THE SERBS HAVE BEEN LEAVING KOCOBO EVER SINCE ALBANIANS HAVE BEEN ENTERING ILLEGALY BECAUSE ALBANIA WAS A 3RD WORLD COUNTRY FOR DECADES WITH NO FUTURE! But most recently they left because theyre lives were in serious and constant danger! BELIEVE ME, KOCOBO WILL NEVER BE TAKEN FROM SRBIJA!

The SOP should be given Vatican level status, with its own right to a "Vatican Guard" type of thing. I suggest we also use the Swiss for this, or members of some other neutral foreign country. I understand Albanian concerns about having Serbian troops stationed in parts of Kosovo, but we Serbs must also have real protection for our what we consider to represent the very cradle of our Civilization. The current troops in Kosovo have failed miserably in protecting our heritage and culture. I personally can not buy into Ceku's claims that our people and monuments will be protected, after all, even the EU gave up on "Standards before Status" and to me, it’s a little insulting to claim otherwise. If the Kosovar government wanted to make the claim that minorities and historical sites would be fully protected, they should have stuck firmly to the idea of "Standards" and not given up on it. You can not abandon "Standards" and then claim to protect minorities, its contradictory.

Maybe we should consider going back to implementing "Standards" first? Then the Kosovar government would be fully in their rights to claim they will protect minorities and their institutions. However, as it stands now, Minority protections are non-existent, putting protections on paper again doesn't change that.

So, what will the ramifications of ignoring the "Standards" requirements? This is a point the Serbian negotiating team needs to emphasize and not back down on.

Right back Ahmet,

"220,000 chased out. serbs that left Kosova as NATO solders were moving, wheere the ones that comitted the worst crimes against their neighbors."

In your warped sense of history are we to believe that the thousands of people displaced when the bombardment started were all moving out because they had blood on their hands?

Oh by the way yes you were right and I was wrong on the 31st May UNHCR total displaced was 240,000

"There are still more than 20,000 internally displaced people in Kosovo, mostly Serbs and Roma. In addition, more than 220,000 internally displaced remain in Serbia and Montenegro."
[
http://www.unhcr.org/cgi-bin/texis/vtx/news/opendoc.htm?tbl=NEWS&id=447db6262&page=news
]

Regarding the familes who have suffered at the hands of ethnic-Albanians read the following article about the dead body returned of a 57 who was kidnapped from her flat on June 28 1999 and many others missing,
[
http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,3604,541595,00.html
]

For a list of those killed
[
http://www.decani.org/killed.html
]

Serb posters like my self have at least said that we are saddened by what individual Serbs have commited against ethnic-Albanians and condemn these atrocities and believe that those who have commited atrocities should face justcice - Is it not time we heard the same form you?

Also you are only too aware that many Serbs did visit Decani and other places but in doing so would have had their name added to a list. regarding socially owned land that is what communism did but surely it is only right that the Church had its property rightfully returned or dod you think like the communists that it is right to misappropriate land that does not belong to you?

Ahmet and other Albanians,
The whole world knows who committed the crimes and the whole world knows the figures. There is no point arguing with Serbs about that.
The Serbian viewpoint switches with the direction of the wind. Look at what happened with Srebrenica. Serbs had been denying the whole thing ever happened. Now, after the Hague decision, they quickly decided to admit it. The same will happen with their crimes in Kosova. The day will come when they will join the rest of the world and admitt them. We do not have to waste time with them about this in the mean time. I hope Kosova will very soon have its own army to guarantee that Serbia will never again committ any massacres on Kosova's soil.

Matthew, I agree with you to some extend and I know that most of Serbs living in Kosovo do not trust local Albanian authorities, but seriously there wasn't ever a considerable attempt to collaborate with provisional Kosovar institutions. It hurts that Belgrade manipulates Kosovo's Serbs for numerous reasons and have inept them for integrating into Kosovo's community. Yes, they may not feel secure for time being, but Belgrade should help reconciliation with Albanians and this is matter of time. I myself, am Milosevic war survivor and trust me I will never do things that Serbian paramilitaries did to my family, such as killing two of my uncles. Aside from that, don't expect that I would be a close to close friend with Serbs in a short period of time, we are human beings and we need time to reconciliate, but we can achieve that by mutual interest, living and doing business together. I look forward to an independent Kosovo, but I look forward to stability and peace in this part of Europe. It's time to move on and progresses economically, generations are coming without future.

NATO troops just watch as Orthodox churches and monasteries are burned and destoryed by Albanians mobs. The only people who will prevent mobs from attacking and destroying Serb landmarks are Serbs.

The churches are the heritage of Kosovo Serbs only?? The Albanians are acting OUTRAGEOUSLY!!

Belgrade:Serbian Police to Guard the Monasteries.
What a joke!
Some people just don't get it.
After what happened with the late Prime Minister Djindjic who can trust Serbian Police!Monasteries will be protected by Kosovan Police.Could be an Kosovan Albanian policeman or a Kosovan Serb policeman.
In few years time when in Europe will be no borders all the interesting people can visit their hitorical heritage places,no problem.
Now why politicising the religion so much,or maybe they have an excuse after what happened in March 2004!
Always something for Serbs,when they are going to take the reality check.Maybe never!!!

