Russia fears chain reaction

It is not just the Russians who want patience and a settlement that is agreeable to all but even within the EU we now find a more vocal voice - Slovakia's Gasparovic President is quoted as saying

"the final solution for Kosovo should be postponed, and the province should remain under international supervision, pending a compromise between ethnic Albanians and Serbs."

( http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/02/09/europe/EU-GEN-Slovakia-Kosovo.php )


I really can't imagine the EU being able to come to any unified position other then to let the talks carry on till a real compromise is found and not as the US & UK want imposed - the US & UK credibilty in International circles is waning rapidly.

princip,

It is hard to accept the fact that you imagination has no capacity to see the reality soberly!!!

furthermore, the Slovakian president should first harmonize the Slovakian stance with his foreign minister who has different view over Kosova’s future.

If Slovakia would have been asked, NATO would have never act during the crisis in 1999. And, we all no that Kosova's final status is the end (coronation) of the that crisis. We also know which countries have contributed to that. I do not think that countries like Slovakia play any role into the global politics now. It is a player, but it is a team of the fourth league.

Cheers!

Minister Ivanov is worried that Kosovo's independence might CREATE a chain reaction for regions to seek independence? My understanding is that the chain reaction has been going on in Russia and Soviet Union for at least century and that Kosovo might just provide tiny boost to it. If there is such a dramatic reaction (region seeking independence), what is the action behind it? Certainly it has nothing to do with Kosovo. Why did e.g. Baltic states, USSR's East European satellites or Finland seek to rid themselves of the Soviet influence?

Even in Serbia/Yugoslavia, Kosovo doesn't start anything, it is just another continuation in the break-up of the nation. The breakup is difficult to prevent now, since the issues behind it should have been dealt with years ago.

As a citizen of a country that got independent from Russia 90 years ago, I hope that regions are allowed to freely ask whether indeed they are not as good Kosovo Albanians - and if necessary, seek independence.

Adi,

all countries are open to their opinion and don't under-rate a country that exists and has a genuine claim to be. Moreover, Slovakia happens to be the UN Security council President this month! Don't forget the Slovaks will have a vote on the Security Council and irrespective of what you think their opinion is just as important as the other 10 votes that don't have a veto. Maybe the US & UK would like push this through to the security council but like the Russians Foreign Minister Lavrov said it would be "futile & counterproductive"

( http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/02/03/europe/EU-GEN-Russia-Kosovo.php )

or for more insight into Russia's perspective see the read the interview with Lavrov in Spiegel.
( http://www.spiegel.de/international/spiegel/0,1518,464531,00.html )

- I guess as plan A-thisarri stands it would not even need a veto as it would not even muster the 9 affirmative votes it would require - look into it for yourself but the figures don't stack!!

Without a plan B-an Ki-Moon this rpoposal is dead in the water even without a veto!

Adi. Slovakia never made pro-independence statements from what I've heard it was the Czech foreign minister who did this. But then again the Czechs can be expected to make statements like this since they are probably one of the few countries on earth that face no potential secessionist threat.

Quote:
As a citizen of a country that got independent from Russia 90 years ago, I hope that regions are allowed to freely ask whether indeed they are not as good Kosovo Albanians - and if necessary, seek independence.
---
Then you certainly must agree that Serbs in Bosnia and Croatia have same right to seek independence ...I guess...

Does Russia "fear" a chain reaction, or will it "create" a chain reaction? No doubt many parastates in the former Soviet Union are supported by Moscow (Transdniestr, S. Ossetia, Abkhazia), and an unilateral declaration of independence of Kosovo, followed by a goodwill recognition from Washington and London will be seen as the green light for Moscow to also push its own secessionist interests. And don't think Catalonia isn't looking at this very carefully as well. Catalonia is all by separate from Spain today, and could easily break away, especially under the super-left policies of Zapatero. Officials in Brussels could say all they want that Kosovo will not set a precedent, but no one's going to listen. As long as a statelet's independent motives are recognized by at least one great power, semi-sovereignty will be assured, and I fear by year's end we could be faced with at least a dozen little Northern Cypruses.

Dear Mike, you are confusing things a little. To make it more simple for you; Kosova case is similar to the child who was taken away from an abusive parent and all the cases that you describe above are similar to a teenager who got mad with his father for not having enough allowance, and now wants to leave home.
If you feel better by giving false hopes to yourself and your co-patriots, I really respect that. Just a lsat advice.... Its time to wake up and go to work.

