41

Tuesday, 18.06.2013.

16:01

"Croat president invites Kosovo to EU celebrations"

Croatian President Ivo Jospović has said that "Kosovo has also been invited" to the celebrations marking his country's EU entry.

Izvor: klix.ba

"Croat president invites Kosovo to EU celebrations" IMAGE SOURCE
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41 Komentari

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Tomasz

pre 12 godina

Aleks, thanks for informations, now I have quite more informations to understand serbian stand of using regular army during the war. In september I plan to visit Serbia, during the match Serbia- Croatia and I hope to know more details. Hvala ti za pomoć CCCC:)

Aleks

pre 12 godina

@tomasz
np, happy to help :) ..actually the public opinion in serbia was very favorable of milosevic at the time as he was extremely popular and that was the reason he was able to stay in power for so long . the reason he witheld the serb army was probably for two reasons, first there were negotiations ongoing between the serbs, croats and muslims and their respective leaders so he pretty much left that to the krajina and rs presidents to deal with and if he got involved directly with the war, it would have made him look badly in front of the intl community that he was trying to disrupt the peace negotiations .. the second reason kind of extends from the first because there was obvious international pressure as pretty much the west was favoring the croats and muslims and thus he himself didnt want the serb army scrutinized by being involved in a bloody battle because he wanted to avoid sanctions and intervention by the west .. remember he was a master manipulator and political tactician so he did his best to support the serbs albeit in a indirect way (it was not enough and he should have done more to help the serbs) . as to the hungarians you really didnt hear much from them or any other minority in serbia apart from the albanians, although they have problems with everyone (montenegro, macedonia & greece) . the hungarians and other minorities were neutral and pro serb for the most part . serbia was the most diverse yugo republic after the war as it was hospitable to them

Tomasz

pre 12 godina

Aleks thanks for answer- I can agree with you, that officials in Serbia thought that Serbs in RS and RSK could deal with their enemies on their own, without official commitment from Belgrade...the best time to unification al least RSK was at the beginning of conflict, when Croats hadn't organised troops, Belgrade lost precious time in my opinion, cuz it could be big risk for Croats to launch oluja against regular serbian army in RSK. But I cannot agree with the stand that serbian troops from RS and RSK despite of they controlled territory were able to crash enemies definitely, without official support from Belgrade, and in final result to end the conflict, look at siege of sarajevo- using federal army at the beginning could end war...to the nato attack Serbs had 3 years, enough time to end war and unify both republics with proper Serbia.
And one more question can you explain me- why Milosević made decision about withdraval regular army from Croatia and Bosnia? International pressure, public opinion in Serbia, will to avoid the bloody fight- what was the reason of that decision? and one specific question- what was the stand of Hungarian minority in Vojvodina- then and current, were they neutral, in favour of Serbia, against?
Pozdrowiam :)

Aleks

pre 12 godina

@tomasz
zdravo .. tudjman and milosevic did meet in secret & there were plans in place for division of bosnia but it never happened ..the other reason milosevic didnt use the serbian army was cuz he didnt want to concede a lot to croatia via krajina due to knowing he would face a similar problem in kosovo against albanians, so he wanted to remain quiet there, thats probably why they didnt unify at the time, they wanted the conflict to be over .actually i think that the other reason that milosvic didnt enter in the war was because he thought that the serbs in bosnia and croatia could handle it on their own with support coming from belgrade via weapons and troops, and this turns out to be true, as the croats and muslims couldnt even touch the serbs in rs or krajina, as they were holding their own and winning .. the tide turned when nato decided to get involved and bomb the serbs in krajina and rs and destroyed their defenses, which allowed the croats to launch oluja and the muslims to start gaining ground, but without nato the serbs would have won decisively, as the other side couldnt even scratch them for 3-4 years ..remember this wasnt even the federal army the croats and muslims were facing, so if the croats and muslims couldnt even beat the serbs in bosnia and croatia, then what chance would they have had against the federal serb army ..yes this was probably Milosevic's biggest blunder, as he didnt provide enough support and wasnt aggressive enough to help the serbs out

Tomasz

pre 12 godina

Zdravo Aleks,
Thanks for answer,so in your opinion the fact that Federal Army didn't launch the operations against your enemies was Milosevic's great mistake and he is responsible for that solely? in Poland we have a proverb "kuj ¿elazo, póki gor¹ce" which can be translated- to strike while the iron is hot. I mean, after referendum and fights in 1991 in RSK there were a ceasefire in krajina, to the operation oluja-can you explain my why during this ceasefire RSK didn't join to Serbia? For what you had to wait in situation when the territory was under your control?Didn't you have the awareness that Croatians would not accept the situation and tried to regain the territory of RSK? Unification would force proper Srbija to use the regular army....and in 1995 during Oluja, there were no options to use a regular, federal army against Gotovina's forces? What was the opinion of population in proper Serbia then in that case-using Army?
Yes, federal army could easily destroy bosnians in BIH and had more chances to defend RSK than only Српска Војска Крајине... And what about international pressure over you in a case of declaration of formal state of the war with bosnians and Croats? I know about shameful arms embargo to Yugoslavia, meanwhile Croats had German support but something more?
and one more, I've read about silent agreement between Milosević and Tudjman concerning division BIH?Is it true? if yes, mayby it was the reason why Milosvić didn't send army to Krajina?
Pozdrav,

aleks

pre 12 godina

@tomasz

Zdravo Polska, its nice that you are so interested in learning about this conflict and I was actually there during the bosnian war so I'm going to try and answer your questions as easily as I can .. first off you are right, the yugoslavian army could have easily won the wars and destroyed both the croats and muslims, in fact izetbegovic and tudjman were scared as hell that the yugoslavian army would enter the fight ... although serbia was never directly involved with the war formally it still provided assistance via troops, weapons, machinery and money ... there was no political fighting between the krajina, rs and serbia presidents, obviously some problems emerged but its expected as a war was going on .. each of the presidents had the same goal and that was to unite all the serb lands into a stronger country, they didn't unite immediately because the war was going on, but they would have once the conflict was over .. as to your main question, the answer is simple, milosevic was stupid when it came to military decisions, remember he was a banker before becoming president so he had no military know how or experience, although he was a genious when it came to politics as he was clever enough to employ manipulative tactics to consolidate his power and control ... simply put if he was more aggressive and provided more support like the yugoslavian army entering the war, krajina and rs would be a part of serbia already