Do you not understand that Albanians are the ones destroying Serbian religious landmarks while Albanians in power do nothing about it? Serbs are supposed to trust Albanians not to destory the churches and monasteries? RIDICULOUS.

"I myself, am Milosevic war survivor and trust me I will never do things that Serbian paramilitaries did to my family, such as killing two of my uncles.(Kushtrim, Thursday, 1 March, 2007, 20:07)"
Kushtrim, I am truly sorry for your loss and what you suffered. In many ways, it is similar to what my family experienced in Krajina during WWII and Operation Storm, at least the feelings are the same (My wife was 16 at the time of Operation Storm). I strongly condemn violence of any kind regardless of the perpetrators.
Let us hope that we can find a solution to our present situation that brings long term stability to our region. I do respect the Albanian people greatly, and I find your history fascinating. We have regional issues and common interests that will bind us together in the future. I grew up in the US, and I consider anyone from the Balkans a brother, and they do as well.
My only concern is for what I consider the very foundation of Serbian civilization. To me, and many other Serbians, it is sacred. I do wish a real compromise and real security could be put in place for my people. It’s the International Communities fault that we don't have better security there, they were the ones in the position to implement it. I personally do not believe that the majority of the Albanian people are planning to destroy our heritage. However, it only takes a few extremists to cause great damage, and who knows what random event might cause another 2004 style riot, which happened because of rampant rumors.
Hopefully both our politicians will get their act together and come up with a compromise that helps the Presevo Albanians in exchange for some of our needs in Kosovo.

Hey, I for one am tiring of the Albanians who come here to say to the Serbs over and over again: "get a reality check!"

YOU folks are the ones who are in NEED of a reality check.

In 1995, according to the USA govt. and the CIA, your present KLA leaders took money to fund their terrorist actions in Serbian region of Kosovo, from OSAMA BIN LADEN and his bankers, at a meeting in Tirana.

The American GOVT NOW knows it; American citizens NOW know it!

The story has been in news many, many times. All the many Christian TV and radio stations have told the story often. The "cat's out of the bag boys!!

Since 9/11 2001, any connection with old OBL makes the KLA really look BAD.

The West holds the war criminal charges over Ceku's head and he is their puppet. He WILL do as they tell him or he can "Do" the Hague court too.

Now, here is another reality check for you: AMERICANS want out of Kosovo!! Springtime in Afganistan looks to be a battle royal! And Iraq is a true diaster. Congress is about to cut the funding in a big way.

Your lobbyists in the USA do not have enough money or power to break up a country now. They couldn't get your pal John Kerry elected. They cannot block a Russian veto at the UNSC.

The American secretly want the Serbs to fight this new UN proposal and they want Ahtisaari to be forced to resign. The man is even an embarassment to his old boss, George Soros.

Just like the Russians, the AMERICANS want a compromise agreement and they will support the side WILLING to work within a compromise. That means, NO independence.

Even the large Muslim nation of Indonesia has had with your stubborn attitudes. They do not want to lose Papua territory in their own country. Their govt. has said, JUST TODAY, that taking Kosovo from a LEGITIMATE, UN member state is simply NOT LEGAL.

Serbs have MUCH more potential financial progre$$ to offer the West than a "greater" Albania called "kosova" with gangsters and drug smugglers.

And last but not least, AMERICANS want to make money in the Balkans and a poor economically challenged "Kosova" has been nothing but a money pit. The Monks at Decani make MORE money on their handiwork that the rest of the province of Kosovo.

THINK PROFIT. Albanians in Kosovo are NOT profitable enough. Bottom line all that counts.

America has no friends, just financial interests, it appears.

Princip,

I took a look at your sources, and here is what I found;

From the UNCHR website; “There are still more than 20,000 internally displaced people in Kosovo, mostly Serbs and Roma. In addition, more than 220,000 internally displaced remain in Serbia and Montenegro.” Only 20,000 are displaced that are identified as non-Albanians in Kosova. As for the 220,000, (I cannot see a study conducted about that number in the site) it is not even identifying what ethnic group that number is divided in – if that number were indeed correct, I wouldn’t even be surprised if a lot of them were Albanians. Plus, the whole article was about Roma getting housing, not Serbs. Kosova with their measly and borderline pathetic budget is getting families housing, whereas Serbian government hasn’t even attempted to repair what they have destroyed mercilessly. So choose your articles to suit your argument better next time.

As for the guardian article – they are interviewing a couple of people who lost loved ones, which is also a tragedy. One life lost is one too much, and there is no justification for killing innocent people, but let me put things into perspective. A lot of what they are saying is biased up the ying yang. Graves in northern Albania, prison/labor camps …. Oh come on. All of what allegedly happened was in mid June of ’99. That’s the time when NATO forces were just getting in – and the Serbian military and paramilitary forces pulling out. Till that time, the Serb forces reigned supreme, so KLA wasn’t even able to confront the Serb forces, let alone have enough land and resources to have secret prisons and labor camps in Kosova without being seen and exterminated by the Serb military and paramilitary units. Then again, as I pointed out, this is an article about a couple of people who have been interviewed and Guardian wrote about how they described of what is going on. Not a study at all to enforce an argument, in my opinion. I can give you articles like this about what people went through all you want, but getting some studies done by international bodies is what matters when trying to enforce an argument.