Mike, you could add Belguim itself - they go to elections on the 19th June with the sepreatist Flanders group Vaams Belang looking to unseat the current government. Then we would need to see where the EU governs itself from an independent flanders or a Wallonia as both vie over the capital. Pandora's Box indeed - right under the noses of the EU technocrats.

Hermon, don't ever become a diplomat because no one's going to take you seriously, let alone understand you, with your normative allegories of likening states to abused families. I don't know how much simpler you've made me see your point since you failed to differentiate the other troubled regions of the world with Kosovo. Be more concrete in your explanations, and I might understand you.

Already at work, but thanks for your concern,

Mike

Mike, Its not my intention to become a diplomat. However, I see that you need exlanations even simpler than the above.
"Wake up and go to work" was metaphoric.

Again, you didn't say anything productive. You clearly disagree with my comment. OK, then show me how Kosovo is different than any other breakaway region of the world. I'm well aware "wake up..." was metaphoric. But stop using metaphors to substitute for a concrete answer. If you can't provide an answer, don't bother to reply in the first place. If you're trying to make a point, than say it.

That's all hot air. The only realties similar to Kosovo (Except of being UN-protectorate) are Chechnya and Tibet, facing the same policy on them as that exercised by the Serbian state in Kosovo. But no one would wage efforts to pull them out of where they're now.

Fine Mike,
I'll make it really simple for you.
Kosova is different because:
The reason why they are taking away Kosova from Serbia is becuse the world comunity does not believe that albanians will be treated fairy and with respect from any serbian goverement. Because Serbs have proven to the world that they cannot live with people with different nationalities. Remamber, the whole Yougoslavia was dismantled because of the serbian mania to dominate. And Kosova is the last piece of that chain.
Now the diference between Kosova and Catalonia is that the spanish goverment, never terrorized and expelled half of the Catalans. Violence was never used over Catalan civilians. So they have proven to be a democratic goverment and responsible enough to handle minorities and other demands for human rights.
Besides you forget that each and every case is unique and should not be treated as common. Catalans, Ossets etc. have a lot in common with the nations that they live with. Serbs and Albanians have absolutly nothing in common. Different nationality, different cultures, different religions. There is absolutly no reason why they should live together.
Kosova was forcly taken away from Albania and was given to Serbia on 1913.
Its time to give it back.

show me how Kosovo is different than any other breakaway region of the world
-----------------------------

Belgrade has orchestrated numerous times the mass expulsion and extermination of Albanians from Kosovo, and has failed. In this respect the Albanians are more like the Jews, therefore Kosovo is really THEIR Jerusalem

In other 'breakaway' regions your Russians might have succeeded.

Does Russia fear a chain reaction or does it welcome it?THAT is the question and only the chessmaster Vladimir Putin knows for sure.If we switch to a regional perspective from a UN based one then Russia and China will feel free to do whatever they want and recognize or not recognize at will according to their own self interests.Many of us Americans NEVER bought into this notion of the US being a so called military superpower in the modern age of nuclear existence.We were defeated in Vietnam and most of us do not have the stomach for long term conflict and body bags of our boys and girls streaming back home from faraway places anymore. Many cynical people wrongly assert that it is oil that drove Bush to invade Iraq but any intelligent person recognizes that it was FEAR that drove Bush to try and remove Hussein and search for any nuclear potential on the Iraqi side.

to kreshnik:

kreshnik, by comparing the K-albanians with the Jews... you are playing down the holocaust. thats´s just disgusting, and so extremely tasteless that I can only say one thing: you´ve disqualified yourself.

Thanks Hermon for your comments. Now that you've given me something tangible to work with, I can respond to you:

1. "The reason why they are taking away Kosova from Serbia is becuse the world comunity does not believe that albanians will be treated fairy and with respect from any serbian goverement."

Response - with all due respect to the K-Albanians, who have been mistreated and deprived of certain rights under Milosevic (I've never denied this took place), the world could give a happy rat's behind about Albanians. Seriously. If the world operated on the basis of good intentions towards oppressed people, we'd have dozens and dozens of little statelets dotting the landscape. More likely the international community will give independence to Kosovo because it is seen as the outcome most likely to deter any more instability in the Balkans. Geopolitics and regional order are the words of the day, not Albanian sympathies here. We all know you're going to riot until you get your way, so rather than adding fuel to the fire, we're going to give you your state. Will the EU support an independent Kosovo? Yes. They see it as a foregone conclusion. DOES the EU want an independent Kosovo? Most likely no. They don't want another mouth to feed.

