1. RE: Vidovdan-St. Vitus Day

    I know you are a historian, but consider the following which all occurred on Vidovdan;

    (1) Belgrade was relieved on Vidovdan , June 28, 1915 after King Peter I urged the Serbians to defend the city. Field Marshal Vojvoda Putnik and Peter Bojovic secured a substantial victory. General Poitorek (sp) of the Austro-Hungarian army led the forces as he was responsible for the botched security when Archduke Ferdinand was shot.

    (2) Gavrilo Princip assassinated Archduke Ferdinand on June 28, 1914, of course aka APIS planned the date.

    (3) Slobodan Milosevic was shipped to the Hague on June 28, 2001. Was the date chosen by Djindic and Kostunica along with the Del Ponte of the Hague Tribunal?

    There are many more examples. There is a reason why Serbs celebrate St. Vitus day and its not from this physical world.
    (Jugoslavija, 30 October 2015 16:14)

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  2. B92

    Please place part-1 too - thanks a lot !


    Nikola : “Serbia never forgot about Kosovo for 500 years while the Ottoman Empire controled the land. But at the end of the day, Serbia defeated the Ottomans and regained control of the land.”


    I wouldn’t like to go into the details now but I think that Kosovo Battle was a much bigger thing than just a routine battle with the Osmans. It was of even greater importance for the Serbs and for rest of the Christians than what is said today. Semi-truth we are told concerning the Косовска битка diverts our attention and leaves us plenty of questions without answers. I do not question the value of the Orthodox treasury in KiM but I believe that at least most of the churches here were built after the battle of 1389. But the monasteries were a different story that could not be tied with the battle directly. Some of the monasteries could be built decades earlier but not in the XIII century when there were no monasteries anywhere yet. So many the questions arise like about the battle and the saint places :

    1/ How came that the Catholic “Ordre des Hospitaliers” (whose activity and geography had nothing to do neither with wars nor the Balkans) appeared here to support the Serbs and what did word Ordre mean if not Орда ?
    2/ How and where had the Serbs prepared for the battle and how many of them came in fact to the Kosovska bitka - 12 or 33 thousand? Because if those were12 000 only then it doesn’t worth talking for 626 years.
    (rote, 30 October 2015 14:43)

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  3. oh what a tangled web we weave......time bodes well for Serbia and all the while that web entangles evermore....

    Serbia must continue to uphold its UN recognised sovereignty while focusing on its economy and that does not mean a blind submission to the EU it means get on with real substantive reforms that work in Serbia's interest and joining only if in Serbia's interest!

    Oh I pity those so called Kosovarians - bit like the US "moderate rebels" non-existent dillusional delinquents who do nothing bar destroy.

    Iraq war was a lie with regards WMD and it was preceded by the NATO illegal war on Serbia over WMG (Wherabouts of Mass Graves) - what happened to those quotes by NATO spokesmen "100,000 missing suspected killed" that was used as a reasoning for NATO war? Lies, damned lies and statistics!
    (Principa, Gracanica, KiM, Serbia, 30 October 2015 14:29)

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  4. CONTINUED–3 (last) FOR NIKOLA :


    22/ How came that the Great Kniaz Dmirty I Ivanovic (Donskoy) whom many Russian historians also call Murad I died the same time as Murad I. Nobody explains why Murad I loked like a Russian Cossack … [link][link] … And why nobody explains how exactly the 39 year old Great Kniaz with no health problems died and why the burial services were held by a low rating Archbishop of Trebizond ?

    23/ Wasn’t it a strange family where one of the sons of Murad I ( Sandji) betrayed him by joining the Christians of Andronicus IV in 1376 and was tortured to death by his father while Murad’s third son Bayazed killed his second Yakub the same very day when their father was killed in Kosovo?

    24/ Why do some of the Shqiptars here insist that their ancestors also took part in the battle and if so which of the sides did they join ? If they were Janissaries or infantry of Lazar ?


    P.S. Nikola I am not a dissident to only Serbian but almost to any other history we are told. Especially when it comes to the events before the 17 century.


    Cheers !
    (rote, 30 October 2015 14:19)

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  5. CONTINUED-2 FOR NIKOLA :

    14/ Why did Bosnian king Tvrtko informed all of the great victory of the Christians if “turks” were supposed to be Muslims ? So did the Europeans and the Byzantines – all believed that “the Turks” had lost the battle. Unlike Serbs themselves who insist that they became vassals despite the fact that “turks” didn’t appeared here for long while Serbs made the elite of the empire …

    15/ They say that almost all Serbian nobility was killed in the battle so I wonder if there had been any special Serbian nobility or Serbs were just a part of something bigger like the Great Horde.

    16/ Wasn’t it strange that husbands of the princes’ daughters made the most notable deeds – one betrayed Lazar and the other killed Murad I ?

