1. NY A-G

    We agree that it was a sale with a deed being transferred, which makes them owners.

    In regards to financial means by the local Serb population in New York, it is known and voiced in print that Serbs give their highest priorities to the living family members in the Serbian homeland. The Serb remittance from the global diaspora is a big economic factor in the Serbian homeland that nobody doubts.

    As for the other issues you have mentioned (insurance, sprinklers, alarms), an Orthodox church, such as the church built 1.5 millenniums ago in Constantinople, can withstand fires and weather, as opposed to the New York church's western European inferior architecture that will constantly become a liability to any church congregation within much less time.
    (Quick Research, 23 October 2017 22:58)

    # Comment link

  2. QR: Yes, in form it was a sale, in substance, they did the Serbs a huge favor aka "gift" - I cop to using the term liberally. When the Episcopalian faithful moved north the building was a liability, they offered it to three Orthodox churches but somehow ended up selling it (not on the open market to the highest bidder) to the smallest and most impecunious of the church bidders with some help from the Episcopalians themselves. There were reasons they favored the SOC but it wasn't because they were offering top dollar. My source seems to think that there were covenants that ran with the land that limited the uses to which the land could be put. I've never investigated how much of this might be pubic myself. You might try and see what deed records are available. Assuming these exist, how enforceable they would be today, I don't know, but it wasn't a "free and clear" sale in the traditional sense.



    The road to hell is frequently paved with good intentions though.. the community was never able to keep up with the maintenance and skimped on things like alarms, sprinklers and ultimately insurance. Church poor the way some Yuppies end up house poor. IMHO, church buildings should be sized to maybe twice the size of the average attendance but parishes are human too.. greedy eyes. They're not the only community in the US that is going to end up bankrupted by its building's maintenance costs. That's as much as I can tell you.
    (NY A-G, 19 October 2017 04:24)

    # Comment link

  3. NY A-G,

    The Serbian Orthodox Church website claims they purchased the church in 1943, not receiving it as a gift. New York Times also claims the church was purchased in 1943.

    New York Times wrote the following after the fire:
    "The building was added to the National Register of Historic Places in 1968, the same year that the city’s Landmarks Preservation Commission gave it landmark status. At the time, the commission wrote of the church that “its special character, historic significance, and aesthetic interest and value of the development, heritage, and cultural characteristics of New York make it irreplaceable.”

    This leads me to ask you, what's your source of information? Are you still stating governing laws never applied to this church before the fire, when there are articles prior to the fire forbidding any change to the church?
    (Quick Research, 18 October 2017 00:28)

    # Comment link

  4. Gerhard the ignorant:
    You don't know me and it's better for you that way....
    The fire was a result of a Serb.

    Your air of superiority is misplaced and laughable. You sound like a teenager. Grow up.
    It was determined that the fire was an accident. No criminal charges resulted from the fire.
    Your use of the phrase "Jew developer" emphasizes your racist mentality, all around.
    Like I said, you have nothing credible to offer. A pathetic depressed troll.
    (Gerhard, 17 October 2017 01:48)

    # Comment link

  5. I cannot believe that this poor excuse for a troll Azir still leaves comments on articles on this news site. Judging by their frequency this ignorant troll really must qualify as the crown prince of unemployment.

    I guess when his drug and organ trading heroes failed to secure both Interpol and UNESCO membership recently, the fact that Ghegs are leaving in their droves to Western Europe and that Albanian sporting teams are the very definition of incompetence, I suppose you can see where his frustration comes from.
    (warren, 16 October 2017 03:32)

    # Comment link

  6. Gerhard the ignorant:

    You don't know me and it's better for you that way....

    The fire was a result of a Serb.

    Like it or not that is the final Fire Marshal's Report.

    Insurance doesn't cover stupidity .......intentional or not....

    Ps. The Adjacent property Jew developer's deal with the Serb church leadership to purchase failed and as result revenge......
    (Azir, 16 October 2017 02:59)

    # Comment link

  7. Azir has no factual information-he is just a simple minded troll.
    (Gerhard, 15 October 2017 15:22)

    # Comment link

  8. And no, it was not insured for replacement cost. A cost-saving managerial lapse that no doubt factored into the removal of the bishop and priest. Though those weren't the only reasons. There were rumors that the previous bishop obstructed police from pursuing fraudulent "fundraisers" and obstructed NYFD arson investigators due to unauthorized storage of alcohol in the basement for a nearby hotel. So he was exiled to Canada.

    The building was a gift from Episcopalians a long time ago but it came with a covenant that it would always be used as a church. This means that the Eastern Diocese can't just sell the land and build something else with the money. If they don't rebuild (probably faithfully to the original or at least within the strictures of the granting covenants) then they would forfeit the site. In order to rebuild in the Orthodox style they would need the Episcopalians to remove or amend their covenants. Nothing to do with any level of american government.
    (NY A-G, 14 October 2017 01:54)

    # Comment link

  9. Right after the fire a bunch of young people from the diaspora tried to start a fundraising campaign but were attacked online by the church board and other Serbians on the east coast. So I'm not donating to this cause.
    (Nikola, 12 October 2017 16:33)

    Stop spreading misinformation. An entity called "28 Jun" pulled a scam and was caught by parishioners and reported to the NYPD. The perp was a Canadian citizen of Croatian nationality called Filipi. Just as the NYPD opened a file he fled to Europe. The parishioners demanded a full accounting of moneys they had allegedly "raised in the name of the church" but never got one. The statute of limitations on fraud in NY state is 6 years. Filipi and his criminal co-conspirators will face the law and the parish will get a full accounting of donations they diverted to 28. Jun's PayPal account even if it takes the removal of another bishop to do it. If people aren't donating its because they're waiting for the bishop to formally charge those criminals.
    (NY A-G, 14 October 2017 01:44)

    # Comment link

  10. What's surprising is Serbs purchased the Church and converted it over to Orthodox in the 1950's..

    But keep the placard of original builders unlike in Kosova were Serbs converted Kosovar churches and now claim Slav late arrivals build existing structures!