2. "Now the diference between Kosova and Catalonia is that the spanish goverment, never terrorized and expelled half of the Catalans. Violence was never used over Catalan civilians. So they have proven to be a democratic goverment and responsible enough to handle minorities and other demands for human rights."

Response: You may have heard of this guy called Francisco Franco? Yeah, he was Spain's answer to Tito. You see, he wanted to consolidate all power in Spain around the basis of Castillian identity, at the expense of other nationalities and regions - particularly the Basques and Catalans. I'd be hard pressed to find any member of either community who would agree with you that violence was never used against them. The Spanish Civil War also targetted numerous civilians on all sides. So I don't really agree with your take on the Catalan model. Plus, Catalonia is all but separate from Madrid anyway. If Kosovo can secede, why not Catalonia? Secession is becoming vocal now under a more liberal government in Madrid, and long felt grievances are finally coming to the front.

3. "Besides you forget that each and every case is unique and should not be treated as common. Catalans, Ossets etc. have a lot in common with the nations that they live with. Serbs and Albanians have absolutly nothing in common."

Response: Again, I beg to differ. Ossetians, Chechens, Abkhazis, NK-Armenians, and Basques all fundamentally base their identites against the identies of their host countries (Georgians, Russians, Azeris, Spaniards). So while I agree that each case is separate, tell that to other independence-aspiring peoples looking to use Kosovo as the same model for their movements.

4. "Kosova was forcly taken away from Albania and was given to Serbia on 1913.
Its time to give it back."

Response: Kosovo was never part of Albania to begin with. Both were parts of the Ottoman Empire until 1912. I know this is something I'll never succeed in convincing you otherwise, but saying Kosovo was taken away from Albania hold little validity in public perception today. You can't give back something you never had in the first place.

Now let me also just say for the record that I hold no illusions of Kosovo remaining part of Serbia. It's going to go, and it's been all but separate since 1999. I have no problems with an independent Kosovo operating as a stable and multi-ethnic state. I've said before I would love for Serbs and Albanians to constructively work together. What I am opposed to however, is the way in which sovereignty will be given, and the naivety some think that other parts of the world will not view an independent Kosovo as a rallying point for their own secessionist ideas. This was the basis of my original comment and the reason for my hesitancy to just accept a new state like this. It's not that I'm anti-Albanian. I could really care less. But if the issue of state-sovereignty is so simply compromised here without clear legal provisions for making it happen (read as compromise, not humiliate Serbia), then we will see further instability in other troubled spots around the globe.

I would like to ask who has bought the cake to return it look at what is going on before commenting that I am dreaming or being mystical !!!

The DRAFT proposal will have to be re-written so that a real negotiated settlement can be reached. If not re-written to accomodate the principles of territorial integrity and "obligating" 1244 (as Wisner said recently) then Veto might be used but I don't think it will even be needed. That said the Russians are getting more vocal in ensuring real negotiations take place rather then the imposition of what was a futile wish of US policy in 1999. Global politics have moved on and the US & UK would have a hard time trying to get 9 affirmative votes seeing as they credibility over the lies they came with to the UN in 2002/03 regarding Iraq. This is why nothing was proposed last October and why the US & UK have not gone to the UN in January - Oh by the way it is now February!!! Looking forward April & May is when the UK & US might push a proposal in given that they will be presiding over the UN security council but even then they will have shot their credibility given all other issues that really matter. Kosovo & Metohija is a non issue for the US & UK in comparison to Iraq, Afgahistan, N. Korea, Iran, Syria, Middle East peace, Sudan/Darfur, and what ever else might crop up between now and then - they have missed the train.

Let your ethnic-Albanian leadership know that negotiations are the key to peace and stability and are the only way to bring about prosperity for all in Serbia.

Dear EU, Bush, Putin, Germany, Dear World!
Some time long ago, Serbia had a war with the
Turkey, Serbia lost the war, and because of that war
that Serbia lost,
(Serbia never had a good defense, they got over taken
by bad things for what happened In the 1989-2000 in
that region. Do not forget they suffered a lot of
bombings from the hole world, and mostly from USA
What do you say about it. Christian Europe and the
hole wold. Muslims will take the world)
Muslims, Albanians, Turks
moved in that Kosovo land to occupied that Province that
Serbian land that is Serbia Period. What they want
now to ethnic cleansed, and to be Independent away
from Mother Serbia, If you let it become (Kosovo)
Independent, This People Muslims, Albanians, Turks,
they will declare more such as Europe, USA, Jerusalem.
They will not stop until they take the hole wold.