    17/ Is it true that most of the Serbian folklore about the battle («Слава кнеза Лазара у Крушевцу», «Бановић Страхиња», «Косовка девојка», «Смрт мајке Југовића», «Цар Лазар и царица Милица», «Зидање Раванице» ect.) was written centuries later during the Oldenburgs?

    18/ How came that in 1371 Murad I easily destroyed the south European army near Marnica and in 1389 failed to destroy a 2-3 times smaller army of in Kosovo ?

    19/ How came that both armies abandoned the battlefield in the evening without burying their killed soldiers and nobility ?

    20/ How came that 8 (eight !) big battles were held here and is there another such place in the world ?

    21/ What and since when do we celebrate in Vidovdan ?
    (rote, 30 October 2015 14:11)

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  6. CONTINUED FOR NIKOLA :

    3/ How could Serbs (if they weren’t idiots) enter the battle against such a powerful empire without a central command ?

    4/ Where did Serbs take heavy cavalry if they had no industry to produce the ammunition and most likely had no such money?

    5/ Why haven’t Marko Mrnjiavcevic and Constantine Dejianovic come to the battlefield ?

    6/ What was D.Stratsimirovic doing during the battle ?

    7/ Why did Vuk Brankovic abandon the place when the battle wasn’t lost yet ?

    8/ Why did “the Turks” move such a small army (30 000-40 000) to conquer the Balkans ?

    9/ How came that after the defeat Kosovo region remained in the property of Vuk Brankovic while he managed to remain independent ?

    10/ How came that greater part of the ‘turks” were either vassals from the Balkans or looked like Russian Cossacks ? Sipahis - [link] … Azaps - [link] … Janissary - [link]

    11/ During what other battle in the history a hostile army’s officer was allowed to approach the head commander ?

    12/ How came that after both armies abandoned the field for the months to come while no one knew which of the sides took the upper hand ?

    13/ What were the military, political and other sequences of the battle ?
    (rote, 30 October 2015 14:02)

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  7. Serbia needs to make this a frozen conflict once and for all.

    Freeze it up.

    Revisit it again in 40 years after two generations pass.
    (factman, 30 October 2015 01:20)
    That is exactly the plan Serbia has had and the results, approximately 110 recognitions and numerous acceptances in international organizations. There is nothing Serbia can freeze, other than making sure Russia is ready to veto in the UNSC on membership of Kosovo. And that too will eventually be up for sale. But as you can see Serbia is unable to "freeze" anything.
    If Serbia would have stepped away in Brussels, talks would have continued in the west with Kosovo and been frozen for Serbia, so the only people feeling the cold is Serbia from any action they take.
    (think again, 30 October 2015 12:32)

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  8. By the way Kosovo not being able to join UNESCO might lead to the repeat of 2004. This time we'll burn everything.
    (Avni, 29 October 2015 20:15)
    --
    And there you have it my friends, the terrorist nature of Albanians. You guys sure did train ISIS well. However, it's time to clean this mess up. One by one, Syria first.
    (Zoran, 29 October 2015 23:00)

    Zoran,
    Calm down, no one is going to burn anything. Avni is just giving you a little of your own medicine.
    (The Count of Kosova, 30 October 2015 07:01)

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  9. Serbia needs to crack on with real reforms that bring real results for Serbian interest and focus less on EU reforms that are about EU interests at the detriment of Serbia. Focus on developing a low tax, business friendly & equitable economy where everyone gains in increased national prosperity growth built upon increased wealth not ever greater debt - something opposite to the EU/US.
    (Principa, Gracanica, KiM, Serbia, 29 October 2015 22:03)

    Princip,
    If it were that easy Serbia would have done that, but instead, Serbia has been begging to join the EU. Obviously, everyone but you knows Serbia can't survive if left to its own devices. Your reasoning has many flaws. Did you think this up just now?
    (The Count of Kosova, 30 October 2015 05:19)

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  10. awww did they hurt your feeling...What makes you think kosovo will let a republic serbska in its territory....did he cry btw?
    (eric, 30 October 2015 05:18)

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  11. Why does Serbia want to join EU when EU is more for Kosovo then Serbia. It seems like they take Kosovo side more often.
    (Why???, 30 October 2015 05:16)

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  12. I find it strange that an autonomous province of Serbia (Kosovo) would try to prevent Serbian people from entering their own territory. Kosovo is not a country and is not recognised as a country by the United Nations, therefore sovereignty does not exist in Kosovo and all Serbian people can travel within their own territory without any formal documents...

    The KLA who controls Kosovo under the watchful guard of the western powers should understand that Kosovo is not a country, that it is a province of Serbia and it will remain so until Armageddon. Therefore any policy which prevents Serbs from free movement within its own territory will be seen as racially motivated and retaliation will be pursued...