Hope this helps

Tomasz

pre 12 godina

Zdravo Srbi! :)

I come from Poland and I'm interested in the situation in former Yugoslavia today and during the civil war, I think that I have a quite good command of knowledge about the conflict, but I cant find the answer about the legal problems connected with Republika Srpskiej Krajiny and Republika Srpska, so I would like to ask you about few questions:

Why during the civil war Srbija was not in the formal state of war with Croatia and BIH. I know that you controlled the nearly whole Kraijna and Slawonia, there were RSK and why this state formally didn't join to Serbia? And why RS during the war also didn't join to Serbia formally? It is strange for my, because I think that if you were in formal conflict you could use a Federal Army which had more pover than Croatian army and Oric's murders. I suspect also the possible political conflict- in RSK-president- Babić, in RS- Karadzić, and in proper Srbija- Milosević, and the president of Yugoslavia- Lilić? So mayby the political conflict stripped you of victory in Kraijna and BIH?
But main question is why you were not in formal unification with RSK and RS and why you were not in formal conflict with independant Croatia and BIH?
I would be thankful for answer
Pozdrav iz Poljske :) Kosovo je Srbija! :)

Peggy

pre 12 godina

awwww, is poor Nikolic throwing his toys out of the pram already? poor baby, poor poor baby
(Nikolle, 19 June 2013 11:42)
=========================

Mock all you like, (I don't think much of Nikolic either), but the fact remains that "Kosova" can never be without Serbian signature.
Now put that in you pipe and smoke it.

Peggy

pre 12 godina

Wake up!Yougoslavia is gone,and along with YU is gone the time when u used to tell others what to do.
For Croatia,Kosovo is equal to Serbia.Take it or leave it!What a peasant mentality!
================================
Mirel, you're right that the host has a right to invite anyone they wish to their home but at the same time the invitee has the right not to attend.
Serbia is not telling Croatia they can't invite Kosovo. Serbia is only saying that they will not be there if that is the case.
Do you even know the difference between telling someone what to do and telling someone that they cannot accept their invitation?
Serbia is not threatening Croatia, therefore Serbia is not telling Croatia what to do.

Stop trying to make Serbs look like the bad guys at every opportunity. This time you are being an idiot.

Mirel from Albania

pre 12 godina

How can you tell the host, who to invite in his own house?
You can ask him not to seat next to someone you dont like to talk and tost with,but not whom to invite.
It amazes me, this ability of the serbs to live in the past and not to grasp with the new reality in the Balkans.
Wake up!Yougoslavia is gone,and along with YU is gone the time when u used to tell others what to do.
For Croatia,Kosovo is equal to Serbia.Take it or leave it!What a peasant mentality!

The rest of the world are trying to embrace the new era of technology and move on,serbs,still leave on 1389,(which ironically at the time were allies with albanians).
Move on men,and dont let peasants(meaning mentality not people) to rule you!

Reader

pre 12 godina

"Second, we're not really all that keen on the EU right now, considering the mess its in. Maybe opinions will change with time, or maybe the government will do what Iceland did"
(Balkan Anthropologist, 19 June 2013 00:29)

You have not followed the news recently, have you?

Daniel

pre 12 godina

How nice, all the Croat and Albanian butchers together.

" albanian butchers " last time i checked serbia commited worst crimes after ww2 during balkan war.
(Bridge, 18 June 2013 19:49)

No, that is the US and why are you talking about after ww2 and not before or during ww2?Oh wait..that must be because you sided with the nazis right?Check again.

YOU are...the...Dimwit!

pre 12 godina

Maybe with a twist of luck a giant rock from space will fall on them and do us all a favour."

And how's that giant rock from space to hit both Croatia and Kosova without hitting Serbia in the middle?
(you are... dimwit, 18 June 2013 22:48)

Only a Dimwit could not realise that the twist of fate would be for the space rock to hit 'Josipovic' and 'whats her name', in Zagreb!

,,,or did you only realise this after you pressed send?

Peggy

pre 12 godina

by the way, Croatia, will, in a forceable future decide whether Serbia can join EU or not. If I were like "the graveyard guard" I would go to Croatia, keep my head down and shut up.
(Xhevdet Hoti, 18 June 2013 16:30)
==================================
You Albanians are always telling us not to speak on behalf of someone else and here you are thretening on behalf of someone else.

BTW, Croatia vill do exactly as Croatia is told and Croatia vill enjoy it. Verstehen?

Balkan Anthropologist

pre 12 godina

EU knows this which is why Serbia will not join for a long time. Another question, arent you guys who are always saying EU is going bankrupt and will dissolve soon? Also does you opinion change form day to day or do you just say what seems popular?
(shpend, 18 June 2013 20:55)

First, even if it takes 10 years for Serbia to join, that's 10 years before Albania joins or someone figures out what to do with Kosovo*.

Second, we're not really all that keen on the EU right now, considering the mess its in. Maybe opinions will change with time, or maybe the government will do what Iceland did, I can't really tell, and to be honest, a lot of us really don't care. All I know is that Kosovo's road to the EU is blocked by more than what Serbia could/would/should throw at it. If it's only Serbia, you can be thankful Belgrade will probably only extract further concessions for autonomy and such for the Serbian parts, which by the time Kosovo is seriously considered for EU membership, will pretty much be functioning as separate entities anyways :)

Balkan Anthropologist

pre 12 godina

Do you really believe EU (Germany) will let Serbia join EU without a fat, 200 page precondition agreement which will probably state somethin like like this (in all capital letters for Serbs to see) PLEASE SIGN BELOW THAT YOU WILL NEVER EVEN THINK/DREAM/HOPE THAT YOU WILL DENY KOSOVA ENTRANCE TO EU. If Serbia doesnt sign, Serbia doesnt get in.
(Xhevdet Hoti, 18 June 2013 22:24)

LOL nope. But you apparently do. Keep dreaming your country actually matters and that others give a damn about it beyond keeping it on the map :)

justhetruth

pre 12 godina

holly-crab seems like still they are a lots of people living in the past no doubt people in Balkan are starving for food and hate but hey you people down there do what you are the best to do for century you know what i'm talking and 'maybe", "maybe " ...i think never will happen seeing a bright future over there...AND STILL SAYING GOOD LUCK TO ALL OF YOU ..