It is so funny to see some people say that KOSOVA's INDEPENDENCE WILL SET E PRECEDENT. Just 3 years ago Eas Timor was seperated from Indonesia and NOBODY in the world said " WE WANT TO SEPERATE BECAUSE EAST TIMOR WAS SEPERATED FROM INDONESIA" Every nation, or every group of people want independence, and there has never been a case where a nation wanted independence because using the argument that because some other nation got independence we will want it too.
Russia will definitely not care if Kosova gets independence or not, all they care is for their own interest up there in and near the russian lands.
Russia will just try to use this example for their own interests, thats all.
I feel sorry for the serbs that they are left all alone, no allies anywhere, its definitely sad, but nobody would want to be your ally due to your unimaginable crimes done to your neighbors.
Israel, one of the biggest players in the world already accepted Kosova as an independent country.
Even Greece declared and agreed that Kosova should be independent. IMAGINE, Greece to accept Kosova's independence.
I honestly do not understand why would serbs want Kosova to be part of Serbia. Dont you know that within 20 to 30 years we the albanians will be the majority in Serbia itself if we stay together with Serbia due to our SUPER HIGH NATALITY and your SUPER LOW NATALITY?
If i were a serb i would want Kosovo to be seperated from serbia AS SOON AS POSSIBLE.
I thank mr. JOVAN for his real comments, I thank him for giving some really good examples and explaining that Kosovo will not be the first puzzle to be broken down from the yougoslav country but it will be one of the last ones.
Simply, 2 million albanian can not be put back under the serbian harsh rule.
Your leaders such Kostunica call as terrorists and so on, so why would they want 2 million terrorists to stay within the serbian borders?
even the so called religious leader Artemija calls us terrorists, so why would he want 2 million terrorists in his counry?
I hope that serbs wake up to reality soon because it will help them realize that they are very backward in their ideology.
Serbs still live in the world of myths.

It is not just the Russians who want patience and a settlement that is agreeable to all but even within the EU we now find a more vocal voice - Slovakia's Gasparovic President is quoted as saying

"the final solution for Kosovo should be postponed, and the province should remain under international supervision, pending a compromise between ethnic Albanians and Serbs."

( http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/02/09/europe/EU-GEN-Slovakia-Kosovo.php )


I really can't imagine the EU being able to come to any unified position other then to let the talks carry on till a real compromise is found and not as the US & UK want imposed - the US & UK credibilty in International circles is waning rapidly.

princip,

It is hard to accept the fact that you imagination has no capacity to see the reality soberly!!!

furthermore, the Slovakian president should first harmonize the Slovakian stance with his foreign minister who has different view over Kosova’s future.

If Slovakia would have been asked, NATO would have never act during the crisis in 1999. And, we all no that Kosova's final status is the end (coronation) of the that crisis. We also know which countries have contributed to that. I do not think that countries like Slovakia play any role into the global politics now. It is a player, but it is a team of the fourth league.

Cheers!

Minister Ivanov is worried that Kosovo's independence might CREATE a chain reaction for regions to seek independence? My understanding is that the chain reaction has been going on in Russia and Soviet Union for at least century and that Kosovo might just provide tiny boost to it. If there is such a dramatic reaction (region seeking independence), what is the action behind it? Certainly it has nothing to do with Kosovo. Why did e.g. Baltic states, USSR's East European satellites or Finland seek to rid themselves of the Soviet influence?

Even in Serbia/Yugoslavia, Kosovo doesn't start anything, it is just another continuation in the break-up of the nation. The breakup is difficult to prevent now, since the issues behind it should have been dealt with years ago.

As a citizen of a country that got independent from Russia 90 years ago, I hope that regions are allowed to freely ask whether indeed they are not as good Kosovo Albanians - and if necessary, seek independence.