    Serbia never forgot about Kosovo for 500 years while the Ottoman Empire controled the land. But at the end of the day, Serbia defeated the Ottomans and regained control of the land. Serbia will never give up Kosovo for another 500 years... Saying that, the western powers are declining and China and Russia is rising, which means the wester powers will eventually leave Kosovo and Russia and China will allow Serbia to once again peacefully police the territory and arrest the KLA which is in illegal possession of Serbian land.
    (Nikola Novakovic, 30 October 2015 03:04)

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  13. Focus on developing a low tax
    (Principa, Gracanica, KiM, Serbia, 29 October 2015 22:03)

    Yeah, but then how is Serbia going to pay for the patriotism regarding Kosovo? Unfortunately, patriotism is expensive, starting with the salaries to be paid to Kosovo residents and ending with other countries which are milking poor Serbia whenever they can by blackmailing Serbia with Kosovo's recognition!
    (icj1, 30 October 2015 02:06)

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  14. However, it's time to clean this mess up. One by one, Syria first.
    (Zoran, 29 October 2015 23:00)

    Huh, Syria first?!!! How on Earth is Syria more important than Kosovo, the craddle of Serbdom :)
    (icj1, 30 October 2015 01:59)

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  15. KLA scared of their own agreements they signed. The same agreements that was supposed to be a big coup for them. They'll never be able to get it together over there. No wonder why 100, 000 Albanians left Kosovo-Metohija in the last year.

    And traveled through the rest of Serbia to get to Europe too. And not once were they harassed by local Serbs. That's the difference between humanists and savages.
    (Ari Gold, 30 October 2015 01:25)

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  16. Serbia needs to make this a frozen conflict once and for all.

    Freeze it up.

    Revisit it again in 40 years after two generations pass.
    (factman, 30 October 2015 01:20)

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  17. Kosovo is absolutely right to block all progress on CSM. Serbia keeps lying about it powers and exaggerating them enormously. Its just a powerless club with some overview not a republic like republika sprska. The constitution of the CSM must have recognition that Kosovo is a sovereign and independent republic and hasn't been written yet. As long as Serbia and Serbs keep lying there won't be a csm.
    (Brian, 30 October 2015 00:48)

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  18. super, give Serbia a tast of their own medicine, they scream and get upset, and cry wolf. Typical!!!!! A country which doesn't reflect on its own behavior, anf gets upset if they are hit with the same thing impose on others. I guess you never get it.
    (observer, 29 October 2015 23:53)

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  19. This time we'll burn everything.
    (Avni, 29 October 2015 20:15)

    Please start with yourself.
    (???, 29 October 2015 23:09)

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  20. By the way Kosovo not being able to join UNESCO might lead to the repeat of 2004. This time we'll burn everything.
    (Avni, 29 October 2015 20:15)
    --
    And there you have it my friends, the terrorist nature of Albanians. You guys sure did train ISIS well. However, it's time to clean this mess up. One by one, Syria first.
    (Zoran, 29 October 2015 23:00)

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  21. Is that not what Serbia does to Kosovo citizens, they make them cover their plates if issued by Kosovo and gives them some type of entry-exit papers instead of their ID card.
    Do not understand the issue if Kosovo does the same.
    (confused, 29 October 2015 22:30)

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  22. Vucic's "EU friends" - will be completely silent....

    Perhaps at last Vucic understands the duplicitous nature of so called "EU friends".

    Serbia needs to crack on with real reforms that bring real results for Serbian interest and focus less on EU reforms that are about EU interests at the detriment of Serbia. Focus on developing a low tax, business friendly & equitable economy where everyone gains in increased national prosperity growth built upon increased wealth not ever greater debt - something opposite to the EU/US.
    (Principa, Gracanica, KiM, Serbia, 29 October 2015 22:03)

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  23. It is very easy to solve this problem Mr Vucic,
    Recognize Republic of Kosovo as sovereign state and in return get ZSO.
    It is call compromise which you Serbs is not a word that you know.
    (Teodor Muzaka 1389, 29 October 2015 20:18)

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  24. Serbs want ZSO to be created right away yet they are playing games with the bridge dividing Mitrovica. If you can't open ONE bridge forget ZSO. By the way Kosovo not being able to join UNESCO might lead to the repeat of 2004. This time we'll burn everything.
    (Avni, 29 October 2015 20:15)

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  25. I cant wait to see vucic changing the plates of his car before entering kosovo( of course if he asks nicely for permission)
    (glen, 29 October 2015 18:19)

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  26. The Serbian prime minister noted that "40 percent of the Brussels agreement concerns the ZSO" and that "it was the only thing that Belgrade asked for, with the goal of protecting Serbs in Kosovo," adding that "Pristina got the SAA" before Belgrade opened any chapters in its EU membership negotiations - but "anyway did not react negatively to that."
    OMG, you are such a big liar, like always Serbs tend to think that they CAN FOOL THE ENTIRE WORLD WITH THEIR LIES.

    And, that is right , Kosova got SAA before Serbia!? You guys should wonder WHY???
    (the truth, 29 October 2015 16:51)

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