EU Dude

pre 12 godina

No Mr. Hoti, you are misinformed. The soon in force Lisbon Treaty does away with member state vetoes on Enlargement which then comes under Qualified Majority Voting in the European Parliament.

you are... dimwit

pre 12 godina

"Maybe with a twist of luck a giant rock from space will fall on them and do us all a favour."

And how's that giant rock from space to hit both Croatia and Kosova without hitting Serbia in the middle?

Xhevdet Hoti

pre 12 godina

@ Balkan Anthropologist

Do you really believe EU (Germany) will let Serbia join EU without a fat, 200 page precondition agreement which will probably state somethin like like this (in all capital letters for Serbs to see) PLEASE SIGN BELOW THAT YOU WILL NEVER EVEN THINK/DREAM/HOPE THAT YOU WILL DENY KOSOVA ENTRANCE TO EU. If Serbia doesnt sign, Serbia doesnt get in.

the truth

pre 12 godina

Nikolić said last week that he would travel to Zagreb on June 30, and added that the only thing that could prevent him would be Croatia's decision to insult Serbia, and present Kosovo as an independent state on the occasion.

How dumb can you get!? Nikolic must have had to much rakija in his lifetime, and now we see the side effects.

shpend

pre 12 godina

LOL, if that's the case "Xhevdet", then I pity what Albania will have to go through if/when it's time comes, knowing what Serbia, Greece, and Montenegro will ask. And when it's Kosovo's turn, Serbia should have a field day :)
(Balkan Anthropologist, 18 June 2013 18:50)

EU knows this which is why Serbia will not join for a long time. Another question, arent you guys who are always saying EU is going bankrupt and will dissolve soon? Also does you opinion change form day to day or do you just say what seems popular?

Bridge

pre 12 godina

How nice, all the Croat and Albanian butchers together.

" albanian butchers " last time i checked serbia commited worst crimes after ww2 during balkan war.

Balkan Anthropologist

pre 12 godina

...….. by the way, Croatia, will, in a forceable future decide whether Serbia can join EU or not. If I were like "the graveyard guard" I would go to Croatia, keep my head down and shut up.
(Xhevdet Hoti, 18 June 2013 16:30)

LOL, if that's the case "Xhevdet", then I pity what Albania will have to go through if/when it's time comes, knowing what Serbia, Greece, and Montenegro will ask. And when it's Kosovo's turn, Serbia should have a field day :)

I AM

pre 12 godina

How nice, all the Croat and Albanian butchers together.

Maybe with a twist of luck a giant rock from space will fall on them and do us all a favour.

Albanian

pre 12 godina

So, not only did Croatia offend Serbia they even invite Serbia to join the party with them lol. Nikolic, everytime you open your mouth you get slapped around like a little girl.
congratulations to Croatia

low IQ

pre 12 godina

...….. by the way, Croatia, will, in a forceable future decide whether Serbia can join EU or not. If I were like "the graveyard guard" I would go to Croatia, keep my head down and shut up.
(Xhevdet Hoti

Yes, but the graveyard guard is not that smart.

Bob

pre 12 godina

Will Croatia also use the opportunity to acknowledge and apologise for the evils done in its name. Croatia's birth was derived by ignominy and not in honour.

This might be an acceptable counter to over-friendliness to its neighbour's ethnically divisive province.

Xhevdet Hoti

pre 12 godina

............by the way, Croatia, will, in a forceable future decide whether Serbia can join EU or not. If I were like "the graveyard guard" I would go to Croatia, keep my head down and shut up.

Xhevdet Hoti

pre 12 godina

............by the way, Croatia, will, in a forceable future decide whether Serbia can join EU or not. If I were like "the graveyard guard" I would go to Croatia, keep my head down and shut up.

Albanian

pre 12 godina

So, not only did Croatia offend Serbia they even invite Serbia to join the party with them lol. Nikolic, everytime you open your mouth you get slapped around like a little girl.
congratulations to Croatia

I AM

pre 12 godina

How nice, all the Croat and Albanian butchers together.

Maybe with a twist of luck a giant rock from space will fall on them and do us all a favour.

Bob

pre 12 godina

Will Croatia also use the opportunity to acknowledge and apologise for the evils done in its name. Croatia's birth was derived by ignominy and not in honour.

This might be an acceptable counter to over-friendliness to its neighbour's ethnically divisive province.

Balkan Anthropologist

pre 12 godina

...….. by the way, Croatia, will, in a forceable future decide whether Serbia can join EU or not. If I were like "the graveyard guard" I would go to Croatia, keep my head down and shut up.
(Xhevdet Hoti, 18 June 2013 16:30)

LOL, if that's the case "Xhevdet", then I pity what Albania will have to go through if/when it's time comes, knowing what Serbia, Greece, and Montenegro will ask. And when it's Kosovo's turn, Serbia should have a field day :)

Bridge

pre 12 godina

How nice, all the Croat and Albanian butchers together.

" albanian butchers " last time i checked serbia commited worst crimes after ww2 during balkan war.

low IQ

pre 12 godina

...….. by the way, Croatia, will, in a forceable future decide whether Serbia can join EU or not. If I were like "the graveyard guard" I would go to Croatia, keep my head down and shut up.
(Xhevdet Hoti

Yes, but the graveyard guard is not that smart.

you are... dimwit

pre 12 godina

"Maybe with a twist of luck a giant rock from space will fall on them and do us all a favour."