Adi,

all countries are open to their opinion and don't under-rate a country that exists and has a genuine claim to be. Moreover, Slovakia happens to be the UN Security council President this month! Don't forget the Slovaks will have a vote on the Security Council and irrespective of what you think their opinion is just as important as the other 10 votes that don't have a veto. Maybe the US & UK would like push this through to the security council but like the Russians Foreign Minister Lavrov said it would be "futile & counterproductive"

( http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/02/03/europe/EU-GEN-Russia-Kosovo.php )

or for more insight into Russia's perspective see the read the interview with Lavrov in Spiegel.
( http://www.spiegel.de/international/spiegel/0,1518,464531,00.html )

- I guess as plan A-thisarri stands it would not even need a veto as it would not even muster the 9 affirmative votes it would require - look into it for yourself but the figures don't stack!!

Without a plan B-an Ki-Moon this rpoposal is dead in the water even without a veto!

Adi. Slovakia never made pro-independence statements from what I've heard it was the Czech foreign minister who did this. But then again the Czechs can be expected to make statements like this since they are probably one of the few countries on earth that face no potential secessionist threat.

Quote:
As a citizen of a country that got independent from Russia 90 years ago, I hope that regions are allowed to freely ask whether indeed they are not as good Kosovo Albanians - and if necessary, seek independence.
---
Then you certainly must agree that Serbs in Bosnia and Croatia have same right to seek independence ...I guess...

Does Russia "fear" a chain reaction, or will it "create" a chain reaction? No doubt many parastates in the former Soviet Union are supported by Moscow (Transdniestr, S. Ossetia, Abkhazia), and an unilateral declaration of independence of Kosovo, followed by a goodwill recognition from Washington and London will be seen as the green light for Moscow to also push its own secessionist interests. And don't think Catalonia isn't looking at this very carefully as well. Catalonia is all by separate from Spain today, and could easily break away, especially under the super-left policies of Zapatero. Officials in Brussels could say all they want that Kosovo will not set a precedent, but no one's going to listen. As long as a statelet's independent motives are recognized by at least one great power, semi-sovereignty will be assured, and I fear by year's end we could be faced with at least a dozen little Northern Cypruses.

Dear Mike, you are confusing things a little. To make it more simple for you; Kosova case is similar to the child who was taken away from an abusive parent and all the cases that you describe above are similar to a teenager who got mad with his father for not having enough allowance, and now wants to leave home.
If you feel better by giving false hopes to yourself and your co-patriots, I really respect that. Just a lsat advice.... Its time to wake up and go to work.

Mike, you could add Belguim itself - they go to elections on the 19th June with the sepreatist Flanders group Vaams Belang looking to unseat the current government. Then we would need to see where the EU governs itself from an independent flanders or a Wallonia as both vie over the capital. Pandora's Box indeed - right under the noses of the EU technocrats.

Hermon, don't ever become a diplomat because no one's going to take you seriously, let alone understand you, with your normative allegories of likening states to abused families. I don't know how much simpler you've made me see your point since you failed to differentiate the other troubled regions of the world with Kosovo. Be more concrete in your explanations, and I might understand you.

Already at work, but thanks for your concern,

Mike

Mike, Its not my intention to become a diplomat. However, I see that you need exlanations even simpler than the above.
"Wake up and go to work" was metaphoric.

Again, you didn't say anything productive. You clearly disagree with my comment. OK, then show me how Kosovo is different than any other breakaway region of the world. I'm well aware "wake up..." was metaphoric. But stop using metaphors to substitute for a concrete answer. If you can't provide an answer, don't bother to reply in the first place. If you're trying to make a point, than say it.

That's all hot air. The only realties similar to Kosovo (Except of being UN-protectorate) are Chechnya and Tibet, facing the same policy on them as that exercised by the Serbian state in Kosovo. But no one would wage efforts to pull them out of where they're now.

Fine Mike,
I'll make it really simple for you.
Kosova is different because:
The reason why they are taking away Kosova from Serbia is becuse the world comunity does not believe that albanians will be treated fairy and with respect from any serbian goverement. Because Serbs have proven to the world that they cannot live with people with different nationalities. Remamber, the whole Yougoslavia was dismantled because of the serbian mania to dominate. And Kosova is the last piece of that chain.
Now the diference between Kosova and Catalonia is that the spanish goverment, never terrorized and expelled half of the Catalans. Violence was never used over Catalan civilians. So they have proven to be a democratic goverment and responsible enough to handle minorities and other demands for human rights.
Besides you forget that each and every case is unique and should not be treated as common. Catalans, Ossets etc. have a lot in common with the nations that they live with. Serbs and Albanians have absolutly nothing in common. Different nationality, different cultures, different religions. There is absolutly no reason why they should live together.
Kosova was forcly taken away from Albania and was given to Serbia on 1913.
Its time to give it back.

show me how Kosovo is different than any other breakaway region of the world
-----------------------------

Belgrade has orchestrated numerous times the mass expulsion and extermination of Albanians from Kosovo, and has failed. In this respect the Albanians are more like the Jews, therefore Kosovo is really THEIR Jerusalem

In other 'breakaway' regions your Russians might have succeeded.