    Serbs blame the arson on everything and everyone except the only culprit !

    The Serb that actually lit the 🔥 fire!
    (Azir, 13 October 2017 20:55)

    # Comment link

  11. Im sure Vucic can send over a truck load of worthless dinars. ⚰
    (Clone Master, 13 October 2017 13:19)

    # Comment link

  12. This was such a beautiful church, originally purchased from a non-orthodox church. I hope when they rebuild the alter will face east, as is the orthodox custom. Before this fire, the alter did not face east. Prayers and good wishes to all of St. Sava's New York community !
    (Betsy Lalich, 13 October 2017 06:56)

    # Comment link

  13. free of memory.
    cause what you remember clearly was knee-jerk reaction by the conspiracy theorists: you know flat-earthers, moon-landing-fakers, area-51ers, the loonies.
    are you a looney too cause when the dust was still settling after the investigation it became the belief that the fire was a result of candles.

    its a shame you only recall the first headline, but don't bother to remember the bulk, and the details of a story. its this sort of weak memory skills that forgets the chain of events of things, and muddles them up cause it fits ones narrative better.
    (iron knee, 12 October 2017 20:20)

    No, what i remember was a real anti-Albanian "terrorist" campaign all over the Serbian press and comments. And it reminded me of some Djordje Martinovic, or Panda Bar Massacre or the "organ harvesting" campaigns. All of them were knee-jerk reaction by the conspiracy theorists: you know flat-earthers, moon-landing-fakers, area-51ers, the loonies... but they inflicted real terrible crimes.
    They say you either learn from the past or you repeat it. And i think this is repeating.

    So, no i don`t think i`m free of memory.
    (Free, 13 October 2017 00:52)

    # Comment link

  14. Mark this intentional "accident" insurance does not cover,

    Aka FRAUD!

    Think about it ?

    Who puts an 80 year old senile Serb in charge of putting out 800 candles???

    Something is bound to happen?
    (Azir, 12 October 2017 23:26)

    # Comment link

  15. 5 million for a new roof??? What world do you live in? It cost 4 million just to repair the old roof and it took over 15 year to raise money. Foolish to think city will let you in for big holiday when there are thousands of people but not every Sunday...you will waste all money...shame!
    (Miro, 12 October 2017 21:57)

    # Comment link

  16. Why won't the insurance pay for it?
    Was it not fully insured for replacement cost?
    (Mark.W, 12 October 2017 21:13)

    # Comment link

  17. @free,
    free of memory.
    cause what you remember clearly was knee-jerk reaction by the conspiracy theorists: you know flat-earthers, moon-landing-fakers, area-51ers, the loonies.
    are you a looney too cause when the dust was still settling after the investigation it became the belief that the fire was a result of candles.

    its a shame you only recall the first headline, but don't bother to remember the bulk, and the details of a story. its this sort of weak memory skills that forgets the chain of events of things, and muddles them up cause it fits ones narrative better.
    (iron knee, 12 October 2017 20:20)

    # Comment link

  18. Why they call it "an accident". I remember very well that when it happenend they called it a terrorist attack against the Holy Serbian Eastern Orthodox Church and the Super-Holy Eastern Orthodox Church of Dear Mother Ruspia.

    Did they arrest those Albanian Islamic Terrorists who burned down this church yet? Niet!?
    (Free, 12 October 2017 19:06)

    # Comment link

  19. Do New York residents forbid building a traditional Serbian Orthodox Church on the site, like they did in the past? America is corrupt on all three levels; federal, states and municipalities. Freedom denied by corrupt citizens, which is evident in the ambassadors sent to Belgrade in the past quarter century. What does U.S. Ambassador Scott think about USA's first amendment that prevents governments from dictating religion?
    (Freedom, 12 October 2017 18:47)

    # Comment link

  20. Dragoljub Djurkovic, 12 October 2017 16:46)

    What about those innocence lost lives , Handcuffed teenagers in srebrenica, raped women in Kosova, etc, etc, created by the eastern orthodox terrorists , blessed by the eastern terrorist church of serbia, who's going to pay for those?
    (Albanian American, 12 October 2017 18:05)

    # Comment link

  21. And how about the over two hundred Serbian Christian Eastern Orthodox Churches and Monasteries in occupied Serbian Holy Land Kosovo that Albanian Islamic terrorist destroyed, who will pay to rebuild them ??? The terrorist even destroyed our ancient cemeteries where for centuries our Serbian ancestors rest in peace ! Good job USA and KFOR for keeping a blind eye on Serbian heritage in occupied Kosovo ! USA and Bondsteal occupy Serbian Sveto i Veliko Kosovo and will continue to eradicate all Slavic Eastern Orthodox Christianity from the face of the earth in the Balkans !!!
    (Dragoljub Djurkovic, 12 October 2017 16:46)

    # Comment link

  22. Right after the fire a bunch of young people from the diaspora tried to start a fundraising campaign but were attacked online by the church board and other Serbians on the east coast. So I'm not donating to this cause.
    (Nikola, 12 October 2017 16:33)

    # Comment link