And how's that giant rock from space to hit both Croatia and Kosova without hitting Serbia in the middle?

Xhevdet Hoti

pre 12 godina

@ Balkan Anthropologist

Do you really believe EU (Germany) will let Serbia join EU without a fat, 200 page precondition agreement which will probably state somethin like like this (in all capital letters for Serbs to see) PLEASE SIGN BELOW THAT YOU WILL NEVER EVEN THINK/DREAM/HOPE THAT YOU WILL DENY KOSOVA ENTRANCE TO EU. If Serbia doesnt sign, Serbia doesnt get in.

shpend

pre 12 godina

LOL, if that's the case "Xhevdet", then I pity what Albania will have to go through if/when it's time comes, knowing what Serbia, Greece, and Montenegro will ask. And when it's Kosovo's turn, Serbia should have a field day :)
(Balkan Anthropologist, 18 June 2013 18:50)

EU knows this which is why Serbia will not join for a long time. Another question, arent you guys who are always saying EU is going bankrupt and will dissolve soon? Also does you opinion change form day to day or do you just say what seems popular?

the truth

pre 12 godina

Nikolić said last week that he would travel to Zagreb on June 30, and added that the only thing that could prevent him would be Croatia's decision to insult Serbia, and present Kosovo as an independent state on the occasion.

How dumb can you get!? Nikolic must have had to much rakija in his lifetime, and now we see the side effects.

Daniel

pre 12 godina

How nice, all the Croat and Albanian butchers together.

" albanian butchers " last time i checked serbia commited worst crimes after ww2 during balkan war.
(Bridge, 18 June 2013 19:49)

No, that is the US and why are you talking about after ww2 and not before or during ww2?Oh wait..that must be because you sided with the nazis right?Check again.

Mirel from Albania

pre 12 godina

How can you tell the host, who to invite in his own house?
You can ask him not to seat next to someone you dont like to talk and tost with,but not whom to invite.
It amazes me, this ability of the serbs to live in the past and not to grasp with the new reality in the Balkans.
Wake up!Yougoslavia is gone,and along with YU is gone the time when u used to tell others what to do.
For Croatia,Kosovo is equal to Serbia.Take it or leave it!What a peasant mentality!

The rest of the world are trying to embrace the new era of technology and move on,serbs,still leave on 1389,(which ironically at the time were allies with albanians).
Move on men,and dont let peasants(meaning mentality not people) to rule you!

Peggy

pre 12 godina

by the way, Croatia, will, in a forceable future decide whether Serbia can join EU or not. If I were like "the graveyard guard" I would go to Croatia, keep my head down and shut up.
(Xhevdet Hoti, 18 June 2013 16:30)
==================================
You Albanians are always telling us not to speak on behalf of someone else and here you are thretening on behalf of someone else.

BTW, Croatia vill do exactly as Croatia is told and Croatia vill enjoy it. Verstehen?

Peggy

pre 12 godina

awwww, is poor Nikolic throwing his toys out of the pram already? poor baby, poor poor baby
(Nikolle, 19 June 2013 11:42)
=========================

Mock all you like, (I don't think much of Nikolic either), but the fact remains that "Kosova" can never be without Serbian signature.
Now put that in you pipe and smoke it.

Balkan Anthropologist

pre 12 godina

Do you really believe EU (Germany) will let Serbia join EU without a fat, 200 page precondition agreement which will probably state somethin like like this (in all capital letters for Serbs to see) PLEASE SIGN BELOW THAT YOU WILL NEVER EVEN THINK/DREAM/HOPE THAT YOU WILL DENY KOSOVA ENTRANCE TO EU. If Serbia doesnt sign, Serbia doesnt get in.
(Xhevdet Hoti, 18 June 2013 22:24)

LOL nope. But you apparently do. Keep dreaming your country actually matters and that others give a damn about it beyond keeping it on the map :)

Reader

pre 12 godina

"Second, we're not really all that keen on the EU right now, considering the mess its in. Maybe opinions will change with time, or maybe the government will do what Iceland did"
(Balkan Anthropologist, 19 June 2013 00:29)

You have not followed the news recently, have you?

Balkan Anthropologist

pre 12 godina

EU knows this which is why Serbia will not join for a long time. Another question, arent you guys who are always saying EU is going bankrupt and will dissolve soon? Also does you opinion change form day to day or do you just say what seems popular?
(shpend, 18 June 2013 20:55)

First, even if it takes 10 years for Serbia to join, that's 10 years before Albania joins or someone figures out what to do with Kosovo*.

Second, we're not really all that keen on the EU right now, considering the mess its in. Maybe opinions will change with time, or maybe the government will do what Iceland did, I can't really tell, and to be honest, a lot of us really don't care. All I know is that Kosovo's road to the EU is blocked by more than what Serbia could/would/should throw at it. If it's only Serbia, you can be thankful Belgrade will probably only extract further concessions for autonomy and such for the Serbian parts, which by the time Kosovo is seriously considered for EU membership, will pretty much be functioning as separate entities anyways :)

Peggy

pre 12 godina

Wake up!Yougoslavia is gone,and along with YU is gone the time when u used to tell others what to do.
For Croatia,Kosovo is equal to Serbia.Take it or leave it!What a peasant mentality!
================================
Mirel, you're right that the host has a right to invite anyone they wish to their home but at the same time the invitee has the right not to attend.
Serbia is not telling Croatia they can't invite Kosovo. Serbia is only saying that they will not be there if that is the case.
Do you even know the difference between telling someone what to do and telling someone that they cannot accept their invitation?
Serbia is not threatening Croatia, therefore Serbia is not telling Croatia what to do.

Stop trying to make Serbs look like the bad guys at every opportunity. This time you are being an idiot.

EU Dude

pre 12 godina

No Mr. Hoti, you are misinformed. The soon in force Lisbon Treaty does away with member state vetoes on Enlargement which then comes under Qualified Majority Voting in the European Parliament.