Does Russia fear a chain reaction or does it welcome it?THAT is the question and only the chessmaster Vladimir Putin knows for sure.If we switch to a regional perspective from a UN based one then Russia and China will feel free to do whatever they want and recognize or not recognize at will according to their own self interests.Many of us Americans NEVER bought into this notion of the US being a so called military superpower in the modern age of nuclear existence.We were defeated in Vietnam and most of us do not have the stomach for long term conflict and body bags of our boys and girls streaming back home from faraway places anymore. Many cynical people wrongly assert that it is oil that drove Bush to invade Iraq but any intelligent person recognizes that it was FEAR that drove Bush to try and remove Hussein and search for any nuclear potential on the Iraqi side.

to kreshnik:

kreshnik, by comparing the K-albanians with the Jews... you are playing down the holocaust. thats´s just disgusting, and so extremely tasteless that I can only say one thing: you´ve disqualified yourself.

Thanks Hermon for your comments. Now that you've given me something tangible to work with, I can respond to you:

1. "The reason why they are taking away Kosova from Serbia is becuse the world comunity does not believe that albanians will be treated fairy and with respect from any serbian goverement."

Response - with all due respect to the K-Albanians, who have been mistreated and deprived of certain rights under Milosevic (I've never denied this took place), the world could give a happy rat's behind about Albanians. Seriously. If the world operated on the basis of good intentions towards oppressed people, we'd have dozens and dozens of little statelets dotting the landscape. More likely the international community will give independence to Kosovo because it is seen as the outcome most likely to deter any more instability in the Balkans. Geopolitics and regional order are the words of the day, not Albanian sympathies here. We all know you're going to riot until you get your way, so rather than adding fuel to the fire, we're going to give you your state. Will the EU support an independent Kosovo? Yes. They see it as a foregone conclusion. DOES the EU want an independent Kosovo? Most likely no. They don't want another mouth to feed.

2. "Now the diference between Kosova and Catalonia is that the spanish goverment, never terrorized and expelled half of the Catalans. Violence was never used over Catalan civilians. So they have proven to be a democratic goverment and responsible enough to handle minorities and other demands for human rights."

Response: You may have heard of this guy called Francisco Franco? Yeah, he was Spain's answer to Tito. You see, he wanted to consolidate all power in Spain around the basis of Castillian identity, at the expense of other nationalities and regions - particularly the Basques and Catalans. I'd be hard pressed to find any member of either community who would agree with you that violence was never used against them. The Spanish Civil War also targetted numerous civilians on all sides. So I don't really agree with your take on the Catalan model. Plus, Catalonia is all but separate from Madrid anyway. If Kosovo can secede, why not Catalonia? Secession is becoming vocal now under a more liberal government in Madrid, and long felt grievances are finally coming to the front.

3. "Besides you forget that each and every case is unique and should not be treated as common. Catalans, Ossets etc. have a lot in common with the nations that they live with. Serbs and Albanians have absolutly nothing in common."

Response: Again, I beg to differ. Ossetians, Chechens, Abkhazis, NK-Armenians, and Basques all fundamentally base their identites against the identies of their host countries (Georgians, Russians, Azeris, Spaniards). So while I agree that each case is separate, tell that to other independence-aspiring peoples looking to use Kosovo as the same model for their movements.

4. "Kosova was forcly taken away from Albania and was given to Serbia on 1913.
Its time to give it back."

Response: Kosovo was never part of Albania to begin with. Both were parts of the Ottoman Empire until 1912. I know this is something I'll never succeed in convincing you otherwise, but saying Kosovo was taken away from Albania hold little validity in public perception today. You can't give back something you never had in the first place.