As for the Serb propaganda site, I take that with a grain of salt. I am not denying that some Serbs have indeed been murdered, but I am not buying what that site says for a second (looks awfully similar to www.kosovo.net ). Given the track record of Milosevic’s government’s skill in forging votes (I am sure you’ve seen numerous incidents where it was found that people who had died two decades earlier, were casting their ballots for Milosevic? Can you prove that this is not a stunt that was borrowed from Milosevic’s book? Or even blatantly fabricated?), I am sure there is some inflation on that list. Have you got an international STUDY to confirm that list? If you do, please post it; I am interested to see if it confirms it (even if it disproves it, but still has people who have indeed been murdered, I am still interested in seeing it).

Until then, your sources aren’t looking very good.



Now commenting on the article;

I really think that Serbian delegation is indeed politicizing the religious and historical monuments in Kosova. If they cared so dearly about them, and wanted to make sure of their safety, why don’t they train Kosova’s police or some other entity to guard these? I mean, it seems that it automatically has to be a Serbian organ to come down there and “protect” them. This translates to Serbia having sovereignty on those premises, with their protection as a pretext. Think of it as having hundreds of embassies with a good amount of land all over a small territory such as that of Kosova. Give me a break! Does the Serb delegation think that people are that stupid to fall for it?


What I and a lot of other Kosovars would gladly accept, as Matthew pointed out, is have an international force protect these places (without having complete immunity of the Kosovar law or Vatican style status). Then Serb delegation can rest assured that their monuments are protected by someone other than Kosovars. This way (and I hate saying this, since Princip pretty much has a trade mark and a monopoly on the word) it’s a win-win solution.

The reason for displaced Kosovo Serbs is that they fear retribution if they return to Kosovo. Serbs love to point out they are the victims but refuse to admit how it got to that position. Simple, serbian army marched on kosovo, killing alabanians and dispelling them. When NATO bombed and they lost, they feared retribution. And now they play the "we are victims" game.

Same in croatia, for 5 years they cleansed Krajina out of Croats and many other places in croatia and then when Croats fought back, all of a sudden they feel they are the victims but dont realise how themselves they contributed to their own downfall. In fact, most of the world sees it as serbs getting what they deserved. Their own medicine.

Serbs want to control the whole of area they live in. Seselj even has said that Croatia is catholic Serbia. While it takes two to tango, in case of what serbs did, the other partner had their legs and arms tied. JNA military strength was inflicted upon croatia and bosnia who had no military early on. its not defence but opportunism. Not to mention cowardly.

Jeton,

is it not time that you accepted the reality that innocent non-Albanians civilians have been kiled in the most barbourous way at the hands of ethnic-Albanians for the fact that they were not Albanian - you clearly can read but it is time for commentators like yourself to accept the barbarity commited by other ethnic-Albanians and realise that all there is no guarantee of security for non-Albanians.

Daniel the same can be said by yourself regarding the killings of Serbs and destruction to their homes and centuries old communities. Matthew has pointed out that Croats have been just as atrocias in the rampage of throughout Krajina. DO you think a innocent Serb civilians life is less then any other human or do you agree that it is ok to kill Serbs as they are lesser humans? Does their death not warrant the same justice - if so then why do you try to make so little of it?

I know what happend in both Krajina and Kosovo because like many "Yugoslav" families I have cousins and family who are Slovene, Croat & Serbs (Krajina, Bosnia & Kosovo - many who are refugees in Serbia proper) so I do know the difference between all the polarisation that goes on in suggesting only one is a victim and only one is the perpertrator. All are responsible and all have lost and each life is as precious as the next. The lies and exagerations that have clouded peoples perception do little to reconcile diffrences - they just store up the troubles - communist froze these conficts that democracy thawed but now lies and deceit will keep them boiling.

Princip,

If you read my post, you would see that I am indeed acknowledging that some people did indeed get killed. If that is not enough, do you want me to take a drum out and beat it to complement my screaming it out loud that there indeed have been victims? Would that satisfy thee, your majesty?
I like it how you pepper your paragraph with words like “barbaric”. I guess you should look in the mirror and see that Serbia gave a whole new meaning of what barbarism is, so don’t make yourself a hypocrite, it just demolishes whatever argument you are trying to make. Least you and anyone else can do is trying a constructive argument on how things should be mended and all people look forward to the future. Going back in history has never really made anyone prosper, and I don’t see why that would work now …

Good day to all.

“Jeton,

is it not time that you accepted the reality that innocent non-Albanians civilians have been kiled in the most barbourous way”

Princip, in Jeton’s defense, he has in fact both apologized and recognized that crimes were committed against the non-Albanian population. For that, he has my deep respect.