YOU are...the...Dimwit!

pre 12 godina

Maybe with a twist of luck a giant rock from space will fall on them and do us all a favour."

And how's that giant rock from space to hit both Croatia and Kosova without hitting Serbia in the middle?
(you are... dimwit, 18 June 2013 22:48)

Only a Dimwit could not realise that the twist of fate would be for the space rock to hit 'Josipovic' and 'whats her name', in Zagreb!

,,,or did you only realise this after you pressed send?

justhetruth

pre 12 godina

holly-crab seems like still they are a lots of people living in the past no doubt people in Balkan are starving for food and hate but hey you people down there do what you are the best to do for century you know what i'm talking and 'maybe", "maybe " ...i think never will happen seeing a bright future over there...AND STILL SAYING GOOD LUCK TO ALL OF YOU ..

Tomasz

pre 12 godina

Zdravo Srbi! :)

I come from Poland and I'm interested in the situation in former Yugoslavia today and during the civil war, I think that I have a quite good command of knowledge about the conflict, but I cant find the answer about the legal problems connected with Republika Srpskiej Krajiny and Republika Srpska, so I would like to ask you about few questions:

Why during the civil war Srbija was not in the formal state of war with Croatia and BIH. I know that you controlled the nearly whole Kraijna and Slawonia, there were RSK and why this state formally didn't join to Serbia? And why RS during the war also didn't join to Serbia formally? It is strange for my, because I think that if you were in formal conflict you could use a Federal Army which had more pover than Croatian army and Oric's murders. I suspect also the possible political conflict- in RSK-president- Babić, in RS- Karadzić, and in proper Srbija- Milosević, and the president of Yugoslavia- Lilić? So mayby the political conflict stripped you of victory in Kraijna and BIH?
But main question is why you were not in formal unification with RSK and RS and why you were not in formal conflict with independant Croatia and BIH?
I would be thankful for answer
Pozdrav iz Poljske :) Kosovo je Srbija! :)

aleks

pre 12 godina

@tomasz

Zdravo Polska, its nice that you are so interested in learning about this conflict and I was actually there during the bosnian war so I'm going to try and answer your questions as easily as I can .. first off you are right, the yugoslavian army could have easily won the wars and destroyed both the croats and muslims, in fact izetbegovic and tudjman were scared as hell that the yugoslavian army would enter the fight ... although serbia was never directly involved with the war formally it still provided assistance via troops, weapons, machinery and money ... there was no political fighting between the krajina, rs and serbia presidents, obviously some problems emerged but its expected as a war was going on .. each of the presidents had the same goal and that was to unite all the serb lands into a stronger country, they didn't unite immediately because the war was going on, but they would have once the conflict was over .. as to your main question, the answer is simple, milosevic was stupid when it came to military decisions, remember he was a banker before becoming president so he had no military know how or experience, although he was a genious when it came to politics as he was clever enough to employ manipulative tactics to consolidate his power and control ... simply put if he was more aggressive and provided more support like the yugoslavian army entering the war, krajina and rs would be a part of serbia already

Hope this helps

Tomasz

pre 12 godina

Zdravo Aleks,
Thanks for answer,so in your opinion the fact that Federal Army didn't launch the operations against your enemies was Milosevic's great mistake and he is responsible for that solely? in Poland we have a proverb "kuj ¿elazo, póki gor¹ce" which can be translated- to strike while the iron is hot. I mean, after referendum and fights in 1991 in RSK there were a ceasefire in krajina, to the operation oluja-can you explain my why during this ceasefire RSK didn't join to Serbia? For what you had to wait in situation when the territory was under your control?Didn't you have the awareness that Croatians would not accept the situation and tried to regain the territory of RSK? Unification would force proper Srbija to use the regular army....and in 1995 during Oluja, there were no options to use a regular, federal army against Gotovina's forces? What was the opinion of population in proper Serbia then in that case-using Army?
Yes, federal army could easily destroy bosnians in BIH and had more chances to defend RSK than only Српска Војска Крајине... And what about international pressure over you in a case of declaration of formal state of the war with bosnians and Croats? I know about shameful arms embargo to Yugoslavia, meanwhile Croats had German support but something more?
and one more, I've read about silent agreement between Milosević and Tudjman concerning division BIH?Is it true? if yes, mayby it was the reason why Milosvić didn't send army to Krajina?
Pozdrav,

Aleks

pre 12 godina

@tomasz
zdravo .. tudjman and milosevic did meet in secret & there were plans in place for division of bosnia but it never happened ..the other reason milosevic didnt use the serbian army was cuz he didnt want to concede a lot to croatia via krajina due to knowing he would face a similar problem in kosovo against albanians, so he wanted to remain quiet there, thats probably why they didnt unify at the time, they wanted the conflict to be over .actually i think that the other reason that milosvic didnt enter in the war was because he thought that the serbs in bosnia and croatia could handle it on their own with support coming from belgrade via weapons and troops, and this turns out to be true, as the croats and muslims couldnt even touch the serbs in rs or krajina, as they were holding their own and winning .. the tide turned when nato decided to get involved and bomb the serbs in krajina and rs and destroyed their defenses, which allowed the croats to launch oluja and the muslims to start gaining ground, but without nato the serbs would have won decisively, as the other side couldnt even scratch them for 3-4 years ..remember this wasnt even the federal army the croats and muslims were facing, so if the croats and muslims couldnt even beat the serbs in bosnia and croatia, then what chance would they have had against the federal serb army ..yes this was probably Milosevic's biggest blunder, as he didnt provide enough support and wasnt aggressive enough to help the serbs out