Now let me also just say for the record that I hold no illusions of Kosovo remaining part of Serbia. It's going to go, and it's been all but separate since 1999. I have no problems with an independent Kosovo operating as a stable and multi-ethnic state. I've said before I would love for Serbs and Albanians to constructively work together. What I am opposed to however, is the way in which sovereignty will be given, and the naivety some think that other parts of the world will not view an independent Kosovo as a rallying point for their own secessionist ideas. This was the basis of my original comment and the reason for my hesitancy to just accept a new state like this. It's not that I'm anti-Albanian. I could really care less. But if the issue of state-sovereignty is so simply compromised here without clear legal provisions for making it happen (read as compromise, not humiliate Serbia), then we will see further instability in other troubled spots around the globe.

I would like to ask who has bought the cake to return it look at what is going on before commenting that I am dreaming or being mystical !!!

The DRAFT proposal will have to be re-written so that a real negotiated settlement can be reached. If not re-written to accomodate the principles of territorial integrity and "obligating" 1244 (as Wisner said recently) then Veto might be used but I don't think it will even be needed. That said the Russians are getting more vocal in ensuring real negotiations take place rather then the imposition of what was a futile wish of US policy in 1999. Global politics have moved on and the US & UK would have a hard time trying to get 9 affirmative votes seeing as they credibility over the lies they came with to the UN in 2002/03 regarding Iraq. This is why nothing was proposed last October and why the US & UK have not gone to the UN in January - Oh by the way it is now February!!! Looking forward April & May is when the UK & US might push a proposal in given that they will be presiding over the UN security council but even then they will have shot their credibility given all other issues that really matter. Kosovo & Metohija is a non issue for the US & UK in comparison to Iraq, Afgahistan, N. Korea, Iran, Syria, Middle East peace, Sudan/Darfur, and what ever else might crop up between now and then - they have missed the train.

Let your ethnic-Albanian leadership know that negotiations are the key to peace and stability and are the only way to bring about prosperity for all in Serbia.

Dear EU, Bush, Putin, Germany, Dear World!
Some time long ago, Serbia had a war with the
Turkey, Serbia lost the war, and because of that war
that Serbia lost,
(Serbia never had a good defense, they got over taken
by bad things for what happened In the 1989-2000 in
that region. Do not forget they suffered a lot of
bombings from the hole world, and mostly from USA
What do you say about it. Christian Europe and the
hole wold. Muslims will take the world)
Muslims, Albanians, Turks
moved in that Kosovo land to occupied that Province that
Serbian land that is Serbia Period. What they want
now to ethnic cleansed, and to be Independent away
from Mother Serbia, If you let it become (Kosovo)
Independent, This People Muslims, Albanians, Turks,
they will declare more such as Europe, USA, Jerusalem.
They will not stop until they take the hole wold.

It is so funny to see some people say that KOSOVA's INDEPENDENCE WILL SET E PRECEDENT. Just 3 years ago Eas Timor was seperated from Indonesia and NOBODY in the world said " WE WANT TO SEPERATE BECAUSE EAST TIMOR WAS SEPERATED FROM INDONESIA" Every nation, or every group of people want independence, and there has never been a case where a nation wanted independence because using the argument that because some other nation got independence we will want it too.
Russia will definitely not care if Kosova gets independence or not, all they care is for their own interest up there in and near the russian lands.
Russia will just try to use this example for their own interests, thats all.
I feel sorry for the serbs that they are left all alone, no allies anywhere, its definitely sad, but nobody would want to be your ally due to your unimaginable crimes done to your neighbors.
Israel, one of the biggest players in the world already accepted Kosova as an independent country.
Even Greece declared and agreed that Kosova should be independent. IMAGINE, Greece to accept Kosova's independence.
I honestly do not understand why would serbs want Kosova to be part of Serbia. Dont you know that within 20 to 30 years we the albanians will be the majority in Serbia itself if we stay together with Serbia due to our SUPER HIGH NATALITY and your SUPER LOW NATALITY?
If i were a serb i would want Kosovo to be seperated from serbia AS SOON AS POSSIBLE.
I thank mr. JOVAN for his real comments, I thank him for giving some really good examples and explaining that Kosovo will not be the first puzzle to be broken down from the yougoslav country but it will be one of the last ones.
Simply, 2 million albanian can not be put back under the serbian harsh rule.
Your leaders such Kostunica call as terrorists and so on, so why would they want 2 million terrorists to stay within the serbian borders?
even the so called religious leader Artemija calls us terrorists, so why would he want 2 million terrorists in his counry?
I hope that serbs wake up to reality soon because it will help them realize that they are very backward in their ideology.
Serbs still live in the world of myths.