Tomasz

pre 12 godina

Aleks thanks for answer- I can agree with you, that officials in Serbia thought that Serbs in RS and RSK could deal with their enemies on their own, without official commitment from Belgrade...the best time to unification al least RSK was at the beginning of conflict, when Croats hadn't organised troops, Belgrade lost precious time in my opinion, cuz it could be big risk for Croats to launch oluja against regular serbian army in RSK. But I cannot agree with the stand that serbian troops from RS and RSK despite of they controlled territory were able to crash enemies definitely, without official support from Belgrade, and in final result to end the conflict, look at siege of sarajevo- using federal army at the beginning could end war...to the nato attack Serbs had 3 years, enough time to end war and unify both republics with proper Serbia.
And one more question can you explain me- why Milosević made decision about withdraval regular army from Croatia and Bosnia? International pressure, public opinion in Serbia, will to avoid the bloody fight- what was the reason of that decision? and one specific question- what was the stand of Hungarian minority in Vojvodina- then and current, were they neutral, in favour of Serbia, against?
Pozdrowiam :)

Aleks

pre 12 godina

@tomasz
np, happy to help :) ..actually the public opinion in serbia was very favorable of milosevic at the time as he was extremely popular and that was the reason he was able to stay in power for so long . the reason he witheld the serb army was probably for two reasons, first there were negotiations ongoing between the serbs, croats and muslims and their respective leaders so he pretty much left that to the krajina and rs presidents to deal with and if he got involved directly with the war, it would have made him look badly in front of the intl community that he was trying to disrupt the peace negotiations .. the second reason kind of extends from the first because there was obvious international pressure as pretty much the west was favoring the croats and muslims and thus he himself didnt want the serb army scrutinized by being involved in a bloody battle because he wanted to avoid sanctions and intervention by the west .. remember he was a master manipulator and political tactician so he did his best to support the serbs albeit in a indirect way (it was not enough and he should have done more to help the serbs) . as to the hungarians you really didnt hear much from them or any other minority in serbia apart from the albanians, although they have problems with everyone (montenegro, macedonia & greece) . the hungarians and other minorities were neutral and pro serb for the most part . serbia was the most diverse yugo republic after the war as it was hospitable to them

Tomasz

pre 12 godina

Aleks, thanks for informations, now I have quite more informations to understand serbian stand of using regular army during the war. In september I plan to visit Serbia, during the match Serbia- Croatia and I hope to know more details. Hvala ti za pomoć CCCC:)

I AM

pre 12 godina

How nice, all the Croat and Albanian butchers together.

Maybe with a twist of luck a giant rock from space will fall on them and do us all a favour.

Bob

pre 12 godina

Will Croatia also use the opportunity to acknowledge and apologise for the evils done in its name. Croatia's birth was derived by ignominy and not in honour.

This might be an acceptable counter to over-friendliness to its neighbour's ethnically divisive province.

Xhevdet Hoti

pre 12 godina

............by the way, Croatia, will, in a forceable future decide whether Serbia can join EU or not. If I were like "the graveyard guard" I would go to Croatia, keep my head down and shut up.

Albanian

pre 12 godina

So, not only did Croatia offend Serbia they even invite Serbia to join the party with them lol. Nikolic, everytime you open your mouth you get slapped around like a little girl.
congratulations to Croatia

Bridge

pre 12 godina

How nice, all the Croat and Albanian butchers together.

" albanian butchers " last time i checked serbia commited worst crimes after ww2 during balkan war.

Balkan Anthropologist

pre 12 godina

...….. by the way, Croatia, will, in a forceable future decide whether Serbia can join EU or not. If I were like "the graveyard guard" I would go to Croatia, keep my head down and shut up.
(Xhevdet Hoti, 18 June 2013 16:30)

LOL, if that's the case "Xhevdet", then I pity what Albania will have to go through if/when it's time comes, knowing what Serbia, Greece, and Montenegro will ask. And when it's Kosovo's turn, Serbia should have a field day :)

low IQ

pre 12 godina

...….. by the way, Croatia, will, in a forceable future decide whether Serbia can join EU or not. If I were like "the graveyard guard" I would go to Croatia, keep my head down and shut up.
(Xhevdet Hoti

Yes, but the graveyard guard is not that smart.

Daniel

pre 12 godina

How nice, all the Croat and Albanian butchers together.

" albanian butchers " last time i checked serbia commited worst crimes after ww2 during balkan war.
(Bridge, 18 June 2013 19:49)

No, that is the US and why are you talking about after ww2 and not before or during ww2?Oh wait..that must be because you sided with the nazis right?Check again.

Xhevdet Hoti

pre 12 godina

@ Balkan Anthropologist

Do you really believe EU (Germany) will let Serbia join EU without a fat, 200 page precondition agreement which will probably state somethin like like this (in all capital letters for Serbs to see) PLEASE SIGN BELOW THAT YOU WILL NEVER EVEN THINK/DREAM/HOPE THAT YOU WILL DENY KOSOVA ENTRANCE TO EU. If Serbia doesnt sign, Serbia doesnt get in.

shpend

pre 12 godina

LOL, if that's the case "Xhevdet", then I pity what Albania will have to go through if/when it's time comes, knowing what Serbia, Greece, and Montenegro will ask. And when it's Kosovo's turn, Serbia should have a field day :)
(Balkan Anthropologist, 18 June 2013 18:50)

EU knows this which is why Serbia will not join for a long time. Another question, arent you guys who are always saying EU is going bankrupt and will dissolve soon? Also does you opinion change form day to day or do you just say what seems popular?

you are... dimwit

pre 12 godina

"Maybe with a twist of luck a giant rock from space will fall on them and do us all a favour."

And how's that giant rock from space to hit both Croatia and Kosova without hitting Serbia in the middle?

Peggy

pre 12 godina

by the way, Croatia, will, in a forceable future decide whether Serbia can join EU or not. If I were like "the graveyard guard" I would go to Croatia, keep my head down and shut up.
(Xhevdet Hoti, 18 June 2013 16:30)
==================================
You Albanians are always telling us not to speak on behalf of someone else and here you are thretening on behalf of someone else.

BTW, Croatia vill do exactly as Croatia is told and Croatia vill enjoy it. Verstehen?

Peggy

pre 12 godina

awwww, is poor Nikolic throwing his toys out of the pram already? poor baby, poor poor baby
(Nikolle, 19 June 2013 11:42)
=========================

Mock all you like, (I don't think much of Nikolic either), but the fact remains that "Kosova" can never be without Serbian signature.
Now put that in you pipe and smoke it.

Peggy

pre 12 godina

Wake up!Yougoslavia is gone,and along with YU is gone the time when u used to tell others what to do.
For Croatia,Kosovo is equal to Serbia.Take it or leave it!What a peasant mentality!
================================
Mirel, you're right that the host has a right to invite anyone they wish to their home but at the same time the invitee has the right not to attend.
Serbia is not telling Croatia they can't invite Kosovo. Serbia is only saying that they will not be there if that is the case.
Do you even know the difference between telling someone what to do and telling someone that they cannot accept their invitation?
Serbia is not threatening Croatia, therefore Serbia is not telling Croatia what to do.

Stop trying to make Serbs look like the bad guys at every opportunity. This time you are being an idiot.

the truth

pre 12 godina

Nikolić said last week that he would travel to Zagreb on June 30, and added that the only thing that could prevent him would be Croatia's decision to insult Serbia, and present Kosovo as an independent state on the occasion.

How dumb can you get!? Nikolic must have had to much rakija in his lifetime, and now we see the side effects.

Balkan Anthropologist

pre 12 godina

Do you really believe EU (Germany) will let Serbia join EU without a fat, 200 page precondition agreement which will probably state somethin like like this (in all capital letters for Serbs to see) PLEASE SIGN BELOW THAT YOU WILL NEVER EVEN THINK/DREAM/HOPE THAT YOU WILL DENY KOSOVA ENTRANCE TO EU. If Serbia doesnt sign, Serbia doesnt get in.
(Xhevdet Hoti, 18 June 2013 22:24)

LOL nope. But you apparently do. Keep dreaming your country actually matters and that others give a damn about it beyond keeping it on the map :)

Balkan Anthropologist

pre 12 godina

EU knows this which is why Serbia will not join for a long time. Another question, arent you guys who are always saying EU is going bankrupt and will dissolve soon? Also does you opinion change form day to day or do you just say what seems popular?
(shpend, 18 June 2013 20:55)

First, even if it takes 10 years for Serbia to join, that's 10 years before Albania joins or someone figures out what to do with Kosovo*.

Second, we're not really all that keen on the EU right now, considering the mess its in. Maybe opinions will change with time, or maybe the government will do what Iceland did, I can't really tell, and to be honest, a lot of us really don't care. All I know is that Kosovo's road to the EU is blocked by more than what Serbia could/would/should throw at it. If it's only Serbia, you can be thankful Belgrade will probably only extract further concessions for autonomy and such for the Serbian parts, which by the time Kosovo is seriously considered for EU membership, will pretty much be functioning as separate entities anyways :)

YOU are...the...Dimwit!

pre 12 godina

Maybe with a twist of luck a giant rock from space will fall on them and do us all a favour."

And how's that giant rock from space to hit both Croatia and Kosova without hitting Serbia in the middle?
(you are... dimwit, 18 June 2013 22:48)

Only a Dimwit could not realise that the twist of fate would be for the space rock to hit 'Josipovic' and 'whats her name', in Zagreb!

,,,or did you only realise this after you pressed send?

Mirel from Albania

pre 12 godina

How can you tell the host, who to invite in his own house?
You can ask him not to seat next to someone you dont like to talk and tost with,but not whom to invite.
It amazes me, this ability of the serbs to live in the past and not to grasp with the new reality in the Balkans.
Wake up!Yougoslavia is gone,and along with YU is gone the time when u used to tell others what to do.
For Croatia,Kosovo is equal to Serbia.Take it or leave it!What a peasant mentality!

The rest of the world are trying to embrace the new era of technology and move on,serbs,still leave on 1389,(which ironically at the time were allies with albanians).
Move on men,and dont let peasants(meaning mentality not people) to rule you!

Tomasz

pre 12 godina

Zdravo Srbi! :)

I come from Poland and I'm interested in the situation in former Yugoslavia today and during the civil war, I think that I have a quite good command of knowledge about the conflict, but I cant find the answer about the legal problems connected with Republika Srpskiej Krajiny and Republika Srpska, so I would like to ask you about few questions:

Why during the civil war Srbija was not in the formal state of war with Croatia and BIH. I know that you controlled the nearly whole Kraijna and Slawonia, there were RSK and why this state formally didn't join to Serbia? And why RS during the war also didn't join to Serbia formally? It is strange for my, because I think that if you were in formal conflict you could use a Federal Army which had more pover than Croatian army and Oric's murders. I suspect also the possible political conflict- in RSK-president- Babić, in RS- Karadzić, and in proper Srbija- Milosević, and the president of Yugoslavia- Lilić? So mayby the political conflict stripped you of victory in Kraijna and BIH?
But main question is why you were not in formal unification with RSK and RS and why you were not in formal conflict with independant Croatia and BIH?
I would be thankful for answer
Pozdrav iz Poljske :) Kosovo je Srbija! :)

Reader

pre 12 godina

"Second, we're not really all that keen on the EU right now, considering the mess its in. Maybe opinions will change with time, or maybe the government will do what Iceland did"
(Balkan Anthropologist, 19 June 2013 00:29)

You have not followed the news recently, have you?

aleks

pre 12 godina

@tomasz

Zdravo Polska, its nice that you are so interested in learning about this conflict and I was actually there during the bosnian war so I'm going to try and answer your questions as easily as I can .. first off you are right, the yugoslavian army could have easily won the wars and destroyed both the croats and muslims, in fact izetbegovic and tudjman were scared as hell that the yugoslavian army would enter the fight ... although serbia was never directly involved with the war formally it still provided assistance via troops, weapons, machinery and money ... there was no political fighting between the krajina, rs and serbia presidents, obviously some problems emerged but its expected as a war was going on .. each of the presidents had the same goal and that was to unite all the serb lands into a stronger country, they didn't unite immediately because the war was going on, but they would have once the conflict was over .. as to your main question, the answer is simple, milosevic was stupid when it came to military decisions, remember he was a banker before becoming president so he had no military know how or experience, although he was a genious when it came to politics as he was clever enough to employ manipulative tactics to consolidate his power and control ... simply put if he was more aggressive and provided more support like the yugoslavian army entering the war, krajina and rs would be a part of serbia already

Hope this helps

Tomasz

pre 12 godina

Zdravo Aleks,
Thanks for answer,so in your opinion the fact that Federal Army didn't launch the operations against your enemies was Milosevic's great mistake and he is responsible for that solely? in Poland we have a proverb "kuj ¿elazo, póki gor¹ce" which can be translated- to strike while the iron is hot. I mean, after referendum and fights in 1991 in RSK there were a ceasefire in krajina, to the operation oluja-can you explain my why during this ceasefire RSK didn't join to Serbia? For what you had to wait in situation when the territory was under your control?Didn't you have the awareness that Croatians would not accept the situation and tried to regain the territory of RSK? Unification would force proper Srbija to use the regular army....and in 1995 during Oluja, there were no options to use a regular, federal army against Gotovina's forces? What was the opinion of population in proper Serbia then in that case-using Army?
Yes, federal army could easily destroy bosnians in BIH and had more chances to defend RSK than only Српска Војска Крајине... And what about international pressure over you in a case of declaration of formal state of the war with bosnians and Croats? I know about shameful arms embargo to Yugoslavia, meanwhile Croats had German support but something more?
and one more, I've read about silent agreement between Milosević and Tudjman concerning division BIH?Is it true? if yes, mayby it was the reason why Milosvić didn't send army to Krajina?
Pozdrav,

Tomasz

pre 12 godina

Aleks thanks for answer- I can agree with you, that officials in Serbia thought that Serbs in RS and RSK could deal with their enemies on their own, without official commitment from Belgrade...the best time to unification al least RSK was at the beginning of conflict, when Croats hadn't organised troops, Belgrade lost precious time in my opinion, cuz it could be big risk for Croats to launch oluja against regular serbian army in RSK. But I cannot agree with the stand that serbian troops from RS and RSK despite of they controlled territory were able to crash enemies definitely, without official support from Belgrade, and in final result to end the conflict, look at siege of sarajevo- using federal army at the beginning could end war...to the nato attack Serbs had 3 years, enough time to end war and unify both republics with proper Serbia.
And one more question can you explain me- why Milosević made decision about withdraval regular army from Croatia and Bosnia? International pressure, public opinion in Serbia, will to avoid the bloody fight- what was the reason of that decision? and one specific question- what was the stand of Hungarian minority in Vojvodina- then and current, were they neutral, in favour of Serbia, against?
Pozdrowiam :)

justhetruth

pre 12 godina

holly-crab seems like still they are a lots of people living in the past no doubt people in Balkan are starving for food and hate but hey you people down there do what you are the best to do for century you know what i'm talking and 'maybe", "maybe " ...i think never will happen seeing a bright future over there...AND STILL SAYING GOOD LUCK TO ALL OF YOU ..

Aleks

pre 12 godina

@tomasz
zdravo .. tudjman and milosevic did meet in secret & there were plans in place for division of bosnia but it never happened ..the other reason milosevic didnt use the serbian army was cuz he didnt want to concede a lot to croatia via krajina due to knowing he would face a similar problem in kosovo against albanians, so he wanted to remain quiet there, thats probably why they didnt unify at the time, they wanted the conflict to be over .actually i think that the other reason that milosvic didnt enter in the war was because he thought that the serbs in bosnia and croatia could handle it on their own with support coming from belgrade via weapons and troops, and this turns out to be true, as the croats and muslims couldnt even touch the serbs in rs or krajina, as they were holding their own and winning .. the tide turned when nato decided to get involved and bomb the serbs in krajina and rs and destroyed their defenses, which allowed the croats to launch oluja and the muslims to start gaining ground, but without nato the serbs would have won decisively, as the other side couldnt even scratch them for 3-4 years ..remember this wasnt even the federal army the croats and muslims were facing, so if the croats and muslims couldnt even beat the serbs in bosnia and croatia, then what chance would they have had against the federal serb army ..yes this was probably Milosevic's biggest blunder, as he didnt provide enough support and wasnt aggressive enough to help the serbs out

EU Dude

pre 12 godina

No Mr. Hoti, you are misinformed. The soon in force Lisbon Treaty does away with member state vetoes on Enlargement which then comes under Qualified Majority Voting in the European Parliament.

Aleks

pre 12 godina

@tomasz
np, happy to help :) ..actually the public opinion in serbia was very favorable of milosevic at the time as he was extremely popular and that was the reason he was able to stay in power for so long . the reason he witheld the serb army was probably for two reasons, first there were negotiations ongoing between the serbs, croats and muslims and their respective leaders so he pretty much left that to the krajina and rs presidents to deal with and if he got involved directly with the war, it would have made him look badly in front of the intl community that he was trying to disrupt the peace negotiations .. the second reason kind of extends from the first because there was obvious international pressure as pretty much the west was favoring the croats and muslims and thus he himself didnt want the serb army scrutinized by being involved in a bloody battle because he wanted to avoid sanctions and intervention by the west .. remember he was a master manipulator and political tactician so he did his best to support the serbs albeit in a indirect way (it was not enough and he should have done more to help the serbs) . as to the hungarians you really didnt hear much from them or any other minority in serbia apart from the albanians, although they have problems with everyone (montenegro, macedonia & greece) . the hungarians and other minorities were neutral and pro serb for the most part . serbia was the most diverse yugo republic after the war as it was hospitable to them

Tomasz

pre 12 godina

Aleks, thanks for informations, now I have quite more informations to understand serbian stand of using regular army during the war. In september I plan to visit Serbia, during the match Serbia- Croatia and I hope to know more details. Hvala ti za pomoć CCCC:)